It Come Down To It... The BEGINNING and the END of the Copper Age!

[joe_collector]

True...what year did the DM start officially? 1979 or so?

 

The middle of 1979, or X-Men 122 for a specific issue.

[joe_collector]

I thiink you nay have to go back to Legends of the Dark Knight #1 for the definitive issue that began the "fooll's gold", "chrome", "Gimik" age.

 

No, LOTDK did not change comics overnight like Spider-man #1 did. I went to several LCS during the mid to late-80's and the VERY DAY Spider-man 1 arrived, it was like a zoo. The books were plastered all over, stacks of multiple covers, speculators talking about how much they were going to make, bozos buying sealed cases, the Platinum Edition proudly displayed with some wild price tag, etc.

 

That was the day comics changed forever.

[50 Cent #II (1st)]

I thiink you nay have to go back to Legends of the Dark Knight #1 for the definitive issue that began the "fooll's gold", "chrome", "Gimik" age.

 

No, LOTDK did not change comics overnight like Spider-man #1 did. I went to several LCS during the mid to late-80's and the VERY DAY Spider-man 1 arrived, it was like a zoo. The books were plastered all over, stacks of multiple covers, speculators talking about how much they were going to make, bozos buying sealed cases, the Platinum Edition proudly displayed with some wild price tag, etc.

 

That was the day comics changed forever.

 

Guess that would make the start of the new Modern Age or end of the old Modern Age the day Captain America died.

[cd4ever]

i can't really accept the Bronze Age as extending all the way into 1992, when i think it's pretty clear it ended sometime on or around August of 1980.

 

 

the Fool's Gold Age, as you refer to it, probably didn't really begin in earnest until at least 1990, or whenever Spider-Man 1 came out. not sure when that age ended, really, but it does seem that there is an argument to be made about the time period immediately after the end of Copper Age which ended before the Modern Age - which began with what, i have no idea

I agree which is why DD 158 in 1979 seems the perfect start of the CA. It signalled the coming of a new generation of creators like Miller, Moore, Gaiman, and the like as well as a new 'dark' and 'gritty' realism to comics.

[seanfingh]

I thiink you nay have to go back to Legends of the Dark Knight #1 for the definitive issue that began the "fooll's gold", "chrome", "Gimik" age.

 

No, LOTDK did not change comics overnight like Spider-man #1 did. I went to several LCS during the mid to late-80's and the VERY DAY Spider-man 1 arrived, it was like a zoo. The books were plastered all over, stacks of multiple covers, speculators talking about how much they were going to make, bozos buying sealed cases, the Platinum Edition proudly displayed with some wild price tag, etc.

 

That was the day comics changed forever.

 

Agreed. As a teenager I would always buy a couple of extra books of series that I thought would blow up, to sell or trade, off the stands (2 extra X-Factor 1's, 5 extra Justice League 1's etc.). I bought 10 green, 10 black, 10 bagged black and 10 bagged green copies. There were so many people (including many that I had never seen) buying cases of books that I couldn't believe it. I was pretty good friends with the guys that ran the shop (back in Carmel, Indiana) and I helped them unload the cases. It was more for one book than my LCS gets now for its entire wednesday allotment.

[40sJohn]

Beginning of the Copper Age? Definitely in '81 or '82. The move to direct sales, Miller Daredevil, Pacific Comics, mini-series targeted at collectors reflected huge changes in the industry. Comics moving from the newstands to the LCS as the primary distribution point seems to began at this point.

 

 

 

[aardvark88]

Don't forget the mass speculation on disco Dazzler #1, the 1st major direct sales smash hit, even though Pacific Comics titles pre-date it.

[The Troll King]

I'm going to say that the copper age started in 1984 with titles like West Coast Avengers (mini that year, regular series the next)

 

1985 saw Web of Spider-man, Miracleman came out that year along with TONS of other titles.

 

1986 saw some the end of the original Superman series with that title and a new Superman series in 1987

 

Anyway, that's my guess... if I had to choose a specific year I'd have to say 1985

[Jamie Coville]

Going by the dates 1979 and 1990-ish I'd consider World of Krypton #1 (1979) to be a key point because it was the first mini series (I believe by any publisher). Considering how popular the mini-series has become I think it's pretty significant. I don't think Watchmen or DKR could have been done effectively as back up stories in another mag.

 

Spider-Man #1 (McFarlane - 1990) I think is the start of the "chrome" age.

 

 

[The Troll King]

Crom age?

 

[Warlord]

Well, I think we can all agree that tagging comics from the 1990s isn't exactly "modern" and personally believe we should looking at this decade as the Chrome Age in comics (even if brass is more logical, chrome is more fitting).

 

The only solution is to combine the two. Plus it fits perfectly. Chrome + Brass Age = the Crass Age!

[Warlord]

True...what year did the DM start officially? 1979 or so?

 

The middle of 1979, or X-Men 122 for a specific issue.

 

From what I've read about Phil Seuling's move to create the DM method of distribution, I might have guessed he had it going even earlier than middle of 1979. MH Chuckie writes a lot about this topic, but I've not spotted anywhere that he pins down a date or the first comic that he, or other dealers, handled as a DM issue.

 

Superboy Spectacular, cover dated 1980, is generally said to be the first comic sold ONLY in the DM.

 

[DrWatson]

Wasn't Dazzler #1 the first comic exclusively delivered to comic shops, i.e. the first direct market only book?

