agamoto

On 12/27/2023 at 9:05 PM, VintageComics said:

Ah OK, so that's where the story came from.

I re-listened to that video the other night,specifically looking for that info but I stopped around the 1:20:00 mark, being too tired (it was my 2nd time listening to it just for the answer we were looking for).

So he has pics of the guy showing off books at a con. Sounds like the alleged seller was walking around, not set up at a show and that's very common. We see it all the time. There's no indication he was actually set up at the show.

CGC definitely knows who that seller is, or at least the name/address/phone and CC# they're using to pay for their shenanigans and have their goodies delivered. That's really all that matters. Armchair detective doxxing is/was a bad idea, unless we can be 100% an alias or the identity of a friend/neighbor/spouse isn't being used to mask who they are. 

On 12/27/2023 at 7:52 PM, William-James88 said:

Gonna disagree on this one simply because of how widespread and varied, in terms of book value, that was over time. CGC messing up at times feels more probable than an organized comic crime ring that did this on random books sold from a multitude of stores. 

It certainly doesn't explain this 9.8 with spine ticks, for instance,  which couldn't have been scammed the same way due to it being a signature series.

Plus there's the idea that 9.8 means mint from the printing press, so it can include bindery tears and colour breaks, as people discuss in one of the many "is this a 9.8?" threads on the site.

To be clear, I am not saying the spidey 252 that sparked this is legit, it isn't.  I just do not think we are looking at the same scam happening all the time everywhere. I feel that absolves CGC too much.

I was waxing rhetorically, but my hypothesis does hold water when it comes to being a potential reason for why objective, properly graded 9.0 books somehow earn 9.8's, or in this case, fine themselves in 9.8 slabs.   

On 12/27/2023 at 8:37 PM, William-James88 said:

 

On 12/27/2023 at 4:51 PM, boreds said:

So this 9.8 Mark Jewellers Secret Wars 8 is at $3,349 and ends in less than two hours. I believe it was a member of the boards who posted this book, as was mentioned earlier in the thread. It looks like a legit 9.8, coming from a trustworthy source.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/285600398199?hash=item427f1c3b77:g:Th8AAOSwTGRldTw6&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA0Dj2Y3tWA6wo0gzpW81ETKPk7HQFcwc5pAndirD%2FbJ77Y9s3lhxgIfQ%2BlKIRAgGDYqt%2BHOc%2B4fZ7fbV4F%2BbpBKC2Q5XJj1vZLKcwEpNhc9KQI4Bkw6ZzxBwfUUL7%2FsYVWPC0QD0ZLr1%2B8YT1iSSwlfv1%2FsKtOjD6s8BnPP80iane%2FoNZFSnpMW9uMtQ%2FcQDEoUII5N4X%2FqYHZFzsHEnQztjLloXUVfhVlv4zHDMKu3AzmYvx0w%2FbgI46M9uf4FFNz%2B2qdvqeympWOFhGje9g4wQ%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR9qql96VYw

Meanwhile our friend Briva's book "sold" for over 21k a few weeks ago. I doubt this was an actual sale, as he ended it early and was obviously shill bidded to the moon... Yet still I feel real bad for the trustworthy seller who is going to take a massive hit because of scumbag Briva. 

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/235352700169?mkevt=1&mkpid=2&emsid=e90001.m43.l1123&plmtId=700008&mesgId=3016&mkcid=8&ch=osgood&bu=43473349826&trkId=b9ade879-3043-4bd1-bc5d-bf16a474ebcd&cnvId=700003&recoId=235352700169&recoPos=1

Woah, I thought Comic Selects, (briva3) had ended all their auctions??

As for this one, you may have missed it, so much of what I and others have done just disappears into the nothingness of a 166 page thread, but this is a sales pattern I've demonstrated with this seller's sales dating back to 2011. Whoever they are, consistently resells the same book multiple times. Their purpose, at least to me, seems to be so that they can prop up the market for sales that they do off of eBay and on venues that are not recorded in GPA/GoCollect/Worthpoint.

Earlier, I listed around 100 submissions from this seller, visited every cert page and discovered several likely swaps that comicwiz hasn't even gotten to yet. I only scratched the surface of his submissions, but out of what I saw, only a portion of those books made it to ebay. 

Also, I lost the point of reference quote, but someone had pointed to a signature book and that being safe. No it isn't, If it's signed by the same folks, the custom label swap scam is still possible to pull off and I wouldn't put it past anyone to try.

On 12/27/2023 at 1:41 PM, VintageComics said:

As someone who submits a lot of books, I can testify that CGC has been inconsistent and you can get overgraded and undergraded books back from CGC. 

Any high volume submitter can testify to this. In fact, we talk to each other all the time about it and compare notes regularly. 

Let's not start yelling fire in a movie theater just yet. 

You saw the post of mine where I looked at his groups of submissions over the past year, no? The one where he sent in 100 books and got 90 of them back 9.8's, a few 9.6's, a 9.4 and some lower grade silvers? What do you think of that win/loss ratio?

Love the ad description on eBay... 

