Garystar

On 2/2/2020 at 7:07 PM, Get Marwood & I said:

My good boardie chum @Gnasher Bob sent me this interesting article from an old UK fanzine recently:

It's not often you find any distribution data that helps with your research but this did. Firstly, it correctly identifies that the Incredible Hulk would stop being distributed in the UK at issue #152. This ties in nicely with the presence / absence of pence copies:

'Distributed in the UK' and actual price variants are two different things of course, but it's still a neat tie in. 

Secondly, the article mentions that only ten titles per month were distributed in the UK which, again, ties in with some research I had been doing - and have done for a few of the seven pence publishers - namely the 'how many titles per cover month' assessment - evidence here:

 

Was February 1971 the first month with 10 titles distributed? If so it would seem to be the date World Distributors took over from T&P. 

It’s lockdown. All the things I enjoy doing I can’t - no pub, no football, no meeting friends, can’t visit family, no meals out, no gigs, no quiz nights at the pub, but still have to work. Working from home have lost a room which is now filled with work equipment so inconvenienced 7 days a week. Worst of all worlds. 

The star stamp signifies that it was sold on a US military base - either in the US or abroad. 
The inserts as you said were also in comics sold on US military bases aimed at service men buying gifts for their wives and girlfriends back home. I used to live not too far from USAF Fairford in Gloucestershire and the inserts turned up quite often - I used to tear them out as they were unwanted adverts. 
Mark jewellers are the most common but national diamond and others turn up. 

Here's a curio (not mine, found on ebay). UK DC reprint comics with a giveaway of postcards of old US DC comics. The comics they chose for the postcards come complete with T&P stamp.

3 hours ago, Get Marwood & I said:

The one and three / one and six / one and nine's are hard work. Getting there though.

Are you trying to put 1-9 runs together, if so what numbers are you missing?

Completely off topic but one job I've taken advantage of lockdown/restrictions to do is copy my CDs to USB, I'm just starting The Smiths - every album seems like a greatest hits!

11 minutes ago, Get Marwood & I said:

You haven't got these two in oblong have you?

No, my copies are unstamped but I'm pretty sure I've had 22 with the oblong in the past. None on ebay at present but I'll keep an eye out.

Good job with the "picture table" however I think the last para here is a bit confusing, perhaps when mentioning hiatus if you said STARTING....

Other comment would be table ends March 1969 - Volunteering even more work for you but there is the period April 69 - July 71 when T&P stamps were still extant (alongside UKPVs).

1 hour ago, Get Marwood & I said:

What makes it difficult to plot is the nature of the three UKPV hiatuses, which are staggered by title over a few months.

When I did my table I wondered if the titles would line up more uniformly if the table was by distribution date rather than cover month but I decided this would be a major task.

Well done good work.

37 minutes ago, Get Marwood & I said:

It's quite remarkable when you look at them all lined up. Only Daredevil and the X-Men are missing and the 10d oblong stamps are rife. So this tells us that someone took the trouble of importing and stamping up the missing issues. Who it was, and when they did it, will likely remain a mystery, but there was clearly an attempt.

I think Albert identified the oblong stamps as belonging to Gold Star Publications. Here’s the two xmen ( my copies)

Anecdotal but I asked a friend who started collecting in 1966 about his buying recollections. He thought US comics were probably on firm sale as spinner racks often contained comics more than a year old. He recalled buying 1965 comics in the same rack as latest issues. Of course the old comics could have been old stock recycled from another newsagent but it could be they had sat there for a year. 
Only his thoughts/recollections so not fact but he did own a comic shop in the 80/90s so does know something about the comic business. 
He also mentioned there was only one copy of each comic supplied so if another kid bought the latest Spidey or Avengers before you that was it. He remembered having to cycle around a few different newsagents in Plymouth trying to find the latest issues. 

1 hour ago, Get Marwood & I said:

Gary, you've studied the later Marvels in more depth than I - we know that the stamped copies appeared during the early printed UKPV gaps as per previous posts, which makes sense (and indicates that shipping strikes were unlikely to be the cause of those cessations). From your review, and in the later stages, did you detect whether stamped copies were always the result of UKPV gaps, or were there lots of stamped copies for titles that had either UKPVs extant or no printed UKPVS at all (like your Pest above)?

It begs the general question, why import and stamp cents copies if you have a formal arrangement to have them printed? That makes no sense. Same goes for DC and the other publishers where applicable. 

It does seem that the process for Marvel, in the later stages, was a mix of formally requested printed UKPVs but also unsold (presumably) US overstock. Maybe the overstock was a lot cheaper than the UKPVs.

Until March 1969 Marvels were generally UKPV with stamps generally only appearing during gaps of no UKPV. In April 1969 UKPVs restarted (after a year and half gap when only T&P stamps appeared) at 1/- price, however unlike previous periods of UKPVs there is an abundance of stamped copies also. I speculated either;

·         There were reduced numbers of UKPVs which meant T&P needed to fill the gap with stamped cents copies

·         Demand had increased to the extent that T&P needed more supply

·         World Distributors had taken over distribution of UKPVs and T&P stamps were in competition? (I can’t find when World Distributors took over from Thorpe and Porter).

