THE MARVELS starring Brie Larson, Iman Vellani and Teyonna Parris (2023) 9 9

[@therealsilvermane]

4 minutes ago, Broke as a Joke said:

Boseman's Black Panther character was so well received by the GP that the sequel which he won't be in will still be titled Black Panther.  I guess Marvel didn't want to call it Panthers.

 

Well there's only ever been one Black Panther. In Marvel Comics, there have been three different characters named Captain Marvel, two Ms. Marvels, and a few other Vells scattered through the galaxy. The Marvels is a great title that honors them all.

It seems like "peas in a pod" is a theme of many MCU Phase Four flicks. Black Widow will have three versions of Black Widow (past present and future), Spider-Man NWH will have at the three cinematic versions of Spider-Man allegedly, Multiverse of Madness will be all the Wizards Sorcerers and Witches in one movie. Love and Thunder will be all the Marvel Gods(Asgard and Olympus) contending with a God Killer. And The Marvels will be all the Marvel Marvels in one movie.

[▫️]

48 minutes ago, Gatsby77 said:

Neither Black Panther nor Captain Marvel sucked.

Both, in fact, were excellent.

I wouldn’t say Captain Marvel sucked but Brie was a bore. Wooden. A smirk here and there was her go-to emote. Whether it’s the directors or her, she didn’t pull it off. She was not a strong female hero that I cared about or cheered for. For a stark contrast, compare to Emily Blunt in Edge of Tomorrow. It was fascinating to watch her act and also in action.

[@therealsilvermane]

4 hours ago, Angel of Death said:

How can you discern what a feminine experience is?

Like I said, I don't know what that is but maybe I could recognize the honest attempt at it in a movie when compared to past films. Sometimes it's hard to discern it I think when it's a scene between a man and a woman as it's many times about romance or flirting. With woman to woman scenes, that can be better I think at fleshing out the experience.

For instance, in the MCU:

In Iron Man dir. by Jon Favreau, the first lady to lady experience is Pepper and Angie the Vanity Fair reporter kinda fighting over Tony. Not exactly a giant leap for womankind in the MCU.

In GOTG Vol 1 & 2 dir by James Gunn, Gamora and Nebula really just fight with each other until they have the "I just wanted a sister" moment in Vol 2, which was sweet, but maybe a little cheesy and forced.

In Ant-Man and the Wasp dir by Peyton Reed, Hope Van Dyne spends part of the movie kicking butt and part of the movie complaining and telling the guys to stop joking. She gets her moment with Janet Van Dyne but by then so much is going on that it feels rushed.

 

In Captain Marvel co-dir. by Anna Boden, for the first time in an MCU film, I saw an attempt at real substantial interactions between women characters that took up screen time. Carol and Maria Rambeau sit down together for the first time in six years and attempt to get to know each other again. It takes up minutes of movie time and doesn't end with some silly joke. It takes itself seriously.

Carol and Monica have a substantial scene where a little girl interacts with an older woman she looks up to.

Even in the brief interaction Carol has with Minn-Erva as they fight, when Carol realizes that Minn-Erva knew her secret origin all along, Carol asks, "Is that why we never hung out?" to which Minn Erva replies, "No. I just didn't like you." It's humorous, a bit whimsical and brief, but it's something probably only two ladies might say to each other. I spend a lot of time around ladies and I know how important their girl time is to each other. It's not a deep example obviously, but it's unique to a woman experience, in as much as I don't think two male super adversaries would say that to each other.

In Captain Marvel, I think we see for the first time in the MCU a real and honest attempt to put "life as a woman" up on the screen. Not just because the lead is a female and we follow her around space and LA, but because of these many small moments she has with her "sisters" in the film.

Edited May 11, 2021 by @therealsilvermane

[theCapraAegagrus]

5 minutes ago, @therealsilvermane said:

In Captain Marvel co-dir. by Anna Boden, for the first time in an MCU film, I saw an attempt at real substantial interactions between women characters that took up screen time. Carol and Maria Rambeau sit down together for the first time in six years and attempt to get to know each other again. It takes up minutes of movie time and doesn't end with some silly joke. It takes itself seriously.