"CGC & CBCS HAVE BAD QUALITY CONTROL AND CASES & INNERWELLS MAY HAVE SCUFFS, SCRATCHES, NEWTON RINGS, SMALL FLOATING PIECES INSIDE CASES OR INNERWELLS, VERY SMALL HAIRLINE CRACKS WHERE CASES ARE SEALED ON THE SIDES, INNERWELLS OR COMICS MAY MOVE INSIDE CASES OR OTHER SLIGHT ISSUES"

In other words, "It may look like someone used a curling iron, a couple of old credit cards and a pair of super thin needle nose pliers yanking the inner well out the bottom, but that's all on you."

Interesting to note they're using the CGC census images in the ad. Note the white marks on the left side and the unbroken bluish/purple luminescence of the unbroken sonic weld on both sides of the case, but not the bottom. Easy solution CGC, weld the friggin' bottom of the case.  

On 12/27/2023 at 10:05 AM, jsilverjanet said:

they have done it before - anything deemed negative on social media will ban you from their groups

i forgot what the last thing CGC did that cause a few people to come to the boards and mentioned they had been banned etc

I don't really participate in social media, so I guess that kinda surprises me. 

Just sitting here thinking... 

The silence from Gem-Mint and ComicTom is deafening. 

On 12/27/2023 at 10:01 AM, MatterEaterLad said:

CGC will be fine. They'll take a small hit to their reputation and maybe their bottom line. Unfortunately, most of those submitting won't even know about this scandal. There are so many CGC fan communities that will be insulated from this. I got the ban hammer from the CGC fan page on Facebook for just mentioning this scandal. And that's a group with 37,000 members, that the mods there are keeping in the dark.

Holy hell, really? Banned?! Why the hell would they do that? Are they crazy? This is something everyone should be aware of. 

On 12/27/2023 at 9:52 AM, BrashL said:

I don’t know how you can say that given what we know. For all we know all those 9.8s with 4 spine ticks people have been complaining about for years are all case switches. I think the books go into the thousands at the very least. 

This... A million times this. It's now the most reasonable explanation for 9.8's that everyone objectively agrees aren't even close to a 9.8

On 12/27/2023 at 9:51 AM, jsilverjanet said:

you have never seen an employee crack a slab? they don't inspect it, they pop it out like it was bubble gum (with little regard to the comic)

True story... And it aint glue anyway. The xylene literally melts the polycarbonate back together again. 

On 12/27/2023 at 9:49 AM, Steven Valdez said:

Joke as we may (and I do) but I don't see CGC recovering from this. They're done.

Too many powerful players with too much money tied to the value of their encased books. I don't think they're done, but it sure as heck better at least level the playing field on resale value. Honestly, how is this any worse than CBCS losing a couple hundred submissions and grading from home or PGX and all their catalog of goof-ups?

On 12/27/2023 at 9:44 AM, Heronext said:

 

You gotta start somewhere!

On 12/27/2023 at 9:34 AM, Point Five said:

With all that said, it may be safest to switch to buying CGC .5 slabs for the time being. No chance that a lower grade copy has been substituted!

Don't let my screen name throw you, this is a really good idea.

 

I agree... Especially the early silver age ones w/o back covers that you can marry to the backs of two gun kids and gunsmoke westerns for the 2.0 blue detached/split cover scam craze... New for 2024!

Now would be a good time for an enterprising sir or madam to put together a simple restoration checker kit and guide and get her up on Amazon to facilitate the expectation of increased trade in raw books. 

Am I the only one getting 403 blocked when I try to make a post?

On 12/27/2023 at 9:14 AM, AbsoluteCarnage said:

If someone uncovers a high value / high grade early SA key book that is indeed a Purple book in as blue label that's gonna set things off. 

Only a matter of time... There's a lot of old qualified high grade books and 0.5 blues without their pin up pages or ad pages missing out there.

Profanity filter works! Let's see you get around THAT, scammers!

Giordano... Testing the profanity filter.

On 12/27/2023 at 9:09 AM, MyNameIsLegion said:

anyone think there's an insurance angle here? A collector files a loss because they recertify or reholder a book that was tampered with and it come back a lower grade and worth significantly less? What the biggest $$$ amount known to be dodgy so far? $15K? 

The 252 MJ 9.8 that kicked off this party was around the 15K mark I think, but given the ease with which any swingin' , Tom or Harry can stuff a lower grade inner well into a higher grade label and send it off for laundry service, who knows for sure what the upper limits actually are.

On 12/27/2023 at 7:40 AM, mephistopheles said:

WTF is Xylene? Who would think to use that?

I have a can of it three feet away from me. It's an excellent solvent, use it all the time. 

That's why Chemical Jesus gave us fume hoods!

On 12/27/2023 at 7:04 AM, Steven Valdez said:

So, there's this:

https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Children-39S-Books-Comic-Slab-Ultrasonic_1600491875113.html

1 - 9 pieces

USD 1,900.00

Cheap, but you have to factor in the cost of the acrylic cases and the aluminum molds used to seal 'em back up. I don't think it's even required now that I've seen what Dr. Rick just pulled off with a heat gun and a little bit of xylene.

On 12/27/2023 at 6:55 AM, BrashL said:

https://youtu.be/vONa3k9gnVg?si=RnyOIRUjOpNgksCr

This is looking like more of a disaster by the day. This isn’t one guy and a few books. This is a fundamental and apparently easily exploited flaw in the slab. This goes beyond reholdering as well. This might be why a response is taking so long, how do you even begin with damage control?

Here comes the science!