The Comics Lore Unpopular Opinion Thread 2 2

[AJD]

CGC should do away with 9.2, 9.4, 9.6 and 9.8 grades. Anything currently 9.2 becomes 9.0, while 9.4 and 9.6 become 9.5. All 9.8 and higher are 10.0

(I know that's really not in their interest, so it will never happen.)

[D2]

On 9/10/2023 at 10:26 AM, Robot Man said:

I’ve said it before and suprisingly, didn’t get as much push back as I figured I would.

I realize the popularity and significance of IH 181. But what a stinker of a book. Poorly written and lousy art. I recently tried to read it again and just couldn’t get through it. I have read many much better Wolverine stories although he has never been one of my favorite characters.

IH 181 is a perfect book for a CGC slab.

That’s most comic books though. Sadly very few pieces really hold the test of time. 
 

My contribution: I think Batman: Year One is the greatest Batman story, ever. 

Edited September 12, 2023 by D2

[BA773]

On 9/12/2023 at 3:48 PM, D2 said:

That’s most comic books though. Sadly very few pieces really hold the test of time. 
 

My contribution: I think Batman: Year One is the greatest Batman story, ever. 

You re probably not the only person to think it 

Edited September 12, 2023 by BA773

[B2D327]

On 9/11/2023 at 7:38 PM, JollyComics said:

I always thought any books were done by Frank Miller that have brought to the movies.

I never read Ronin mini series and I tempted to buy them. The resales of those books are not that great. Are those mini series worth to read?  I enjoyed reading Frank Miller's 300 mini-series.

The movie and the books are completely unrelated. Frank Miller’s book is mainly tied to the traditional Japanese term regarding samurai while the movie focuses on a modern day heist where the term “Ronin” is described to Robert DeNiro’s character that basically interprets his lifestyle as it’s parallel 

[D2]

On 9/12/2023 at 9:59 AM, BA773 said:

You re probably not the only person to think it 

That’s a curious point. I always believed DKR was haloed as the epitome of Batman perfection 

[BA773]

On 9/12/2023 at 5:41 PM, D2 said:

That’s a curious point. I always believed DKR was haloed as the epitome of Batman perfection 

I think there is too much content  about batman, so much amazing story... that is hard to get a common opinion about the best title. Where on the contrary for a secondary charachter you have less choice because there is less story writed about him

Edited September 12, 2023 by BA773

[Lazyboy]

On 9/12/2023 at 8:32 AM, valiantman said:

I can't picture a shelf with a dozen slabbed Ferraris.

So you were specifically talking about comics and are saying that issues like ASM 252 are not worth owning?

[valiantman]

On 9/12/2023 at 1:55 PM, Lazyboy said:

So you were specifically talking about comics and are saying that issues like ASM 252 are not worth owning?

I'm saying that it's fantastic for the hobby when something that was once worthless becomes a collectible. Every single Golden Age comic was once worthless. Most Silver Age books were once worthless. Bronze Age 30 and 35 cent variants were once "no different" than their regular price counterparts. Second, third, fourth, fifth print Copper books were worthless. Baseball cards were put in bicycle spokes, Star Wars toys were passed down, Lego sets were always opened, video games were sold for almost nothing in garage sales, VHS tapes were clearance items. These examples are all collectible many years after they were deemed worthless. 

Meanwhile, there are $1,000 brand new comics. There are $500 brand new packs of baseball cards. The most valuable sportscards of all time include cards printed since 2000. It's possible to "manufacture" any new collectible at whatever value (or limited quantity) you want it to have, but these are manipulations of the original hobby.

Collectibles worth having were once worthless.

Edited September 12, 2023 by valiantman

[Happy Noodle Boy]

On 9/10/2023 at 4:15 PM, Ken Aldred said:

Thought it was a masterpiece back in the 80s, but I’m in a fairly sizeable group that by now has come to dislike the space squid ending.

I like the space squid. It's a very "comic book" ending. Watchmen is a celebration of the comic book medium and it works best in that medium.

Edited September 12, 2023 by Mark Warren

[Ryan.]

On 9/12/2023 at 11:41 AM, D2 said:

That’s a curious point. I always believed DKR was haloed as the epitome of Batman perfection 

I've always preferred Year One. 

[Happy Noodle Boy]

My two big unpopular opinions:

1. I can't stand Wolverine. Never could, and I've been reading comics since his debut. He's the Fonzie of the Marvel Universe. It's nice though, from a collecting perspective, not having to care even one little bit about Hulk 181.

2. The central metaphor of the X-Men doesn't make sense. The average citizen of Marvel USA wouldn't know the difference between a mutant and a powered superhero. The general public should hate the ice guy who makes ice slides all over the city but not have a problem with the flaming guy who's always yelling "Flame On"? Why? Also, evolution doesn't work the way the writers think it does. Marvel's mutants aren't actually a separate species.

