zhamlau

I broke down before why the ANH and ESB comparison I believe is often applied incorrectly, Ill try and give a high level here. ESB had a run in the theaters of about 3 months primary distribution (which you can find on BoxOfficeMojo). After its 12th week it had a domestic gross of 141,000,000.00 ANH had a Run in the theaters of 12 months primary distribution (also reported in BoxOfficeMojo) which gave it a domestic gross of 214,000,000.00 There was a gap it seems as the movie was pulled for a while (still showing however in smaller theaters) for ANH but it was re-released the next year for a few weeks. In reality its primary release was 29 weeks for ANH and 12 for ESB. If you compare ANH's first 12 weeks run (Which is ESB entire primary run) the numbers are as follows ANH: 107,000,000.00 ESB: 141,000,000.00 If you want to , just for "funzies" (or however its spelled) look at ROTJ's First 12 week domestic gross... ROTJ: 219,000,000.00 ROTJ murders ANH and ESB over the same period of time. Each of the 3 movies over its first 12 week run gets stronger as the series goes on (based on US domestic numbers). You can dive in the numbers further, but if we are just talking US box office alone, ESB outperforms ANH over the same periods in the theater. Where you start getting some muddied info is when you try and factor in re-release numbers into the equation. I like to keep it clean, US box office over like for like periods of time. I've always found this topic fascinating anyway.

Im here now, heard back from a few others. Should be a good show so far. Im tempted to go that comedy club they are setting up right now in the room we normally use.

Ouch, sorry man what happened?

Haha, well I hate leafs fans so as long it’s not one of their caps we will be good

Hey just wondering who else is heading in tomorrow.

What do people think of the price the Starlin Warlock page got? I feel anything that cosmic Starlin bronze is going to of course be high, but without Thanos it has a potential to sell sorta flat in an auction format.

The Sal page. In terms of execution, flow, emotion, collect-ability , and long term value/growth...its the winner of those two. 1. Right Era 2. Right Artists 3. Right Characters 4. Great execution 5. Great Eye Appeal 6. Established market 7. Greater numbers of collectors looking for pages like it 8. Main line not annual On every measurable level, that first page is better. The AJ page doesnt suck, dont get me wrong. Its fine and well done. But the Sal page just feels cleaner and is more gripping. The fight is more personal and less about having a big splash panel like some mini cover.It feels like two people who truly hate each other just going to blows. Also having Nick Fury being tortured by the Skull in the top just adds Bronze age drama. Cleaner winner for Sal IMO.

Over time I grew to not like it very much, for those first few seasons were awesome! Creative show at the very least.

I kinda wonder how that will effect this sale.

God, what a time capsule to a different Era. The style and look of it appears as modern as any Image or indie published book today. But when you look at the content, it couldn't scream anymore of a bygone era. Someone smoking, siting in the back seat of a stationwagon style vehicle with blankets. Boombox present, people actually engaging each other with no cellphones in view, and people looking somewhat disheveled without spending hours and hundreds to design the look. I never gave a cr@% about love and rockets before, but i look at this cover and i see something beyond nostalgia. This appears almost like a work of fine art. It just captures a time perfectly. Great pick up.

The spider-man figure appears to be hand drawn paste up, cant see where it ends though. I assume this is another cover with elements pasted together? This look like a 280-300k cover?

Its Dave Dorman, not sure what from though.

The Jedi Luke? LOL, actually id rather have watched that movie (fixed that btw).

then thats my bad. Im sorry i misread that. One question: Honestly did you think TLJ was a good movie?

LOL....god a line by line recounting of his opinions and rationalizations followed up by an ever present like-minded friend following up with a "wow you're the best" meme...We have hit internet debate perfection... TLJ and its Spinoff did 1/2 of what the first film/spinoff combo did. The Chinese market looks all but lost to the films based on performances. Spinoff films were being worked on but no are not. all of those are facts you may have not agreed on those but they are true. I personally find those to be very damning of KK and her vision for the franchise and its future, and I can very easily see a corporation doing the same. You do not, that's all this is despite all the high handed "Im calling out BS" self aggrandizing.

