Is intentionally inflating prices on eBay against their rules? 2 2

[Sky1]

I just want to get some feedback from the people here who have been purchasing from eBay.  Has anyone notice that some sellers will sell a book for a silly amount over GPA then a couple of days later that same book is back on sale?  This increases value by eBay & GPA's metrics, which does not take into account non-payment.

Anyone know if I can report this as against ToS so eBay can at least investigate?  Not worth my time?  Shady practices like that is one of the reasons why we are all paying absurd amount for slabs that used to be worth $200 a month ago.  If I can stop one seller from doing it, I will.

[Sky1]

22 minutes ago, BingBing said:

You sure about that? Maybe they need to be reported to GPA but I've seen George take down listings like this.

Not really since this has been happening on Ebay for over 20 years.

Yes I am sure.  Ebay still has the inflated value listed & GPA is still taking into account the "false" sale.  I am not saying this is the sole reason we are paying a premium for everything, but it's definitely one of the many reasons why.  When you can track sales & listings, sometimes it's obvious.  What other reason is there for someone to overpay GPA by $500 when there are cheaper listings available; then that same sale/slab ends up being relisted days later.  Once other sellers catches on, they end up raising their prices too.

Thanks for the heads up on reporting to GPA though.  I will at least be doing that.

[SOTIcollector]

If a seller regularly puts up fake auctions, just to get the sale recorded on GPA, and then they cancel the sale and gets an eBay fee refund, eBay would notice them skipping out on fees and would put a stop to it.

If the seller regularly puts up fake auctions, and then pays their eBay fees, there is no reason in the world eBay would want to stop them.  Why lose the fees?  Fake inflated GPA sales don’t hurt eBay, and in a small way they contribute to eBay‘s bottom line. 

Edited June 18, 2021 by SOTIcollector

[Sky1]

10 minutes ago, SOTIcollector said:

If a seller regularly puts up fake auctions, just to get the sale recorded on GPA, and then they cancel the sale and gets an eBay fee refund, eBay would notice them skipping out on fees and would put a stop to it.

If the seller regularly puts up fake auctions, and then pays their eBay fees, there is no reason in the world eBay would want to stop them.  Why lose the fees?  Fake inflated GPA sales don’t hurt eBay, and in a small way they contribute to eBay‘s bottom line. 

That's fine, but all it takes is one time (which I am sure eBay will not notice unless otherwise brought to attn).  The inflated price is recorded, other sellers take notice, edit their listings, then the waiting begins for the "ignorant" buyer.  I have actively witnessed this.  It may not work out, but it's a gamble most sellers are willing to risk I bet.

[CHASEnBLUE]

Agreed that unless they begin receiving complaints, that platform will not automatically address/deal with the issue. This coming from an ebay seller...

[theCapraAegagrus]

Not sure why eBay would care about another site's statistics.

[Sky1]

4 hours ago, theCapraAegagrus said:

Not sure why eBay would care about another site's statistics.

EBay does not care, however the seller that sell slabs on there do.  Am I the only one that negotiates?  When did that become sus?

When you negotiate the seller often throws the inflated GPA prices back in your face, they treat it as gospel & will start a crusade if you say otherwise.

I'm not here saying prices can't rise, as long as it's organic, it's cool.  But just alot of shady stuff happens, just want to know if eBay allows this kind of practices.

[Sky1]

8 hours ago, CHASEnBLUE said:

Agreed that unless they begin receiving complaints, that platform will not automatically address/deal with the issue. This coming from an ebay seller...

This is what I am starting this thread for, first to find out if inflating is against their rules then to get others to watch out for this stuff & report it too.  From the responses I am getting (which is not much) I take it most of us are sellers.

Edited June 21, 2021 by Sky1

[theCapraAegagrus]

46 minutes ago, Sky1 said:

When you negotiate the seller often throws the inflated GPA prices back in your face, they treat it as gospel & will start a crusade if you say otherwise.

I refuse to negotiate with people like that.

[Math Teacher]

4 hours ago, Sky1 said:

Am I the only one that negotiates?  When did that become sus?

No, you are not. I negotiate on every book I buy, be it from Ebay, Instagram, or a dealer. If the seller isn't willing to throw me a bone, I respond, "I am sorry that you are not willing to negotiate. I will look for this book elsewhere."

