ARE WE SINKING?

[VintageComics]

Every time somebody quotes GPA numbers to low ball a book to me I point out that it was an Ebay sale that they are quoting. Ebay has traditionally been the worst place to sell *more common* stuff if you are looking to maximize a return. It will fetch top dollar for rare, sought after or obscure items..but that is not the norm.

 

There are alos 10's of 10,000's of "low doller" books being sold outside of Ebay so I'm not sure that the market is all that "top heavy". Pedigree, Comiclink, LCS's...they all sell low and mid grade (and cheap hi grade) books all the time.

 

R.

 

 

[arexcrooke]

One should probably not use ebay as the only market indicator. Look at SDCC, comiclink, metro's sales, and heritage and one can see our hobby is perfectly fine.

 

But that's exactly what people are saying - the upper crust is scrambling to break GPA records at CL, Metro, Pedigree, etc., but the average collector (who usually shops for lower-cost books on EBay) is slowing disappearing.

 

Being so top-heavy is NOT a healthy sign for the hobby.

Where are you getting this info at? Your rectum?

[drbanner]

The recently revised ebay pricing structure is what's keeping sales of low dollar items down. To start a book at $1 and end it at $10, you pay ebay 9%, not to mention PP fees. It used to be a lot cheaper to sell inexpensive items on ebay, they seem to be revising their business model to cater to wholesalers and away from mom and pops.

 

Either Chuck Rozanski doesn't have a good feel for what the sub-$25 market of average collector comics books is, or the market is much stronger than your ebay observations make it seem to be. Otherwise, he wouldn't bother coming to a relatively small local show like we have here in Raleigh and clear out boxes and boxes of cheap "commons". True story!

[joe_collector]

 Originally Posted By: joe_collector

 Originally Posted By: Miraclo

One should probably not use ebay as the only market indicator. Look at SDCC, comiclink, metro's sales, and heritage and one can see our hobby is perfectly fine.

 

But that's exactly what people are saying - the upper crust is scrambling to break GPA records at CL, Metro, Pedigree, etc., but the average collector (who usually shops for lower-cost books on EBay) is slowing disappearing.

 

Being so top-heavy is NOT a healthy sign for the hobby.

Where are you getting this info at? Your rectum?

You do read OS, right?

[Mac Man]

The recently revised ebay pricing structure is what's keeping sales of low dollar items down. To start a book at $1 and end it at $10, you pay ebay 9%, not to mention PP fees. It used to be a lot cheaper to sell inexpensive items on ebay, they seem to be revising their business model to cater to wholesalers and away from mom and pops.

 

(thumbs u

 

Accurate assessment I'd say. People are probably looking for other, cheaper avenues to unload their cheaper books.

[Blind Owl]

I think the Market is still very strong, at least in the type of books I have been pursuing!!!

 

Most of the books I've been purchasing are not expensive, nor are they at the bottom tier either, probably somewhere in the middle priced range from $100.00-$1000.00. My focus is to purchase hard to find copies, key issues, or if a book is more common, a higher graded issue VF or better!!!

 

I can tell you here & now there is a LOT of competition for the books in this range!!!! I don't see it as slowing down, and most of these books sell for at guide or higher (most of the books I purchase are priced over guide). If I can purchase these books at guide prices I feel I did very well.

 

Now I also purchase other books that are not on my want lists if I consider them deals, but I do this mainly to flip and maybe make a little profit so I can purchase more books on my want lists!!!

 

As far as E-bay is concerned, I only purchase books if they are a very good deal (ALWAYS 1/2 to 2/3 below Overstreet). If you do this you won't get burnt by Overgrading, which can be a problem on e-bay!!!

 

In closing, I don't see the hobby really sinking as was mentioned, but from my point of view appears very strong!!!

 

I'd also state that at the high end of the hobby (of which I am not a player, but wish I were) this is even more pronounced (meaning the hobby appears very strong)!!!

 

On the very low end, I don't know since I'm not really a player in that game. Others will have to chime in on that?

[NewWorldOrder]

This topic is washed.

 

Obviously the collectors are there, it's since eBay became FeeBay there is no real advantage to selling any book that ranges from $1-25 anymore.

 

Plus I think alot of collectors prefer to buy in person if the book is "raw."

 

I only buy CGC online.

 

THE HOBBY IS VERY STRONG!

[joe_collector]

Obviously the collectors are there, it's since eBay became FeeBay there is no real advantage to selling any book that ranges from $1-25 anymore.

 

This makes no sense, as that would influence new listings, not why *existing* EBay books aren't selling.

[NewWorldOrder]

 Originally Posted By: spiderman-on-tilt

Obviously the collectors are there, it's since eBay became FeeBay there is no real advantage to selling any book that ranges from $1-25 anymore.

 

This makes no sense, as that would influence new listings, not why *existing* EBay books aren't selling.

there not selling because most eBayer sell garage comics.Why would anyone need a comic like X-men 243 in F+ condition?CGC's always sell well, and if they dont its because again who the hell needs X-men 243 CGC 9.2.

[lizards2]

Part of the problem with eBay is just filtering through the crapp - there is just so much stuff and so many crappy dealers, and then throw in the dealers with great stuff who can't package the books to survive the trip to you. It is a minefield.

