BUD PLANT QUITS SDCC AFTER 48 YEARS 1 1

[Robot Man]

I miss Bud's booth selling old comics from his collection the most. Always, found a few cool gems. The "little booths" of comic sellers went away a long time ago.

Was conversing with Catrick and he told me that not only did Motor City Comics give up their SDCC booth but now Motor City Comic Con is up for sale. Another dealer at SDCC I used to spend a lot with.

These are sad times indeed for buyers and sellers of vintage comic books. What's left? Big Auction Houses? I don't buy much from them, Ebay? To much "wild west" antics, don't buy or sell there much any more. Dealer websites? Everything is gone the minute it comes up. Thank goodness for these boards or I would be done buying probably.

[Mmehdy]

1 hour ago, Robot Man said:

I miss Bud's booth selling old comics from his collection the most. Always, found a few cool gems. The "little booths" of comic sellers went away a long time ago.

Was conversing with Catrick and he told me that not only did Motor City Comics give up their SDCC booth but now Motor City Comic Con is up for sale. Another dealer at SDCC I used to spend a lot with.

These are sad times indeed for buyers and sellers of vintage comic books. What's left? Big Auction Houses? I don't buy much from them, Ebay? To much "wild west" antics, don't buy or sell there much any more. Dealer websites? Everything is gone the minute it comes up. Thank goodness for these boards or I would be done buying probably.

Consolidation is what occurs in any business when the $$$ are there.  A 12M comic book auction  which occurred this weekend will raise a few heads on that number, the good part is that a lot of GREAT stuff comes on the market in one central place. I agree with you Robo there is nothing like finding comics in different places such as garage sales, antique stores, etc but E-bay eliminated a big chuck of that, and if  I had to guess, the biggest sellers of comic books in the world is E-Bay in terms of quantity. Don't be surprised if one or more dealers such as CC begin buying some midsize dealers. Chuck/Mile High went around after the last bust and paid 5cents on the dollar for the smaller dealers and still is buying low-tier dealers out  like Rich H, etc. These auction houses can buy the dealer out and put the entire inventory and auction it  themselves, I am surprised not more of this has happened but as more whales buyers come in, and when George Lucus museum starts aggressively  buying to complete their collection, the $$ are gonna get ramped up. On the flip side when you buy a book from Ha/CC/CL you know you are going to receive it properly packaged and that has to be a factor, as well buying from an established dealer. I agree,  Using E-bay I am use caution and avoid whenever I can, one way to get around it is buy from Amazon if the dealer lists there too, they are good about refunds etc.

  Robo, I understand that we grew up buying comics from the local drugstore or supermarket and that is something that I carry with me today, going to the rack on tuesday...not knowing what was going be there, amazing time, I have mixed feelings about how the investment market has taken over our hobbys headlines, its not about the book, its about the greater price it got this time at auction or sale. Investment if fine, but let's not forget why we are here, if you just only want to make money..play stocks, bonds, Calif real estate, and stay out unless you are a true comic book collector for the long haul. What is left?..we have ourselves, we have some the greatest adventures, artwork, stories, memories ....we have a heck of lot left to go. I predict 2019 will be the biggest year yet, and some of the most important collections will become available mostly thru auction, but also some thru private sale.

Edited May 13, 2018 by Mmehdy

[telerites]

4 hours ago, Robot Man said:

I miss Bud's booth selling old comics from his collection the most. Always, found a few cool gems. The "little booths" of comic sellers went away a long time ago.

That is what he brings to OAFCON - a few boxes of his personal collection and some of catalog/online items.  I bought this Prize from him a couple of years ago - it was raw and I have since had it slabbed.

Edited May 13, 2018 by telerites

[50YrsCollctngCmcs]

1 hour ago, telerites said:

That is what he brings to OAFCON - a few boxes of his personal collection and some of catalog/online items.  I bought this Prize from him a couple of years ago - it was raw and I have since had it slabbed.

Yeah, I've found some gems in those boxes too. Mostly Kelly books for me including some cool old Our Gangs.