Have I paid over GPA on Ebay, on IG, or with a dealer? Damn straight I have. If I see a book that I want in the condition I want, I'm not opposed to paying over GPA for it, especially if it's a hard book to find. I'm not willing to pay double GPA, but I am OK with $50 - $100 above GPA. Perhaps even more on a big ticket book.

I am currently looking for BatB #35 - #36 in CGC 7.0 to go along with my BatB #34 CGC 7.0 and my Hawkman #1 CGC 7.0. If I ever see one of those books come up for sale, I will gladly pay over GPA for either of them. BatB #35 - #36 are not that hard to find in lower grades, but the same cannot be said for upper grades. I will keep looking, but I wouldn't be shocked if I never see either book during my lifetime.

[SOTIcollector]

5 hours ago, Sky1 said:

This is what I am starting this thread for, first to find out if inflating is against their rules then to get others to watch out for this stuff & report it too.  From the responses I am getting (which is not much) I take it most of us are sellers.

Not only is this not against eBay's rules, it would go against eBay's interest to stop fake sales.  I understand that consumers find it frustrating.  I understand that it can be used to manipulate GPA data.  There's just zero reason for eBay to care about that. 

You could ask eBay to change their policy.  That would be asking them to make less money, and spend time policing their auctions, just so that GPA could reflect slightly more realistic sales. 

This is a known limitation of GPA and every pricing tool (price guide, website, whatever) that has even been invented.  Neither buyers nor sellers should treat any pricing tool as gospel.  Only fool or novices buy or sell based exclusively on a single pricing tool. 

[SOTIcollector]

On 6/21/2021 at 5:18 PM, Math Teacher said:

No, you are not. I negotiate on every book I buy, be it from Ebay, Instagram, or a dealer. If the seller isn't willing to throw me a bone, I respond, "I am sorry that you are not willing to negotiate. I will look for this book elsewhere."

 

That's an interesting strategy and I'm happy that it works for you.  When selling, I've encountered buyers who assume everything is negotiable.  That's not always the case, and sometimes it means they lose out.  At shows, I've had buyers walk away because I wouldn't "deal" on an item with a fair but firm price, and seconds later the item sold for full price to somebody who recognized a good deal.  When I'm buying a book, I determine what it's worth to me.  If the seller will sell it for that much or less, I buy the book.  

Edited June 23, 2021 by SOTIcollector

[Math Teacher]

Sorry, double post.

Edited June 21, 2021 by Math Teacher

[Math Teacher]

49 minutes ago, Sgt. D said:

That is ridiculous. I bet your entitlement has gotten you put on a lot of Blocked Bidders list.

How am I being entitled? I have a price that I am willing to pay for the book, and if the seller won't meet that price, I walk away. People do this all the time in other areas other than purchasing comic books. Is it safe to assume that all those people are entitled?

Also, in the future, please take time to read my entire post.

1 hour ago, Math Teacher said:

Have I paid over GPA on Ebay, on IG, or with a dealer? Damn straight I have.

As for a Blocked Bidders list, I have never been turned down on any bid I have made on Ebay.

Just out of curiosity, is @SOTIcollector entitled also?

54 minutes ago, SOTIcollector said:

When I'm buying a book, I determine what it's worth to me.  If the seller will sell it for that much or less, I buy the book.

You are more than welcome to your opinion. But I don't consider you to be the be-all, end-all of comic book purchasing. You buy comics in a way that is best for you, and I will buy comics in a way that is best for me. How's that sound?

[Math Teacher]

56 minutes ago, SOTIcollector said:

That's an interesting strategy and I'm happy that it works for you.  When selling, I've encountered buyers who assume everything is negotiable.  That's not always the case, and sometimes it means they lose out.  At shows, I've had buyers walk away because they selected an item with a fair but firm price, and seconds later the item sold for full price to somebody who recognized a good deal.  When I'm buying a book, I determine what it's worth to me.  If the seller will sell it for that much or less, I buy the book.  

When I say that I negotiate on every purchase, I am never asking for 50% off a book. Sometimes I only get a $5 reduction or free shipping. My theory is that it never hurts to ask.

[SOTIcollector]

2 hours ago, Math Teacher said:

You are more than welcome to your opinion. But I don't consider you to be the be-all, end-all of comic book purchasing. 

We have that in common.  I don't consider myself to be the be-all and end-all of comic book purchasing, either.    