In the end, this really winds up with just people having differing opinions and pretending everyone else is wrong. The money the films made is fact (mostly, I still wonder if some of these numbers are sometimes fudged by the studio at times with creative accounting but that's a different story lol). The first two movies had a more competitive marketplace to fight and managed to make nearly 100% more in ticket sales and DVD sales then the last two. That's a fact. We can argue if that's problematic for Disney or if they will just accept that greatly reduced revenue and not question it. But the fact is the TJL and its follow up act Solo came into what should have been favorable conditions and managed to vastly under perform the first two in ticket sales and DVD/Rentals combined. Why that happened again we can debate all we want with no one being able to actually prove anything, just make arguments in their favor. No one here is a guardian of truth, we are just interpreters of facts and the opinions of other theorists. No one knows if KK is going to be fired or not, no one here was in the room. There are reports it was seriously looked at, but if you want you can down play them and write them off. Again no one here was at any of those meetings so it's all speculation. Disney would never admit to having the conversation either, It looks bad and unsteady and no company with shareholders would want that. I think this is probably the most honest assessment any of us can make. I personally think Disney looks at that as lost revenue and ties it to fan reactions and extreme displeasure with the way KK is steering the franchise. Others might think Disney just looks at it as an unusually steep drop off and completely unrelated waning fan interest. To each their own. There were films in production that have on some level, after Solo, been put on hold/not moving forward at this time. I think that part, with the statements of the Rogue one art Director and Ewan, is not in question. I think its clearly tied to the lack of fan support of Solo which i think would be hard to argue against, but again all ANYONE here can do is speculate on this front. Why solo , a quality movie, did so poorly is up to speculation. I think like many think its due to fan displeasure with its lead in movie TJL. That not going to this movie was their way of showing Disney they aren't pleased with how this is being steered. Again, we can debate the causes all we want. If you feel the franchise is in a healthy place and has nearly full fan support and a strong future based on the leadership of KK so be it, everyone's entitled to their interpretation. I feel otherwise as do many others. Time will tell.

He and George Evans always drew such nice planes. Great piece!

And the sick part is we spend more on k-12 education then almost country on the planet, we just arent getting much for it. Thats why I get so tired of new invented taxes, I just dont feel like Im getting anything for the increases.

I Don't think its fair to call this just a hobby though, and to not think about the investment value. These aren't 10 dollar match box cars or 3 dollar new issues. These pages are thousands to hundreds of thousands of dollars. They are BMW's and Round the World vacations we just happen to put in binders or hang on the wall. When you spend more on a 11x17 sheet of paper then would on a new Ferrari, you have fully passed from the realm of "hobby" and moved onto "future retirement investment".

And won the box office anyway for 2017. This is like speculating that they're going to fire Bellichick for winning the Super Bowl but not by enough points. No its not, its showing failure to maintain. Also TFA had to fend off Jurassic Park, An Avengers Movie, and a Disney Pixar Movie. TLJ had to beat Jumanji 2.0 and a remake of Beauty and the beast (which it just BARELY edged out).

I think this is a key point. These core films, on title alone, would make 1 billion each (if one didnt, there would be more then one firing lol). Again, i would be Disney isnt looking at the fact that it made the default threshold and be satisfied. I think they look at TFA and think "this is what we can get if we hit our audience right". This thread alone seems to be proof of the fan divide and on some level anger. Thats NOT something Disney wants. They want to sell mugs, teeshirts, and plastic figures. They want something that appeals across the board, and branches out into foreign markets, namely China. You wanna see something interesting, look at the fall off in China (aka what disney thinks is its future by way of its film productions and expanding presence there). TFA did 124 million in China TJL did 42 Million in China For Spin offs Rogue one did 62 million (also seen 69 million before but cant find now) Solo did 9 million (!!!) Thats dangerous to Disney, that is the exact opposite of what they want to see considering their push there. I think that alone is giving them pause. The brand under her seems to be dying in their hopeful future playground.

