Superman vs Thor 2 2

[kav]

17 minutes ago, KirbyJack said:

If I’m writing it, Thor beats Sups every time.

Its hammertime.

[Pat Thomas]

6 hours ago, kav said:

DC tapped prolific top science fiction talent like edmond hamilton and otto binder to write these stories.  There is no way stan lee could have written a story just being shown some absurd cover.  That takes a different level of talent.

Look, I like Superman just fine, and I collect Action Comics, Adventure Comics, Superman, and World's Finest, and I plan on eventually owning 90% of each series. But I have a very difficult time actually reading DC Silver Age Superman Comics. I love buying them and flipping through my collection, but most of the stories are downright horrible. The "mysteries" didn't make sense half the time, and the way Superman interacted with his "friends" was sometimes psychotic. But what really gets under my skin is that the many times Superman is transformed into "Superbaby", his speech pattern doesn't become childish; Instead, he sounds like a stupid version of the Savage Hulk (Me do this, Me do that, etc.). You're trying to tell us Stan Lee couldn't write at that level? I was 9 when I read my first comics (in 1975), and I loved Spider-Man and the Avengers. I would sit on the floor at the comic spinner in the drug store at the mall while Mom shopped for clothes and other boring stuff, and occasionally a DC cover would catch my eye. Even at that age, the stories didn't seem to me that they had any depth to them. Every story seemed thrown together just enough to fill the pages it needed, all the heroes talked weird, and continuity didn't matter from one story to the next. I was used to good guys who got into arguments and remembered that they were mad at each other, and they talked more like real people. Stan wrote continued stories and tried to make sure all the Marvel books took place in the same world and affected each other. Most Superman comics had 2 or 3 unrelated stories per issue. I don't see how you could consider the DC stuff from that era superior to Marvel in any way. There's a reason why Marvel was able to take so many readers from DC, until New Teen Titans came out. That was the first DC series I thought read like a Marvel.

[kav]

7 minutes ago, Pat Thomas said:

Look, I like Superman just fine, and I collect Action Comics, Adventure Comics, Superman, and World's Finest, and I plan on eventually owning 90% of each series. But I have a very difficult time actually reading DC Silver Age Superman Comics. I love buying them and flipping through my collection, but most of the stories are downright horrible. The "mysteries" didn't make sense half the time, and the way Superman interacted with his "friends" was sometimes psychotic. But what really gets under my skin is that the many times Superman is transformed into "Superbaby", his speech pattern doesn't become childish; Instead, he sounds like a stupid version of the Savage Hulk (Me do this, Me do that, etc.). You're trying to tell us Stan Lee couldn't write at that level? I was 9 when I read my first comics (in 1975), and I loved Spider-Man and the Avengers. I would sit on the floor at the comic spinner in the drug store at the mall while Mom shopped for clothes and other boring stuff, and occasionally a DC cover would catch my eye. Even at that age, the stories didn't seem to me that they had any depth to them. Every story seemed thrown together just enough to fill the pages it needed, all the heroes talked weird, and continuity didn't matter from one story to the next. I was used to good guys who got into arguments and remembered that they were mad at each other, and they talked more like real people. Stan wrote continued stories and tried to make sure all the Marvel books took place in the same world and affected each other. Most Superman comics had 2 or 3 unrelated stories per issue. I don't see how you could consider the DC stuff from that era superior to Marvel in any way. There's a reason why Marvel was able to take so many readers from DC, until New Teen Titans came out. That was the first DC series I thought read like a Marvel.

Doing self contained short stories that had a beginning middle and end in a short number of pages and coming up with elaborate reasons for stuff takes more imagination than "5 pages of slugfest.  Add wisecracks".

