Any guesses what this might fetch? Byrne XMEN battle page w Wolverine! 0

[inovrmihd]

IThis is slightly off topic, but as collectors get older, will Byrne X-Men continue to be viewed as the most desirable vs. say Jim Lee?  The Byrne X-Men run is practically the only thing I have real nostalgia for, but my younger brother thinks it’s “eh”.  Same question goes for ASM.  Will Ditko always be more desirable than Romita? 5 years ago I would have thought these were ridiculous questions.  Now I am not so sure.  Without looking it up, I couldn’t tell you who the artists for Flash Gordon were, and would assume the first one was the most desirable, but it would just be an assumption.  I have a lot of sympathy for the poster on an earlier thread who said you would have to explain exactly who Frank Frazetta was to most people. Anyone on this thread feel certain that 5 years from now (assuming Alpha Flight never becomes a big thing) this will be more valuable than an A+ Jim Lee page?  I think it will be, but I’ m not sure.

[mtlevy1]

1 hour ago, inovrmihd said:

IThis is slightly off topic, but as collectors get older, will Byrne X-Men continue to be viewed as the most desirable vs. say Jim Lee?  The Byrne X-Men run is practically the only thing I have real nostalgia for, but my younger brother thinks it’s “eh”.  Same question goes for ASM.  Will Ditko always be more desirable than Romita? 5 years ago I would have thought these were ridiculous questions.  Now I am not so sure.  Without looking it up, I couldn’t tell you who the artists for Flash Gordon were, and would assume the first one was the most desirable, but it would just be an assumption.  I have a lot of sympathy for the poster on an earlier thread who said you would have to explain exactly who Frank Frazetta was to most people. Anyone on this thread feel certain that 5 years from now (assuming Alpha Flight never becomes a big thing) this will be more valuable than an A+ Jim Lee page?  I think it will be, but I’ m not sure.

But then in another 25 years when Jim Lee becomes past nostalgic sweet spot will Byrne rebound (assuming it ever falls behind)....

[Rick2you2]

11 hours ago, inovrmihd said:

IThis is slightly off topic, but as collectors get older, will Byrne X-Men continue to be viewed as the most desirable vs. say Jim Lee?  The Byrne X-Men run is practically the only thing I have real nostalgia for, but my younger brother thinks it’s “eh”.  Same question goes for ASM.  Will Ditko always be more desirable than Romita? 5 years ago I would have thought these were ridiculous questions.  Now I am not so sure.  Without looking it up, I couldn’t tell you who the artists for Flash Gordon were, and would assume the first one was the most desirable, but it would just be an assumption.  I have a lot of sympathy for the poster on an earlier thread who said you would have to explain exactly who Frank Frazetta was to most people. Anyone on this thread feel certain that 5 years from now (assuming Alpha Flight never becomes a big thing) this will be more valuable than an A+ Jim Lee page?  I think it will be, but I’ m not sure.

In 5 years, maybe. In 20 years, no. In 1980, I bought a page from The Spirit newspaper insert by Will Eisner, with his Masthead on it, for all of $450.  At the time, that was pretty good money for a page of art. That was also around when Adams covers were available for $200, and Sienk was trying to sell his New Mutants pages for about $50. Now, compare prices, and you will see that in terms sale pricing, the newer stuff has easily exceeded the price of Eisner’s Spirit work (although, it should be noted that a lot more of it became available after he died). That’s a serious problem with this hobby. While some classics will retain or grow in value, the mid and lower grade stuff that ordinary mortals buy is likely to drop in price as their owners drop. 

Some Byrne stuff is likely to hold or grow in value; it is classic. But I doubt it even for middle and lower tier pages. 

[fsumavila]

A superb page from a classic X-Men issue featuring the first appearance of Weapon Alpha/Vindicator/Guardian??

I don't see how that hammers at less than $100K ...

Glen Brunswick better sell off all that Snake Eyes art, because I would bet Liefeld makes a strong run at this page.

