What’s your preference. Okajima or Denver Pedigree ? 2 2

[action1kid]

.

[jimbo_7071]

The Denver books have crummy pages, so I'd go with Okajima. I'm one of the odd ducks who prefers the ones without writing on them.

[Drgoldage]

Hi to my knowledge I don’t have a single Okajima Pedigree book from what I’ve seen on line they are lovely copies hopefully will own one some day . I have over a fourth of the Denver Pedigree Books most not encapsulated and page quality for mine are off white or better  , never seen one with “crummy “ pages , I can only wonder if a few  after sold were stored poorly . In general the Denver pedigree also doesn’t have identifying marks . I met the couple that acquired the Denver collection right after they bought it and loved their story on how they acquired it but it doesn’t have the impact of the story behind the Okajami. I favor the Denver Pedigree for the number of Key first issues but ask me again after I acquire  a few of the Okajima.

[Cat-Man_America]

This is difficult to answer, mainly because the Okajima Pedigree touches on an area of sensitivity regarding citizens wrongly persecuted and imprisoned because of their ethnicity. While I don't have a problem with the portrayal of Japanese soldiers as war propaganda on comics ...which would be very offensive taken out of the historical context... and I have quite a few examples in my collection, the idea of Japanese-American families having their possessions taken and being placed in guarded camps bothers me.

So, personally, my tendency would be avoidance of the Okajima pedigree, writing notwithstanding. That  isn't to criticize the pedigree itself or anyone else's taste collecting them as they're beautiful books, lovingly stored and maintained; definitely deserving of their stature in the collecting community. It's just a personal thing; they're splendid books, but honestly, I'd always prefer the Denver pedigree.

[Robot Man]

I have never had the opportunity to pick up a Denver. So I can’t comment on condition. Would love to have one for my pedigree “type” collection.

I do have a handful of Okajimas. None are what I would consider high grade to speak of. But the historical significance far out weighs that. 

[adamstrange]

On 1/31/2024 at 1:49 AM, Drgoldage said:

I met the couple that acquired the Denver collection right after they bought it and loved their story on how they acquired it

Do tell

[Drgoldage]

It was a few months after James Payette and Sparkle City acquired the “Denver “collection  early 1980 s I would say when I went down to a large antique show in downtown Omaha. I came across  a booth put up by a middle age couple from Colorado they had a lot of everything glass antique furniture old paper items and too my delight a box of high grade  comics from the 1950s . We started talking and they mentioned they had an antique store in Colorado which they kept stocked with frequent buying  trips back east , Pennsylvania a frequent state to visit and buy . Anyway while back east they caught site of a  flyer of an upcoming auction in Pennslyvania of a retired retail shop owner that caught their interest as it had older quality furniture ,antiques smalls etc including  paper items .The couple were not comic dealers or collectors but they got to the auction at an early preview and found one small box with twenty some comics  and on another table a larger box with more than a hundred. .The previous owner had apparently owned a newsstand and had kept one copy of first issues of magazines newspapers and comic books .The auction was loaded with quality items and the comic boxes were just there no fanfare but they immediately noticed these were not rag tag random comics but rather high grade all number 1 issues including Batman 1 , Marvel Comics 1 , Flash 1 , Captain America 1  all from late 1930 to early 1940s . The books were not protected no bags no boards no description of contents and they immediately knew they were special and valuable .  They noticed  the comics received no special attention at the preview they did request of the auctioneer to put the boxes next to each other with which they complied . Later that day they reviewed a comic price guide and made banking arrangements to have available nearly 50,000 dollars but they hoped to get them for, of course, far less . The day of the auction came and though a few auction goers looked at the box they received no special attention . The auction started and at the request of the couple the comics were sold early , to their surprise the Auctioneer grabbed  the first larger box and heaved the contents spreading them  across a empty table so the audience could get a better look. As it turned out there was one other auction goer who recognized the books were special and the bidding which started low quickly escalated with just the two bidding back and forth . The general audience had no idea of there value and when they won the first box for 8000 dollars they were relieved and the other bidder dejected he knew they were worth more but that’s all the money he had . The second bidder lost interest when he knew he had no chance to win and then  the second box went only for 1000 or so I was told . The couple after the auction put the books in plastic bags packed then tightly in luggage and then contacted several major dealers . James Payette received the list of high grade first issues asked for them  to send a example of one of the lowest graded items , found the book of high quality and bought the collection along with Sparkle City . My conversation with the couple sparked my interest so ,I bought a high grade Stange Adventures  9 that day (not from the Denver collection ) and then I contacted James Payette who still had several “Denver “copies available . 