Edited May 22, 2020 by kav

[kav]

43 minutes ago, Pat Thomas said:

Look, I like Superman just fine, and I collect Action Comics, Adventure Comics, Superman, and World's Finest, and I plan on eventually owning 90% of each series. But I have a very difficult time actually reading DC Silver Age Superman Comics. I love buying them and flipping through my collection, but most of the stories are downright horrible. The "mysteries" didn't make sense half the time, and the way Superman interacted with his "friends" was sometimes psychotic. But what really gets under my skin is that the many times Superman is transformed into "Superbaby", his speech pattern doesn't become childish; Instead, he sounds like a stupid version of the Savage Hulk (Me do this, Me do that, etc.). You're trying to tell us Stan Lee couldn't write at that level? I was 9 when I read my first comics (in 1975), and I loved Spider-Man and the Avengers. I would sit on the floor at the comic spinner in the drug store at the mall while Mom shopped for clothes and other boring stuff, and occasionally a DC cover would catch my eye. Even at that age, the stories didn't seem to me that they had any depth to them. Every story seemed thrown together just enough to fill the pages it needed, all the heroes talked weird, and continuity didn't matter from one story to the next. I was used to good guys who got into arguments and remembered that they were mad at each other, and they talked more like real people. Stan wrote continued stories and tried to make sure all the Marvel books took place in the same world and affected each other. Most Superman comics had 2 or 3 unrelated stories per issue. I don't see how you could consider the DC stuff from that era superior to Marvel in any way. There's a reason why Marvel was able to take so many readers from DC, until New Teen Titans came out. That was the first DC series I thought read like a Marvel.

You might enjoy the series where we demolished the silliness of those stories though:
http://www.championcitycomics.com/2012/05/kav-tony-break-it-down-action-comics_22.html

[Ken Aldred]

1 hour ago, Pat Thomas said:

There's a reason why Marvel was able to take so many readers from DC, until New Teen Titans came out. That was the first DC series I thought read like a Marvel.

It was just copying the New X-Men formula, blatantly.

[James J Johnson]

On ‎5‎/‎20‎/‎2020 at 3:19 PM, kav said:

True but keep in mind supes has a massive mullet tho.

Judging by the expression on their faces, one of them might have passed the Devil's wind.

[Ken Aldred]

On 5/21/2020 at 5:31 AM, kav said:

What if stupidman lost his powers tho-could he still de-feet Thor?  Survey says YES

Yup.  He'd still have his Kryptonian martial arts training to fall back on.

(One of the knowledge crystals he keeps at the Fortress of Solitude, IIRC.) 

And, maybe then have his comic become 'Clark Kent, mild-mannered Master of Kung Fu'.

 

Edited May 22, 2020 by Ken Aldred

[kav]

17 minutes ago, Ken Aldred said:

Yup.  He'd still have his Kryptonian martial arts training to fall back on.

Klur-Kor if I remember correctly.  Not that it was explained in the SA how he even learned it and not that he ever did anything but punch things so seems like a McDojo style.

[Ken Aldred]

44 minutes ago, kav said:

Klur-Kor if I remember correctly.  Not that it was explained in the SA how he even learned it and not that he ever did anything but punch things so seems like a McDojo style.

I was joking.  So, they actually did it? 

[James J Johnson]

1 hour ago, kav said:

Not that it was explained in the SA how he even learned it

If I'm not mistaken, I think it stemmed from the Brainiac bottled city of Kandor. A lot of Kryptonian lore and customs were intact, including KlurKor, God Bless Brainiac after all, he did them all a big favor as things turned out..

Edited May 22, 2020 by James J Johnson

[SeniorSurfer]

9 hours ago, KirbyJack said:

If I’m writing it, Thor beats Sups every time.

And then a follow-up story where he would leave Metropolis going to New York seeking the inevitable rematch, only to be sent packing by Dr. Strange.

[Ken Aldred]

6 hours ago, kav said:

Klur-Kor if I remember correctly.  Not that it was explained in the SA how he even learned it and not that he ever did anything but punch things so seems like a McDojo style.

So, what they could've done is have the Man of Steel temporarily become Steel Fist, the Living Weapon.

Maybe Marvel wouldn't have liked that, though.

Edited May 22, 2020 by Ken Aldred

[World Devourer]

With a well-written story that takes into account all factors, I'd have to give it to Thor.

Why? Thor is a GOD. His power levels are unbelievable - they HAVE to be to battle beings such as the Destroyer, Gladiator, the Heralds of Galactus, Mangog, Midgard Serpent, Surtur and Ulik. This is only addressed in the comics occasionally, but readers should always be reminded of this, especially when Thor is on Midgard and with the Avengers etc.

