Avengers #4 Extremely Undervalued because its a #4 not a #1

[Mark 1]

I have one for sale on e-bay no reserve at CGC 9.2. the high bid is currently $5200. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300447419946&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT#ht_500wt_1154 Terry O.

 

I certainly hope you get much more than $5,200. That book should be at least 8k...according to GPA.

 

I'm keeping my fingers crossed for ya.

 

 

[SAGAT]

Avengers #4 ($4.2K in 9.2) is extremely undervalued because its a #4 not a #1.Captain America is the leader of the Avengers but why does he take a backseat pricewise to Thor (JIM83-$26K) and Iron Man (TOS39-$20K). Cap is the leader of Avengers and wears the USA costume yet he even loses out to Daredevil ($7.5K). Afterall Avengers 4 was released in 1964 not 1968.

 

If Cap appeared in Avengers #1 on the cover and story then Avengers 1 would be worth 35K in the new guide at 9.2 agree anyone?

Avengers 4 is not Cap's 1st ever appearance (Cap 1--3/41). JIM 83/TOS 39 are 1st appearances so that is why they have always been priced higher...A4 has been undervalued for many many years, so it is making it's rightful climb. (thumbs u It won't ever pass JIM 83 or TOS 39.

 

No but it'll pass DD#1 over time.

[Mark 1]

I have one for sale on e-bay no reserve at CGC 9.2. the high bid is currently $5200. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300447419946&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT#ht_500wt_1154 Terry O.

 

I certainly hope you get much more than $5,200. That book should be at least 8k...according to GPA.

 

I'm keeping my fingers crossed for ya.

 

 

The auction ended at $7250....lower than I expected.

[SAGAT]

I have one for sale on e-bay no reserve at CGC 9.2. the high bid is currently $5200. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300447419946&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT#ht_500wt_1154 Terry O.

 

I certainly hope you get much more than $5,200. That book should be at least 8k...according to GPA.

 

I'm keeping my fingers crossed for ya.

 

 

The auction ended at $7250....lower than I expected.

 

Ya I thought 10-11K at least- guess scan had something to do with ending price. Buyer should be happy.

[Raphael]

You mean the size, or lack thereof in the auction?

[SAGAT]

Scan had a line down the middle if I recall so it wasn't best pic so ending price was much lower than expected.

[showcase22gr1959]

If it had better PQ, it would have probably ended above $10K.

[Mark 1]

If it had better PQ, it would have probably ended above $10K.

 

I don't know about that. Perhaps if it had white pages...but OW or OW/W probably would have been very similar IMHO.

 

I think the lack of scans and a good scan was the culprit...but I also think eBay is the worst place to sell comics. I've yet to see a proper price on ebay for some of these key books. The almost always go lower than GPA or guide.

 

I won't sell any of my comics there. Just me...but this forum seems to be the best place to sell...fair pricing and you know what you are getting. Plus better chance for communications with between the parties.

 

 

[VintageComics]

If it had better PQ, it would have probably ended above $10K.

 

The market has plateaued a bit on the Av 4 craze, much like it did with AF #15. It went up too far, too fast. That's not to say that the book doesn't have a lot of inherent value. It's a terrific book.

 

I'm sure it will rebound.

 

PQ definitely hurt this copy. This new market we live in is very sensitive to PQ and cover appearance.

 

 

[SAGAT]

Gonna have to say AV#4 has alot of room to move up in bigger chunks than what it is now-the recession is a killer for demand right now. $4200 in 9.2 in OSPG is a joke. $10K is doing it a little justice. AV#1 should also go past the 20K barrier.

[showcase22gr1959]

If it had better PQ, it would have probably ended above $10K.

 

The market has plateaued a bit on the Av 4 craze, much like it did with AF #15. It went up too far, too fast. That's not to say that the book doesn't have a lot of inherent value. It's a terrific book.

 

I'm sure it will rebound.