[delekkerste]

On 7/8/2021 at 10:38 AM, delekkerste said:

$40-50K is so 2018 IMO. I would be surprised if this one doesn't do $60K at a minimum. I'll put down $65K as my official guess, but, would frankly not be surprised to see higher (potentially much higher) based on the kind of offers I'm seeing/hearing/getting for things like Byrne X-Men pages with heavy Wolvie content and Miller Daredevil pages with Elektra in the private market.  

Now that I've helped to successfully convince everyone that the early guesses were too low, I'm going to raise my estimate to $90K.  

On 7/8/2021 at 11:29 AM, delekkerste said:

Makes sense.  It would be far less shocking to me for this to hit $100K than to go sub-$50K, frankly. 

$100K+ is not out of the question of course. Only lowball estimates are out of the question in this market.

[delekkerste]

On 7/8/2021 at 8:05 PM, Race said:

This page will easily break 100K... there are too many Wall St Bets folks out there with money burning holes in their pockets to keep the hammer price at a sane level

I wonder if the collapse in meme stocks and crypto (most are down by half or more from peak levels, though, still up a lot y/y of course) will start showing up in comics/OA at some point, as there's no doubt that asset price inflation has been a substantial contributor to the boom in collectibles prices this year.  In fact, many are probably unaware that the general sports card market has been correcting since Feb/Mar of this year and that the decline in crypto/stock wealth has almost surely been a factor the past 2-3 months at least of the decline. 

[delekkerste]

On 7/9/2021 at 8:17 PM, J.Sid said:

That's a pretty good page. Not best page in the book or anything, but that's a pretty good page. Gene you still have yours?

That page is a forever keeper for me - the only way I potentially might have let it go would have been in a deal for a Byrne X-Men cover, but, as that is off the table now, it's staying put! 

Edited July 19, 2021 by delekkerste

[PhilipB2k17]

On 7/19/2021 at 11:28 AM, delekkerste said:

I wonder if the collapse in meme stocks and crypto (most are down by half or more from peak levels, though, still up a lot y/y of course) will start showing up in comics/OA at some point, as there's no doubt that asset price inflation has been a substantial contributor to the boom in collectibles prices this year.  In fact, many are probably unaware that the general sports card market has been correcting since Feb/Mar of this year and that the decline in crypto/stock wealth has almost surely been a factor the past 2-3 months at least of the decline. 

But the Comic book market continues to be hot. 

[jjonahjameson11]

On 7/19/2021 at 2:21 PM, PhilipB2k17 said:

But the Comic book market continues to be hot. 

The upcoming AF15 cgc 9.6 auction will bring even more attention to this (and related) hobbies

[tth2]

On 7/19/2021 at 11:28 PM, delekkerste said:

I wonder if the collapse in meme stocks and crypto (most are down by half or more from peak levels, though, still up a lot y/y of course) will start showing up in comics/OA at some point, as there's no doubt that asset price inflation has been a substantial contributor to the boom in collectibles prices this year.  In fact, many are probably unaware that the general sports card market has been correcting since Feb/Mar of this year and that the decline in crypto/stock wealth has almost surely been a factor the past 2-3 months at least of the decline. 

In an ideal world, the last Heritage auction would represent the high water mark for comics and prices would immediately implode to 1975 levels thereafter.

[delekkerste]

On 7/19/2021 at 2:21 PM, PhilipB2k17 said:

But the Comic book market continues to be hot. 

Yes, that was my point - the comic market is hot now, but, will it stay hot at a time when more and more assets are suddenly turning ice cold.  

[Xatari]

In the big recession back around 2008-2010, comic books were one of the only asset classes that did well. The recent covid pandemic showed this again.  I’m not saying it is into perpetuity, but there is a train of thought that believes this recent jump is a leveling up and not just a quick spike. I thought it was a crazy notion but I am warming to the idea I was wrong with all the news collectors entering the market. It’s actually great to see for the hobby. 
 

