Heritage's Next Event Auction has started posting books ! 32 32

[woowoo]

On 5/16/2022 at 8:09 PM, batman_fan said:

I know how I would treat that book if I owned it

I see you agree he is purple 

[Black Bat]

On 5/16/2022 at 1:17 PM, batman_fan said:

I predict this book will get some interest

If only it had a signature!

[batman_fan]

On 5/16/2022 at 10:45 PM, Black Bat said:

If only it had a signature!

 

[Tri-Color Brian]

On 5/15/2022 at 4:40 PM, lou_fine said:

Yes, but aren't all of these Verified Signature books which means that CGC is not only encouraging this destructive process, but actively facilitating and knowingly participating in it even though they are clearly aware of the damage being done to the underlying books themselves.    

Then again, maybe it's really nothing more than just a case of to each their own, as one person's definition of "destruction" might just be another person's definition of "beautification".    

There was a time when sharpies were not used to sign books.  What fool thought it would be a good idea to use sharpies?  I'd rather have the ballpoint sig...

And, my apologies for showing a non-GA book...so here's a GA book to further illustrate...signed by Kirby in his kitchen...

Edited May 17, 2022 by Tri-ColorBrian

[woowoo]

On 5/17/2022 at 10:31 AM, Tri-ColorBrian said:

There was a time when sharpies were not used to sign books.  What fool thought it would be a good idea to use sharpies?  I'd rather have the ballpoint sig...

And, my apologies for showing a non-GA book...so here's a GA book to further illustrate...signed by Kirby in his kitchen...

I do not like the sharpie but the ballpoint would damage the book if not done really light and after 30 sigs Damage would be high.

Edited May 17, 2022 by woowoo

[lou_fine]

On 5/14/2022 at 8:00 PM, lou_fine said:

After almost a full year of auctions with Promise Collection books in there, is anybody aware of even one Promise book that has managed to sell for a higher price point after coming back to auction on a second go round?  

Although a different environment at the time, still a stark comparison to the Jon Berk Collection from almost 5 years ago where I believe that virtually every single Jon Berk book was sold at a higher price point in subsequent auctions right from the get go.  

 

On 5/15/2022 at 5:16 AM, tth2 said:

So you're saying that if you're a consignor and want to maximize your sales, go with Heritage, and if you want to leave money on the table for everyone else, then go with ComiConnect?

How soon we forget because it's rather obvious that the strategies used to auctioned off these two collections were completely different, and probably due to the fact that they just might have had two different purposes in mind.  

With the Berk collection being auctioned off all in one shot like that, it was acknowledged by many boardies here at the time that this strategy would clearly not get top dollar for all of the books in the collection, but would result in the books being spread much more widely to a far greater number of buyers.  As Jon himself had stated, this was a collection which he had been the caretaker of for all of his collecting life, and the sale of it was to see the books passed down to the next generation of comic book collectors to treasure and take care of them like he had.  Although I might be a bit naive here, but with the sale of Jon's collection, I never once got the impression that it was about the grades or the money, and by the time it was all said and done, I believe it did achieved the purpose that Jon had initially set out to do.  

On the other hand, with the Promise Collection, the impression that I got was that it was nothing but all about the grades and getting nothing but top dollar for the books right from the moment when they were first unveiled.  Maybe just a sign of the times, but it seem that the Promise books were targeted not so much for the regular comic book collectors, but more for the ones with the deeper pockets including hopefully bringing in some of the newbies from outside the comic book hobby with their new found money.  And as such, by the time it's all said and done, I believe Heritage will have achieved the purpose that it had initially set out to do. 

In this age of certification with the CPR game in full and active play, the mere fact that we have not seen even one single upgrade to date or heard of anybody even dare to try for an upgrade speaks volumes.  I guess it says that if you really want to get maximum top grades for your books and not be shortchanged, you should really be sending your books through Heritage for followup grading instead of sending them directly to CGC yourself.  

Edited May 17, 2022 by lou_fine

[tth2]

On 5/18/2022 at 5:59 AM, lou_fine said:

 

How soon we forget because it's rather obvious that the strategies used to auctioned off these two collections were completely different, and probably due to the fact that they just might have had two different purposes in mind.  

With the Berk collection being auctioned off all in one shot like that, it was acknowledged by many boardies here at the time that this strategy would clearly not get top dollar for all of the books in the collection, but would result in the books being spread much more widely to a far greater number of buyers.  As Jon himself had stated, this was a collection which he had been the caretaker of for all of his collecting life, and the sale of it was to see the books passed down to the next generation of comic book collectors to treasure and take care of them like he had.  Although I might be a bit naive here, but with the sale of Jon's collection, I never once got the impression that it was about the grades or the money, and by the time it was all said and done, I believe it did achieved the purpose that Jon had initially set out to do.  