[buttock]

On 1/31/2024 at 9:54 AM, Drgoldage said:

It was a few months after James Payette and Sparkle City acquired the “Denver “collection  early 1980 s I would say when I went down to a large antique show in downtown Omaha. I came across  a booth put up by a middle age couple from Colorado they had a lot of everything glass antique furniture old paper items and too my delight a box of high grade  comics from the 1950s . We started talking and they mentioned they had an antique store in Colorado which they kept stocked with frequent buying  trips back east , Pennsylvania a frequent state to visit and buy . Anyway while back east they caught site of a  flyer of an upcoming auction in Pennslyvania of a retired retail shop owner that caught their interest as it had older quality furniture ,antiques smalls etc including  paper items .The couple were not comic dealers or collectors but they got to the auction at an early preview and found one small box with twenty some comics  and on another table a larger box with more than a hundred. .The previous owner had apparently owned a newsstand and had kept one copy of first issues of magazines newspapers and comic books .The auction was loaded with quality items and the comic boxes were just there no fanfare but they immediately noticed these were not rag tag random comics but rather high grade all number 1 issues including Batman 1 , Marvel Comics 1 , Flash 1 , Captain America 1  all from late 1930 to early 1940s . The books were not protected no bags no boards no description of contents and they immediately knew they were special and valuable .  They noticed  the comics received no special attention at the preview they did request of the auctioneer to put the boxes next to each other with which they complied . Later that day they reviewed a comic price guide and made banking arrangements to have available nearly 50,000 dollars but they hoped to get them for, of course, far less . The day of the auction came and though a few auction goers looked at the box they received no special attention . The auction started and at the request of the couple the comics were sold early , to their surprise the Auctioneer grabbed  the first larger box and heaved the contents spreading them  across a empty table so the audience could get a better look. As it turned out there was one other auction goer who recognized the books were special and the bidding which started low quickly escalated with just the two bidding back and forth . The general audience had no idea of there value and when they won the first box for 8000 dollars they were relieved and the other bidder dejected he knew they were worth more but that’s all the money he had . The second bidder lost interest when he knew he had no chance to win and then  the second box went only for 1000 or so I was told . The couple after the auction put the books in plastic bags packed then tightly in luggage and then contacted several major dealers . James Payette received the list of high grade first issues asked for them  to send a example of one of the lowest graded items , found the book of high quality and bought the collection along with Sparkle City . My conversation with the couple sparked my interest so ,I bought a high grade Stange Adventures  9 that day (not from the Denver collection ) and then I contacted James Payette who still had several “Denver “copies available . 

Interesting, so the Denver collection is originally from Pennsylvania? 

[Drgoldage]

Yes

[action1kid]

On 1/30/2024 at 10:29 PM, jimbo_7071 said:

The Denver books have crummy pages, so I'd go with Okajima. I'm one of the odd ducks who prefers the ones without writing on them.

You mean cream/ off white?

[Pantodude]

Pennsylvania, where I went to college for four years, met the woman I've been with for almost 36 years, and gave us the single-highest graded of an uncommon Centaur:  World Famous Heroes Magazine #1 in 9.0, Denver pedigree. 

The label says OW, which is fine with me for this uncommon oldie, but what they say about undergrading of page quality with these older slabs (graded April 2002) might be apparent here.  I compared the look of my interior pages all around to my many slabbed GA books circa 1940 with OW/W and W page quality, and this Denver is at least OW/W interior pages based on that. 

Note:  I am not a ped collector, just happened to obtain a few, so just commenting on the particular issue of this ped that I own. That's my 

Edited January 31 by Pantodude
waffling over whether to scan the whole slab

[jimbo_7071]

On 1/31/2024 at 2:17 PM, action1kid said:

You mean cream/ off white?

Yes.

[lou_fine]

On 1/30/2024 at 7:29 PM, jimbo_7071 said:

The Denver books have crummy pages, so I'd go with Okajima. I'm one of the odd ducks who prefers the ones without writing on them.

Didn't you just contradicted yourself with your post here?  

[lou_fine]

On 1/30/2024 at 10:49 PM, Drgoldage said:

I favor the Denver Pedigree for the number of Key first issues

This is it EXACTLY and also the primary reason why I would go for the Denver, along with the fact that there are only 153 books out there.    

[MrBedrock]

On 1/30/2024 at 9:29 PM, jimbo_7071 said:

The Denver books have crummy pages...

Yep, awful page quality...

 

[Drgoldage]

That Doll man 1 and Dating mystery 1 are gorgeous,  with no surprise  great paper !!

[MrBedrock]

@Drgoldage Thanks for some back story on the Denver Penn books. The first I heard of them was around 1985/86 from a dealer-collector named Joe Dungan who lived in San Antonio. He had purchased a fair number of them from Payette and was trading them for DC's that he wanted. I had a bunch pass through my hands courtesy of Joe, including Crash 1, Green Hornet 1, Miracle 1, Rocket 1, Sure Fire 1, Super-Mystery 1, Rex Dexter 1, Flame 1 and the Dollman above. They all were incredibly fresh and had killer paper. I wish I had the foresight to, and could have afforded to, keep all of those books back then.

[Drgoldage]

Hi Richard , I  met Joe Dungan when Ed Sobolak introduced me to him down in a Houston Comic show a long time ago , he told me the same story about getting a nice stack of Denver Pedigree books right after James Payette picked them up . I ended up with the Rex Dexter 1 and Rocket 🚀 1 that you mentioned will see if I can post pictures later tonight . I like you wish I had had the foresight to buy more 

[Robot Man]

On 1/31/2024 at 9:33 AM, buttock said:

Interesting, so the Denver collection is originally from Pennsylvania? 

Yes, Denver PA is right next to Adamstown, PA a legendary place for antique collecting. Have been there many times and scored a lot of old comics in the shops and flea markets. It is about a half an hour away from Allentown. The birthplace of another legendary pedigree comic find. 

[action1kid]

On 1/31/2024 at 2:17 PM, action1kid said:

You mean cream/ off white?

I knew what you meant. Some people don’t like to have their books creamed on like Richard says.