Heritage Auctions - How is this possible?

[brasseye]

Yet another reason to dislike Heritage. Throw it on the pile.

Yes, giving your bigger customers additional benefits is such a unique, evil thing to do. I can't imagine any other company in the world does that.

 

Tim, remeber this is an auction, not a sauna facility down at your local health club.

 

To allow a separate 'category' of bidders' effectively negate all 'sub' bidders not included. In the same way, their live floor bidding forrmat uses internet bidding as some vaunted 'starting price', it's just another method employed by them to jack bidding up, and excluded one group of bidders (in this case, the poor ones) in the process

 

At the end of the day, all participants in heritage auction's, need to break out Piles cream it's safe to say.

 

Heritage already mock the most fundamental principles of auctioneering, and this is just unfortunately another notch on a long list of greivances for most of us here have against them.

 

[Norrin_Radd]

Yet another reason to dislike Heritage. Throw it on the pile.

Yes, giving your bigger customers additional benefits is such a unique, evil thing to do. I can't imagine any other company in the world does that.

right back atcha, Heritage Fanboy #1.

 

Two words... unfair advantage. Giving special treatment and discounts to large customers is expected. But now there are three different ways to win the normal internet bidding and still lose.

 

* Separate eBay auctions

* Live floor bidding

* Extended hour bidding for "special" customers

 

This along with excessive fees and a history of questionable practices really doesn't make me want to even bother with Heritage.

 

[1koko]

Yet another reason to dislike Heritage. Throw it on the pile.

Yes, giving your bigger customers additional benefits is such a unique, evil thing to do. I can't imagine any other company in the world does that.

right back atcha, Heritage Fanboy #1.

 

Two words... unfair advantage. Giving special treatment and discounts to large customers is expected. But now there are three different ways to win the normal internet bidding and still lose.

 

* Separate eBay auctions

* Live floor bidding

* Extended hour bidding for "special" customers

 

This along with excessive fees and a history of questionable practices really doesn't make me want to even bother with Heritage.

 

On the bidding side you have to remember that the additional bidding capability is limited to Signature Auctions only.

 

There are still two further options available to everybody - bidding on the floor (through postal/telephone or being present) and live through the internet.

 

The value in the extra time is the possibility to win auction by bidding a high amount after the auction has closed but before it hits the floor. This however is moderated by the same opportunity being available to anyone before normal internet bidding is closed.

 

 

 

[Goonchild-migration]

Yet another reason to dislike Heritage. Throw it on the pile.

Yes, giving your bigger customers additional benefits is such a unique, evil thing to do. I can't imagine any other company in the world does that.

right back atcha, Heritage Fanboy #1.

 

Two words... unfair advantage. Giving special treatment and discounts to large customers is expected. But now there are three different ways to win the normal internet bidding and still lose.

 

* Separate eBay auctions

* Live floor bidding

* Extended hour bidding for "special" customers

 

This along with excessive fees and a history of questionable practices really doesn't make me want to even bother with Heritage.

 

AGREED

Feebay may have its faults, but you can generally see the mines in the water, and not have to worry about 'depth-charges' (Pun intended)

[G.A.tor]

Yet another reason to dislike Heritage. Throw it on the pile.

Yes, giving your bigger customers additional benefits is such a unique, evil thing to do. I can't imagine any other company in the world does that.

right back atcha, Heritage Fanboy #1.

 

Two words... unfair advantage. Giving special treatment and discounts to large customers is expected. But now there are three different ways to win the normal internet bidding and still lose.

 

* Separate eBay auctions

* Live floor bidding

* Extended hour bidding for "special" customers

 

This along with excessive fees and a history of questionable practices really doesn't make me want to even bother with Heritage.

 

On the bidding side you have to remember that the additional bidding capability is limited to Signature Auctions only.

 

There are still two further options available to everybody - bidding on the floor (through postal/telephone or being present) and live through the internet.

 

The value in the extra time is the possibility to win auction by bidding a high amount after the auction has closed but before it hits the floor. This however is moderated by the same opportunity being available to anyone before normal internet bidding is closed.

