They're Still Out There! 22 22

[october]

46 minutes ago, Bronty said:

And don’t get me wrong PL is a third rate (or fourth rate) superhero too, but a hg PL17 is a unicorn.    MS5 even in hg is only a unicorn if you have to have 9.8 and 9.2/4/6 won’t do.

The PL is the best copy of the best book of the entire good girl genre , at least to me.   Vs a Bronze Age marvel. 
 

But I guess you can’t speculate on PL 17 the same way.   Just makes my head shake with where the market is at these days

I own both a MS5 and a PL17, and honestly, I always though the PL was pretty overrated.

Flaming skull headed anti-hero riding a motorcycle > a not-Matt-Baker girl with bolt-ons, some rope and claw hands. I'll see myself out of the gold section. 

[Funnybooks]

3 minutes ago, october said:

I own both a MS5 and a PL17, and honestly, I always though the PL was pretty overrated.

Flaming skull headed anti-hero riding a motorcycle > a not-Matt-Baker girl with bolt-ons, some rope and claw hands. I'll see myself out of the gold section. 

[lou_fine]

11 hours ago, sfcityduck said:

We've just seen it happen with the Chinatown pedigree - 1,300 books purchased by a collector/dealer from an OO in 1997 and only given pedigree status 24 years later.

The collection was actually purchased in 1999 and could have been given pedigree status much earlier in 2000.  

Especially since CGC had just started operations that year and had offered to give pedigree status to the collection as it would also probably most likely have helped with CGC's lauch and acceptance in the marketplace to co-ordinate it with the release of a new GA comic book pedigree.  I believe the offer was turned down due to the exorbitant high cost of slabbing the collection, especially given the fact that there were no plans to sell any of the books at the time, save for a small portion of the later lower demand non-hero books. 

Needless to say, the offer for pedigree status was no longer there several years later when a large majority of the collection was graded, most likley because CGC was already established in the marketplace by then. 

[Pantodude]

But the 1st Riddler....in green tights...with the goofy question marks all over his body....PRICELESS.  Seriously, I wouldn't be surprised if all four of the books being discussed exceed expectations (although, like I've already stated here and in the bronze section, especially with respect to MS5 and Tec 140).  

Edited June 5, 2021 by Pantodude

[lou_fine]

4 hours ago, october said:

6 hours ago, GreatCaesarsGhost said:

Is anyone else shocked that this book is leading AA 61 and PL 17?
 

Marvel Spotlight #5 Ghost Rider (Marvel, 1972) CGC NM/MT 9.8 White pages.... https://comics.ha.com/itm/bronze-age-1970-1979-/superhero/marvel-spotlight-5-ghost-rider-marvel-1972-cgc-nm-mt-98-white-pages/a/7244-91011.s

Not really. Honestly, I would take the MS5 over the PL17. 

Well, in that case since I do have a copy of MS 5 and as such, it must be in HG condition, how about that for your restored Church copy of Mask 1.  

[lou_fine]

6 hours ago, Pantodude said:

Someone brought up relative census. FWIW, there are seven PH17s in 8.5 and above compared to only six for Tec 140.  AA61 has five.

Well, besides the relative census though, while some of these other PL 17's and 'Tec 140's have come to public auction in the past already, as far as I am aware of, this is the first one of these 5 AA 61's to have ever hit the public auction marketplace.    

Edited June 5, 2021 by lou_fine

[Bronty]

41 minutes ago, october said:

I own both a MS5 and a PL17, and honestly, I always though the PL was pretty overrated.

Flaming skull headed anti-hero riding a motorcycle > a not-Matt-Baker girl with bolt-ons, some rope and claw hands. I'll see myself out of the gold section. 

Bolt-ons in the late 40s.    Think about how ahead of it’s time that is 😂 

[Funnybooks]

Just now, Bronty said:

Bolt-ons in the late 40s.    Think about how ahead of it’s time that is 😂 

More accurately, around 44DD

[october]

21 minutes ago, lou_fine said:

Well, in that case since I do have a copy of MS 5 and as such, it must be in HG condition, how about that for your restored Church copy of Mask 1.  

I would trade my PL 17 for a nice MS 5.

Mask 1, however, kicks the s$#t out of both of those books put together. 

[Bronty]

5 minutes ago, Funnybooks said:

More accurately, around 44DD

Ha!   Although More like 34FF from the looks of her 

[Mmehdy]

2 minutes ago, october said:

I would trade my PL 17 for a nice MS 5.

Mask 1, however, kicks the s$#t out of both of those books put together. 

Long term I would see better census protection in the PL17 in terms of what is going to be potentially  discovered with future MS #5 hitting the census. .. I think the PF 17is a much wiser and safer bet to throw 100K or more at.

[lou_fine]

1 hour ago, Bronty said:

Ultimately while it’s a terrific book it’s also a third rate superhero. 

Well, I would have to totally disagree with you on the sole reason that I have one of these MS 5's in my personal collection, along with probably every other comic book collector back in those days.  

As such, I hope a rising tide lifts all boats, including even slightly lower graded copies of MS 5, even though I haven't seen my copy in decades now and have absolutely no idea where it would be.  

 

[october]

Just now, Mmehdy said:

Long term I would see better census protection in the PL17 in terms of what is going to be potentially  discovered with future MS #5 hitting the census. .. I think the PF 17is a much wiser and safer bet to throw 100K or more at.

If I had a 100k to throw, it would miss both of those by a country mile.

[Funnybooks]

8 minutes ago, Bronty said:

Ha!   Although More like 34FF from the looks of her 

Beggars can't be choosers 

[SOTIcollector]

I had the perfect plan to get the Promise books I want from this auction.  All I'd have to do is liquidate my retirement accounts...  Oh, yeah, and discuss it with my wife.  My wife is incredibly supportive of of all my endeavors.  She also happens to have an abundance of things called "sanity" and "reason", so I'm sure my plan would have been shot down.

