Overrated Key "First" Books 5 5

[Lazyboy]

On 1/25/2023 at 10:12 AM, mr_highgrade said:

 

You're focusing too much on the first word of the thread title and ignoring the other three.

[mr_highgrade]

On 1/25/2023 at 11:30 AM, Lazyboy said:

You're focusing too much on the first word of the thread title and ignoring the other three.

Like a moth to a flame. 

[mysterymachine]

I gave my Secret Wars #8 away to a friend as a gift. Plus, I knew it was only one page of the book that just showed Peter finding the costume and not much else.

[PeterPark]

On 1/23/2023 at 9:44 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

The difference is that SW 8 is the first appearance in Marvel continuity.  ASM 252 doesn’t actually happen until SW 1-12 concludes.  Spidey is wearing the black costume on battleworld for 5 issues before he pops back into Central Park in 252

Well...ok...but modern origin stories don't become the first appearance of established characters...it's really a black costume origin story, rather than a first appearance. The only chronology that matters is the actual publication date. I'm looking at you UXM 266

[Dr. Balls]

I'm sure it's been said - the "preview" books where characters first appear (Malibu Sun Spawn comes to mind or Foom #2 for Wolverine) - or even the ads for next month's books showing the first appearance of a character on a cover of a comic not yet released. To each their own when collecting in subsets like that, but to me: if canon isn't tied to the first appearance in continuity, I don't see how it's relative to the general collecting goals defined by the majority of people in the hobby.

Edited January 25, 2023 by Dr. Balls

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 1/24/2023 at 4:47 PM, Lazyboy said:

We can call them ads. Because they're just ads.

What if the character appears on the cover....not just in a preview ad?

Edited January 25, 2023 by THE_BEYONDER

[shadroch]

On 1/25/2023 at 11:38 AM, THE_BEYONDER said:

What if the character appears on the cover....not just in a preview ad?

 I'm thinking that had a print run of a few thousand compared to 300,000 for Black Lightning 1

[sfcityduck]

On 1/25/2023 at 9:18 AM, Dr. Balls said:

I'm sure it's been said - the "preview" books where characters first appear (Malibu Sun Spawn comes to mind or Foom #2 for Wolverine) 

Foom 2 was not Wolverine.

[Dr. Balls]

On 1/25/2023 at 12:20 PM, sfcityduck said:

Foom 2 was not Wolverine.

Agreed. But people love calling it a prototype and love it as a selling point.

[sfcityduck]

On 1/25/2023 at 10:38 AM, THE_BEYONDER said:

What if the character appears on the cover....not just in a preview ad?

The classic example is this:

But it is still nothing more than a bit of preview ad art -- just not a house ad like the Action 1 preview ads, instead an ad released to fan or industry publications to hype an upcoming product attendant to an interview or other form of promotion.  Not a true 'first appearance" in the sense people concerned about comics as stories use.

Otherwise, since the 1980s, just about every "first appearance" has probably occurred in a fan or industry publication.

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 1/25/2023 at 2:23 PM, sfcityduck said:

The classic example is this:

But it is still nothing more than a bit of preview ad art -- just not a house ad like the Action 1 preview ads, instead an ad released to fan or industry publications to hype an upcoming product attendant to an interview or other form of promotion.  Not a true 'first appearance" in the sense people concerned about comics as stories use.

Otherwise, since the 1980s, just about every "first appearance" has probably occurred in a fan or industry publication.

I’m not trying to suggest that these should be seen as 1st appearances.  I just find the hate expressed for them in this thread odd.  If I’m a Black Lightning fan, I want a copy of that comic reader.  If I’m a Spawn fan...I want a Malibu.   They’re just another subset of fun stuff to collect.

[sfcityduck]

On 1/25/2023 at 11:30 AM, THE_BEYONDER said:

I’m not trying to suggest that these should be seen as 1st appearances.  I just find the hate expressed for them in this thread odd.  If I’m a Black Lightning fan, I want a copy of that comic reader.  If I’m a Spawn fan...I want a Malibu.   They’re just another subset of fun stuff to collect.

They are cool things to collect. So are posters, radio premiums, toys, and lots of character related material. They just aren't first appearances.  I don't think they are a "first appearance" or even a "preview" in the real sense of those terms.  DC Comics Presents was a "preview" of New Teen Titans that qualifies as a first appearance.  

The hard cases are when the house ads have so much detail that they look more like a story than a house ad, so much so that they begin to resemble a "preview" like DC Comics Presents 26.  Some of those sell for 1/10th or less of the price of the first appearance, but they have a much stronger case to being a first appearance than a picture in a fanzine.

 

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 1/25/2023 at 2:46 PM, sfcityduck said:

On 1/25/2023 at 2:30 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

I’m not trying to suggest that these should be seen as 1st appearances.

Expand  

  Some of those sell for 1/10th or less of the price of the first appearance, but they have a much stronger case to being a first appearance than a picture in a fanzine.

I’m not sure what point you’re arguing 

[the blob]

On 1/25/2023 at 1:38 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

What if the character appears on the cover....not just in a preview ad?

This might be worth more than BL 1 just because it is pretty uncommon. I had one and it sold for a nice price if I remember correctly.

 

[sfcityduck]

On 1/25/2023 at 11:50 AM, THE_BEYONDER said:

I’m not sure what point you’re arguing 

Goes to the thread title (Key "First" Books).

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 1/25/2023 at 2:56 PM, sfcityduck said:

Goes to the thread title (Key "First" Books).

It’s called a tangent 

[serling1978]

Man...I saw the thread title and had some thoughts on Hulk 180/181 but after reading through all 9 pages here and the arguments (started drinking heavily around page 5) I'm just curious about the ownership of these books on each side of the argument.  Does ownership of one vs the other sway the person to see that book more favorably?  Maybe not conciously. It can be debated to the end of time, but to me just owning all 3 books is the way to go . I'm a Hulk collector so I have them all as part of my Hulk run so if 180 becomes the more desirable/collectable/valuable/insert-other-words-here-able book then I'm ok with that.

[trademarkcomics]

On 1/25/2023 at 1:22 PM, serling1978 said:

Does ownership of one vs the other sway the person to see that book more favorably?  

Oh, it most definitely does. And it is more often than not subconscious(just like all those Datelines I've watched where the kids/family...even in-laws will invariably stick by a father accused of murder---if he's rich ). I own all three myself and my #181 is signed by Stan Lee but I still think if it was a rainy day and I had to sell, I'd pick the 180 to keep. 

Edited January 26, 2023 by trademarkcomics
Clarification

[WolverineX]

This thread has made me think, what omnibus or collections cover the X-men 94-144 run?  I want to buy the least amount of books as possible. 

[Ken Aldred]

On 1/26/2023 at 1:21 AM, WolverineX said:

This thread has made me think, what omnibus or collections cover the X-men 94-144 run?  I want to buy the least amount of books as possible. 

Uncanny X-Men Omnibus Vol 1 and 2