Carol and Monica have a substantial scene where a little girl interacts with an older woman she looks up to.

Even in the brief interaction Carol has with Minn-Erva as they fight, when Carol realizes that Minn-Erva knew her secret origin all along, Carol asks, "Is that why we never hung out?" to which Minn Erva replies, "No. I just didn't like you." It's humorous, a bit whimsical and brief, but it's something probably only two ladies might say to each other. I spend a lot of time around ladies and I know how important their girl time is to each other. It's not a deep example obviously, but it's unique to a woman experience, in as much as I don't think two male super adversaries would say that to each other.

In Captain Marvel, I think we see for the first time in the MCU a real and honest attempt to put "life as a woman" up on the screen. Not just because the lead is a female and we follow her around space and LA, but because of these many small moments she has with her "sisters" in the film.

Okay, but you're wrong.

[drotto]

13 minutes ago, @therealsilvermane said:

Like I said, I don't know what that is but maybe I could recognize the honest attempt at it in a movie when compared to past films. Sometimes it's hard to discern it I think when it's a scene between a man and a woman as it's many times about romance or flirting. With woman to woman scenes, that can be better I think at fleshing out the experience.

For instance, in the MCU:

In Iron Man dir. by Jon Favreau, the first lady to lady experience is Pepper and Angie the Vanity Fair reporter kinda fighting over Tony. Not exactly a giant leap for womankind in the MCU.

In GOTG Vol 1 & 2 dir by James Gunn, Gamora and Nebula really just fight with each other until they have the "I just wanted a sister" moment in Vol 2, which was sweet, but maybe a little cheesy and forced.

In Ant-Man and the Wasp dir by Peyton Reed, Hope Van Dyne spends part of the movie kicking butt and part of the movie complaining and telling the guys to stop joking. She gets her moment with Janet Van Dyne but by then so much is going on that it feels rushed.

 

In Captain Marvel co-dir. by Anna Boden, for the first time in an MCU film, I saw an attempt at real substantial interactions between women characters that took up screen time. Carol and Maria Rambeau sit down together for the first time in six years and attempt to get to know each other again. It takes up minutes of movie time and doesn't end with some silly joke. It takes itself seriously.

Carol and Monica have a substantial scene where a little girl interacts with an older woman she looks up to.

Even in the brief interaction Carol has with Minn-Erva as they fight, when Carol realizes that Minn-Erva knew her secret origin all along, Carol asks, "Is that why we never hung out?" to which Minn Erva replies, "No. I just didn't like you." It's humorous, a bit whimsical and brief, but it's something probably only two ladies might say to each other. I spend a lot of time around ladies and I know how important their girl time is to each other. It's not a deep example obviously, but it's unique to a woman experience, in as much as I don't think two male super adversaries would say that to each other.

In Captain Marvel, I think we see for the first time in the MCU a real and honest attempt to put "life as a woman" up on the screen. Not just because the lead is a female and we follow her around space and LA, but because of these many small moments she has with her "sisters" in the film.

But life as a woman according to who? There are many different woman with many different views, and many different experiences. This is very narrow thinking to discount other representations of woman to focus on one that fits your narrative.  It also lessons the shared human experience that is not based on traits. Again, you make the argument that a man can not understand or convey a woman's experience, than you pick the examples of authentic female interactions? You seem to have an extremely narrow view on how women should act and interreact.

 

Good writers, directors, and producers should be able to convey a story and create good characters regardless of their personal traits.  To insist otherwise is very dismissive of their talents.

[Gatsby77]

53 minutes ago, @therealsilvermane said:

Like I said, I don't know what that is but maybe I could recognize the honest attempt at it in a movie when compared to past films. Sometimes it's hard to discern it I think when it's a scene between a man and a woman as it's many times about romance or flirting. With woman to woman scenes, that can be better I think at fleshing out the experience.

For instance, in the MCU:

In Iron Man dir. by Jon Favreau, the first lady to lady experience is Pepper and Angie the Vanity Fair reporter kinda fighting over Tony. Not exactly a giant leap for womankind in the MCU.

