Jaydogrules

You're still posting. Ain't nobody reading. I'll assume you're speaking for yourself. Does that mean I can expect you to stop trolling me now ? -J.

The existence of the five below books disproves your notion of how Marvel accounts for and prints incentive variants. Your numbers mean absolutely nothing. Your estimates mean absolutely nothing. You have no idea how Marvel determines its final print numbers, nobody here does. Finding a VALUED incentive variant in the packs being an exception is not the point. The fact that they contained high ratio incentive variants AT ALL is the point. Today that ignored incentive variant could be 10 bucks, tomorrow it could 200 bucks. Even if all of the packs being sold by five below only contain dozens of copies of 1:50 and 1:75 variants then that isn't an infinitesimal amount of copies. Dozens of copies of a "rare" incentive variant is not insignificant. How would those Venom variants be doing on eBay right now if there were dozens of listings instead of only a handful? You don't need palettes of these books sitting in warehouse somewhere waiting to be discovered to devalue these books. Yeah, yeah, yeah anything is possible, so what ? Marvel has actually gone on the record confirming via Diamond how they produce their retailer variants. You evidently just don't believe them (for some reason). Do you actually read what other boardies say before you respond, or are you already formulating that self-important drivel in your head before you even finish reading a post ? And what made you decide to post this sputum under "darkstar" today instead of under "lazyboy", "grails" or any one of a number of your other usernames? Just curious. I think you should go back and re-read the part where it was stated that marvel will print a variant up to the nearest case of 200-225, and also accounting for potential damaged copies, with the possible exception of an event book or a "#1" book which they may print at an excess. So where might some of those overages end up once in a blue moon ? In a five below pack or at a variant sell off, that's where. No one ever said no variant is ever over printed excessively beyond what retailers order. What was said is that is rare. You are far, far more likely to see a variant in a retailer's bargain bin than you are in a five below pack. Period. Any one who says they regularly find incentive variants in a five below pack is lying. They are indeed out there but finding one is the exception not the rule. And again, as a percentage of the sheer volumes of variants a publisher prints in a single year , this is an infinitesimal amount. -J.

More meaningless numbers and conjecture. More meaningless babble from the peanut gallery. Seriously, do you ever have anything productive to say? -J. Striking down the nonsense you insist on posting in regards to incentive variants seems pretty productive to me. I'm not a big fan of misinformation, especially when it involves money. But yeah all those ASM 4 Ramos variants that hit the market after their discovery at the five below stores was just an infinitesimal amount, right? That didn't noticeably affect the supply or market price of that book, right? And those copies were already accounted for in your nonsense calculations as a result of using a partial print number divided by the incentive ratio then rounding that number up to the closest case total plus 10% for overages and non North American market copies, right? And lets just ignore the fact that those packs also contained higher ratio variants including 1:50 and 1:75 variants. 1:75 ratio variants that frequently get associated with print runs in the hundreds. Surely dozens of copies of a 1:75 variant being found would have no effect on the book's value if it was a book that was actually sought after, right? No, of course not, because its as you say "infinitesimal." Five Below have 440 stores nationwide (as of 2015)... that's a lot of variants. Marvel may think they've hidden them from the direct market, but they haven't. Except variants are rarely ever in them. That's the exception , not the norm. -J.

I haven't heard anything yet. He's nowhere near as prolific as JSC. In the meantime the X 23 #1 has been blowing it up this week. I think it's his hottest book right now. -J.

More meaningless numbers and conjecture. More meaningless babble from the peanut gallery. Seriously, do you ever have anything productive to say? -J. Striking down the nonsense you insist on posting in regards to incentive variants seems pretty productive to me. I'm not a big fan of misinformation, especially when it involves money. But yeah all those ASM 4 Ramos variants that hit the market after their discovery at the five below stores was just an infinitesimal amount, right? That didn't noticeably affect the supply or market price of that book, right? And those copies were already accounted for in your nonsense calculations as a result of using a partial print number divided by the incentive ratio then rounding that number up to the closest case total plus 10% for overages and non North American market copies, right? And lets just ignore the fact that those packs also contained higher ratio variants including 1:50 and 1:75 variants. 1:75 ratio variants that frequently get associated with print runs in the hundreds. Surely dozens of copies of a 1:75 variant being found would have no effect on the book's value if it was a book that was actually sought after, right? No, of course not, because its as you say "infinitesimal." What you call "misinformation" is in reality just your own personal opinion. You are not the arbiter of truth on these boards, RMA, oh uh excuse me, I mean "darkstar". And apart from the sparse and anecdotal finds that you are referring to, so what ? Before you start saying someone is "wrong" about something , maybe you should first understand what they are actually saying : The few different variants that a few people have said they found in a cheap-o five below pack are an infinitesimal fraction of a fraction of the many different variants that publishers will print in just one year alone. And the fact that it was, for the most part, just that one variant essentially that many people found, should tell you something. Understand the point yet? And by the way, youtube is littered with people opening up five below packs , multiple packs at times even , and finding the kind of worthless , beat up that you would expect to find. Finding a variant in one of those, let alone anything of value, is, once again , the exception , and not the norm. Goodie goodie for the few who pulled something decent, but you only hear about the success stories and almost never about the epic fails that happened before they found that one $30 variant. -J.

