PROBATION DISCUSSIONS 21 21

[Columbia Comics]

maybe someone should call Brent??

[KONG]

Still nothing from this jackhole. Order is incomplete, no reply in this forum, PM or email. Dont give Wil Blas aka wdmarvelcomics your well earned cash. Dude is a crook.

By my count and read, this seller will be eligible for the Probation list on June 13. Sorry to hear about this.

 

I think I understand the rules as posted for this and I wanted to consolidate this into one place. SO with that I want to nominate WDMARVELCOMICS for the probation list. I'll try to keep this brief, although that's not possible. This should be complete however to this point.

 

short synopsis of facts.

 

I found these forums (which I am enjoying) while doing a google search for the books WDMARVELCOMICS had posted in this thread.

 

May 9, 2012 - Contacted seller via PM after finding the sales thread. This was the first transaction I initiated on these boards after finding this via google search for these particular books (WD Argentina). We exchanged a few emails until we hammered out a deal.

May 14, 2012 - Sent e-check via paypal personal, seller insisted on either this or that I cover their paypal fees. I was uncomfortable with both as I'm either out more cash that I feel the seller is responsible for (I've been in the mail-order business for over 15 years now and have never asked anyone to do either of these things, paypal fees or credit card fees are a small cost of doing business day to day. Also it is against paypal policy to require either of these of a buyer. The worst part of this is obviously the choice I took which was to send them a personal payment.

May 17, 2012 - E-check cleared. I also added another book on this date, that e-check cleared two days later. I was now in $1232.00

May 19, 2012 - hadn't heard from seller so I emailed an inquiry, on the 20th (Sunday) seller emailed back stating they had been having some personal issues and would ship the books "Thursday or Friday" and they would let me know when they shipped.

May 29, 2012 - emailed again and also PMd, no reply. Noticing that they were still very much active on this forum at the time I posted here looking for advice and also hoping they would see my post as well. Shortly after I posted in this thread he emailed me apologizing and adding some other comments including "The longer you're on the CGC Message Boards you'll see it's more of laid back selling forum and the normal time frame for a transaction is about 20 to 30 days unless other arrangements are made". This hasn't been the case with other transactions I've had here and there have been many. Having said that they seem like nice enough people and I'm still hopeful this will end well. He then shipped the next day via media mail (?!).

 

06-04-12 - Early this morning Wil sends me a partial refund ($251.00) for some books with the following explanation "I just noticed I forgot to put 4 books into your package, so I just sent you a refund for the 4 books and I wanted to let you know right away so there's no surprises when you receive your package." Included in those four books they 'forgot' until five days after shipment were the keys to the whole deal in that they were three issue #1s. I got a discount on the 1s and a couple of other key issues if I bought a bunch of commons for full pop. I wrote back asking him when he was shipping the other books and then after a coffee wrote again telling him if I don't get the complete order I want to return the entire thing for a full and complete refund. I'm waiting to hear back from them. I obviously have some reservations in doing so as I'm still out the bulk of the money. I don't think I'm out of line here but I can't think of any way to protect myself. In all honesty at this point I don't want the books at all now and would rather have my money back so I can just hunt the books down elsewhere..

 

I wrote again Monday night letting them know I just want a complete refund as I'm done screwing around with this. I still haven't heard back from them.

 

 

Meanwhile media mail is taking it's time with the box making it about 150 miles south in five days time. Another 250 miles to go so I might have the box by labor day.

 

06-05-12 - I PMd them as well with the same request and never heard back to this point via email or PM. At the end of day yesterday I got the media mail package, it sits here in my office untouched as I want nothing to do with it.

 

6-07-12 - The seller hasn't returned a single email or PM this week. I sent PMs with new titles etc informing them I was nominating them for inclusion on the probation list. Again the seller was WDMARVELCOMICS. Seems they have had prior issues. I just want my money back at this point. I'm still in for $981.00 and I'm pretty angered by this entire situation. Whatever is in this sad looking box here is nothing that I want and not what I ordered. I purchased a large order that has been compromised due to books being removed prior to shipment. I'm in for $981 and would like this money refunded to me via the way I paid it. I will return the books at that time in whatever manner the seller arranges me to do so.

 

Thanks for your time.