I really think older OA collectors should embrace the next generation. I have been at this for a little over a year and have constantly felt “less than” by a very vocal number in this community because my collecting taste didn’t align with the classics and focused on more modern pieces. Remember, we need new collectors if any of us want an exit strategy at some point. 

[Lago32]

A couple of observations...

1) With his "forever keeper" comment on his X109 page (and therefore dashing the hopes of anyone with designs on his page), I think Gene may have just inadvertently added another $10-20k to the final hammer price for this X109 page in Clink lol

2) It is a real sign of the times - and in particular of the high demand for, and coinciding dearth of, Byrne X-men pages - that we are giving so much attention to this one Byrne X-men page

[Bronty]

On 7/20/2021 at 9:04 AM, Lago32 said:

A couple of observations...

1) With his "forever keeper" comment on his X109 page (and therefore dashing the hopes of anyone with designs on his page), I think Gene may have just inadvertently added another $10-20k to the final hammer price for this X109 page in Clink

2) It is a real sign of the times - and in particular of the high demand for, and coinciding dearth of, Byrne X-men pages - that we are giving so much attention to this one Byrne X-men page

1) checked it out on CAF and yeah, Gene's is better (although I don't think that changes the price for this one)

2) agree.   Yesterday's B is today's A.

[Bronty]

On 7/20/2021 at 1:35 AM, delekkerste said:

Yes, that was my point - the comic market is hot now, but, will it stay hot at a time when more and more assets are suddenly turning ice cold.  

I'm sure I don't follow as many asset classes as you do but I'm surprised to hear that.   Ice cold I interpret as dropping like a rock. 

Real estate, around here, has cooled but is steady, no price changes just less heat.

Certain collectibles have cooled, certain haven't.     I wouldn't have called any of it ice cold, though.

What do you mean in particular, and what assets?   

I get that trading cards might be down 50% in some cases, but 700k Jordan RC's seems destined for a quick drop and even 300k jordans are 10x  three years ago right.

Maybe its just all in how you look at it, but I was surprised by the choice of words.

 

Edited July 20, 2021 by Bronty

[PhilipB2k17]

On 7/20/2021 at 1:35 AM, delekkerste said:

Yes, that was my point - the comic market is hot now, but, will it stay hot at a time when more and more assets are suddenly turning ice cold.  

No. It’s being fueled by crazy speculation right now. But it will collapse of it’s own weight, regardless of what happens to other asset classes, I think. 

Edited July 20, 2021 by PhilipB2k17

[PhilipB2k17]

On 7/20/2021 at 11:32 AM, Bronty said:

I'm sure I don't follow as many asset classes as you do but I'm surprised to hear that.   Ice cold I interpret as dropping like a rock. 

Real estate, around here, has cooled but is steady, no price changes just less heat.

Certain collectibles have cooled, certain haven't.     I wouldn't have called any of it ice cold, though.

What do you mean in particular, and what assets?   

I get that trading cards might be down 50% in some cases, but 700k Jordan RC's seems destined for a quick drop and even 300k jordans are 10x  three years ago right.

Maybe its just all in how you look at it, but I was surprised by the choice of words.

 

People are already predicting a stock market correction soon. 

[jjonahjameson11]

On 7/20/2021 at 6:47 PM, PhilipB2k17 said:

People are already predicting a stock market correction soon. 

Yeah, they've been predicting it for the last few years already.  its not news.

[J.Sid]

On 7/20/2021 at 8:29 AM, Bronty said:

1) checked it out on CAF and yeah, Gene's is better (although I don't think that changes the price for this one)

Gene's is Best page in the book IMO.
 

Sure, the page before is an iconic half splash that is used for the cover scene, but Gene's has zero weak panels, a great front shot of Wolverine, and a shot of Wolverine using his claws. Oh, and it's got the "snikt" for those who care about that.

The page at auction is great, but it's a class below these two:

 

 

[PhilipB2k17]

On 7/20/2021 at 7:08 PM, jjonahjameson11 said:

Yeah, they've been predicting it for the last few years already.  its not news.

My 401K is saying it’s happening now.