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ASM #252 CGC 9.8 Record Sale - something fishy going on? - Holder Tampering Incident confirmed by CGC
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Started by spidermanbeyond,

9,029 posts in this topic

LOC Collectibles

LOC Collectibles

Posted
Posted
On 12/24/2023 at 9:36 AM, skybolt said:

Honestly, I think this is the likely main reason CGC has not come out with a statement. They're trying to see how much this board can uncover first.

My gut tells me their response will note negligence on the part of their re-holdering department. They'll note that staff should've checked the books more carefully if the slab came in with major damages that impacted the corners. The staff is going through proper training now to ensure this does not occur in the future. Any customers with books in question should send back to CGC for further evaluation. They will also ensure these were isolated cases and not rampant. Any issues with cert #'s or dates graded will be downplayed as system errors.

Rest assured, the blame will 100% be passed.

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sledgehammer

sledgehammer

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On 12/24/2023 at 10:47 AM, migmtl76 said:

Some folks think it could be a woman.

Could he be using a fake name ?

Anywho you can see a reflection in the back of ASM 300 of this individual.

Maybe it's a couple?  Who knows??

Did you watch the video? The comments all seemed to be written "seedy guyish" is his communications to me, but make your own call

"I've been a collector for 30 years"  Exact written words.

That could fit a 36 year old man. Especially one that wants to BS everybody.

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VintageComics

VintageComics

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I know a lot of people laughed early on at @paqart's assertion that eBay may have recourse. 

Now, with alleged shill bidding, price fixing, racketeering and fraudulent products this takes on a very different picture.  

This is massive fraud, on a grand scale through eBay's website. 

Is anyone on contact with or has anyone heard of anyone who has contacted eBay about this?

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VintageComics

VintageComics

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On 12/24/2023 at 12:06 PM, sledgehammer said:
On 12/24/2023 at 11:47 AM, migmtl76 said:

Some folks think it could be a woman.

Could he be using a fake name ?

Anywho you can see a reflection in the back of ASM 300 of this individual.

Maybe it's a couple?  Who knows??

Did you watch the video? The comments all seemed to be written "seedy guyish" is his communications to me, but make your own call

"I've been a collector for 30 years"  Exact written words.

That could fit a 36 year old man. Especially one that wants to BS everybody.

The name of this person is allegedly known. It's just not public yet. 

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VintageComics

VintageComics

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On 12/24/2023 at 12:10 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

Wasn’t it already posted in this thread?

I haven't read the entire thread. Where was it posted?

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sledgehammer

sledgehammer

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On 12/24/2023 at 11:13 AM, THE_BEYONDER said:
On 12/24/2023 at 11:13 AM, BigLeagueCHEW said:

I posted a possible, but who knows what the real name is? 

@sledgehammer

 

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skybolt

skybolt

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On 12/24/2023 at 11:07 AM, VintageComics said:

I know a lot of people laughed early on at @paqart's assertion that eBay may have recourse. 

Now, with alleged shill bidding, price fixing, racketeering and fraudulent products this takes on a very different picture.  

This is massive fraud, on a grand scale through eBay's website. 

Is anyone on contact with or has anyone heard of anyone who has contacted eBay about this?

This is like watching a police car chase where the perpetrator is driving 120 mph and police is going 25 mph. The guy is probably sitting back sipping tea and waiting for his eBay funds to kick in. In the meantime he's looking up some tours in the Caribbean.

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Buzzetta

Buzzetta

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On 12/24/2023 at 12:07 PM, VintageComics said:

I know a lot of people laughed early on at @paqart's assertion that eBay may have recourse. 

Now, with alleged shill bidding, price fixing, racketeering and fraudulent products this takes on a very different picture.  

This is massive fraud, on a grand scale through eBay's website. 

Is anyone on contact with or has anyone heard of anyone who has contacted eBay about this?

Again Roy, no one "laughed".  There is no need for the dramatic. 

Previously it was mentioned for eBay to file suit against CGC.  eBay would never do that.   It opens a pandora's box for eBay that is not worth the ensuing legal trouble or burden it places upon them.  If eBay claimed that they were damaged because of someone else's inferior product t then allows for eBay to assume liability for all of their listings which they are not going to ever take up.  Despite their seller and buyer rules, they are not escrow.  As of now they perform a service to make the buyer whole if the product is not as described or claimed but they do not pursue action further than the extent of banning a user if there is a repeated demonstration of fraudulent activities. 

Let's say you want to file suit against eBay for selling fraudulent materials across their system.  Since the previous case filed in Europe they have tightened up the language both there and here to release them of responsibility of whether or not an item is "fake" or not.  

 

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paqart

paqart

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Posted (edited)
On 12/24/2023 at 9:37 AM, comicwiz said:

Nice job @agamoto! I juxtaposed the two for better comparison, and include the cert data as well as sales dates:

9.2 - 4134002001 was graded on 1/24/2023 and sold on eBay July 1, 2023 for $1450 (Newsstand, MJ insert)

9.8 - 4152956002 was graded 11/09/2022 and sold on eBay Dec 16 2022 $4995 (Newsstand, MJ insert)

 

 

I'm missing something here. How does the $4,995 sale for the MJI/9.8 version happen before the $1,450 sale for the 9.2/MJI?

I'm picturing something like this:

Step 1 or 2) Buy "SLAB" (this is the 9.8 slab, with comic)
Step 1 or 2) Buy "INFERIOR" (this is the low grade comic)
Step 3) Swap INFERIOR into SLAB, making "FAKE"
Step 4) Get FAKE graded (must have latest graded date)
Step 5) Sell FAKE (must have latest sale date)

So how is the ASM INFERIOR graded and sold after the FAKE?

Edited by paqart
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grendel013

grendel013

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On 12/24/2023 at 11:47 AM, migmtl76 said:

Anywho you can see a reflection in the back of ASM 300 of this individual.

Using my sophisticated photo analysis software, I think I was able to identify the fraudster...

image.png.d1a694263851a12daa1f6e353b7eadcf.png

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Buzzetta

Buzzetta

Posted
Posted
On 12/24/2023 at 12:33 PM, paqart said:

I'm missing something here. How does the $4,995 sale for the MJI/9.8 version happen before the $1,450 sale for the 9.2/MJI?

I'm picturing something like this:

Step 1 or 2) Buy "SLAB" (this is the 9.8 slab, with comic)
Step 1 or 2) Buy "INFERIOR" (this is the low grade comic)
Step 3) Swap INFERIOR into SLAB, making "FAKE"
Step 4) Get FAKE graded (must have latest graded date)
Step 5) Sell FAKE (must have latest sale date)

So how is the ASM INFERIOR graded and sold before the FAKE?

The debate seems to rest on what is entered into the computer versus what is actually processed... 

I think... 

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