COMIC STORES 2023: 'IT'S NEARLY 2024 AND I'M MORE THAN CONCERNED' 4 4

[1Cool]

Roy is attacked on this site.  People can say it's not true but it's pretty plain if you have been here for awhile.  People do not debate the ideas he has but instead attack the person.  This has morphed into always dissecting that person's statement to always posting a certain emoji when the person writes something.  Roy in my opinion does bring it on himself to some extent by the manner of writing and being borderline political way too often but maybe some people should ignore his post more like I was recommending he do.  Attack mode shouldn't be the default on a comic book message boards.  

[1Cool]

On 11/20/2023 at 4:01 PM, Prince Namor said:

When I want to read comics, something new, I usually pick up a Manga I've been considering. The stories are inspired, sometimes weird, and the stories come from an angle that sometimes surprises me. 

With mainstream Marvel and DC, it's just the same regurgitated ideas I've read for years. It's boring.

 

I've not read a new comic since around the time Saga came out so it's good to hear what books people are actually reading (even if they are not super hero books).  

[Prince Namor]

On 11/21/2023 at 3:42 AM, jsilverjanet said:

so they made changes to some characters to appeal to a different group of buyers, because their old buyers stopped buying their merchandise...

It's the Jimmy Olsen 'fish boy' story, perverted to the nth degree.

In the 60's, in order to sell more books - DC realized that when they had a storyline where something shocking happened to a character - it pumped up sales.

If on the cover, Jimmy Olsen had been turned into a 'Fish Boy', people wanted to know what happened. By the end of the issue, Jimmy was back to normal, and comic fans of the day could breathe a sigh of relief.

Then some genius figured out, they could make it a continued story and get sales up for maybe TWO issues.

See where this is going?

Fast forward to the 90's and 12 part Secret Wars and 17 part Maximum Carnage, etc.

Even now with 'Wolverine Dies' and 'Captain America becomes a Nazi spy!' and... someone's Gay! They run with it as long as they can.

It's all gimmicks.

[1Cool]

On 11/20/2023 at 3:42 PM, jsilverjanet said:

I think there are several discussions going on being tied into one discussion

1 the decline of comics as a media form

2 the decline of marvel

1 - there are far more outlets as people have mentioned, i think video games is a great one. why spend $5 on a comic that i can read in 5 minutes etc, or play a video game for $60 that not only will last me forever (in a young persons version of time/space), but it's what all my friends are doing and i interact with while doing it etc

2 - the problem with Marvel is very complex. you have a set of characters with a backlog of history (over 60 years for Spiderman). Haven't all the spider-man stories been told already (over 5-6 titles throughout the years)? so what can i do with this character creatively that hasn't been done before

the people who were buying Spider-man in the 80's 90's 00's and even beyond, aren't buying the title anymore (unless you are completely the entire run) , what could they do to bring those readers back? anything? everyone claims better stories etc, but let's be honest we probably won't come back to buy it and if we do, how many issues will we stay on the run? are we going back to getting pull lists, or stopping at the comic shop on Wednesdays? how many of you are at your shop every wednesday?

go to a shop on Wednesday, look at the people who still have pull lists, look at those pull lists, that's an entire different group of buyers and I suspect not many on this CGC board

and this is with Spider-man, what chance does a b character have?

so Marvel needs to appeal to a new audience, an audience that has nothing to really do with the buyers from the previous decades etc

change the character too much, that group will be completely unhappy, but they weren't really buying your product so it doesn't matter

the smaller publishers like Image are successful because they can create a character and move on once their story is completed. Marvel is in a tough spot, they are damned if they do and damned if they don't.

so they made changes to some characters to appeal to a different group of buyers, because their old buyers stopped buying their merchandise

this lie that we tell ourselves that we would go back to buying modern comics, if A B C happened is a lie, we aren't going back, i certainly wouldn't be spending $5 on a new comic, even it was good. I got other responsibilities and choose to spend my money differently.

 

 

You still talk to that board member that opened a store several years ago (I think it was Jason)?  It didn't sound like it was working out pre-COVID so I hope he either turned it around of got out when the going was good.  

[Prince Namor]

On 11/21/2023 at 4:03 AM, 1Cool said:

Roy is attacked on this site.  People can say it's not true but it's pretty plain if you have been here for awhile.  People do not debate the ideas he has but instead attack the person.  This has morphed into always dissecting that person's statement to always posting a certain emoji when the person writes something.  Roy in my opinion does bring it on himself to some extent by the manner of writing and being borderline political way too often but maybe some people should ignore his post more like I was recommending he do.  Attack mode shouldn't be the default on a comic book message boards.  