[mica]

From what I've read about Phil Seuling's move to create the DM method of distribution, I might have guessed he had it going even earlier than middle of 1979. MH Chuckie writes a lot about this topic, but I've not spotted anywhere that he pins down a date or the first comic that he, or other dealers, handled as a DM issue.

 

Superboy Spectacular, cover dated 1980, is generally said to be the first comic sold ONLY in the DM.

 

I agree. I'd say 1980 seems right to me. This fits in so many areas and predates WEB of Spiderman (which is purebred Copper)

Another good indicator of this is the ability to focus elsewhere besides Marvel and DC.

 

Declining sales forced Western (GOLDKEY/WHITMAN) in 1981 to cease newsstand distribution and thereafter release all its comics solely in bags as "Whitman Comics". The "Gold Key" logo was discontinued.

by 1984 Western (GOLDKEY/WHITMAN) was out of the comic book business.

[Zonker]

Wasn't Dazzler #1 the first comic exclusively delivered to comic shops, i.e. the first direct market only book?

 

I don't think so.

 

May 1979: Daredevil 158- First Miller art

Sep 1980: X-Men 137- Death of Dark Phoenix

Oct 1980: DC Presents 26- first New Teen Titans

Nov 1980: New Teen Titans 1

"1980" : Superboy Spectacular- Direct Sales only 1-shot (anyone know which month?)

Jan 1981: Daredevil 168- First Miller -script; Intro Elektra

Jan 1981: X-Men 141- Days of Future Past launches alternate time line that would form the basis for lots of X-continuity over the next several years

Mar 1981: X-Men 143- Final Claremont/Byrne

Mar 1981: Dazzler 1- First direct-sales-only for an ongoing series

Nov 1981: Captain Victory 1- First Pacific Comics issue, direct-only publisher

 

[DrWatson]

I am not trying to argumentative, but I could have sworn that I read somewhere that Dazzler #1 was the first comic to be available only at an LCS and not any other outlet.

[Zonker]

I am not trying to argumentative, but I could have sworn that I read somewhere that Dazzler #1 was the first comic to be available only at an LCS and not any other outlet.

 

Probably the first ongoing series conceived as a Direct Only title. That Superboy Spectacular was an odd experiment. A pretty unappealing collection of Grade Z reprints. Can't imagine what DC hoped to compare it to, if they were trying to judge the viability of the Direct Only strategy.

[awe4one]

That's news to me as well...

 

Jim

[Jamie Coville]

Publishers began selling direct to Phil Suiling around 1973, with him distributing to other stores at the same time.

 

According to Jim Shooter, it wasn't until the mid 80s that the Direct Market overtook the newsstand market.

 

 

[Kevin Boyd]

1. Can the CA's beginning be narrowed down to 1 specific issue OR did it gradually occur?

 

It occurred gradually for different titles, for Marvel it occurred with the start of Secret Wars and for DC it was Crisis on Infinite Earths, with indies it was TMNT1.

 

2. Same as Questions #1, but in reference to the end of the CA and beginning of MA.

 

Again, gradually at different times, but I think Modern begins with Morrison's JLA, Wildstorm being purchased by DC, Planetary and the Authority debut, Event Comics starts producing books under the Marvel Knights imprint. Around 1998-99.

 

I see Image's formation as the mid-way point for the Copper Age.

 

I still stand with my hypothesis that comic ages tend to go in 14 year cycles. If you see silver as 1956-1970 and Bronze as 1970-1984, then it follows that Copper would be 1984-1998 and I think it fits. With Silver the age kicks off with a revival of the Flash which leads to a new age of super-hero comics at DC and Marvel. Bronze kicks off with a change in storytelling techniques and the rise of the anti-hero as the "star", and copper is all about "flash" - overwhelming the customer with more gimmicks, be that as a crossover, a gimmick cover, variants, superstar artist vanity projects, deaths, etc. And it fits - you can see a shift occurring in 1984-85 and another in 1998-1999. The Image stuff fits into the pattern of what was started with Secret Wars and Crisis and by the mid-1990's it's declining and creators are reacting AGAINST that stuff. It's not until the late 1990's that people start saying this isn't working... let me try to FIX what's broken.

 

3. What differentiated the CA from the preceding BA and the MA that would follow it?

 

Copper from Bronze: Crossovers after crossovers! New universes. Worlds within worlds. Change for the sake of change. Vanity projects out the wazoo. Gimmicks, variants...! Breakout companies do as well or better than the Big Two (Marvel and DC). Comic book collecting craziness. Batmania in 1989. John Byrne Superman, George Perez Wonder Woman, Miller's Batman: Year One and Dark Knight Returns. Hellblazer and Sandman and the rise of Vertigo from the "roots" of Alan Moore's Swamp Thing. Spider-Man, X-Force, X-Men hit new sales records. Hellboy, Sin City, Marvels, Kingdom Come. Superman dies and gets replace. Batman breaks his back and is replaced. Flash dies and is replaced. Green Lantern goes mad and is replaced. Green Arrow dies and is replaced. Wonder Woman loses a fight and gets replaced. It's all action and reaction.

 

Modern Age was a renewed emphasis on characters over gimmicks. Streamlining of superhero lines "back to basics". Emphasis on writers over artists. Rebuilding after the speculators left and what remained of the readership was dwindling. Marvel recovering from bankruptcy - Joe and Bill Jemas and "New Marvel". Comic book movie hit after comic book movie hit.