 

That being said, I still buy half my books there. You just have to find the guys that are good dealers, and do repeat business with them.

 

As for market health, try to buy MG to HG big five war books from eBays top sellers with Andy Greenham pounding the snot out of you on every auction - very helluva healthy market there, even if it can be attributed to one or two big-time hoarders

 

Or, try to buy HG books from Bob Catent on eBay, and feel the pain of greggy snipes

[NewWorldOrder]

Plus with shipping most of the time to buy one comic online is more of a hassle than just waiting to find the book at a local show.

 

Example.....

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/X-men-243-8-5-9-0_W0QQitemZ170249399377QQihZ007QQcategoryZ63767QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 

gee, I wonder why he wont sell it!

 

Just like most dealers......cant grade or price!

[Lego]

 Originally Posted By: drbanner

The recently revised ebay pricing structure is what's keeping sales of low dollar items down. To start a book at $1 and end it at $10, you pay ebay 9%, not to mention PP fees. It used to be a lot cheaper to sell inexpensive items on ebay, they seem to be revising their business model to cater to wholesalers and away from mom and pops.

 

 

Accurate assessment I'd say. People are probably looking for other, cheaper avenues to unload their cheaper books.

What are we considering "cheaper books"? I think most shop owners would have some interesting input into this conversation. The high grade hobby is chugging right along at the moment, with the same small group trading the same books and the same money back-and-forth, but the larger portion and the bedrock of the hobby (mid-grade) is withered and dying.I think the question is, with the "high grade collectors" becoming more and more finicky and the books pursued becoming more and more scarce, how long will it be before interest in back issues disappears altogether? It's very obvious that there is little interest in mid-grade books even from the Silver and Bronze ages any more, and most collectors are in the high grade hunt because they want the best of the best, and as a result of that, the "best of the best" keeps being refined and redefined and the criteria keeps narrowing and prices keep going up on "acceptable books"... so where does it end? Is that end in sight?But worrying about high grade collectors is putting the cart before the horse. Like I said, I think it would be very interesting to hear back issue sales data from some store owners. I'd like to hear about the sales volume of back issues, the ages of the books being purchased, prices realized, presumed grades, etc. In fact, I might head down the street right now and ask my local shopkeep. I wonder how he'd like that? (And I know for a fact that he's sitting on multiple warehouse units full of backstock that he simply can't move for realistic prices.)

[joe_collector]

Part of the problem with eBay is just filtering through the crapp - there is just so much stuff and so many crappy dealers, and then throw in the dealers with great stuff who can't package the books to survive the trip to you. It is a minefield.

 

And this is somehow different from any other time on EBay....

 

Or, try to buy HG books from Bob Catent on eBay, and feel the pain of greggy snipes

 

Is that Bobcat?

[joe_collector]

Like I said, I think it would be very interesting to hear back issue sales data from some store owners.

 

Go read the OS dealer reports, and many are saying the same thing - high-grade and CGC is rocking, but the rank-and-file collector is disappearing.

[NewWorldOrder]

[Mac Man]

There's still a strong demand for key books of any grade though. Try and find a low grade copy of Incredible Hulk 181 in GD at guide prices--you won't. In fact, plan to bring nearly double guide to the table when hunting for that book. Same rule applies for most of the key books in low grade (GS XM 1, XM 94, ASM 1, AF 15, FF 1, and the list goes on and on).

 

While I can't speak definitively about the low-to-mid grade filler issues, I can say that there is a VERY vibrant market for low grade key comics, whether you look on eBay or any of the other sites.

[mikephoen]

I've been a full time dealer for more than 15 years. Here are a few facts.

 

has never sold well.

 

Good stuff, priced fairly, has always sold great.

 

Someone is always predicting the end of all things.

[joe_collector]

Someone is always predicting the end of all things.

 

Yeah, just like everyone was always saying that "Bronze Age books were never gonna be worth anything!".

 

Where do you jokers dig these nuggets out of, your butt?

[jools&jim]

I can say that there is a VERY vibrant market for low grade key comics, whether you look on eBay or any of the other sites.

 

But that's always been true: keys are still keys, no matter the grade, and are not comparable in any way (in terms of overall sales or desirability) to the lower and mid-grade box stock that generally makes up the largest percentage of older books in most dealers' inventories.

 

Anecdotal evidence is hardly conclusive, but I know for a fact that in the two or three comic book stores I still visit periodically, the lower/mid grade SA and BA books (and even most of the more "common" CA books in higher grades) have been there, unsold, for years...and this despite frequent sales with deep discounts on back issues.

 

I'm not sure if this means the end of all things, by any measure, but it's still not encouraging to see this stuff remain unsold at (sometimes) very reasonable prices. Too bad I already have most of it...!

[Mac Man]

Well, kudos to you Mike for enough insight to know that your experience isn't gospel. Not saying you're incorrect either, but how many times do we see people find an exception to the rule and confuse the two?

 

Back to topic though, I think that one also needs to consider the economic times we're in and that low to mid grade books are more for collecting than investing; when keys start dropping, then you know there's a problem with the hobby.