[Robot Man]

6 hours ago, Mmehdy said:

Consolidation is what occurs in any business when the $$$ are there.  A 12M comic book auction  which occurred this weekend will raise a few heads on that number, the good part is that a lot of GREAT stuff comes on the market in one central place. I agree with you Robo there is nothing like finding comics in different places such as garage sales, antique stores, etc but E-bay eliminated a big chuck of that, and if  I had to guess, the biggest sellers of comic books in the world is E-Bay in terms of quantity. Don't be surprised if one or more dealers such as CC begin buying some midsize dealers. Chuck/Mile High went around after the last bust and paid 5cents on the dollar for the smaller dealers and still is buying low-tier dealers out  like Rich H, etc. These auction houses can buy the dealer out and put the entire inventory and auction it  themselves, I am surprised not more of this has happened but as more whales buyers come in, and when George Lucus museum starts aggressively  buying to complete their collection, the $$ are gonna get ramped up. On the flip side when you buy a book from Ha/CC/CL you know you are going to receive it properly packaged and that has to be a factor, as well buying from an established dealer. I agree,  Using E-bay I am use caution and avoid whenever I can, one way to get around it is buy from Amazon if the dealer lists there too, they are good about refunds etc.

  Robo, I understand that we grew up buying comics from the local drugstore or supermarket and that is something that I carry with me today, going to the rack on tuesday...not knowing what was going be there, amazing time, I have mixed feelings about how the investment market has taken over our hobbys headlines, its not about the book, its about the greater price it got this time at auction or sale. Investment if fine, but let's not forget why we are here, if you just only want to make money..play stocks, bonds, Calif real estate, and stay out unless you are a true comic book collector for the long haul. What is left?..we have ourselves, we have some the greatest adventures, artwork, stories, memories ....we have a heck of lot left to go. I predict 2019 will be the biggest year yet, and some of the most important collections will become available mostly thru auction, but also some thru private sale.

I just hate buying from big auction houses. It takes all the fun out of it. Like SDCC all the extra money grab really turns me off. It usually prevents me from spending the extra bucks to land a book. Heck, at this point there just isn't much left I really want bad anyway.

I'm not a high grade chaser. I do chase rare books but usually grade isn't my biggest focus. They do turn up on eBay but the competition is too fierce for me. I have been some pretty insane amounts and coming up  empty. When I finally get lucky and get a book with an un-disclosed centerfold and a nasty seller, it just turns me off.

Sure Mitch, I'm a geezer. I remember the good old days. Do I miss the past? Hell yes. I am a realist though. I never thought comics would be worth what they are today. I'm not whining. You are right, if you really want to invest. Blue Chip stocks and CA real estate are far better and have been real good to me. And when I get ready to sell my collection, I will be laughing all the way to the bank. Sad part of is a lot of what makes me what I am and many, many years of happy times will be gone. Just not willing to sell out for mere money yet...

[Robot Man]

1 hour ago, 40YrsCollctngCmcs said:

Yeah, I've found some gems in those boxes too. Mostly Kelly books for me including some cool old Our Gangs.

That is exactly what I'm talking about with Bud. In addition to being just a great guy, and a devoted comic fan, finding a book like that at a real reasonable price in one of his boxes was a regular occurance. I miss that. What SDCC was all about for me. 

[BeholdersEye]

On 5/11/2018 at 1:27 PM, Mmehdy said:

According to the "Times of San Diego" article and Bud Plants Facebook page--he is done...1970-2017...Amazon got him.. SDCC did not let in the real comic book collectors....He is still going to do little shows, but it's OVER...Folks, and I hate to say this....the SDCC Ain't what it used be...... Mile high said some interesting stuff also in the article about SDCC...Dylan said it best...the "times they are a changing" Thank you Bud for all the great books and browse time your booth gave me.

...and recently Romitaman Original Art announced this is his last show and he's one of the Top 3 Comic Art Dealers, arguably #1 for his pricing, broad inventory including both affordable for budget minded collectors and high end for prestige collectors or investors,  and ability to continually obtain new pieces fresh to market regularly. 

SDCC is still a great show when you get there and settled in, but the hoops you have to jump through as an attendee often makes it less worthwhile.  There's still enough traditional dealers in original comic art and vintage comic books (thank goodness it's not a flea market of just dollar bins!).  The cosplay, corporate booths and celebrity three-ring circus atmosphere with the crowds is tough, but if you stick around the vintage comic area and artists alley section it's easy to navigate and remain with elbow room.

