Jaydogrules

Seven. That's how many gave me the information that I decided to share in this thread. You're welcome. -J.

Dude, that rare phenomenon of why that occasionally happens was explained in my earlier post. You are not factually disputing anything that I have said and are in fact once again using isolated anecdotes to draw an extremely broad conclusion that is in reality just your opinion (and since your disdain for inventive variants is now well documented and on the record , anything you have to say about them should be viewed with skepticism. -J. No Jay... EVERY major Diamond event, they give us books like that. Ask any retailer who travels to the summit each year or goes to the breakfast at C2E2, or the lunch in San Diego. They always have free packs of variants for us. Retailer Incentive Variants (that's where I got my Saga Retailer Incentive I sold on the boards 5 minutes after the breakfast that year).... EVERY event. A new batch of variants that are 6 months to over a year old. I go to SDCC and attend that lunch EVERY year. I go to Baltimore and attend the Summit, EVERY YEAR (except when it's elsewhere). One of the reasons I go and listen to the publisher's presentations is because I know, that packet will help PAY for my trip. They do it for us, for that reason. They give us those EXTRA variants, so we CAN pay for the trip and come out and meet them. They know they have those extra variants to give us, and we'll put them to use. Extra variants that YOU claim don't exist. Like the 2013 sale showing ALL of those variants being sold for 75 CENTS. Ask any seller why they would sell variants for 75 cents.... go on, ask them... the answer will always be the same - I got a chit ton of them and I need to move them before any trace of desire is gone for them. Diamond was blowing them out. Cause they had a but load of them. Not a chit load, a BUT load. Deny all you want, I just knocked over your milkshake. You keep saying "no" but it's clear you are either ignoring the point or did not catch it. It has been explained why there are sometimes certain (modest ) quantities of "some" books handed out at cons or end up in five packs. You are a retailer you of all people know how many hundreds or thousands of variants are printed every year. And what tiny, infinitesimal amount end up being "given out" or sold off on the cheap several months or a year later. As a percentage of what is printed it is microscopic, which, again , is why Diamond only does those bulk offerings once every few years. -J.

You are mistaken, on multiple levels, all of which have exhaustively been detailed many times, in many threads. Please don't derail another thread with your caustic posts. Thank you. Actually no, that hasn't been done at all. Yourself, and one or two others are very skilled at disguising your opinions as "settled fact". You speak in broad, sweeping absolutes yet can never cite more than one or two of the same isolated anecdotes or outliers to buttress your opinions. While it is a clever debate tactic, it is fraught with potholes and is easily defeated. So let me drop some actual facts on you and clear up a few myths: I have heard from multiple dealers and Diamond account holders over the last few months that have shed a lot of light on why a few incentive variants trickle out into Diamond fire sales and 5 packs every now and then. According to them, Marvel/DC print books by the case for distribution. Each case holds 200/225 copies. Let's say for an example that a book is offered with a variant and say 610 retailers qualify for one copy AND order the variant. Marvel will print 675 copies (enough for three full cases to cover the order and this amount would also be enough to cover any overages for printing snafus, etc.). Marvel will not print less than enough to fill one full case. So in this instance we have 65 "extra copies" of this particular variant ultimately sitting around somewhere. Perhaps they are given away to employees or creators if it's a "hot release". Perhaps they are given away to retailers who didn't even necessarily qualify for it or order it at release who were shorted on a prior order as a "make good". Perhaps they will end up in a five pack. Perhaps they are given out at conventions. Or perhaps they are actually stored in a warehouse somewhere until the day comes that Marvel decides that they have enough of these printing overages on numerous books sitting stacked up to blow them out in a fire sale. All of this easily explains why "some" variants do turn up from time to time after a book's release. It also explains why this is a very sporadic occurrence and why these RI variants are only blown out only once in a very blue moon. But under no circumstance in the above scenario is the publisher printing the RI variant "by the thousands" to only fill a 610 copy order. That is simply a preposterous notion on its face. Hope that clears things up a little. -J. One more time: You are mistaken, on multiple levels, all of which have exhaustively been detailed many times, in many threads. We have gone over this and over this and over this and over this, you won't listen to anyone, and lie about the statements and positions of others to "make your points." Please don't derail another thread with your caustic posts. Thank you. Once again. That's your opinion. And you've been very clear and repetitive with it. Thank you. -J.

