gino2paulus2

I’m case anyone was curious what Wonderworld #31 looks like here is my copy I think it presents well enough and has nice PQ. 3rd highest graded (of 4) 🤣 It’s one I have always been surprised isn’t on more want lists. Personal taste aside it’s got the monsters, the bondage, the cool color pallete heck it’s even got Rivets for those early Planet lovers out there hehe!!

On 1/29/2022 at 2:31 PM, lou_fine said:

I guess you must be referring to this copy of U.S. Jones 2 with the classic Nazi WWII cover and a much much tougher book than U.S. Jones 1:  

https://comics.ha.com/itm/golden-age-1938-1955-/us-jones-2-fox-features-syndicate-1942-cgc-fn-55-off-white-to-white-pages/a/122205-19840.s?ic4=OtherResults-SampleItem-071515&tab=ArchiveSearchResults-012417

Looks like it has already hit Heritage's prescient auction listing description of this book coming in at more than 10X condition guide as it's already touching on 5-figures with another 2 days to go.  Then again, not really that much of a surprise considering how super rare and tough it is to find a copy of this book here with only 4 Universal unrestored copies on the census.  It also looks like the purchaser of Jon Berk's highest graded Church copy at CGC 8.0 must be absolutely ecstatic when they purchased it for what now appears to be a bargain basement price of only $13,800 back in the summer of 2017.  

I guess this goes to confirm that there are some diamonds in the rough just waiting to be mined in some of these later Fox books.  Some of the tougher ones and the ones that are also extremely HTF, if not impossible, to find in grade are the very few issues of Mystery Men and Wonderworld's that were not present in the Edgar Church collection.  Books such as Mystery Men 22 & 23 and Wonderworld 24 with census counts in the same ballpark as this U.S. Jones 2, but yet still only maxes out in only mid-grade condition in terms of highest graded copies to date.  If only we could have a repeat performance or a second shot at some of these books from the Jon Berk Collection.    

I know these parts have long heard me preach the words of the late 41’ early 42’ Fox books in terms of rare factor. Heritage even lists this USJ2 as being THE rarest Fox book. For perspective Berks copy sold in 2017. There has not been a single public sale of this issue since then!! So almost 5 years go by and none of the auctions houses or ebay have brought even 1 to market. There are only a handful of comics that this could be said about. I was contemplating attempting to upgrade my 3.0 copy when i first saw this pop up…the ship had sailed haha!! Good luck to all who are bidding it is a gorgeous copy and to think if you don’t land this one the wait could be awhile before another pops up!! Mine is NFS btw 🤟☺️

On 1/7/2022 at 9:48 PM, tth2 said:

The downside of buying low grade books is you end up owning a lot of crappy looking books. 

Also, you have to work so much harder.  If I sell one AF 15 in 9.6, I only need to list, pack and ship one book to get $3.6m.  How many AF 15s in 2.0 would I have to list, pack and ship to reach $3.6m? 

this is the kind of post i was hoping for!! Let’s play numbers 🤗 We will for example use that 9.6 that sold for a whopping 3.6 mil. We have the luxury of seeing in 2011 it sold for 1.1 mil. That’s a great return at about 227%. Let’s now use a 4.0 using GPA sold for for high 75K and in 2010 high was $5676. That’s a staggering 1240% increase!! So if you had taken that 1.1 mil you could have bought 196 copies BUT your overall return instead of 3.6 mil would have been $14,700,000!!! I think I would be willing to pack up 196 books for $11,000,000 wouldn’t you?!! That’s a lot of bubble wrap but it’s certainly not for peanuts (packing or not 🤣🙌) 

Again thinking realistically no one is going to find 196 copies of AF15 in 4.0 unless you’re an auction house who has 2 every week BUT the point is still made that investing in either ends of the pool have turned out pretty great. Just like a real pool, pond, lake, or ocean however the shallower waters seem to be getting affected by that beautifully warm sunshine even more than the deep cold often unseen depths of the highest grades!

On 1/7/2022 at 11:44 AM, buttock said:

There hasn't been an AF15 in 8.5 at auction since 2017 and the Action 1 in 8.5 is probably worth 50-100% more than what it sold for with the recent runups.  You could just as easily cite the recent 9.0 Hulk 1 at $490K which is roughly an equivalent multiple compared to 10 years ago as a 2.0.  In a bull market everything sells and grows.  When that market contracts the higher grade stuff is more likely to hold both its value and liquidity due to supply:demand ratio.  We can find exceptions to justify any claim, but as a general rule you'll be better off in the long term with premium quality books.  

As a general rule over the past 10 years you can see either the equivalent or MORE in many cases of percentage increase in value of the more obtainable copies period. I feel like every year i make a similar comment somewhere and get the same response of the bull market and how long term premium books will grow better and I am the only person bringing actual data to prove it’s not necessarily true in fact in most cases it’s not true. Just because we think should be and it makes sense in our heads doesn’t make it true. The data is there time and again and i’m not cherry picking i’ve done it on so many books but didn’t want to bog it down too much. 