 

 

true...or, for dummies like me, that was watching "life" last night and didn't realize I had been outbid on Man of War #1....so, I was happy to have some extended bid time, but truth is, if you want a book ,sign up for phone or live internet bidding, as anything that happens before then, is really irrelevant unless no one else bids

gator

[1koko]

there are also the deductions on seller commissions, pre-approved credit limits and secret handshake and dance

hey, I have not been shown the secret handshake yet!

gator

 

The dance is worse

[G.A.tor]

there are also the deductions on seller commissions, pre-approved credit limits and secret handshake and dance

hey, I have not been shown the secret handshake yet!

gator

 

The dance is worse

[Red Hook]

Yet another reason to dislike Heritage. Throw it on the pile.

Yes, giving your bigger customers additional benefits is such a unique, evil thing to do. I can't imagine any other company in the world does that.

right back atcha, Heritage Fanboy #1.

 

Two words... unfair advantage. Giving special treatment and discounts to large customers is expected. But now there are three different ways to win the normal internet bidding and still lose.

 

* Separate eBay auctions

* Live floor bidding

* Extended hour bidding for "special" customers

 

This along with excessive fees and a history of questionable practices really doesn't make me want to even bother with Heritage.

 

Totally agree, NR. Add that to the fact that Heritage makes zero effort to make this clear to the average bidder and you get an incredibly smarmy setup. This one makes my top five list of things that are wrong with the hobby.

[1koko]

Lack of information is key here.

 

The closing of internet bidding stages - normal and legacy are irrelevant - the Live bidding process on the internet allows for proxy bids to be left till the start of the floor process anyway.

 

So there is no advantage other than a lack of knowledge of options available.

 

Lack of information of the various options has created a variety of deadlines to stimulate bidding.

 

Done on purpose

 

 

 

[qualitycomix]

Also, to encourage bidding, they start every auction at $1.00. Then, 5 days before the end of the auction, they reveal the reserve on the book if there is one. That's not a huge problem.

 

The problem that I found is in that same time period (5 days before the end of the auction), they also bid up all of the reserve books to just under the reserve, so that the next bid will meet reserve.

 

It's kind of a sneaky way to encourage bidding and basically shill bid under the reserve price.

[G.A.tor]

Also, to encourage bidding, they start every auction at $1.00. Then, 5 days before the end of the auction, they reveal the reserve on the book if there is one. That's not a huge problem.

 

The problem that I found is in that same time period (5 days before the end of the auction), they also bid up all of the reserve books to just under the reserve, so that the next bid will meet reserve.

 

It's kind of a sneaky way to encourage bidding and basically shill bid under the reserve price.

this is what I didn't like to find out...sure, great to be a "legacy" this and legacy that, and yes, heritage does offer some nice books, but the bid manipulation that has been rumored, has now been "proven"!?...I believe it gives a "false" indication to market demand...

I mean, how many times have you bought a book at a price that you did so, because you knew someone else was willing to pay just one increment below you?...I know that has swayed my opinion more than once...

ugh!

gator

[Wrightson fan]

Let me say that I consider myself a Heritage Live Auction newbie. This is my first

attempt at this format but have bought from them in the past. I set some high max bids on the two books I am going after. If I am outbid, then it is just meant to be. However, the revelations that you guys are laying on me make me wonder if I will ever participate in this type of auction again. ComicLink and Bill Hughes run auctions that are more in line with the way they should be...no hidden agendas or fine print that only a priveleged few must get to see. If I hadn't wanted the books so badly I wouldn't have ventured into this "no man's land". Good luck to everyone on the books they want.

 

Scott

[Norrin_Radd]

Lack of information of the various options has created a variety of deadlines to stimulate bidding.

 

Done on purpose

this is what I didn't like to find out...sure, great to be a "legacy" this and legacy that, and yes, heritage does offer some nice books, but the bid manipulation that has been rumored, has now been "proven"!?...I believe it gives a "false" indication to market demand...

 

It's a question of image. And the image that emerges over and over again is one of excessive greed on Heritage's part. Gaming the system as much as possible to maximize their profits. I rubs many people the wrong way.