I think eventually the traditional comic vendors may move out to an adjacent convention just for purists into comics, no frills.  I'm sure it's semi-political with the City of San Diego if this were done in competition of SDCC and it would have to be either in the Los Angeles area or Oceanside and the surrounding SD area.  I know there's a pre-preview night type show coming to LA this year for comics and art, but it's not exclusive or separate from SDCC, more of a "since I'm in the area" type of situation for dealers to showcase before SDCC.

 

[Pickie]

11 hours ago, Mmehdy said:

(...) and when George Lucus museum starts aggressively  buying to complete their collection, (...) (1)

 

I predict 2019 will be the biggest year yet, and some of the most important collections will become available mostly thru auction, but also some thru private sale. (2)

(1) Interesting, I wouldn't expect them to be on the lookout for (more) comic books? (OA, yes, but books?)

(2) Interesting, I wouldn't expect 2019 to be the biggest year yet. In fact, I expect the dispersions of big collections to come to be scarce and, if any, rather to spread over a long period of time ... 

[Mmehdy]

1 hour ago, Pickie said:

(1) Interesting, I wouldn't expect them to be on the lookout for (more) comic books? (OA, yes, but books?)

(2) Interesting, I wouldn't expect 2019 to be the biggest year yet. In fact, I expect the dispersions of big collections to come to be scarce and, if any, rather to spread over a long period of time ... 

1- It was pretty well know that George, who co-owned Supersnipe comic book store, had completed his major issue comic book  collection right after the Empire Strikes Back was released, and believe me its a great, however that is not every comic book ever made, and over the years Good Girl Art comics etc came into fancy...I know he does not need Action 1 but some of the minor issues/titles are not there. He has always collected original art including buying Carl Barks paintings when they original came out, along with Steven. The old word has it that he owns the OA to the cover of ASM1 and he has always been a player in the original art market, including illustration and pin up for quite some time. He will be a player in the future , both comic book and OA.

2-The economic boom cannot continue forever, I see a dip due to inflation/ bond prices and its about that time in 2019 in a economy has historically gone they cycles every 10 years or so and  add a possible political change at the top and BINGO.  The smart guys  are always ahead of the curve and they are are gonna see  coming from a mile away. The issue is not the older collector, who paid pennys on the dollar for there collection and can hang on forever, but the new INVESTORS..those who bought mainly to make a profit like any other kind of widget, they will dump and run. I repeat 2019 will be so far the best year of available quality GA/SA ever since the late 70's.  In 2019, Demand will also increase among  new "whale" clients as comic book movies  continue take over hollywood, with the both #1 and #2  for 2018 movies being comic book over 1 billion dollars gross each. Remember, in any auction it only takes two...who want buy.  Movie theaters are coming to the middle east, and these Marvel films  are gonna have a cultural effect on people who have unlimited funds.   The Avengers just broke box office record in China for 200M for a weekend, it is gonna be interesting to see if that has an impact on the market when  Asian collectors turn their attention to comic books. I know here in California asian buyers from China are active and tend to pay cash for property purchases.  2019 is gonna be a great time to buy AND a good time to sell. I would be very picky however, on the buy side. I would upgrade existing copies to the highest grade you can afford, grade everything you have left in your grading pile to maximize your potential return and get you want lists ready.

Edited May 14, 2018 by Mmehdy

[Pickie]

@Mmehdy: Thank you for your insights, I'm not in that poole of "investor fans" and I don't know anyone personally who is. And I'm happy about that because I don't like the idea of having to sell at some point (that's what an investment is for, after all). But, although being a hobbyist/keeper, I still like the idea of a prospering market very much so as to see what new people and what new "treasures" are going to come along ...

So are you saying some new investors (who will be confident) will buy from old investors (who will "dump and run"), but there will be very few old collections (owner "can hang on forever") that are going to be auctioned off ... That's more of what I had in mind.

[batman_fan]

There is an old school comic show in Denver next weekend (May 20th). Tickets are $10 to get in and free parking. I am planning to go and really try to spend some money to help support it. 