I'm attacked pretty regular on my Lee-Kirby-Ditko threads, usually by the same people.

I put them on ignore and report any post that is directed at me as opposed to the topic.

It seems to have mostly went away because of this, with the exception of one specific troll - but I don't engage him at all. I just have him on ignore and report any post that is directed at me as opposed to the topic.

Sometimes moderation steps in and sometimes they don't.

I just do my thing.

 

This is directly the opposite of the way I used to handle it.

I am no wallflower when it comes to a verbal battle.

But it got me into nothing but trouble. I LEARNED.

Some people learn and some people don't.

But I feel no pity for wounds that are self inflicted. 

Edited November 20, 2023 by Prince Namor

[1Cool]

On 11/20/2023 at 4:13 PM, Prince Namor said:

I'm attacked pretty regular on my Lee-Kirby-Ditko threads, usually by the same people.

I put them on ignore and report any post that is directed at me as opposed to the topic.

It seems to have mostly went away because of this, with the exception of one specific troll - but I don't engage him at all. I just have him on ignore and report any post that is directed at me as opposed to the topic.

Sometimes moderation steps in and sometimes they don't.

I just do my thing.

 

This is directly the opposite of the way I used to handle it.

I am no wallflower when it comes to a verbal battle.

But it got me into nothing but trouble. I LEARNED.

Some people learn and some people don't.

But I feel no pity for wounds that are self inflicted. 

You seem to have laid out a pretty good route for avoiding pretty much every conflict on the boards.  Ignoring people should be pretty easy considering the filtering options we have and the fact that it's very, very easy to just pass on by if you don't like a post of a series of posts.  We all know Roy doesn't like to let slights go unanswered - especially if he is passionate about the topic. I hope he gets the ability to just ignore some people when they start picking at his every word.

[1Cool]

On 11/20/2023 at 4:08 PM, Prince Namor said:

It's the Jimmy Olsen 'fish boy' story, perverted to the nth degree.

In the 60's, in order to sell more books - DC realized that when they had a storyline where something shocking happened to a character - it pumped up sales.

If on the cover, Jimmy Olsen had been turned into a 'Fish Boy', people wanted to know what happened. By the end of the issue, Jimmy was back to normal, and comic fans of the day could breathe a sigh of relief.

Then some genius figured out, they could make it a continued story and get sales up for maybe TWO issues.

See where this is going?

Fast forward to the 90's and 12 part Secret Wars and 17 part Maximum Carnage, etc.

Even now with 'Wolverine Dies' and 'Captain America becomes a Nazi spy!' and... someone's Gay! They run with it as long as they can.

It's all gimmicks.

Based on the current print runs it appears the gimmicks are not working   I always thought the age of multiple variant covers was the beginning of the end of printed comics since it was just one big gimmick to get extra sales on a lagging product. 

[Prince Namor]

On 11/21/2023 at 4:22 AM, 1Cool said:

You seem to have laid out a pretty good route for avoiding pretty much every conflict on the boards.  Ignoring people should be pretty easy considering the filtering options we have and the fact that it's very, very easy to just pass on by if you don't like a post of a series of posts.  We all know Roy doesn't like to let slights go unanswered - especially if he is passionate about the topic. I hope he gets the ability to just ignore some people when they start picking at his every word.

It would be INFINITELY better if we had an ignore system like on Facebook. You ignore someone, and it is like they cease to exist in the world. You see NOTHING. No nested quotes, no messages, NOTHING.

For some reason, this silly place, and many here, are against it.

[squidmo2000]

[Prince Namor]

On 11/21/2023 at 4:25 AM, 1Cool said:

Based on the current print runs it appears the gimmicks are not working   I always thought the age of multiple variant covers was the beginning of the end of printed comics since it was just one big gimmick to get extra sales on a lagging product. 

It still works to some degree. Comic Book print runs, overall have been falling since the 70's, with the one main blip in the 90's and blip of a lesser degree in the early 2000's.

But when Marvel 'kills' Wolverine or has an Anniversary issue that they price at $9.99, and incentivize with multiple variant covers - it works temporarily...

But it is its own kind of bubble and sooner or later its going to pop and be ugly...

