Edgar Church Mile high penciled dates on cover. 1 1

[adamstrange]

On 8/19/2024 at 11:52 PM, tth2 said:

Not all Church books are structurally high grade.  But barring bad storage practices after they left Edgar's basement, they will still have a freshness and vibrancy that surpasses the vast majority of their peers.

I have seen a lot of mid-grade Church books across the eras, and that is my experience.

[Robot Man]

On 8/19/2024 at 8:49 PM, sfcityduck said:

I don't doubt the experience and expertise of @adamstrange, but I would be more than satisfied based on the story you just told that the books you bought from Chuck are what he told you they are. While I understand the "smell test" relevant to Mile High copies, there are other comics that have been stored in cedar (top graded Action 1 is an example), and that smell certainly can fade or be replaced. 

While many of the Mile Highs that were of the greatest interest to collectors went to some very well known collectors, others were sold to guys who are bit more private and who still own the books (yourself included). I don't know if anyone has counted up how many Mile Highs have shown up for the CGC treatment. I would not be surprised if it was less than half. Even big books are buried in collections like the Action 1 never to be seen, and Chuck allegedly forgot who the buyer was on some of the notable books he sold (isn't that the story on Wonder Woman 1?) and they too are whereabouts unknown (at least to most of us). I've read about frequent buyers of Mile Highs from Chuck whose names I've never heard on these boards. But some of those guys have kids. Makes you wonder if they are buried in generational collections (and no I'm not referring to Dave and Adam). 

A long winded way of saying that provenance is definitely a useful and reliable way of identifying a pedigree like the Mile Highs.

 

For what it is worth, I still remember that Casual Con very well even after almost 50 years. A virtual feeding frenzy. I, as well as many others spent every bit of our money in Chuck’s booth. Even at the unknown concept of “over guide”. He relates the story very accurately in his blog on the collection. While most were picking the “Men in Tights” pretty books, I was grabbing all the SOTI, Avons and PCH over in the cheaper boxes. Some were sold or traded back then with no providence but I kept most of them.

Many of you know me so I can verify most of the ones I have. Although there are some I’m not entirely sure of after 50 years. I have never had any graded so I’m not sure what CGC would say if I did. I still prefer them raw. Nothing like holding one in my hands.

I know John V, John McLaughlin and Redbeard bought large quantities of the lessor priced ones. I don’t know how they sold them but Redbeard provided a COA with several I bought from him. MANY are lost to time I’m afraid unless they had the markings. 

[buttock]

On 8/19/2024 at 9:21 PM, Frisco Larson said:

I would agree with that. However, I HAVE heard of Church copies that were apparently (from what I've heard) stored in a garage (Fiction House issues I believe) that were lessened to a substantial degree because of that environment. Page quality being called out as the most major change. I've also heard that some had an unfortunate run in with one or more cats, leaving them ... stained. But yes, I agree that most collectors who can afford to purchase Church copies take responsible care of them. 

It was the Super Magician run.  Many are OW or C/OW.  

The cat-pee story has been debunked here I believe. 

[Robot Man]

On 8/20/2024 at 8:40 AM, buttock said:

It was the Super Magician run.  Many are OW or C/OW.  

The cat-pee story has been debunked here I believe. 

The “cat pee” story is real. I witnessed it first hand on a visit to John McLaughlin’s house. There were piles of unbagged GA books all over the living room floor. There was a pile of Chesslers with an obvious stain on a bunch of them. John had a house full of cats that had full reign of the house. They clawed up the furniture and peed and pooped where they wanted. He didn’t seem to care much. 

[sfcityduck]

On 8/20/2024 at 8:23 AM, Robot Man said:

For what it is worth, I still remember that Casual Con very well even after almost 50 years. A virtual feeding frenzy. I, as well as many others spent every bit of our money in Chuck’s booth. ... MANY are lost to time I’m afraid unless they had the markings. 

Sort of sad, but if they are still great condition books they will get a deserving price. 

[sfcityduck]

On 8/20/2024 at 8:50 AM, Robot Man said:

The “cat pee” story is real. I witnessed it first hand on a visit to John McLaughlin’s house. There were piles of unbagged GA books all over the living room floor. There was a pile of Chesslers with an obvious stain on a bunch of them. John had a house full of cats that had full reign of the house. They clawed up the furniture and peed and pooped where they wanted. He didn’t seem to care much. 

Now that is really sad.