On the other hand, with the Promise Collection, the impression that I got was that it was nothing but all about the grades and getting nothing but top dollar for the books right from the moment when they were first unveiled.  Maybe just a sign of the times, but it seem that the Promise books were targeted not so much for the regular comic book collectors, but more for the ones with the deeper pockets including hopefully bringing in some of the newbies from outside the comic book hobby with their new found money.  And as such, by the time it's all said and done, I believe Heritage will have achieved the purpose that it had initially set out to do. 

In this age of certification with the CPR game in full and active play, the mere fact that we have not seen even one single upgrade to date or heard of anybody even dare to try for an upgrade speaks volumes.  I guess it says that if you really want to get maximum top grades for your books and not be shortchanged, you should really be sending your books through Heritage for followup grading instead of sending them directly to CGC yourself.  

Sounds like a nice theory, but there was no way of assuring that Jon's books went to a next generation of comic collectors who would treasure them and take care of them like he had. 

In fact, just the opposite, as we've seen a lot of Berk books come back on the market.  One could actually argue that the money that Jon was leaving on the table meant that flippers like Ritter were guaranteed a big profit when they bought the books and pressed and resubbed them, so there were many buyers who were incentivized to buy them to maximize and flip rather than treasure them and preserve them.  Personally, I would've preferred that Jon pocketed the extra dollars rather than the flippers.

Because the Promise books were already maximized and went for so much, my guess is that not many were bought by dealers or professional flippers and most actually went to collectors.  Based on the results from resales so far, anyone who intended to buy them for a quick flip has been seriously deterred.  I would therefore expect the holding period for the Promise books to be much longer than the Berk books.

[woowoo]

Clark as good as mine @GreatCaesarsGhost

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

On 5/17/2022 at 10:34 PM, woowoo said:

Clark as good as mine @GreatCaesarsGhost

Harold I’m glad you’ve got such a fine book. I’m jealous!

[woowoo]

On 5/17/2022 at 8:45 PM, GreatCaesarsGhost said:

Harold I’m glad you’ve got such a fine book. I’m jealous!

No Vincent was offering the book at 750k so I am drunk bidding at 180k No chance of winning.  wait i said the same thing on that Marvel 2 

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

On 5/17/2022 at 10:57 PM, woowoo said:

No Vincent was offering the book at 750k so I am drunk bidding at 180k No chance of winning.  wait i said the same thing on that Marvel 2 

Heck, Harold. I figure you’ve got 2 or 3 of these

[woowoo]

On 5/18/2022 at 5:01 AM, GreatCaesarsGhost said:

Heck, Harold. I figure you’ve got 2 or 3 of these

[Gotham Kid]

On 5/17/2022 at 1:25 AM, woowoo said:

Who wants a Blue Label 100k plus book?  I say but one in purple for 30k and have 70 left over.  I also say at my age I never get a 20 year loan 

100k ?

5.0s break 100k, easily 

The 8.5 will probably hit 100k the first day of bidding…

Edited May 18, 2022 by Gotham Kid

[lou_fine]

On 5/17/2022 at 7:35 PM, tth2 said:

Sounds like a nice theory, but there was no way of assuring that Jon's books went to a next generation of comic collectors who would treasure them and take care of them like he had. 

In fact, just the opposite, as we've seen a lot of Berk books come back on the market.  One could actually argue that the money that Jon was leaving on the table meant that flippers like Ritter were guaranteed a big profit when they bought the books and pressed and resubbed them, so there were many buyers who were incentivized to buy them to maximize and flip rather than treasure them and preserve them.  Personally, I would've preferred that Jon pocketed the extra dollars rather than the flippers.

Because the Promise books were already maximized and went for so much, my guess is that not many were bought by dealers or professional flippers and most actually went to collectors.  Based on the results from resales so far, anyone who intended to buy them for a quick flip has been seriously deterred.  I would therefore expect the holding period for the Promise books to be much longer than the Berk books.

Athough I would tend to agree with you from a strict theoretical logic POV, it should be noted that theory often does not line up with what actually happens in real life practice.  

Although there were clearly dealers like Ritter (i.e. clearly the most obvious one) who were sweeping up some of the books from the Jon Berk collection for a fast and highly profitable resale, the actual number of Berk books coming back onto the secondary market is still actually only a very small percentage of the original collection which numbered something around 3,000 books or thereabouts.  Although the Promise Collection is going to be around 5,000 books by the time it's all said and done, I wish there was some way to survey the number or proportion of long time collectors  who had picked up the books from the Berk Collection, as opposed to the proportion from the Promise Collection.  