GPA has a recorded AF 15 in 8.5 selling in Sept of 2021 i’m not sure if it was an auction or not but it was close to $707K (i’m not sure how many of us here are buyers at 707K for any 1 book that aren’t investments and i work very very hard but i’m out 😂)

the Bottom line is i’m not an investor or am in this to invest in comics and many here in Gold section are the same we are here for the love of the books. Even most dealers that participate here are big time comic lovers which is why this site has always been amazing. My collection could be worth zero dollars tomorrow and while it would be mildly upsetting it was a risk i was willing to take bc i was only putting in money I could afford to lose. I chase stuff no one may care about in 20 years and I know that but because I enjoy them so much  they could be worth nothing and still be worth something to me.

I gave my 2 cents here with data bc year after after year we see the same similar market reports that, “investing in premium high grade books” are a slam dunk long term. I’m not here to say that isn’t true just that it is misleading. Again, just because some PREFER high grade books doesn’t always mean they are a better investment. 

…and As many have said before me buy what you love and can afford to lose in this hobby and the reward will be worth so much more than the monetary gain. But if your buying power only gives you access to lower to mid graded copies don’t let the investment aspect deter you from pulling the trigger bc data proves you may have done pretty well had you not waited out for the higher graded copy.  

I know i’ve said this many times but i’m not quite sure the, “only buy high grade for investment purposes” holds any weight anymore as we have well over 10 years of data now and book and after book repeats the same pattern. If you had the same money you would have made more buying multiple lower grade copies than one high grade copy aside from maybe the highest grade example on rare occasions and even then you never know when someone will CPR etc. The stats are there to back it up on many and most sought after books.

Take AF 15 for example which trades hands enough to gather data. Over 10 years an 8.5 has went up about 600%. A 3.5 about 750%. and a 2.0 1000%!! basically if you would have bought 3 (2.0)s your net gain would have been significantly higher than had you bought 1 8.5.

Lets use the higher graded often traded book and try Hulk 181 on for size. If in 2010 you had bought a 9.8 you would be looking at a 320% increase today (not bad heck i take it!!) However in that same time frame 5.0s have increased a whopping 1,150%!! WOWZA!! Probably Should have taken than 20K and bought 40 copies in 5.0!! You would have done MUCH better investment wise.

Not satisfied with these common Silver and bronze examples let’s  try THE BIG ONE!! With a recent record setting sale of Action 1 in an 8.5 less than a year ago we can see another sale back in 2010. It would have been a nice return as you would have netted 117% increase. Again…not bad…not great either; at least compared to lower graded examples!! Had you taken that Same 1.5Mil back in 2010 and bought Five 3.0s that sold for around 300K you would have done FAR better as they have soared an earth shattering 460% in value!! 

I rest my case. Don’t count out the lower to mid grade copies of our hobby. As many have said the buyer pool is much higher AND let’s face it the numbers simply don’t lie.

On 1/3/2022 at 3:41 PM, Point Five said:

And man, did I want that #19! Such a neat cover. Unfortunately that was the most brittle book of all, literally flaking apart inside the CGC holder. I looked up the grading notes online and the CGC grader who wrote them practically steps through the screen and begs you not to buy the book. I threw in bids anyway, and still lost.

 

Have no fear there was a buyer out there brother and it was me hehehe!! I have made literally multiple wtb threads for this book over the years and never even got a lead so was elated to finally nab a copy!! I NEEDED this one for my hero/horror mashup collection and I’m highly considering having Kenny the Wizard Sanderson conserving this one since the presentation is nice enough and once he gets his paws on them you can kiss that brittleness goodbye. Not many sought after books 10 and under on the census anymore these days but this remains one of them for now. Let us see if it can survive the trip from Texas to nippy Cleveland Ohio in only a few separated pieces 🤣 

Top 3 2021…

3.   Silver Streak #8 White pages (I’ve had a few copies of this over the years but all 3 were either restored, destroyed (absolute brittle taped up rag), or incomplete (missing back cover) so to finally land a blue label with wonderful presentation and amazing PQ makes me gitty haha!!

2.   Our Flag #5!!! My favorite book of all time PERIOD. Not just picking up another copy but getting to own 2 for A short while was amazing and what makes me even happier is knowing the new owner of my old copy @sagii is just as appreciative of its rarity and cool factor as myself. Book is finally getting the respect it deserves!! 

#1.   Getting my oldest son started officially on his collection with some bigger books. Bringing in the next generation so to speak. Sure comics take a back seat to sports and friends etc as they did for me but i’m hopeful one day he will look back and appreciate sitting down and reading some of these stories with his old man like i did with mine and find an appreciation for it and if not he can always trade in his 2 UF4s for some beer money or something 🤣

Honorable mentions for 2021…

Thanks to @Cat-Man_America for firing up this thread every year as it’s always a favorite and thanks as well for putting this book on my radar years ago been chasing a decent copy ever since!!