[sfcityduck]

On 8/20/2024 at 8:50 AM, Robot Man said:

The “cat pee” story is real. I witnessed it first hand on a visit to John McLaughlin’s house. There were piles of unbagged GA books all over the living room floor. There was a pile of Chesslers with an obvious stain on a bunch of them. John had a house full of cats that had full reign of the house. They clawed up the furniture and peed and pooped where they wanted. He didn’t seem to care much. 

My favorite cat and comics pic:

Any idea about when he died? Durrell not his cat. Was trying to figure out how old he was back in the mid-60s.

[Robot Man]

On 8/20/2024 at 8:50 AM, sfcityduck said:

Now that is really sad.

John was a rather tragic figure. A kind of lost trust fund guy. He had tons of money and bought as much of the best stuff he could find. It was just about having it and bragging rights. He never really read or cared about them. At one time he was offering tripple guide for any MH book he could get. 

On one visit he literally tossed me an autographed first edition of Frankenstein…

After he died, his sister literally dumped his collection for peanuts. 

[tth2]

On 8/21/2024 at 12:03 AM, Robot Man said:

After he died, his sister literally dumped his collection for peanuts. 

She wasn't the consignor to Heritage?

[MrBedrock]

On 8/19/2024 at 10:49 PM, sfcityduck said:

 

A long winded way of saying ...

 

 

[adamstrange]

On 8/20/2024 at 12:25 PM, tth2 said:

On 8/20/2024 at 12:03 PM, Robot Man said:

After he died, his sister literally dumped his collection for peanuts. 

She wasn't the consignor to Heritage?

He died intestate and I'm pretty sure there was more than one heir.  Heritage dealt with the probate judge who didn't understand this "slabbin thing", which is why only a subset of his Church books were slabbed (at Heritage's expense).

The comics and pulps did not sell for peanuts, as can be verified with in the Heritage archives.

[Frisco Larson]

On 8/20/2024 at 10:40 AM, buttock said:

It was the Super Magician run.  Many are OW or C/OW.  

The cat-pee story has been debunked here I believe. 

Thanks for some clarity on that. I hadn't heard that the cat-pee story was disproven. A few friends had some early issue Church Cheslers with that staining, so that at least somewhat supported the rumor. I'm glad it was disproven.  

[Frisco Larson]

On 8/20/2024 at 10:50 AM, Robot Man said:

The “cat pee” story is real. I witnessed it first hand on a visit to John McLaughlin’s house. There were piles of unbagged GA books all over the living room floor. There was a pile of Chesslers with an obvious stain on a bunch of them. John had a house full of cats that had full reign of the house. They clawed up the furniture and peed and pooped where they wanted. He didn’t seem to care much. 

Well, I replied to a comment before seeing this post, but this is the story and the individual I heard about. I didn't want to name names (I think he's passed) but yes, this is the story that circulated. AND I saw some of the Cheslers in person ... while I'm no expert on animal scents, I HAVE changed a bajillion litter boxes in my day and yeah .... bad kitty! 

[october]

On 8/20/2024 at 10:40 AM, buttock said:

The cat-pee story has been debunked here I believe. 

I own one of those Cheslers and, while I would love it if the story'd been debunked...yeah...this stain ain't water.

 

Edited August 21 by october

[Silver Surfer]

Crazy deep inks. What is the stain from?

[RareHighGrade]

On 8/19/2024 at 8:52 PM, tth2 said:

Not all Church books are structurally high grade.  But barring bad storage practices after they left Edgar's basement, they will still have a freshness and vibrancy that surpasses the vast majority of their peers.

Agreed.  In countless instances, I've found that there is no comparison between the Church copy and a similarly graded non-pedigree copy.  This is why I will often pay more for a Church copy than for a higher graded non-pedigree copy. 

[october]

On 8/20/2024 at 8:36 PM, Silver Surfer said:

Crazy deep inks. What is the stain from?

 

Edited August 21 by october

[Silver Surfer]

Is that the Church “smell” every is talking about?

[jimbo_7071]

On 8/20/2024 at 11:40 AM, buttock said:

It was the Super Magician run.  Many are OW or C/OW.  

The cat-pee story has been debunked here I believe. 

This Super-Magician copy looks pretty fresh in hand, at least in the slab.

If the story is about Burrell Rowe's books being stored in a shed, those were supposedly the Fiction House runs (and possibly others because those weren't the only ones he owned). 

[Frisco Larson]

On 8/20/2024 at 7:24 PM, october said:

I own one of those Cheslers and, while I would love it if the story'd been debunked...yeah...this stain ain't water.

 

THIS is still a VERY beautiful book!!!