A Dealer is a flipper 3 3

[Bird]

many of the comics we all buy and sell have been bought and sold more than once...does your buyer think you are the OO?
Don't sweat it, ask a solid price without gouging (only eye gouging on ECs allowed) and provide a service, that earns your nickel.

[Robot Man]

On 3/15/2023 at 8:22 AM, southern cross said:

Are we talking about a dealer with a bricks and mortar store, Diamond, Penguin and Luna monthly accounts?

A dealer that sells books after spending 1-2k for a booth?

A collector that is "slinging floppies on the bay"? Have to use the slang!

Or scalper that buys up a con exclusive within minutes and sells for multiples of what they paid?

Seriously!

I think I read a story here where a seller was selling a book (let's pretend it was 2k) and a buyer messaged them with the story this book is my grail, been wanting it forever yadda yadda yadda I can pay $1500. The seller had meat on the bone with the book. And helping out a fellow collector and getting a warm fuzzy feeling, not exactly worth $500 but okay compensation did the deal. Only for the buyer to list the book for $2k a month later. Not good!

If the buyer had a change in life circumstances and had to sell and contacted the seller and gave them first option to buy the book back at $1500. Ok. And after refusal saying I have to sell the book back and get my money back so just giving you a heads up.

This scenario is icky, Getting the discount (say in head with a southern Belle accent) "I always rely on the kindness of strangers" Then flipping it for FMV a month later.

Means the next time a collector asks the seller about a discount for a grail book they've always wanted. The seller will think unfortunately!

“This is my “grail”…That is one of the oldest ploys in the book…

You would think if it were a “grail”, the buyer would pay as much as they had to to get it. 

[Robot Man]

It makes zero difference what one pays for a book or where they got it. They can “ask” anything they want and you can walk away if you want…

[Gaard]

I never understood how someone can feel animosity towards anyone who flips comics, but have absolutely none towards dealers.

[shadroch]

On 3/16/2023 at 1:01 PM, Gaard said:

I never understood how someone can feel animosity towards anyone who flips comics, but have absolutely none towards dealers.

 

The hobby can't exist without dealers. I can't say the same for flippers. 

[Gaard]

So dealers are a necessary evil?

[toro]

Dealers are necessary, not evil.  As much as I am not a fan of Mile High Chuck, if he doesn't buy the Church collection thousands of great books are gone forever.  Many other dealers do the same too.

Now the ones on Whatnot, they might be evil (just kidding)

[kimik]

On 3/15/2023 at 9:31 AM, theCapraAegagrus said:

Yup, here on the boards. Truly sad that someone would lie like that. We all want the best price, buying or selling, the least we can all do is be honest. Delusions of utopia, I know.

It happens all the time here, at shows, on eBay, etc. so you basically have to view it that everyone who says that is lying and not bite. Set your discount limit and sell within it. 

[Dr. Balls]

On 3/16/2023 at 9:32 AM, Robot Man said:

“This is my “grail”…That is one of the oldest ploys in the book…

You would think if it were a “grail”, the buyer would pay as much as they had to to get it. 

I resemble that comment.

[Artboy99]

Had this exact scenario play out right here on these boards. Seller with a book I want lists at a price. I checked gpa for sales data and notice the very grade sold very recently and with a little digging I found the auction and it was for the exact book so I now know exactly how much the seller paid for the book.

Some negotiation occurred where basically all I needed to know was how much more did the seller want to make vs what I was willing to pay.

 

[jimjum12]

On 3/14/2023 at 10:01 PM, Westy Steve said:

Hey guys,

I have an interesting ethical question for you. I am trying to build up a business as a dealer. So I am setting up at shows, trying to build an audience on Facebook etc.

Like most of you here, I like looking through comic book ads on eBay and in the sales forum here etc.

How would you feel if someone like me was offering a desirable comic book to you at a good price. But when you looked up past sales on eBay to get a feel for what the market value of the comic book was, you noticed that the comic you’re interested in buying was purchased at a much better price. (Presumably by me).  Like really recently. 
 

If you’re still getting a “good” price on it, does it bother you that I recently bought it at a “great” price to flip it on a public site like EBay?  Is that somehow different than if I bought it from Joe Schmoe at wholesale?

Just curious. 

... almost everyone starts as a flipper, I personally don't waste my time or emotion trying to assign a difference between "flippers" and "real" dealers. . I've also seen many a book sold on the boards, eBay, auction, etc, that I would be thrilled to have the chance to buy for twice what they paid. There's always going to be those folks who feel that "true" collectors deserve all the bargains and actually get angry when they don't. You may actually be better off NOT having that collector as your customer. Do your thing, Westy Steve ... life is short and happiness fleeting. Don't let "Karen" rob you of your dreams. GOD BLESS ...

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

 

Edited March 17, 2023 by jimjum12

[Westy Steve]

On 3/17/2023 at 12:05 AM, jimjum12 said:

 ... life is short and happiness fleeting. Don't let "Karen" rob you of your dreams. GOD BLESS ...

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

 

Lol.  Thanks, but when I read this I laughed out loud. My wife’s real name is Karen. 

Edited March 17, 2023 by Westy Steve

[jimjum12]

On 3/17/2023 at 8:19 AM, Westy Steve said:

Lol.  Thanks, but when I read this I laughed out loud. My wife’s real name is Karen. 

That's too much 

I bet she doesn't dis you. GOD BLESS.... 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 3/17/2023 at 8:19 AM, Westy Steve said:

Lol.  Thanks, but when I read this I laughed out loud. My wife’s real name is Karen. 