From restart of UKPVs in April 1969 for around 6 months 1-9 stamping continues albeit in a rather random way, then all stamps become number 3. For one month, August 1970, the stamp becomes “5p/1/-“ and thereafter all stamps are T&P – ampersand rather than a number. The last stamp I can find is July 1971. From here on in Marvels are either UKPV or they are non-distributed – no more stamps.

From April 1969 onwards I found no instances of MAJOR TITLES (Avengers, Daredevil, Spidey, FF etc) with a T&P stamp which didn’t exist as a UKPV. However lesser titles such as Peter The Little Pest (posted) Kull, Kid Colt do appear as T&P stamps where no UKPV exists. There might be something in this I’ll have a ponder.

Doesn’t advance first distribution knowledge but here’s one of mine I was surprised to see had been distributed with a T&P stamp. 

13 minutes ago, Albert Tatlock said:

It will necessitate a visit to the British Library at St Pancras,

Apart from a visit to Wembley I haven’t been to London since 2002 (you’ll like this Marwood, last time was to see Morrissey at Albert Hall) and I don’t think I’ll be going any time soon. 

3 hours ago, Get Marwood & I said:

Next slide (I feel like the bloke on the Coronavirus briefing - and you can't read their charts either):

Try living in the South West - when regional slides shown our slide is always at the bottom obscured by the BBC logo and rolling banner. 

Have we determined that comics were SOR in the UK? If the numbers on stamped DCs and others indicate a return schedule where do Marvels fit in - firm sale when they were UKPV and SOR when they were stamped? What about the sizable amount where the stamp is illegible. Although scarce what about Marvel UKPVs with a stamp? Even if SOR it seems a time intensive exercise for the newsagent and the distributor if they have to separate Marvel from others and then check all these hard to read numbers, wouldn’t newsagents have just cleared out the last months issues?

Possible different processes in different areas? By the late 60s all Marvels were using stamp number three so possibly the stamps purpose changed over time?

8 minutes ago, Get Marwood & I said:

Take your pick 

I’ll open the box!

No pence copies of Man From Atlantis are there. 

36 minutes ago, Get Marwood & I said:

Did you not see the Klaw, Solarr (with two r's) and Wundarr (also with two r's)?

...... but George Perez art. When/where I started collecting American comics were thin on the ground so I’d buy anything I could find - except Marvel Classics Comics which I’d leave on the shelf.

My Skull the Slayer issues are in the loft otherwise might have posted one of those. 

2 hours ago, rakehell said:

On 11/4/2020 at 10:07 PM, AJD said:

I would now like to be considered for the "least interesting book posted in this thread for quite some time" award please.

A great suggestion for the next thread! I think I've got that beat, but I can't be arsed to dig anything out.

2 hours ago, androolx said:

I should have said the Tattooz insert opening is accessible on most of the inserts; some of the inserts were stapled in such a way that the opening is not accessible.

Just checked my FF#252 and you’re right the wallet is open although the opening is very tight and would be difficult, but not impossible, to get tattooz out without causing damage. 
I wonder if it is completely random or if all copies of spider-man #238 (which my pictures came from) are inaccessible?

4 hours ago, androolx said:

The Tattooz insert was an unsealed envelope containing usually one tattoo; tattoos can be removed from or inserted into the insert without altering the insert. 

I don’t think this is right? My copies you can’t get the tattooz without ripping the paper wallet. 

6 hours ago, Kevin.J said:

I never found a #6 pence, #7 I did

Pretty rough but reads exactly the same as mint. 

As in x-men#6 subby is wearing his away kit red trunks. 

Just read UK fanzine Panelologist #2 and it says the Marvel b&w mags were distributed by Gold Star. Just couldn’t get it right could they - 1966 the stickers wouldn’t stay on, 1973 you couldn’t get them off. 
Although it does show that they did have a relationship with Marvel. 

2 hours ago, Get Marwood & I said:

I don't know why they don't exist though, and shipping strikes has been the only suggestion that I have seen put forward. Does it make any sense though?

Just a couple of guesses;

•T&P contract with Marvel expired so stamped until new arrangement agreed.
•Marvel changed printers and new ones weren’t initially geared to do duel runs.  
??????????

41 minutes ago, Get Marwood & I said:

What are your recollections guys? How did the books in the alleged 10 month shipping gap arrive in the UK in your experience?

Sorry can’t help as I started collecting in 1973 when all marvels were 6p UKPV although as I’ve said before “new” T&P 5p stamped and UKPV 1/- still appeared several years out of date. 
I’m uncomfortable with the dock strike theory - this wouldn’t have stopped issues being printed without long prior notice (as Albert said probably less than 3 months I initially surmised but still Must have been4 to 6 weeks). The only reference to a 1964 dock strike I can find states it started on eve of general election (october 1964) and was “rapidly” settled.  What sort of contract did T&P have with Marvel - I can’t believe they could just turn on and off print runs of thousands?

1 hour ago, Albert Tatlock said:

These 10d copies - I remember that just about all of them has a little sticker with 'GOLD STAR PUBLICATIONS' on, but they were not very sticky, and maybe there are none left that have not had the sticker peeled off. I have checked mine, and there is not one sticker left.

It’s great to hear these stories first hand, I’ve been collecting 45 years and never heard of Gold Star’s involvement before. Nor do I recall ever seeing one of the stickered comics, I’ll be on the look out now although it sounds like it may be in vain. Learning all the time.