Thor also wields a magical weapon with a wide array of abilities. Magic, of course, is one of Superman's few vulnerabilities. John Byrne once stated in a interview that the JLA/Avengers story was flawed, and that the Thor/Superman fight would be a case of "one really strong guy hitting another really strong guy with a sledgehammer". Thor is also capable of withstanding the fires of Muspelheim (Surtur) and the cold of Jotunheim (Ymir), which gives him immunity to two of Superman's major abilities (heat vision and cold breath).

That said, there IS a way to placate everyone.

A 3-part story line called "Meeting of Magicks". Due to manipulation by Loki and Mordru - who are not so much working together but attempting to fulfill separate goals - there is an accident at the cosmic crossroads and after some exploring by the separate heroes, a meeting, misunderstanding and eventually a battle. Thor wins the first fight as Superman simply can't cope with a being that can match him in strength and also attacks with blows from a magical weapon, magical lightning, energy blasts etc. A deflated Superman then puts his super-intellect to use and combats Thor's magical abilities with Kryptonian science - possibly in the form of a suit of armour - and manages to stun Thor and banish him to the Phantom Zone. Superman is later surprised to learn that courtesy of Mjolnir, Thor has returned - but with new-found respect for Superman's abilities. The pair then team-up and with an awesome display of power and subtle not-so-used abilities (eg. Superman's ventriloquism and Thor's molecular manipulation) defeat the villains.

 

 

 

Edited May 22, 2020 by World Devourer

[Ken Aldred]

21 minutes ago, World Devourer said:

Why? Thor is a GOD. His power levels are unbelievable

Yup.  He's now thought to be deliberately holding back 'a bit' when fighting with mortals.

You don't often see his full-on power level in the comics.

Edited May 22, 2020 by Ken Aldred

[Gaard]

1 hour ago, World Devourer said:

With a well-written story that takes into account all factors, I'd have to give it to Thor.

 

 

 

Even Fat Gamer Beer-gut Thor?

[kav]

11 hours ago, Ken Aldred said:

I was joking.  So, they actually did it? 

yes they went there.
Klurkor is a hard style described as 'Kryptonian Karate', practiced by modern age (pre-nu52) Kara Zor-El (trained in the first level, which probably means 'beginner' or 'just above beginner'), and Silver Age Lois Lane (who used it to, among other things, defeat an evil roller-derby team... because it was the Silver Age). Silver Age Lois describes herself as a master of Klurkor, and I have no reason to doubt her.

Edited May 22, 2020 by kav

[World Devourer]

2 hours ago, Gaard said:

Even Fat Gamer Beer-gut Thor?

No, this is the Thor that was seen in:

Journey Into Mystery #109 - 169 (Thor humiliates Magneto, Absorbing Man, Super-Beast and the Super-Skrull, defeats Ego, High Evolutionary, Mangog and the Enchanters Three etc)

Avengers #158 - 181 (check out #166 - via technology Count Nefaria has endowed himself with the combined powers of Living Laser, Power Man and Whizzer but a hundred-fold. Despite this Nefaria panics when confronted with Thor's power)

Thor #300 (Thor lifts the Odinsword - a feat thought impossible - and throws it through Celestial Arishem)

Thor #337 - 389  (Simonson run + a few gems)

to name a few.

[shadroch]

2 hours ago, kav said:

yes they went there.
Klurkor is a hard style described as 'Kryptonian Karate', practiced by modern age (pre-nu52) Kara Zor-El (trained in the first level, which probably means 'beginner' or 'just above beginner'), and Silver Age Lois Lane (who used it to, among other things, defeat an evil roller-derby team... because it was the Silver Age). Silver Age Lois describes herself as a master of Klurkor, and I have no reason to doubt her.

So a person with a lifetime of combat experience like General Zod would kick a neophyte like Kal Els ?

[theCapraAegagrus]

On 5/21/2020 at 2:54 PM, Comixroc said:

Ok, if he’s an “ideal”, and an “ideal” cannot be defeated or destroyed....🤔🤔🤔🤔, that means he can never be beaten.

Touche.

[theCapraAegagrus]

On 5/21/2020 at 3:11 PM, Crops068 said:

While yes, not quite the same feel to it.