TJL made nearly 1 billion dollar less then TFA.That can very easily kill a career in a town where you seem to only be as good as your last outing. They did not make that film and spent that money to expect to do close to 40% less than the previous outing. I don't think they were expecting this level of deep and sustained fan backlash and apathy leading to lack of interest in future products. TFA and its spin-off follow up Rogue One combined did 3.3 Billion. TJL and its follow up Spin Off Solo did 1.7 Billion.That's not normal fall off, especially considering these films were unworldly ({un intended?) expensive to make. I feel that fall off in huge part is directly tied to TLJ and the choices greenlight by KK in that movie, im not alone by any means in that analysis. Past performance I think has to be factored you are right, but again Disney will only go so long with someone helming a ship that appears to be sinking. Cancelling spinoff movies, to me, speaks volumes. I also think the completely debacle of the director hiring/firing through Solo cant be waved away either. That you could have such a fundamental misunderstanding of what the project was supposed to be, this far into it, is mind blowing. I'd LOVE to see how much money TJL made in licensing versus TFA, that would tell the truest story.

Tax his land, tax his wage, Tax his bed in which he lays. Tax his tractor, tax his mule, Teach him taxes is the rule. Tax his cow, tax his goat, Tax his pants, tax his coat. Tax his ties, tax his shirts, Tax his work, tax his dirt. Tax his chew, tax his smoke, Teach him taxes are no joke. Tax his car, tax his grass, Tax the roads he must pass. Tax his food, tax his drink, Tax him if he tries to think. Tax his sodas, tax his beers, If he cries, tax his tears. If he hollers, tax him more, Tax him until he’s good and sore. Tax his coffin, tax his grave, Tax the sod in which he lays.

Angry contrarian screed!!!! SCREAMING PARTISAN ANGER!!!!!!! Meh, I don't really feel the need to play the game anymore with some of you. Lets not get personal, its a dam star wars movie thread. If you feel you cant disagree without getting personal, you have issues and probably need to take a step back. As for a response to the case being laid out.... Long and short the films as i shown have done poorly as they progress. There are countless articles pointing out that "making lots less money than expected is bad for Disney". Even if you don't agree and are dismayed at the notion they would consider replacing an under performing executive, its fair to say that routinely happens in boardrooms across this nation when expectations aren't being meet. KK is not meeting expectations, if she was we wouldnt be having these conversations all across the internet. As to the notion that spinoff films have been put on hold... As of this month Ewan McGregor said he doesn't know of an official Obi-Wan movie being made (stated live on "The View") which would indicate its not moving forward at this time (even though last year they started scouting locations according to multiple reports). Neil Lamont, a production designer for lucasfilm said a movie spinoff he was working on was put on hold (again just this month). Either Ewan and this Lucasfilm employee are lying, or at least SOME spinoffs being planned before have been put on hold after the flop of KK's Solo. The facts are the films have under performed greatly. TJL is nearly 1 billion dollars off the pace of the TFA even though it had every historically positive tailwind behind it (loyal fans, good lead in, favorable release date, world class marketing). Rogue one did nearly 3 times what Solo did, and both were very good movies. Before TLJ spinoff's do well it, after TLJ they crash and burn. The only thing you can try to hang your hat on is to try and discredit the sources that say Disney wanted to remove KK due to very poor performance of the product she is producing and the chaos (firing directors in mid filming, etc) she brings. That's fine, I get it. If you want we can all concede no one reading this was at any of the meetings or have anything but well groomed sources supporting our opinions.

I think Disney looks at it not in terms of "hey it made a BILLION!"....they expect each of these films to make 1-2 billion each. This is what they paid for. What they are seeing I'm sure is the lost revenue. TLJ most likely should have (in their eyes) done just under 2 billion. Solo should have done something approaching 1 billion ala Rogue One. To them, they are looking at potentially 1-1.5 billion dollars in expected revenue lost due to the mistakes of TJL. That's most of the profit they intended to make on these two films. These films cost 300-400 million each to make when you add up all costs including marketing. They aren't looking to break even, they aren't looking for ways to talk 500-600 million out of their pockets for TLJ alone. The bombs already hit for them. That's why the panic. If this next film could have made like 1.7-1.8 billion and it comes in around 1.1-1.2 Billion instead due to people hating the decisions KK and RJ have made in the last episode, That's gonna gut punch The Mouse. Even they don't cheerfully throw away 1 billion dollars. This film changed the profit trajectory of the franchise. Id love to see how toy and marketing sales are going for these properties...I'm betting pretty poorly also. Those funds being lost will eventually cause upheaval.