2 hours ago, Math Teacher said:

 You buy comics in a way that is best for you, and I will buy comics in a way that is best for me. How's that sound?

Like I said, I'm happy your approach works for you.  

Since this is a newbie forum, and you volunteered your approach to comics buying, I thought it might be helpful to a newbie if they were presented with a different approach, which some sellers might find less abrasive.  I pointed out that I buy based on the price of the book, rather than on whether somebody is willing to drop their price.  In fact, the approach that I prefer seems a lot like the second approach you said you use

2 hours ago, Math Teacher said:

I have a price that I am willing to pay for the book, and if the seller won't meet that price, I walk away. 

rather than the first approach you said you use

3 hours ago, Math Teacher said:

If the seller isn't willing to throw me a bone, I respond, "I am sorry that you are not willing to negotiate. I will look for this book elsewhere."

My decision to purchase is based mostly* on the purchase price of the book, and never on whether somebody is willing to negotiate.   

[*Mostly= if it's a seller I really like, such as Ted from Superworld, I'm probably willing to pay a little more.  If it's a seller I really can't stand in the least, like [xxxx censored XXX], then it had better be a real bargain or a book that I absolutely can't get elsewhere.]

[KCOComics]

3 hours ago, Math Teacher said:

When I say that I negotiate on every purchase, I am never asking for 50% off a book. Sometimes I only get a $5 reduction or free shipping. My theory is that it never hurts to ask.

 

4 hours ago, Sgt. D said:

That is ridiculous. I bet your entitlement has gotten you put on a lot of Blocked Bidders list.

It's not entitled at all. The negotiation is half the fun. I can understand being annoyed if he's offering $200 for an AF15, but why have a "Make an Offer" option if you don't want people to make an offer? The seller has every right to say no or counter if they feel it's to low. 

I don't subscribe to a set rule on making offers and every situation is treated uniquely. If a seller says it's his bottom line and it's the book I want, I wouldn't walk away if the price was reasonable. 

Also if I recognize a screaming deal, I don't negotiate... I actually have this terrible habit of telling people they aren't charging enough. 

[Math Teacher]

2 hours ago, Sgt. D said:

You said if the seller doesn't "throw you a bone" you won't buy from them, while insinuating that they did something wrong. That's ridiculous.

As I stated earlier, the "bone" might only be only a $5 discount or free shipping. If my way of doing things results in discounts for me, that it seems to imply that most (not all) sellers have some "wiggle" room on their price. If a seller wants $600 for a book and I am only comfortable spending $575, then I need to find out how motivated they are to sell. Honestly, most of the time we just end up meeting in the middle.

Sellers certainly have the right to set the price for a book they have for sale. They have no obligation to sell it to me if I am not willing to meet their price. Just as I have no obligation to purchase from him/her if s/he is not willing to meet my price.

To address your next post, I don't demand anything. I ask for a discount, and if the seller is firm on the price, then I walk away without any hard feelings toward the seller. And if I have done this do a particular seller and the seller was offended, surely s/he would never sell to me. That has not been the case.

When you go through the sales threads, you often see a buyer post, "I'll take it via PM." Why do you think that is? It's because the seller and buyer negotiated to a mutually beneficial price. Are all these buyers entitled too? I would tell you that I would wait for your answer, but I know you'll just dodge that question, just like the ones I posted in the message of mine that you quoted.

Fine. You think what I do is ridiculous. You have made that painfully clear. There's nothing that you can say that will change my mind. Just as there is nothing I can say to change your mind. Let's agree to disagree and move on.

[Math Teacher]

1 hour ago, SOTIcollector said:

We have that in common.  I don't consider myself to be the be-all and end-all of comic book purchasing, either. 

Actually, the be-all and end-all comment was meant for Sgt. D.

And, in retrospect, when I said that I negotiate all the time, it probably would have been more appropriate to say most of the time. I should know better to deal in absolutes. As you stated, when I work with a dealer who has treated me fairly in the past, I will at times just pay their asking price, especially if I think it is a good deal.

[Dr. Love]

Power and control.  Fascinating stuff,  tie money into it and it gets real interesting.  The symbolic importance of even a small give and the willingness to walk away without it.  Exceptions when an equitable "fair" relationship already exists.

It's all good - and good to be conscious about what's moving beneath the surface.