About 225 worthless books sold off at one time over two years ago proves what, exactly? (other than my point earlier?) -J. It proves that Marvel REALLY DID print more variants than retailers earned... AND... It proves that Marvel REALLY DID sell variants for under a buck that SHOULD have cost retailers $30+ in orders before they earned one. You have said Marvel wouldn't print more variants than they needed and that there's no chance they'd risk upsetting dealers by just giving away hard-to-earn books for next-to-nothing prices. Wrong. Wrong. Plus... You're Three strikes buddy. Take a seat in the dugout. Actually all it "proves" is what I outlined and explained in my earlier post. But keep trying pal, maybe you will actually best me someday. -J. No. One. Believes. You. About. Comics. Whether. It. Is. What. You. Say. Or. What. You. Show. In. Your. Signature. You. Live. In. A. Fantasy. World. P.S. You're still Yes I know. Actual facts hurt. Carry on. -J.

About 225 worthless books sold off at one time over two years ago proves what, exactly? (other than my point earlier?) -J. It proves that Marvel REALLY DID print more variants than retailers earned... AND... It proves that Marvel REALLY DID sell variants for under a buck that SHOULD have cost retailers $30+ in orders before they earned one. You have said Marvel wouldn't print more variants than they needed and that there's no chance they'd risk upsetting dealers by just giving away hard-to-earn books for next-to-nothing prices. Wrong. Wrong. Plus... You're Three strikes buddy. Take a seat in the dugout. Actually all it "proves" is what I outlined and explained in my earlier post. . I didn't say any of what you said I did so in will give you the benefit of the doubt and just chalk that up you simply not having read the post rather than a failure at reading comprehension. But keep trying pal, maybe you will actually best me someday. -J.

That rare phenomenon of why that occasionally happens was explained in my earlier post. You are not factually disputing anything that I have said and are in fact once again using isolated anecdotes to draw an extremely broad conclusion that is in reality just your opinion (and since your disdain for incentive variants is now well documented and on the record , anything you have to say about them should be viewed with skepticism). -J.

About 225 worthless books sold off at one time over two years ago proves what, exactly? (other than my point earlier?) -J.

You are mistaken, on multiple levels, all of which have exhaustively been detailed many times, in many threads. Please don't derail another thread with your caustic posts. Thank you. Actually no, that hasn't been done at all. Yourself, and one or two others are very skilled at disguising your opinions as "settled fact". You speak in broad, sweeping absolutes yet can never cite more than one or two of the same isolated anecdotes or outliers to buttress your opinions. While it is a clever debate tactic, it is fraught with potholes and is easily defeated. So let me drop some actual facts on you and clear up a few myths: I have heard from multiple dealers and Diamond account holders over the last few months that have shed a lot of light on why a few incentive variants trickle out into Diamond fire sales and 5 packs every now and then. According to them, Marvel/DC print books by the case for distribution. Each case holds 200/225 copies. Let's say for an example that a book is offered with a variant and say 610 retailers qualify for one copy AND order the variant. Marvel will print 675 copies (enough for three full cases to cover the order and this amount would also be enough to cover any overages for printing snafus, etc.). Marvel will not print less than enough to fill one full case. So in this instance we have 65 "extra copies" of this particular variant ultimately sitting around somewhere. Perhaps they are given away to employees or creators if it's a "hot release". Perhaps they are given away to retailers who didn't even necessarily qualify for it or order it at release who were shorted on a prior order as a "make good". Perhaps they will end up in a five pack. Perhaps they are given out at conventions. Or perhaps they are actually stored in a warehouse somewhere until the day comes that Marvel decides that they have enough of these printing overages on numerous books sitting stacked up to blow them out in a fire sale. All of this easily explains why "some" variants do turn up from time to time after a book's release. It also explains why this is a very sporadic occurrence and why these RI variants are only blown out only once in a very blue moon. But under no circumstance in the above scenario is the publisher printing the RI variant "by the thousands" to only fill a 610 copy order. That is simply a preposterous notion on its face. Hope that clears things up a little. -J.