In GOTG Vol 1 & 2 dir by James Gunn, Gamora and Nebula really just fight with each other until they have the "I just wanted a sister" moment in Vol 2, which was sweet, but maybe a little cheesy and forced.

In Ant-Man and the Wasp dir by Peyton Reed, Hope Van Dyne spends part of the movie kicking butt and part of the movie complaining and telling the guys to stop joking. She gets her moment with Janet Van Dyne but by then so much is going on that it feels rushed.

 

In Captain Marvel co-dir. by Anna Boden, for the first time in an MCU film, I saw an attempt at real substantial interactions between women characters that took up screen time. Carol and Maria Rambeau sit down together for the first time in six years and attempt to get to know each other again. It takes up minutes of movie time and doesn't end with some silly joke. It takes itself seriously.

Carol and Monica have a substantial scene where a little girl interacts with an older woman she looks up to.

Even in the brief interaction Carol has with Minn-Erva as they fight, when Carol realizes that Minn-Erva knew her secret origin all along, Carol asks, "Is that why we never hung out?" to which Minn Erva replies, "No. I just didn't like you." It's humorous, a bit whimsical and brief, but it's something probably only two ladies might say to each other. I spend a lot of time around ladies and I know how important their girl time is to each other. It's not a deep example obviously, but it's unique to a woman experience, in as much as I don't think two male super adversaries would say that to each other.

In Captain Marvel, I think we see for the first time in the MCU a real and honest attempt to put "life as a woman" up on the screen. Not just because the lead is a female and we follow her around space and LA, but because of these many small moments she has with her "sisters" in the film.

*Cough*

https://screenrant.com/marvel-movies-pass-bechdel-test-feminist/

[drotto]

3 minutes ago, Gatsby77 said:

*Cough*

https://screenrant.com/marvel-movies-pass-bechdel-test-feminist/

Spot on, I had the exact same thought.

[Dr. Love]

I had a dream

[drotto]

1 minute ago, Dr. Love said:

I had a dream

I would watch that movie.

[Bosco685]

1 hour ago, Dr. Love said:

I had a dream

 

1 hour ago, drotto said:

I would watch that movie.

All.Day.Long!

She was incredible and a strong female role in Vikings. Took no carp from anyone. Including her own sons and husbands.

[drotto]

3 minutes ago, Bosco685 said:

 

All.Day.Long!

She was incredible and a strong female role in Vikings. Took no carp from anyone. Including her own sons and husbands.

More than held her own on Vikings.  She was probably my favorite character, but when the show was at it's best it was a tough competition. Katheryn Winnick deserves more work, and staring roles in big name films. MCU make this happen.

[Bosco685]

4 minutes ago, drotto said:

More than held her own on Vikings.  She was probably my favorite character, but when the show was at it's best it was a tough competition. Katheryn Winnick deserves more work, and staring roles in big name films. MCU make this happen.

She's a third-degree black belt as well which I found out later. So she truly could do her own stunts.

[drotto]

7 minutes ago, Bosco685 said:

She's a third-degree black belt as well which I found out later. So she truly could do her own stunts.

Anyone that can go from this..

to this in one role and be convincing as both can play anything.

Edited May 11, 2021 by drotto

[Callaway29]

Ugh this woulda been so good... My actual disappointment has now been replaced with disappointment of what coulda been...

Edited May 11, 2021 by Callaway29

[▫️]

8 hours ago, Dr. Love said:

I had a dream

Me too.

[@therealsilvermane]

8 hours ago, Dr. Love said:

I had a dream

 

49 minutes ago, Oddball said:

Me too.

Nah, Marvel Studios and Kevin Feige, geniuses that they are, got it right the first time...

[▫️]

30 minutes ago, @therealsilvermane said:

 

Nah, Marvel Studios and Kevin Feige, geniuses that they are, got it right the first time...