Personally, I picked up close to about a dozen books from the Berk Collection for my own personal collection, but I highly doubt that I will end up with any of the Promise Collection books by the time it's finished.  I have heard the same thing from a few of the other collectors here, but then that might be due in part to the fact that I tend to swim in the shallow end of the pool, as opposed to the more deeper pocketed buyers like you who tend to swim in the deeper end of the pool.  Definitely more importantly, however, I was also highly influenced by the fact that I much prefer to acquire books from the HTF 1930's time period like the ones which Jon had in his collection and which seemingly never ever shows up for sale in any condition, as opposed to the much later books from the 1940's which the Promise Collection was primarily made up of.  

Although it certainly can't be proven, I somehow just tend to get the feeling that the Berk Collection books went to a bigger and wider range of collectors, as opposed to the Promise Collection which probably was sold to a narrower but deeper pocketed range of collectors and newbies entering into the marketplace during the past couple of years.  Well, let's have a survey of two collectors (one from the shallow end and one from the deeper end ) here anyways, did you or will you most likely end up buying more books from the Promise Collection as compared to what you had purchased from the Jon Berk Collection? 

 

Edited May 19, 2022 by lou_fine

[tth2]

I've bought zero books from the Promise collection so far.  Even in the weekly auctions they're going for more than I'm willing to pay.

Edited May 19, 2022 by tth2

[tth2]

On 5/19/2022 at 1:30 PM, lou_fine said:

Definitely more importantly, however, I was also highly influenced by the fact that I much prefer to acquire books from the HTF 1930's time period like the ones which Jon had in his collection and which seemingly never ever shows up for sale in any condition, as opposed to the much later books from the 1940's which the Promise Collection was primarily made up of.  

Good point about Berk's books being from an earlier time period.

However, while the Promise books came from the less scarce mid-to-late 1940s, there were a lot of Promise books from titles I'd never seen before, certainly not in these kinds of grades.  And the Promise books also had the good fortune of including LOTS of GGA, which happened to hit one of the market's current sweet spots.

[adamstrange]

On 5/19/2022 at 10:54 AM, tth2 said:

I've bought zero books from the Promise collection so far.  Even in the weekly auctions they're going for more than I'm willing to pay.

I don't think I've seen any obvious bargains among the Promise books.  Everything looks fully priced for 2022, with many priced for 2032.

[clarkkentdds]

I think we are going to see a pretty decent correction on all this stuff...

[lou_fine]

On 5/19/2022 at 7:54 AM, tth2 said:

I've bought zero books from the Promise collection so far.  Even in the weekly auctions they're going for more than I'm willing to pay.

I am actually not that surprised you haven't brought any books from the Promise Collection because based upon some of your more recents posts on these boards here, you seem to be approaching the point in your collecting life cycle whereby you are starting to downsize your personal collection, as opposed to significantly adding to it.  

Based upon what I have heard from other long time collectors along with some boardies here through PM's, it seems that although they did acquire some books from the Berk Collection, it's pretty much nada from the Promise Collection to this point in time.  Nothing definitive, but this sort of confirms my initial thinking or gut feeling that the distribution of the books from the Berk Collection was more widespread and indeed most likely did go to a much wider range of long time collectors. 

[lou_fine]

On 5/19/2022 at 7:58 AM, tth2 said:

Good point about Berk's books being from an earlier time period.

Yes, when I first moved away from collecting new MA comics off the shelves of the LCS's, I moved right past the SA and GA time periods and started my first (but very short) foray in collecting vintage collectible comic book with the very early pre-hero time period from early 1938 and before.  Although each of those years were just a single year, it just seem so much more than that simply because every year you moved back just seem so much tougher to find.  Sure, books from 1937 were tough to find, but nice copies of DC's or Centaurs from 1936 were even much tougher, and of course DC's from 1935 were almost impossible to find.    

 

On 5/19/2022 at 7:58 AM, tth2 said:

However, while the Promise books came from the less scarce mid-to-late 1940s, there were a lot of Promise books from titles I'd never seen before, certainly not in these kinds of grades.

As I had mentioned in some of my previous posts here, this might be due in part to the perception by many collectors here that some of these rather forgettable 3rd and 4th tier titles (which I can't even remember now even after all of these Promise weekend auctions ) were not worth slabbing due to their perceived low demand and relatively low value in the marketplace.  Especially if collectors had only the odd or random copy here and there within their collection, as opposed to the small runs that were present in the Promise Collection which made it a lot easier to hype and build up some degree of interest in them.  

 

On 5/19/2022 at 7:58 AM, tth2 said:

And the Promise books also had the good fortune of including LOTS of GGA, which happened to hit one of the market's current sweet spots.

Probably a case of to each their own, but from my own personal POV, I thought there actually wasn't too much of the classic GGA or classic PCH cover books in the Promise Collection once you got past the first couple of Heritage Signature Auctions.  Just a lot of small runs of rather forgettable titles that sold for realtively crazy money where I believe the winners are going to have to hold onto them for a long long time if they hope to ever get their money back on them.