[VintageComics]

On 11/20/2023 at 4:13 PM, Prince Namor said:

But I feel no pity for wounds that are self inflicted. 

Let me, with good intent put this in crayon for everyone. 

I want no pity and I don't have wounds. I don't wound easily, and I genuinely enjoy disagreeing because it makes me stronger, wiser and better but some people just don't play fair and can only hit below the belt. 

So if you want to bring my (or anyone's) points into a discussion, I would ask you not to "copy and paste" small sections of what someone said. It's not how to have a proper discussion, especially when details matter. 

Click on that little + sign on the bottom left of every post.

This will allow you to carry AS MANY QUOTES AS YOU WANT over into your post, and then quote people PROPERLY and discuss what's IN THE QUOTE rather than paraphrasing and coloring with your own words.

That is how you play fair. 

And DON'T TALK ABOUT THE MESSENGER. Just talk about the message.

If everyone did that, this place would be far more productive and peaceful and I think everyone would appreciate that, not just me. 

 

Edited November 20, 2023 by VintageComics
Made it less personal.

[Buzzetta]

On 11/20/2023 at 4:25 PM, 1Cool said:

Based on the current print runs it appears the gimmicks are not working   I always thought the age of multiple variant covers was the beginning of the end of printed comics since it was just one big gimmick to get extra sales on a lagging product. 

They can work when used in moderation and with a compelling reason to do so.

I liked and have been purchasing the Disney 100 Years variant covers.

This was an Amazing Spider-man variant.  Yes, I am surprised it was not an Avengers variant. 

 

 

[Prince Namor]

On 11/21/2023 at 4:38 AM, VintageComics said:

So if you want to bring my (or anyone's) points into a discussion, I would ask you not to "copy and paste" small sections of what someone said. It's not how to have a proper discussion, especially when details matter. 

I didn't do that purposefully, I was trying to limit my words.

[VintageComics]

I'd like to genuinely apologize for my part in the derailment and won't contribute to it any longer. Thanks to @1Cool and @D2 who tried to help. 

Edited November 20, 2023 by VintageComics

[squidmo2000]

you are funny Roy....

[jsilverjanet]

On 11/20/2023 at 3:03 PM, 1Cool said:

Roy is attacked on this site.  People can say it's not true but it's pretty plain if you have been here for awhile.  People do not debate the ideas he has but instead attack the person.  This has morphed into always dissecting that person's statement to always posting a certain emoji when the person writes something.  Roy in my opinion does bring it on himself to some extent by the manner of writing and being borderline political way too often but maybe some people should ignore his post more like I was recommending he do.  Attack mode shouldn't be the default on a comic book message boards.  

I agree some people can be a real lightning rod. I remember a few other people who were constantly attacked

copperagekids

hustruck

Chip Cataldo

certainly these boards have a habit of targeting someone and not letting up

the boards have a mob mentality that's for sure

 

 

Edited November 20, 2023 by jsilverjanet

[jsilverjanet]

if a tree falls in the woods, does it make any sound?

if a tree falls on a railroad track, destroying the track, having the train flip over etc, is it pretty easy to say, i don't like trees very much?

but it's not the trees fault

it just wasn't in the woods were it would have not bothered anyone with all that noise/destruction etc

Edited November 20, 2023 by jsilverjanet

[squidmo2000]

[jsilverjanet]

On 11/20/2023 at 3:10 PM, 1Cool said:

You still talk to that board member that opened a store several years ago (I think it was Jason)?  It didn't sound like it was working out pre-COVID so I hope he either turned it around of got out when the going was good.  

i do not, i do see some local shop owners at comic conventions and ask how things are going, they say it's steady for now but nowhere what it was 2-3 years ago

oddly enough i picked up 8 short boxes of modern variants a local shop owner was blowing out at a show for $2. me and a friend picked up cheap and sold them for $1 and then I sold my half to my friend

one thing i see at shows a lot are multiple long boxes of $1-$2 modern books being sold - retail for the consumer is $4.99 sometimes even $9.99 on the anniversary issues

kinda hard to grow a market where the retailer is being put at a disadvantage and no one wins (not even the buyer)

[squidmo2000]

Not concerned about things I can't control.Next year,I plan on selling my books,slowly,tax reasons,lol.Surfer first.then late FF's,then Spidey.....it was a good ride,I had alot of fun,made a few bucks...and laughed my off on these boards...win win,thanks.....