Are we still trying to float the nonsensical notion that Marvel and DC deliberately over print incentive variants that they have no intention of distributing based solely on the fact that they sell off their scant overages on a tiny microscopic percentage of their variants once in a blue moon? That is nothing but baseless speculation constantly floated as "fact" by a select few who have been exposed as having some kind of "problem" with variants in general and incentive variants specifically. Do Marvel and DC divulge the print runs of specific variants ? Nope. Do they print comic books that they have no intention of distributing and for the sole purpose of storing in a warehouse until the day they decide to sell them for below cover price two years later? Nope. Let's not be silly. -J.

There were a lot of SA and some GA recent lows last night. -J.

Cgc only designates tan if book is close/borderline to slightly brittle. No way that book comes back cr/ow That's the reason I didn't bid more. Pq scared me. Rick, I know you put a lot of stock into the unverifiable and mercurial "PQ" labeling of CGC, but with all due respect this is simply not true. There are at least 15 different possible "PQ" designations and sub-designations between "light tan to off white " and "slightly brittle", including "tan", "dark tan", and "brown". "Light tan to off white" isn't even close to "brittle" and Peter is right, as there are numerous accounts by boardies (including me) of the "PQ" on a label flipping from "Light Tan" all the way up to "off white" in some instances on resubs. Frankly the book is just looking soft right now as we have seen other GA keys set or approach GPA highs recently with "brittle pages" on the label even. -J.

$35k final? Wow, what makes you think this book is going to go for almost 4X condition guide, or am I missing something here? After all, this is only the introduction of the much laughed about Robin, not 'Tec 31 which we are talking about here. The 3.5 that sold on GPA had better PQ OW-W and hammered well below 35K. I say 26K for this copy MAX with the winner being William Leach Don't be upset though Red ol pal...my prediction is the book will sell here then show up on CCs site in a few months with a Sticker price of.....you guessed it...35K Last GPA on a 3.5 was $26k. Maybe a couple people get frisky and it jumps up to 35. No whammies! No whammies! Hammer falls at $22,422 2 more copies have appeared on eBay. Both 1.5 Blues, BIN at $16,950 and $18,500 Looks like it came in a bit below the last GPA recorded sale of $26K, but well below the wish for price of $35K. The PQ might have hurt the final price on this book, but hard to say. A 15%+ hit just for the "PQ" on the label on a grail? That's a stretch. That price is below the 3.0 that just last sold as well. That's just a soft result for the book, plain and simple. Either demand is softening with so many copies coming to market at once or someone got bamboozled when they paid $26k+ for that other 3.5 a couple months ago. I also noticed the item description called it a 3.0 even though the picture of the slab is of a 3.5. Given that many auction results have looked soft of late I'm inclined to go with the former. But there might be a touch of the latter in there as well. Either way it's all just speculation. -J.

Wow great copy ! -J.

Awesome looking copy. Congratulations. -J.

Thats subjective, and I can't believe that ASM #688 is "cooler" than 50% of his other stuff. Cooler, much tougher to find in general, and a very well done departure from his usual "big titty" stuff. (And also in a long running, title). -J. Woah... did you just knock big titties? I'm not sure we can be friends anymore... I knock big titties all the time. -J.

Thats subjective, and I can't believe that ASM #688 is "cooler" than 50% of his other stuff. Cooler, much tougher to find in general, and a very well done departure from his usual "big titty" stuff. (And also in a long running, title). -J.

I picked one up, thx for the link. And a few more ASM 688 Campbells popped up on ebay too. They are all 9.6's tho Jerome Maybe press them up? Mmaybe but I am always afraid that there's some defect that a press wouldn't get out and I'd be out some time and money. Maybe if the price was closer to $500 I 'might' consider taking the gamble. I was gonna sprng for that 9.6 that was on Pedigree Comics recently, but there was a spine corner square cut hanging out so I held off. Jerome You were probably wise to do that. Looking at the current census numbers the book does not appear to be an "easy 9.8" by any means. -J.

Yup. Actually, we collect "slabs". I think that's the guy's point. -J.