An actual Karen in this day of “Karens”

That can’t be fun for her

Edited March 17, 2023 by THE_BEYONDER

[N e r V]

When I was a dealer many moons ago you could use the term that another dealer was just flipping books to get a quick return on something “hot” at the moment. The number of people being what we call flippers today was small or maybe even non-existent.

Like most of the comments above I care more about the book and what’s it being offered at than the sellers profit margin. I can say that some people don’t like all flippers though because they can cause negative price increases with their speculation on some books. Everybody that’s collected since the 90’s knows what too many speculators can do as far as damage to the market. It’s pretty easy today to “flip” books for anyone with little or no effort. There’s a number of people here that only live in the CGC sales section. So I’d have to split my opinion that it’s perfectly fine to “flip” books but I’m not really fond of those that heavily speculate and create those artificial and temporary price jumps/drops. It’s not great for the market and has severely damaged other non-comics markets if the behavior gets to out of control. It’s almost sadly amusing the last few years watching people dart after the Marvel movie characters to speculate and run up the prices. 

[serling1978]

Dealers who are skilled at finding books at low prices only please. As long as the dealer is good enough to get actual deals then I have no problem.  My problem is only if a dealer fails at finding a good price and therefore when they mark up the price to make a profit they are now asking enough above FMV that it's instantly clear its overpriced without even having to check GPA.  Sure it doesn't directly effect me in the sense that I can simply not buy the many many many many overpriced books out there,  but I still reserve the right to feel annoyed when I see overpriced books flooding the market. To me that's largely a symptom of the seller not having taken the time or having the resources to buy their books at a deal to be able to still make a profit while not overasking.

[blazingbob]

To me the real difference is the way the person is doing business.  The truest form of flipper is the guy clearly asking me what I'm looking for,  finding it on the floor and then trying to flip it to me so that he makes a quick profit.  There are a couple of guys I know who do that at shows.  To use a friends phrase they are solely turn em and burn em.  You are solely a ATM machine for them.      

Wanna be dealers to me are the people on another dealers badge buying books to clearly resell.     

They have no booth costs,  no cost of setting up except getting there and maybe a hotel day or 2,  no business costs like annual corporate tax,  filing sales tax forms when necessary,  no cost getting in and are basically competing for the same inventory that I spent up to $5000 getting in to see.  They also get to run around the show all day while I'm stuck at the booth.  Back in the day of when CGC did on-site grading some of them literally parked themselves at submission pickup to see what everybody just got.       

Now I would have more respect for that buyer if maybe they were buying to do local shows and possibly down the road started supporting the national shows and maybe even becoming national dealers.  I get that we all started somewhere but frankly the lack of new blood does concern me.  

Edited March 18, 2023 by blazingbob

[Stefan_W]

On 3/18/2023 at 10:15 AM, serling1978 said:

Dealers who are skilled at finding books at low prices only please. As long as the dealer is good enough to get actual deals then I have no problem.  My problem is only if a dealer fails at finding a good price and therefore when they mark up the price to make a profit they are now asking enough above FMV that it's instantly clear its overpriced without even having to check GPA.  Sure it doesn't directly effect me in the sense that I can simply not buy the many many many many overpriced books out there,  but I still reserve the right to feel annoyed when I see overpriced books flooding the market. To me that's largely a symptom of the seller not having taken the time or having the resources to buy their books at a deal to be able to still make a profit while not overasking.

One thing that always bugs me is during the comic boom when prices were going up and up the dealers with overpriced books basically got a get out of jail free card. In late 2020 and into 2021, everything seemed to sell well above what anyone would have paid a few years before. So people who basically sucked at selling and overpriced their books were suddenly able to move their stock and cash in big time. 

The really funny flip side to this coin is some of the people who were overpricing their books kept raising the prices above FMV as the market went up, and then when it crashed out they missed their golden window and were stuck with the same books they had before. Their tears of anguish give me sustenance. 

Edited March 18, 2023 by Stefan_W

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 3/18/2023 at 11:59 AM, Stefan_W said:

One thing that always bugs me is during the comic boom when prices were going up and up the dealers with overpriced books basically got a get out of jail free card. In late 2020 and into 2021, everything seemed to sell well above what anyone would have paid a few years before. So people who basically sucked at selling and overpriced their books were suddenly able to move their stock and cash in big time. 

The really funny flip side to this coin is some of the people who were overpricing their books kept raising the prices above FMV as the market went up, and then when it crashed out they missed their golden window and were stuck with the same books they had before. Their tears of anguish give me sustenance. 

2021 was a huge gift to dealers/sellers.   It was like printing money.  If I had an inventory at all I would have made out like a bandit.   I have no sympathy for those complaining about the current market. 
 

If you didn’t make money hand over fist during the peak...I don’t think you have much hope surviving this downturn.

[ThothAmon]

On 3/18/2023 at 12:17 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

2021 was a huge gift to dealers/sellers.   It was like printing money.  If I had an inventory at all I would have made out like a bandit.   I have no sympathy for those complaining about the current market. 
 

If you didn’t make money hand over fist during the peak...I don’t think you have much hope surviving this downturn.

Those were the days my friend.  I’d hoped they’d never end. I described it as throwing a sponge into the ocean. I bought plenty myself during this period that I’m sure are currently upside down but in the scheme of things cest la vie. It’s called dollar cost averaging.