On to plan B.  I now have a foolproof way that I'll be able to pick up every SOTI book and every Phantom Lady in the auction.  And I'm not greedy.  I just want ONE really nice Schomburg Timely war cover, and I'll leave the rest for somebody else.  

My plan can't miss. 

Spoiler

 

 

[Funnybooks]

2 minutes ago, SOTIcollector said:

I had the perfect plan to get the Promise books I want from this auction.  All I'd have to do is liquidate my retirement accounts...  Oh, yeah, and discuss it with my wife.  My wife is incredibly supportive of of all my endeavors.  She also happens to have an abundance of things called "sanity" and "reason", so I'm sure my plan would have been shot down.

On to plan B.  I now have a foolproof way that I'll be able to pick up every SOTI book and every Phantom Lady in the auction.  And I'm not greedy.  I just want ONE really nice Schomburg Timely war cover, and I'll leave the rest for somebody else.  

My plan can't miss. 

  Hide contents

 

 

 

Good idea..I commend the thought that went into the plan, however, it seems needlessly complicated...

Here's how I plan to own PL 17...

[SOTIcollector]

1 minute ago, szav said:

It bears repeating that its not just about the cover, flaws and all, with PL17, there's the context of that cover making to the stands in conservative 1947s America and the immutable history and SOTI factor.  PL17 is 10 times cooler than yet another formulaic anti-hero to me.

But to each their own, and they're both gonna shatter records I'm sure.

Yes, that SOTI factor.  Only three comic books were pictured with full covers in SOTI: Crime Detective #9, Reform School Girl, and Phantom Lady 17.  Thanks to Dr. Wertham's efforts in SOTI, Ladies' Home Journal, the Saturday Review, and his work with the New York State Legislature and he US Senate investigation of juvenile delinquency, the entire American comic book industry nearly died in the mid 1950's.  It was far more than just the death of EC Comics as we knew them.  Dozens of companies closed, hundreds lost their jobs, and the entire industry was neutered for years to come.  The books that shocked America in 1954, including PL17, are more than just comics.  They are history.  

[Robot Man]

So far from what I’ve seen the PL 17 would be the one I would want the most. For all the reasons above as well as it is after all one of the sexiest comics ever published. 

[Mmehdy]

50 minutes ago, SOTIcollector said:

I had the perfect plan to get the Promise books I want from this auction.  All I'd have to do is liquidate my retirement accounts...  Oh, yeah, and discuss it with my wife.  My wife is incredibly supportive of of all my endeavors.  She also happens to have an abundance of things called "sanity" and "reason", so I'm sure my plan would have been shot down.

On to plan B.  I now have a foolproof way that I'll be able to pick up every SOTI book and every Phantom Lady in the auction.  And I'm not greedy.  I just want ONE really nice Schomburg Timely war cover, and I'll leave the rest for somebody else.  

My plan can't miss. 

  Hide contents

 

 

 

I think  to have a "Promise" collection buying plan is safe. I was just discussing that with a long term non board member collector  as to what conditions would be ideal for your Promise collection purchase. He stated the best way to get a few is to wait until  they hit the weekly auctions as it will have less "air time" out on the market as opposed to a signature auction exposure of several months . Now the key is and someone should ask Ha the million dollar question " how many Promise books are going to the Sunday auctions ". I know they generate a lot money and ha wants to increase the exposure to that platform but a hard number would be great to make a totally accurate judgment or waiting. For me, the best time is on the final day of the Signature auction when everyone is "tapped out" and those Internet sales go very quickly and also are hard to predict when time wise they hit the actual auction time...some promise books are gonna go thru the cracks we have over 5000 of them coming on strong.

 Of course , if you are buying the "book' you might not have a choice as to timing this auction. One thing for sure is have some kind of a "plan" ahead time, it just makes sense.

 

Edited June 5, 2021 by Mmehdy

[lou_fine]

2 hours ago, szav said:

It's surprising to see only 4 cgc 9.8 MS5 on census... guess it is a genuine rarity.  Years ago when everyone made fun of the FF 52 9.8s going for 90k I think there were 4 on census, but a few years later its only gone up to by one to 5 (cue the comments about endless gardens of raw uber high age SA/BA keys all over the country).

Yes, but that was kind of well deserved because didn't the prices dropped like a rock right after that mid-$80K and $90K sale for the FF 52?  

Of course, in today's crazed FOMO marketplace, the prices would most likely be right back up there.  Yeah, with only 4 copies on the census in CGC 9.8, I see no problems for the MS 5 to top $100K, especially with the FF 48 in CGC 9.8 with a total of 45 copies still able to get close at $93,888 in the last CL Auction.  Heck, even much more common uber HG books like Spidey 129 are hitting $55K, while GSXM 1 with over 200 copies slabbed in CGC 9.8 are now fetching into the $60K's, while the ever common as dirt Spidey 300 with over 1,400 copies in CGC 9.8 just saw a Signature copy go for $25K.  Totally nutso out there right now.  

 

20 minutes ago, Mmehdy said:

Long term I would see better census protection in the PL17 in terms of what is going to be potentially  discovered with future MS #5 hitting the census. .. I think the PF 17is a much wiser and safer bet to throw 100K or more at.

Is it possible that a low census count actually hurts the price of a book going forward, especially when they only appear in the marketplace once every several years?  Especially, as compared to these other much more common BA books with multiple copies in every single auction with their reinforcing and self perpetuating market action which continues to drive their prices ever skywards.