Another new copy just listed: http://www.ebay.com/itm/CGC-9-8-NM-M-Uncanny-X-men-510-Campbell-Psylocke-Sketch-Variant-Wolverine-/262261956299? -J.

Yes you did nail that one. -J.

Now THAT is impressive. -J.

Hey, there's two sides to every coin...in this case there's Jay's side, and the side of every other dealer and collector on the board. ...and the third side... Reality. (as inconvenient as that may seem) Your arguments fail because you speak in absolutes. There are rarely absolutes in anything, and especially in this hobby. Feel free to peruse GPA for yourself. There's cherries there for everybody. -J.

You forget page quality and cover paper quality. Yes, white paged copies do sell for more so that's definitely a key consideration. ...except when they don't. -J. Which is rarely. The highest priced sale of a 6.0 recorded in GPA had white pages. It fetched 19% more than any other copy has sold for at that grade, and is the only white paged copy to have sold at that grade level in the past 3 years. The second highest recorded sale for a 6.0 had ow/w page quality. The three highest sales ever recorded for a 5.0 all had ow/w page quality. In the past 3 years, no white paged sales are recorded at that grade. The two highest recorded sales for a 3.0 were for ow/w paged copies, both sold last year. There were no recorded sales for a white pager in this grade. Conversely, the two lowest selling copies last year in this grade had c/ow pages. There have been too few sales of this book in conditions above 6.0 over the past two years to refute the importance of white pages to selling price. Are there recent examples of white paged copies underperforming compared with a ow or c/ow example, or are you just blowing hot air again? Don't bother trying on the PQ with him. Everyone has tried but because there is a sale at some point or another where a CR/OW out sells a OW/W it doesn't matter. I mean its not like someone can find sales of a book with tape outselling one without, or a book with MC outselling one without or a book with writing on the cover/date stamp outselling one without. Its a useless and pointless argument with Jay Yup, you're right. It's useless (i.e., impossible) to "prove" anything either way with anecdotal, cherry picked evidence. The difference is that I accept and acknowledge that, while you feel the need to be "right" (despite all evidence that says you aren't "right"). For every data point you can produce I can produce a counter one. Stalemate. -J.

You forget page quality and cover paper quality. Yes, white paged copies do sell for more so that's definitely a key consideration. ...except when they don't. -J. Which is rarely. The highest priced sale of a 6.0 recorded in GPA had white pages. It fetched 19% more than any other copy has sold for at that grade, and is the only white paged copy to have sold at that grade level in the past 3 years. The second highest recorded sale for a 6.0 had ow/w page quality. The three highest sales ever recorded for a 5.0 all had ow/w page quality. In the past 3 years, no white paged sales are recorded at that grade. The two highest recorded sales for a 3.0 were for ow/w paged copies, both sold last year. There were no recorded sales for a white pager in this grade. Conversely, the two lowest selling copies last year in this grade had c/ow pages. There have been too few sales of this book in conditions above 6.0 over the past two years to refute the importance of white pages to selling price. Are there recent examples of white paged copies underperforming compared with a ow or c/ow example, or are you just blowing hot air again? I've blown holes in this myth on numerous occasions. You've cherry picked a couple recent examples. I can cherry pick some as well. Without even trying very hard, and starting at the very bottom of the census, I see all of the current GPA highs in a 1.5, 1.8, and 2.0 all have "Cr/Ow" on the label. Once again, all that tells us is that the "PQ" on the label does not matter to enough people for it to be consistently reflected in prices. The lack of consistency is prima facie evidence that no "premium" exists or can even be proven. Maybe you pay a "premium" based on that and nothing else and that's good for you. Some people pay "premiums" for eye appeal, centering, lack of chipping, etc. But even "premiums" for those things are impossible to quantify or prove. There will ALWAYS be too many other factors at play, as Joey D. pointed out in his earlier post, that will affect price, and one is not more important or a "guaranteed premium" over the other. That's where the myth lies. I don't think you really want to go down this rabbit hole again. -J.

You forget page quality and cover paper quality. Yes, white paged copies do sell for more so that's definitely a key consideration. ...except when they don't. -J.