Edited September 12, 2023 by Mark Warren

[Happy Noodle Boy]

On 9/11/2023 at 1:33 AM, OtherEric said:

Killing Joke?  That's an Alan Moore comic that's insanely overrated.

My next unpopular opinion is that the Red Hood origin for Joker is stupid and Moore never should've used it in Killing Joke. It means that everything that makes Joker who he is came from the acid bath. It's awful. And it's not a red hood, it's a red bucket. The Joker, one of the greatest villains of all time, was a failed stand-up comedian who was duped into committing a crime with a red bucket on his head. We're just lucky Moore didn't decide to write a story about Lex Luthor's origin. We would've had "Superboy made me go bald" as Luthor's motivation chiseled in stone forever. 

[thecollectron]

On 9/11/2023 at 4:38 PM, JollyComics said:

I always thought any books were done by Frank Miller that have brought to the movies.

I never read Ronin mini series and I tempted to buy them. The resales of those books are not that great. Are those mini series worth to read?  I enjoyed reading Frank Miller's 300 mini-series.

I bought and read the Ronin comics when they were first published in the 80’s. I remember enjoying them at the time but I haven’t re-read them since then.

[Happy Noodle Boy]

On 9/12/2023 at 9:48 AM, D2 said:

My contribution: I think Batman: Year One is the greatest Batman story, ever. 

I don't think that's an unpopular take. But I think making Gordon's kid that Batman rescued a baby boy instead of Barbara makes it not quite the epic it could have been. Barbara could have been a pre-teen to make the timeline work out.

My favorite Batman stories are the two Matt Wagner miniseries, Batman and the Monster Men and Batman and the Mad Monk. Very 1940's, with no Robins  to be seen.

[Coverless 9.8]

On 9/12/2023 at 3:31 PM, Mark Warren said:

 We're just lucky Moore didn't decide to write a story about Lex Luthor's origin. We would've had "Superboy made me go bald" as Luthor's motivation chiseled in stone forever. 

Superboy's loss was Luthor's Rogaine!  

[Lazyboy]

On 9/12/2023 at 2:12 PM, valiantman said:

I'm saying that it's fantastic for the hobby when something that was once worthless becomes a collectible. Every single Golden Age comic was once worthless. Most Silver Age books were once worthless. Bronze Age 30 and 35 cent variants were once "no different" than their regular price counterparts. Second, third, fourth, fifth print Copper books were worthless. Baseball cards were put in bicycle spokes, Star Wars toys were passed down, Lego sets were always opened, video games were sold for almost nothing in garage sales, VHS tapes were clearance items. These examples are all collectible many years after they were deemed worthless. 

Meanwhile, there are $1,000 brand new comics. There are $500 brand new packs of baseball cards. The most valuable sportscards of all time include cards printed since 2000. It's possible to "manufacture" any new collectible at whatever value (or limited quantity) you want it to have, but these are manipulations of the original hobby.

Collectibles worth having were once worthless.

Okay. I was pretty sure you were just railing against manufactured collectibles.

[Cat]

On 9/11/2023 at 6:15 AM, Ken Aldred said:

Thought it was a masterpiece back in the 80s, but I’m in a fairly sizeable group that by now has come to dislike the space squid ending.

I like the movies ending better. 

[the blob]

On 9/11/2023 at 4:56 PM, valiantman said:

The numbers will tell the story.  All our anecdotes about "perfect newsstands" and "destroyed direct editions" won't mean squat if the availability consistently tells a different story.  So far, it's pretty clear... except for books where the direct edition collectors raided the newsstands (ASM #252, #361, Thor #337-#339), there just aren't a ton of high grade newsstands to be had. If they exist, they're not making their way to CGC.  If they're not making their way to CGC, they may not exist. When there are 10 times more of A than B, is it crazy to think that B should sell for 2 times the price of A?  Some of you guys get your undies in a knot when things that are 20 times less common sell for a 20% premium.  Math doesn't care about feelings.

Well, by the time of ASM 361, newsstands were dying out anyway. The others are mid 80s books and yeah, by then there was definitely a lot more spec. My old LCS ordered 1000 copies of Thor 339 and 500 of 338. True, I don't think the shops were ready on 337.  I just think late 70s newsstands are a different story. 

[Cat]

The 90's were not all doom-and-gloom. They have us some great comics. Offhand, to name a few, Operation:Galactic Storm, Age Of Apocalypse, Onslaught, Green Lantern with Kyle Rayner was a breath of fresh air, JSA The Golden Age, Starman, and finally JSA by Goyer, Robinson, and Johns. Terrific books all from an era that people would have you believe was a desert for quality. I'm sure there's many more. 

For the record I love chromium covers, they keep the pages inside in such beautiful condition. I would legit pay for every book to have a chromium cover. I've said that for decades now. Just protects the book so much better, and keeps it minty fresh,a pleasure to reread. 

[valiantman]

On 9/12/2023 at 3:29 PM, Lazyboy said:

Okay. I was pretty sure you were just railing against manufactured collectibles.

Abbbb...soooooo... lutely.