 

Kevin Feige is not a genius. Actual geniuses like Marie Curie would have taken exception to that. Feige is a comic book nerd (like most of us) and a good businessman that knows how to market his product to appeal to the masses in the same way Michael Bay does. Bay gets a lot of heat but he brings in the box office and will never be out of work. Feige knows his box office formula works and he can put the most amount of butts in seats across the ages from young children to their parents even if those parents have no interest. They gotta take their kids. It’s basic marketing without a lot of risk. I don’t blame him. If I had the option to produce a PG Marvel movie like Winter Soldier or an R rated DC movie like Joker, my wallet makes that decision. Make mine Marvel. (Of course who knew Joker would have broke a billion? None of us.)  But Joker was risky and I appreciate that risk they took.  But enough about Feige and formulas, that’s nothing new. Marvel, The Fast and Furious, Transformers and Pirates of the Caribbean are franchises that own the box office for good reason. 
On casting Captain Marvel, I’m happy she worked for you and others. Sincerely. Larson took a lot of hate from her interviews but I don’t care about her offscreen persona or any actors offscreen persona for that matter. As long as they are not morally bankrupt. My favorite actors are people I would never care to meet. I rib Larson a lot for her performance in CM because I wanted to love it. As I’ve said before, I loved her in Free Fire. Not a great movie but a fun one with great performances from the entire cast.  Sorry for the long winded post, I’m not working today. In bed with fever. Bored.  

[theCapraAegagrus]

5 hours ago, Oddball said:

Kevin Feige is not a genius. Actual geniuses like Marie Curie would have taken exception to that. Feige is a comic book nerd (like most of us) and a good businessman that knows how to market his product to appeal to the masses in the same way Michael Bay does...

[@therealsilvermane]

6 hours ago, Oddball said:

Kevin Feige is not a genius. Actual geniuses like Marie Curie would have taken exception to that. Feige is a comic book nerd (like most of us) and a good businessman that knows how to market his product to appeal to the masses in the same way Michael Bay does. Bay gets a lot of heat but he brings in the box office and will never be out of work. Feige knows his box office formula works and he can put the most amount of butts in seats across the ages from young children to their parents even if those parents have no interest. They gotta take their kids. It’s basic marketing without a lot of risk. I don’t blame him. If I had the option to produce a PG Marvel movie like Winter Soldier or an R rated DC movie like Joker, my wallet makes that decision. Make mine Marvel. (Of course who knew Joker would have broke a billion? None of us.)  But Joker was risky and I appreciate that risk they took.  But enough about Feige and formulas, that’s nothing new. Marvel, The Fast and Furious, Transformers and Pirates of the Caribbean are franchises that own the box office for good reason. 
On casting Captain Marvel, I’m happy she worked for you and others. Sincerely. Larson took a lot of hate from her interviews but I don’t care about her offscreen persona or any actors offscreen persona for that matter. As long as they are not morally bankrupt. My favorite actors are people I would never care to meet. I rib Larson a lot for her performance in CM because I wanted to love it. As I’ve said before, I loved her in Free Fire. Not a great movie but a fun one with great performances from the entire cast.  Sorry for the long winded post, I’m not working today. In bed with fever. Bored.  

As I see it, geniuses come in all different shapes, sizes, and skill sets. Technically, you only need a 140 IQ to be considered "genius." But not all geniuses set the world on fire. So let's say Kevin Feige and the folks at Marvel Studios are talented movie geniuses who work their butts off and have, as a result, kinda changed the world.

I hope you see the MCU as more than just clever marketing. There's been a certain brilliance to the way they've handled the whole thing, from the first Iron Man film to the Falcon and the Winter Soldier series. As I see it, part of that brilliance has been their casting. They cast actors who were all a little off-center from what you might expect in a super-hero aka they cast against type. Rather than cast some real life bad*ss or actor/underwear model with a square jaw or Mr/Miss Universe face, they chose weirdos and outcasts for the most part. Robert Downey Jr is Exhibit A of that. Scarlet Johannsen was the last person I'd have thought of when considering a super-hero spy lady, but she ended up being perfect. I'd have never thought of Paul Rudd, a traditional funny guy, as a super-hero but he's been brilliant as Ant-Man. In the beginning, Chadwick Boseman didn't fit my initial impression of what a prince of Africa might look like, but the guy is T'Challa now.