 

PS - I also just found this thread . Thanks GOOGLE!!

[divad]

Under the new "simplified rules" here's all you need to do now:

 

2) Notification on the Probation Discussion Thread

a) After the 30 Day Rule is fulfilled, the accuser will send a PM to the accused informing them the issue is being submitted to the Probation Discussion Thread for their inclusion in the PL. This should be a new PM and not part of an existing PM chain.

 

b) After the PM is sent the accuser may submit the accused for inclusion in the PL via the Probation Discussion Thread.

 

c) The accuser should outline as completely as possible the circumstances surrounding the transaction in dispute. Where possible include hyperlinks to board transactions and contact attempts along with dates.

 

d) If reasonable additional expenses are incurred the accuser may include them as part of the resolution. The validity of "reasonable additional expenses" may be subject to discussion.

 

e) If completing the transaction is no longer possible, the accuser may outline a proposed path to resolution.

 

3) Being Placed On The PL

a) After a 72-hour waiting period, if the accused does not respond they will be placed on the PL.

b) If the accused responds in the Probation Discussion Thread and it is determined the conditions of the transaction was not met, they will be added to the PL.

 

c) If the accused is not available during that 72-hour period and is placed on the PL, they are free to later respond in the Probation Discussion Thread and present their side.

 

d) If the accused has not responded in the Probation Discussion Thread but continues to post on the boards, a reply can be made informing them they are being considered for placement on the PL.

[Roundguy]

Wow i cant believe wil left you hanging on this i have bought from him in the past and had no problems at all. Sorry to see him go down this road.

[Snake Eyes]

Even though you did Paypal personal, is initiating a charge back a possibility? Not sure how the rules shake out on that one, but may be worth a call to your credit card company

[comicdonna]

I don't believe so. It's against paypal rules to use paypal personal for purchasing goods. I can't imaging they would honor a chargeback, when their rules were broken.

[mschmidt]

Like Mike says, Paypal isn't going to do anything when you're dealing with a personal payment. If the payment was funded by a credit card, however, I would call up the CC company, file a chargeback that way and bypass Paypal entirely.

 

Please note that:

 

a) I have no idea whether that will actually work

b) Even if it works, Paypal might go after you afterwards

 

So, yeah, YMMV.

[Snake Eyes]

Like Mike says, Paypal isn't going to do anything when you're dealing with a personal payment. If the payment was funded by a credit card, however, I would call up the CC company, file a chargeback that way and bypass Paypal entirely.

 

Please note that:

 

a) I have no idea whether that will actually work

b) Even if it works, Paypal might go after you afterwards

 

So, yeah, YMMV.

 

I was kind of thinking this...may backfire, may not...but if the money is lost either way worth a try....I figure at the very least the credit card itself would honor the chargeback and at least make the seller's life more difficult...petty I know but

[Peter Loves Gwen]

It might help if it was a CC payment, they can do more than PayPal. It is likely too late with PayPal, but not with a CC company.

 

Yes that would get you in trouble with PayPal. They would rightly admonish you, hopefully not lock you out, but they should ultimately understand about fraud and trying to help you. They can handle absorbing fraud more easily than an individual.

[Speedy-D]

It might help if it was a CC payment, they can do more than PayPal. It is likely too late with PayPal, but not with a CC company.

 

Yes that would get you in trouble with PayPal. They would rightly admonish you, hopefully not lock you out, but they should ultimately understand about fraud and trying to help you. They can handle absorbing fraud more easily than an individual.

They probably can, but why would they? Just to be nice? You're skipping out on Paypal's fees when you go the personal payment route ... that's the whole reason you do it. Why in the world would they reward that?

[Peter Loves Gwen]

As good will, to be decent rather than pray to the book. I hate zero tolerance rules BTW. They(Paypal, everyone) should work with people, try to be fair and not laugh in the face of a person's misfortune.

 

You should ask, try to have a conversation and develop a personal relationship with business partners. Try to be friendly, smack your friend on the back of the head, but be friendly. Regards,

[Speedy-D]

As good will, to be decent rather than pray to the book. I hate zero tolerance rules BTW. They(Paypal, everyone) should work with people, try to be fair and not laugh in the face of a person's misfortune.