More meaningless numbers and conjecture. More meaningless babble from the peanut gallery. Seriously, do you ever have anything productive to say? -J.

Without having too much to go on, I'd say a nice round number like $1,000 would be in the ballpark Jerome I think I would put it in the $600-$700 range tops. -J. Really hard to say, I think it'd be higher than that(since it is graded?), but like Jreezy said, sell it and find out! Jerome There's a 9.6 on ebay right now sitting at $1100 with little interest. The highest public sale for any copy ever, raw or graded was $540 but there have been sales of high grade looking raw copies in the low $400s after that. Maybe just too many copies hitting the market at the same time. -J.

I want know where all the convergence covers went to die. Sooooo sooooo many extras everywhere. are they sent to poor African kids like Super Bowl loser gear? Convergence early issues were returnable, and everyone loved the Hughes #0, so that's only one issue that sold well (because of the variant). I only see Marvel variants. I did good last year. I know the Ramos ASM 4 was talked about the most but I did fnd two Elektra 1:75 variants. Some Captain Marvel 1:50 2014 Same here, bought a ton of the Five Below packs and they were stuffed with Marvel Now variants. Sold a ton of them. Yeah. Guess you're the lucky one. 99.99% of what comes out of those is the worthless, man-handled you would expect to get in a five below pack And yeah, the overprinted Ramos ASM 4 (first Silk) is the one semi-notable variant that everyone talks about coming out of those that goes for about $30 raw that is definitely a "win" if you just spent $5 for the pack. As a percentage of what's printed in just one year even, the junk that you might occasionally find in one five below pack is, once again, infinitesimal. -J.

Without having too much to go on, I'd say a nice round number like $1,000 would be in the ballpark Jerome I think I would put it in the $600-$700 range tops. -J.

That helps. Even on a phone. The book looks to have some of the same spine issues I've seen on other copies but it is definitely in better shape than the raw copy that sold on ebay last month. -J.

If thats a 7.0, then my 9.8 is a 10. Unless I'm really missing something in pics.... Jerome What are you seeing ? I'm looking at the pics on a small cell phone ... -J.

We know because things like this happen quite often: http://www.bleedingcool.com/2015/05/15/marvel-liquidates-miracleman-1-10-in-all-its-variants/ ...and yet that is one of exactly two or three examples from the last ten years that anyone can ever talk about to show that it happens "all the time". Silly Billies. Like I said, once in a blue moon and an infinitesimal amount as a percentage of variants that a publisher will print in a single year even. -J.

Posted in another thread but thought it is more relevant here: http://mycomicshop.com/search?ItemID=36417518 A raw copy MCS has graded at 7.0.... -J.

Other than printing overages to account for possible damaged copies and printing up to the nearest full case of 200-225, there isn't much difference between the two. Comichron doesn't account for UK sales, but realistically that would only add about another 10% or so to the number you see on comichron. Are there exceptions to this rule of thumb ? Of course, especially with big event books or "#1's". But again , those are the exception and not the norm. -J. all of this is nonsense Wanna bet? The view must be nice from that peanut gallery you live in. -J. I'd think the cover artists get some copies for themselves. Hmmm here's a thought, how many ASM 700 Ditko covers do you think Stan Lee got to sign, slab and sell? I'm sure he can get 100 copies of any variant that he wants Maybe? Like I said, event books or "#1's" would be the rare exception. And certainly whatever unaccounted/un-ordered printing overages may very well get handed out to employees or creators. But we would be talking copies in the dozens not in the hundreds, and not remotely in the thousands. -J. What about all those incentive variants found in the multi-packs at Five Below? How many of those were there Jay? Where did they come from? What about them ? Whatever minor printing overages there are on the occasional book can end up in one of those packs or in a Diamond variant sell off. As a percentage of variants that publishers print it is an absolutely infinitesimal amount. Infinitesimal. These are the rare exception and not the rule. And again, if you think publishers are deliberately over printing variants on a regular basis for the sole purpose of blowing them out for a fraction of cover price months or years later, you are loco in the coco. -J.

Other than printing overages to account for possible damaged copies and printing up to the nearest full case of 200-225, there isn't much difference between the two. Comichron doesn't account for UK sales, but realistically that would only add about another 10% or so to the number you see on comichron. Are there exceptions to this rule of thumb ? Of course, especially with big event books or "#1's". But again , those are the exception and not the norm. -J. all of this is nonsense Wanna bet? The view must be nice from that peanut gallery you live in. -J. I'd think the cover artists get some copies for themselves. Hmmm here's a thought, how many ASM 700 Ditko covers do you think Stan Lee got to sign, slab and sell? I'm sure he can get 100 copies of any variant that he wants Maybe? Like I said, event books or "#1's" would be the rare exception. And certainly whatever unaccounted/un-ordered printing overages may very well get handed out to employees or creators. But we would be talking copies in the dozens not in the hundreds, and not remotely in the thousands. Publishers do not print books they have no intention of distributing. Anyone who suggests otherwise is out of their minds. -J.