[N e r V]

10 hours ago, Mmehdy said:

1- It was pretty well know that George, who co-owned Supersnipe comic book store, had completed his major issue comic book  collection right after the Empire Strikes Back was released, and believe me its a great, however that is not every comic book ever made, and over the years Good Girl Art comics etc came into fancy...I know he does not need Action 1 but some of the minor issues/titles are not there. He has always collected original art including buying Carl Barks paintings when they original came out, along with Steven. The old word has it that he owns the OA to the cover of ASM1 and he has always been a player in the original art market, including illustration and pin up for quite some time. He will be a player in the future , both comic book and OA.

2-The economic boom cannot continue forever, I see a dip due to inflation/ bond prices and its about that time in 2019 in a economy has historically gone they cycles every 10 years or so and  add a possible political change at the top and BINGO.  The smart guys  are always ahead of the curve and they are are gonna see  coming from a mile away. The issue is not the older collector, who paid pennys on the dollar for there collection and can hang on forever, but the new INVESTORS..those who bought mainly to make a profit like any other kind of widget, they will dump and run. I repeat 2019 will be so far the best year of available quality GA/SA ever since the late 70's.  In 2019, Demand will also increase among  new "whale" clients as comic book movies  continue take over hollywood, with the both #1 and #2  for 2018 movies being comic book over 1 billion dollars gross each. Remember, in any auction it only takes two...who want buy.  Movie theaters are coming to the middle east, and these Marvel films  are gonna have a cultural effect on people who have unlimited funds.   The Avengers just broke box office record in China for 200M for a weekend, it is gonna be interesting to see if that has an impact on the market when  Asian collectors turn their attention to comic books. I know here in California asian buyers from China are active and tend to pay cash for property purchases.  2019 is gonna be a great time to buy AND a good time to sell. I would be very picky however, on the buy side. I would upgrade existing copies to the highest grade you can afford, grade everything you have left in your grading pile to maximize your potential return and get you want lists ready.

The most popular date by economist is 2020 for the next recession. We are well into the current boom period. It’s not an exact science but it’s also not a matter of if but rather when the next recession will hit. I’m super curious myself to see what is going to happen to the entire market at that point. I’m not an investor either in my comics (though I probably should be) but I’m already prepping my other investments for a economic wall within the next 2-3 years and paying down and controlling any debt until then.

[Mmehdy]

10 hours ago, Pickie said:

@Mmehdy: Thank you for your insights, I'm not in that poole of "investor fans" and I don't know anyone personally who is. And I'm happy about that because I don't like the idea of having to sell at some point (that's what an investment is for, after all). But, although being a hobbyist/keeper, I still like the idea of a prospering market very much so as to see what new people and what new "treasures" are going to come along ...

So are you saying some new investors (who will be confident) will buy from old investors (who will "dump and run"), but there will be very few old collections (owner "can hang on forever") that are going to be auctioned off ... That's more of what I had in mind.

A new "whale" client has the ability to impact the market greater than 20 regular new collectors, especially in an auction setting. 2019 will be a record year for the auction houses also, if they were publicly traded might be a great investment  as they profit on both an up and down market. As far as investors go, it seems more of them are just that, not in it for the long run, and not a true collector...more of a speculator  on ultra key GA/SA key books. There are a lot of old collections out there, however many could be bought outright and then brought to market to recycle. Not an exact science, but my gut tells me 2019 will be an record year for acquiring great material for your collection.

Edited May 14, 2018 by Mmehdy

[MrBedrock]

32 minutes ago, Mmehdy said:

A new "whale" client has the ability to impact the market greater than 20 regular new collectors, especially in an auction setting. 2019 will be a record year for the auction houses also, if they were publicly traded might be a great investment  as they profit on both an up and down market. As far as investors go, it seems more of them are just that, not in it for the long run, and not a true collector...more of a speculator  on ultra key GA/SA key books. There are a lot of old collections out there, however many could be bought outright and then brought to market to recycle. Not an exact science, but my gut tells me 2019 will be an record year for acquiring great material for your collection.

A group of 20 "whales" could be a school, gam or pod.

[N e r V]

12 minutes ago, MrBedrock said:

A group of 20 "whales" could be a school, gam or pod.

I think you are one of the whales he was talking about...

[MrBedrock]

1 minute ago, N e r V said:

I think you are one of the whales he was talking about...

I have been beached.

[N e r V]

 

 

[N e r V]

57 minutes ago, MrBedrock said:

I have been beached.

Don’t be sad Bedrock, you’re still a Super Whale in my book...