[G.A.tor]

Lack of information of the various options has created a variety of deadlines to stimulate bidding.

 

Done on purpose

this is what I didn't like to find out...sure, great to be a "legacy" this and legacy that, and yes, heritage does offer some nice books, but the bid manipulation that has been rumored, has now been "proven"!?...I believe it gives a "false" indication to market demand...

 

It's a question of image. And the image that emerges over and over again is one of excessive greed on Heritage's part. Gaming the system as much as possible to maximize their profits. I rubs many people the wrong way.

[tth2]

Lack of information is key here.

 

The closing of internet bidding stages - normal and legacy are irrelevant - the Live bidding process on the internet allows for proxy bids to be left till the start of the floor process anyway.

 

So there is no advantage other than a lack of knowledge of options available.

 

Lack of information of the various options has created a variety of deadlines to stimulate bidding.

 

Done on purpose

 

 

Thanks George. This is so incredibly obvious I just can`t understand why people are making such a mountain out of a molehill. If Heritage allowed Legacy bidders an additional opportunity to trump all live bids, my reaction would be completely different. But the fact is that everyone who bids via internet, Legacy or not, gets trumped by the live floor bidding which is open to everyone with a phone or internet connection. So an additional 10 hours of internet bidding time is just a way for Heritage to make their Legacy customers feel good while actually not helping them one bit.

[Sal]

Also, to encourage bidding, they start every auction at $1.00. Then, 5 days before the end of the auction, they reveal the reserve on the book if there is one. That's not a huge problem.

 

The problem that I found is in that same time period (5 days before the end of the auction), they also bid up all of the reserve books to just under the reserve, so that the next bid will meet reserve.

 

It's kind of a sneaky way to encourage bidding and basically shill bid under the reserve price.

 

eh, sort of. all bids made below a reserve are equal, since none of them are enough to buy the book. setting the initial starting bids just under reserve would curtail bidding until the final day, which is bad. leaving books with reserves alone just before the reserve reveal wouldn't really do anything, as the next person to bid that wanted the book would have to go above reserve anyway.

 

the more i see about Heritage, the less nervous i am about bidding on their auctions. i've gotten a number of books for a lot less than my max bids, so anyone who's nervous about funny stuff going on by Heritage employees is probably blowing the thing out of proportion a bit. my chief complaint is that i can't seem to get freaking catalogues no matter how many times i am high bidder, even though there's a bunch of people who simply bid with no intention of winning so they can get the damned things...and they do! grumble grumble

[Norrin_Radd]

But the fact is that everyone who bids via internet, Legacy or not, gets trumped by the live floor bidding which is open to everyone with a phone or internet connection. So an additional 10 hours of internet bidding time is just a way for Heritage to make their Legacy customers feel good while actually not helping them one bit.

 

Why bother with internet bidding at all when the live bids have the final say? But then how often do live bids trump the internet bid? How many people bid live versus the internet?

 

I think the live bidding may be fairly inconsequential compared to internet bidding.

[Point Five]

I think the live bidding may be fairly inconsequential compared to internet bidding.

[G.A.tor]

But the fact is that everyone who bids via internet, Legacy or not, gets trumped by the live floor bidding which is open to everyone with a phone or internet connection. So an additional 10 hours of internet bidding time is just a way for Heritage to make their Legacy customers feel good while actually not helping them one bit.

 

Why bother with internet bidding at all when the live bids have the final say? But then how often do live bids trump the internet bid? How many people bid live versus the internet?

 

I think the live bidding may be fairly inconsequential compared to internet bidding.

I believe that when it was just phone bidding only, post internet bids, it was less consequential on the average lot (most folks likely only utilized phone bidding for the "big guns")...but, now that you have live internet bidding, I believe it has a huge impact on all the lower tier books...I know I no longer bid as strong on the internet portion, partly to keep the price potentially down, and partly because I know if I want a book , I am there on the HA live and I nail them!

gator

[thedude]

all this makes my head hurt, I don't like jumping through hoops just to win a book.

 

I'm done with all Heritage "signature" auctions, may still bid on "internet only" ones in the future.

 

 

good luck to the rest of you.