Other than printing overages to account for possible damaged copies and printing up to the nearest full case of 200-225, there isn't much difference between the two. Comichron doesn't account for UK sales, but realistically that would only add about another 10% or so to the number you see on comichron. Are there exceptions to this rule of thumb ? Of course, especially with big event books or "#1's". But again , those are the exception and not the norm. -J. all of this is nonsense Wanna bet? The view must be nice from that peanut gallery you live in. -J.

Other than printing overages to account for possible damaged copies and printing up to the nearest full case of 200-225, there isn't much difference between the two. Comichron doesn't account for UK sales, but realistically that would only add about another 10% or so to the number you see on comichron. Are there exceptions to this rule of thumb ? Of course, especially with big event books or "#1's". But again , those are the exception and not the norm. -J.

I think RMA is saying that they print tons and tons of them and then distribute the amount based on how many a shop buys. Then later sell the rest at a discount to Diamond account holders If that's what he's saying he's wrong. Not only would that be incredibly wasteful it would be stupid. There's a reason Diamond has a "final order cut off" for retailers and that reason is so publishers will know how many books they need to print- that includes variants. The variants are then printed in cases , 200-225 per case, and they are printed up to the nearest case. Whatever printing overages there are on books are usually minor. Do publishers sometimes over print books and then burn them off in a variant offering once in a blue moon? Yes. But that is the extreme exception and not hardly the norm, and even more so now. -J.

Incentive variants are not printed according to their distribution ratio. Those are distribution numbers, not print run numbers. I'm just wondering what definitive source you originally received this information from that has you so convinced that it is (still) true, to the point of repeating your thoughts on the matter ad nauseum, in multiple treads and forums. I.E., why are you so convinced that publishers routinely print books that they have no intention of distributing? -J.

Tough to take you seriously when you mention rarity in the first post of the thread. Not sure why that matters. Not sure why you even bother to read or post in this thread either. -J.

As hard as it is to believe, some of us are actually just collectors and fans. -J.

That very photo could be in their stock photos. You don't know for sure but to keep from beating a dead horse, yeah the guy is unscrupulous for ripping off someone's photo to sell a comic he may or may not have. Ebay is just not going to do anything to him for selling with someone else's photo. The following is a Public Service Message, brought to you by The Copper Age Kids Comics & Services. We here at at C.A.K. Headquarters appreciate all of YOUR feedback, we hope to WORK with you to bring about a just resolution to any of your comic book buying experiences. Our Mission Statement, is based on a COLLECTIVE effort to bring awareness of potential d-baggery via eBay never do wells. We do all that we can and strive with due diligence to effectively police the Comic Book Community to make your ebay trading experiences as pleasurable for all parties involved as is humanly possible Saacasm aside.... The seller is violating eBay's listing practices, on several counts. Clearly stating in the auction description that the book pictured is his own personal copy. The seller outright cancelled the first listing of the same book/same photos and citing "item is no longer available"..........leads me to think he sold the book elsewhere...or it was sold to the 1st (or 2nd highest) bidder offline at below $660. He then relisted the same book/same photos. He also posted his cell number, stating he will make a deal off ebay. There, you have 3 to 4 eBay policy violations. All it takes is 5 people to file listing violations reports with eBay . Copy/paste the 1st auction that ended at $660 when you report the current listing. And to make it easier on everyone: Go ahead and copy/paste the bulk of my post here in your report (minus the last few sentences, tidy up my summation a bit) ............and PRESTO, LAWD ALMIGHTY ............. The listing will be removed and the dude will get a healthy smack down from eBay...ESPECIALLY for urging would be buyers/bidders to buy the book from him offline. I'm thinking the original auction was shilled and the book was relisted by the same seller under a different handle in order to capitalize on the "buzz" of the original fake sale. -J.

Very aggressive. He "might" be in the ballpark at half that. -J. I know the owner. He sold it for $1600. -J.

A nice looking raw X-23 #1 just went for a little under $800 today: http://www.ebay.com/itm/X-23-1-RARE-1-25-Variant-HTF-Dell-Otto-/252313757682?hash=item3abf1267f2:g:-hUAAOSwoBtW3zVE -J.

Depends what's wrong with it. If simply incomplete with s decent looking cover? $12-15k? Clink sold a nice looking Qualified 4.0 copy that was otherwise unrestored with a missing centerfold for $25K nearly two years ago. I believe it was sold by a boardie. It was a boardie and if I'm not mistaken it started off as an incomplete blue label 0.5. -J.