Knowing that these same actors will live and grow with these roles for at least a decade, Marvel cast these actors with the idea that their personalities and traits will embody and flesh out these fictional characters. Robert Downey Jr IS Tony Stark. The sense of social justice and the optimism of Chris Evans is part of who Captain America is now. Carol Danvers as Ms. Marvel was created by Stan Lee and Gerry & Carla Conway to be not only Marvel's answer to TV's Wonder Woman, but also their appeal to the growing feminist movement. So why not cast Brie Larson who is an outspoken feminist and leader of the #MeToo Movement, a talented Oscar winning actress, and someone who played a captive rape victim just like Carol Danvers herself once was in an infamous Avengers storyline? I know some folks hate Brie for that very same activism, but you can't win battles by making friends of everyone. Elizabeth Olsen also was perfect as Wanda. I mean, she just looks like a witch even resembling Sissy Spacek's Carrie, the ultimate cinema witch. And in WandaVision, we saw that perfect casting finally pay off. I'd have never thought they'd find the perfect Thor, but they did.

There's a lot of genius level things that Kevin Feige and the Marvel Studios creators did to make the MCU the biggest movie franchise in the world, but in my mind, their casting has been the most important.

[theCapraAegagrus]

5 minutes ago, @therealsilvermane said:

As I see it, geniuses come in all different shapes, sizes, and skill sets. Technically, you only need a 140 IQ to be considered "genius." But not all geniuses set the world on fire. So let's say Kevin Feige and the folks at Marvel Studios are talented movie geniuses who work their butts off and have, as a result, kinda changed the world.

I hope you see the MCU as more than just clever marketing. There's been a certain brilliance to the way they've handled the whole thing, from the first Iron Man film to the Falcon and the Winter Soldier series. As I see it, part of that brilliance has been their casting. They cast actors who were all a little off-center from what you might expect in a super-hero aka they cast against type. Rather than cast some real life bad*ss or actor/underwear model with a square jaw or Mr/Miss Universe face, they chose weirdos and outcasts for the most part. Robert Downey Jr is Exhibit A of that. Scarlet Johannsen was the last person I'd have thought of when considering a super-hero spy lady, but she ended up being perfect. I'd have never thought of Paul Rudd, a traditional funny guy, as a super-hero but he's been brilliant as Ant-Man. In the beginning, Chadwick Boseman didn't fit my initial impression of what a prince of Africa might look like, but the guy is T'Challa now.

Knowing that these same actors will live and grow with these roles for at least a decade, Marvel cast these actors with the idea that their personalities and traits will embody and flesh out these fictional characters. Robert Downey Jr IS Tony Stark. The sense of social justice and the optimism of Chris Evans is part of who Captain America is now. Carol Danvers as Ms. Marvel was created by Stan Lee and Gerry & Carla Conway to be not only Marvel's answer to TV's Wonder Woman, but also their appeal to the growing feminist movement. So why not cast Brie Larson who is an outspoken feminist and leader of the #MeToo Movement, a talented Oscar winning actress, and someone who played a captive rape victim just like Carol Danvers herself once was in an infamous Avengers storyline? I know some folks hate Brie for that very same activism, but you can't win battles by making friends of everyone. Elizabeth Olsen also was perfect as Wanda. I mean, she just looks like a witch even resembling Sissy Spacek's Carrie, the ultimate cinema witch. And in WandaVision, we saw that perfect casting finally pay off. I'd have never thought they'd find the perfect Thor, but they did.

There's a lot of genius level things that Kevin Feige and the Marvel Studios creators did to make the MCU the biggest movie franchise in the world, but in my mind, their casting has been the most important.

They're not, though. All they did was follow a blueprint set by Stan Lee and Marvel Comics. They didn't do anything unique or "genius"-level.

Neither Kevin Feige nor Marvel Studios have done a single "genius-level" thing. They did their jobs. Nothing more; Nothing less.