3rd time's the charm? Avengers 4 CGC 7.5: Improper encapsulation, damage by CGC & what to do next? - Updated Conclusion 0

[comicdonna]

I always buy the book, not the grade.  I can tell you I would not be happy with a now torn book in the same grade.  

[Randall Ries]

2 minutes ago, comicdonna said:

I always buy the book, not the grade.  I can tell you I would not be happy with a now torn book in the same grade.  

No. NOW what am I supposed to do with it? I am one of those unfortunates who would not be able to sell it to someone else without disclosure. Which is basically saying I WOULDN'T be able to sell it. I would know the tear was there. I couldn't inflict that on someone else whether they knew or not. At that point, may as WELL get a purple label and have a pro repair it. What a shame on such a fine 7.5, too. All I know is someone would be making up the difference to me in cash.

[MatterEaterLad]

If the tear wasn't there before, you should be compensated for the damage. 

 

Edited March 22, 2021 by MatterEaterLad

[The Lions Den]

Regardless of how it occurred, the book has been damaged. I'm very sorry for your loss.

Unfortunately, this kind of thing does happen when dealing with comics. And questioning the professionalism of CGC and their employees isn't going to help resolve the situation.

The question now is what's the next step?  

 

[Math Teacher]

Maybe questioning the professionalism is not appropriate, but discussing the situation surely is. I don't really keep up on this, but do major issues like this happen regularly? And what is regularly? Once every 500 books? Once every 2000 books? Once every 5000 books?

I have some books that I plan on sending in sometime soon (so I will get them back before Christmas). Fortunately, all of the books I am sending in would have a value of $750 or less. No, I don't want them damaged like the OP's were, but I would think that CGC would be more willing to pay for the damages to a $750 book compared to a $7,000 book. This is just an educated guess on my part; I certainly don't know it as fact.

[Phill the Governor]

3 hours ago, The Lions Den said:

Regardless of how it occurred, the book has been damaged. I'm very sorry for your loss.

Unfortunately, this kind of thing does happen when dealing with comics. And questioning the professionalism of CGC and their employees isn't going to help resolve the situation.

The question now is what's the next step?  

 

That is what I'm thinking as I'm sitting here reading this thread. 

The crazy part is that the majority of books I submit with the intention to sell. This was one of the few books, and only book from my personal collection that I have literally 0 interest in selling, that has been damaged. My dad gave it to me a few years ago at Christmas, and almost died a few months later. We bond the most over comic books, this one means a lot to me value aside.

[The Lions Den]

5 minutes ago, Phill the Governor said:

That is what I'm thinking as I'm sitting here reading this thread. 

The crazy part is that the majority of books I submit with the intention to sell. This was one of the few books, and only book from my personal collection that I have literally 0 interest in selling, that has been damaged. My dad gave it to me a few years ago at Christmas, and almost died a few months later. We bond the most over comic books, this one means a lot to me value aside.

If I had a personal attachment to the book, I would do everything I could to preserve it. The way it is right now would bother me. I'd consider sending this to someone who knows how to deal with an issue like this and who could make the book look as good as possible. I'm talking about a guy with an outstanding reputation who has already commented in this thread. I have the utmost confidence in him...

[thehumantorch]

10 hours ago, Phill the Governor said:

I do consider you an authority on grade, for obvious reasons. Do you say this because on a technical level "even if they didn't cause the tear/crease" the damage is considered a manufacturing defect and won't affect grade?

Regardless of this, new damage, regardless of the extent or how it is graded on a technical level, is surely unacceptable. Especially since the book was 1-day express mailed to CGC and then back to me, at their request, under the pretense of being properly encapsulated because of an initial lack of quality control. Clearly whoever encapsulated the book either 1. didn't follow up quality control check or 2. did and is either blind or apathetic. Since there is presumably a record in their system of who it was that did the work, that person needs to be talked to.

 

My biggest concern is that considering this track record, I have literally no reassurance that my book won't be damaged again. Which is why I was seriously asking if it's best to just cut my losses and accept it as is.

I had a problem last year with the bottom spacer not holding a book and allowing it to move inside the case.  That movement caused 2, 1/4 inch rips on the bottom back cover.  CGC did take it back, flatten it, and regrade it at the same grade, but I was disappointed that my book now had two visible rips that didn't exist before and I never received an apology or an explanation.

I'm really sorry this happened to you.  The book will never be the same.

Edited March 23, 2021 by thehumantorch

[Topnotchman]

I would notify CGC of this thread and request to send it back at there expense again, the folded piece can be unfolded and pressed flat.   

[thehumantorch]

1 hour ago, Topnotchman said:

I would notify CGC of this thread and request to send it back at there expense again, the folded piece can be unfolded and pressed flat.   

From my experience, CGC asked for pictures and then immediately made arrangements to have the book sent back for evaluation and they then pressed and regraded the book.  

[Randall Ries]

6 minutes ago, thehumantorch said:

From my experience, CGC asked for pictures and then immediately made arrangements to have the book sent back for evaluation and they then pressed and regraded the book.  

Regraded? How much of a hit did you take?