 

You should ask, try to have a conversation and develop a personal relationship with business partners. Try to be friendly, smack your friend on the back of the head, but be friendly. Regards,

I hear you, and you're right. But in this particular case, the seller & buyer have defrauded Paypal by circumventing the fees, no? To then run to them and complain of fraud, and expect them to take pity ... well, it'd certainly be cool of Paypal to do so, but I'd be pretty understanding if they didn't.

[Peter Loves Gwen]

True indeed, but I might ask them, depending on the loss.

 

I'm a favored customer of Paypal now, but I did have a transaction from 2004 that I got screwed on because of Paypal's policies. An eBay seller sent me an uninsured parcel with one of two comics bought. PayPal opened a claim when I called them to explain that there was only one item sent. The seller was able to finally keep the money and I couldn't get the CC to reverse the payment. That was bad policy to accept a delivery confirmation number as proof of delivery of the actual items. I believe it came down to the user reputations, and I was brand new to eBay. The seller later that year had other issues, and lost his account.

[RockMyAmadeus]

I don't believe so. It's against paypal rules to use paypal personal for purchasing goods. I can't imaging they would honor a chargeback, when their rules were broken.

 

Fees are based on whether you are making a Purchase Payment, a Personal Payment or a PayPal Business Payment. Some fees are expressed as a percentage of the payment amount. All Fees are in U.S. Dollars unless otherwise stated.

 

b. For Personal Payments, the following applies:

 

• The Fee depends on the Payment Method you use.

 

• It is free to send a Personal Payment to someone in the United States in U.S. Dollars if you use your bank or Balance as the exclusive Payment Method. If you use a different Payment method (Other, including a fully or partially funded payment by credit or debit card, or PayPal Credit.) to send a Personal Payment, the Fees set out below will apply (and the transaction then behaves like a Purchase Payment.)

 

13.3 Ineligible Items. PayPal Purchase Protection only applies to PayPal payments for certain tangible, physical goods. Payments for the following are not eligible for reimbursement under PayPal Purchase Protection:

 

• Personal Payments

 

 

 

[divad]

As good will, to be decent rather than pray to the book. I hate zero tolerance rules BTW. They(Paypal, everyone) should work with people, try to be fair and not laugh in the face of a person's misfortune.

 

You should ask, try to have a conversation and develop a personal relationship with business partners. Try to be friendly, smack your friend on the back of the head, but be friendly. Regards,

 

Great advice here. (thumbs u

[HighRadArt]

So what happens when someone on the probation list gets banned? Should they be moved to the HOS list or do they stay on the Probation list forever? The probation list seems to be getting rather long.

[seanfingh]

So what happens when someone on the probation list gets banned? Should they be moved to the HOS list or do they stay on the Probation list forever? The probation list seems to be getting rather long.

 

I don't know that anyone on the regular PL is banned. Maybe a couple, but not too many.

[HighRadArt]

So what happens when someone on the probation list gets banned? Should they be moved to the HOS list or do they stay on the Probation list forever? The probation list seems to be getting rather long.

 

I don't know that anyone on the regular PL is banned. Maybe a couple, but not too many.

 

Sorry I wasn't specific. I noticed primeinvestibles was banned in April. Just wondered what the "rules" were.

[Speedy-D]

So what happens when someone on the probation list gets banned? Should they be moved to the HOS list or do they stay on the Probation list forever? The probation list seems to be getting rather long.

 

I don't know that anyone on the regular PL is banned. Maybe a couple, but not too many.

 

Sorry I wasn't specific. I noticed primeinvestibles was banned in April. Just wondered what the "rules" were.

There was talk of having a time limit on the PL, just to keep it manageable. But I don't think it went anywhere.

Moving folks to the HoS doesn't seem right to me though. That list is separate from the PL for a reason. The folks in the HoS have done some serious off-ripping of boardies. Which is not the same thing as getting the boot for being a trouble maker.

 

Maybe we could have a "Probation List Retirees" list, for those PLers who see fit to get themselves permanently banned. I nominate POV to maintain that list. Second?

[stendek-migration]

My humble apologies. Erred in posting. My mistake. Will someone please lift my ban? Honest error. Thanks.

Edited June 14, 2012 by stendek