[Phill the Governor]

To add insult to injury I just noticed that the book is also so tightly sealed in the inner well, that the book was sealed with "SCS" (shaken comic syndrome). The entire top edge of the back cover has been creased. While I do understand this can happen to book while in transit, by mishandling, etc- there is no space for this book to move vertically - implying it wasn't damaged because it shifted- there is literally no room for it to have shifted. This was caused by improper encapsulation.

 

I don't care if it can be pressed out or not, that's not the point- this a problem. 

 

Edited March 23, 2021 by Phill the Governor

[Randall Ries]

49 minutes ago, Phill the Governor said:

To add insult to injury I just noticed that the book is also so tightly sealed in the inner well, that the book was sealed with "SCS" (shaken comic syndrome). The entire top edge of the back cover has been creased. While I do understand this can happen to book while in transit, by mishandling, etc- there is no space for this book to move vertically - implying it wasn't damaged because it shifted- there is literally no room for it to have shifted. This was caused by improper encapsulation.

 

I don't care if it can be pressed out or not, that's not the point- this a problem. 

 

It added another small tear to the edge too, didn't it?

[Phill the Governor]

21 minutes ago, Randall Ries said:

It added another small tear to the edge too, didn't it?

No, from what I can tell it's only a crease. 

[Phill the Governor]

So in summary:

The book was initially graded with the bottom of the inner well unsealed.

The book was graded a second time with (in order of severity):

• a new tear/crease on the bottom right edge of the front cover
• a crease along the entire edge of the back cover
• some little dot, that drives me nuts, on the first A in "Captain" that was not there before it was graded.
• a piece of plastic inside the case on the bottom back cover

 

 

 

Of all three main problems with the book (the piece of plastic is nothing really, an eyesore) the little dot is the most arbitrary. I get that. But considering the other two issues, this bothers me coming from a company that grades books according to arbitrary defects.

[Randall Ries]

5 minutes ago, Phill the Governor said:

So in summary:

The book was initially graded with the bottom of the inner well unsealed.

The book was graded a second time with (in order of severity):

• a new tear/crease on the bottom right edge of the front cover
• a crease along the entire edge of the back cover
• some little dot, that drives me nuts, on the first A in "Captain" that was not there before it was graded.
• a piece of plastic inside the case on the bottom back cover

 

 

 

Of all three main problems with the book (the piece of plastic is nothing really, an eyesore) the little dot is the most arbitrary. I get that. But considering the other two issues, this bothers me coming from a company that grades books according to arbitrary defects.

Well, the fact is the book was damaged. Makes one wonder if it's even the same book you sent in. I'm sure it must be. As you may have read, it isn't something I would take lying down. It's a $6k book or in today's weird market, a $25k book. I will be interested in hearing what CGC has to say for themselves.

As a small business person, I can say that when I create damage to someone else's property, I pay for it no questions asked. I tromped across someones new hardwood kitchen floor with those damned ice cleats on. I just wasn't thinking. I just didn't notice. When the client returned home, she sure did. She was hot and not in a good way. After she got it all out, she asked "What are you going to do about this?"

"I said "Please call a floor company of your choice and get an estimate. Whatever the estimate is, I will pay for it." So, she did. When I received the estimate, I went directly to the flooring place and paid their estimate. Embarrassing? Yes. The floor guy said: "Yes. You made a mistake. But you know? We RARELY see this happen where someone is accused of ruining someone else's thing and they come in and pay the estimate to have it replaced. So, good on you! Your client was impressed as well. They had nothing but good things to say."

Because. That's what a company with integrity does. I didn't pay to have it "restored". I paid to have it replaced. A cherry wood kitchen floor. Ouch. Gonna have to walk a LOTTA dogs to pay for it. I ruined it. I pay for it. It is as simple as that. I paid. Not insurance. I paid. CGC ought to do the same. And get rid of an employee who should probably not be handling other peoples collectibles.

[THE_BEYONDER]

3 hours ago, Phill the Governor said:

To add insult to injury I just noticed that the book is also so tightly sealed in the inner well, that the book was sealed with "SCS" (shaken comic syndrome). The entire top edge of the back cover has been creased. While I do understand this can happen to book while in transit, by mishandling, etc- there is no space for this book to move vertically - implying it wasn't damaged because it shifted- there is literally no room for it to have shifted. This was caused by improper encapsulation.

 

I don't care if it can be pressed out or not, that's not the point- this a problem. 

 

What a complete cluster .  I’m sorry CGC did this to your father’s book.

[THE_BEYONDER]

3 hours ago, Phill the Governor said:

To add insult to injury I just noticed that the book is also so tightly sealed in the inner well, that the book was sealed with "SCS" (shaken comic syndrome). The entire top edge of the back cover has been creased. While I do understand this can happen to book while in transit, by mishandling, etc- there is no space for this book to move vertically - implying it wasn't damaged because it shifted- there is literally no room for it to have shifted. This was caused by improper encapsulation.

 

I don't care if it can be pressed out or not, that's not the point- this a problem. 

 

What a complete cluster .  I’m sorry CGC did this to your father’s book.

[The Lions Den]

  

[Phill the Governor]

I was going to call tomorrow, but to my surprise CGC's customer service just reached out to me first.

I will be sending the book back for a third time, against my better judgement, to hopefully have the situation remedied.