 

PQ definitely hurt this copy. This new market we live in is very sensitive to PQ and cover appearance.

 

 

Yeah, great book for sure. I'm PQ sensitive...but it's just me.

[showcase22gr1959]

If it had better PQ, it would have probably ended above $10K.

 

I don't know about that. Perhaps if it had white pages...but OW or OW/W probably would have been very similar IMHO.

 

I think the lack of scans and a good scan was the culprit...but I also think eBay is the worst place to sell comics. I've yet to see a proper price on ebay for some of these key books. The almost always go lower than GPA or guide.

 

I won't sell any of my comics there. Just me...but this forum seems to be the best place to sell...fair pricing and you know what you are getting. Plus better chance for communications with between the parties.

 

 

My really high $10K price is for white pages of course. Definitely would have done a little better for OW and bit more if OW/W. (thumbs u

[bhhooks22]

It's a key, no doubt...but as Mac Man said above, it's in the second tier of keys behind the big boys of the SA:

 

 

AF#15

FF#1

Hulk#1

TOS#39

JIM#83

 

Would you rate AV#4 above other second tier keys like Daredevil #1, Strange Tales #110, TTA#27?

Below all of them. Ive always wondered why people even care about 'first SA appearance of xxxxx'

 

then we can get into argument about Flash and GL they started in Golden age. We're talkin Silver Age relevance only.

 

SC4 1st app of baryy allen, SC 22 1st app Kyle Raynor

Av 4 isnt Steve Rogers 1st app

 

uh, you mean Hal Jordan in SC 22

 

Whew! I know I don't know my SA DC all that well but I was pretty sure it was Hal.

 

And for what it's worth Brian, while I placed Avengers 4 as the top end of the second tier, and I far prefer to it JIM 83 or Avengers 1. Sorry, but machine gun toting aliens air assaulting out of the sky or the dynamic cover of A4? No contest. And then there's the splash pages! Again, no comparison for me (though the JIM splash isn't bad). Avengers 1 is ok but FF 1 gets credit for the first Marvel super group and everyone else in that book had been around so no new ground broke there.

 

I will openly admit to the fact that my sole reason for bumping it down half a step to behind the other big keys is that up until movie hype, this book was quite affordable in low grade--something the other keys did not have as a characteristic. Again, that's come from the bottom end of the collecting pool (GD and Lower). ToS 39 and JIM 83 could not be had for under $300 in GD condition but a copy of A4 could be had for under $99 without much work. Even the much-neglected Daredevil 1 can't be found for under $100 in 2.0 let alone FR/GD.

 

Mac ,

Good points , really . However , I think I'd better run down to my estate sale store find my old handy decal shirt press , toss one of my lower grade AV.'s #4 in it , smash and waffle it several times over into a medioce PR/FR for you, and presto! I've got your $99 book back. (thumbs u

[Mark 1]

If it had better PQ, it would have probably ended above $10K.

 

The market has plateaued a bit on the Av 4 craze, much like it did with AF #15. It went up too far, too fast. That's not to say that the book doesn't have a lot of inherent value. It's a terrific book.

 

I'm sure it will rebound.

 

PQ definitely hurt this copy. This new market we live in is very sensitive to PQ and cover appearance.

 

 

I also think the issue is the higher graded books...it's a market that only a select few can dabble in. If the book were a mid to high grade it might have received the true market value for that lower grade of a book...mainly because more people can afford the $1500 to $2,500 range...once you get over $3k or more...the numbers of people who can pay that much goes down.

 

I think AV4 has more chances of increasing in price in the F (6.0) to VF (8.0) ranges.

 

Just my opinion.

[bhhooks22]

My criteria is simple, its what of these four books will be easier to sell in three to five years for the most profit? Will it be Tos 39, JIM 83,Hulk 1 or Avengers 4? Hands down it will be TOS 39,According to the Disney stockbrokers Iron Man last year sold more merchandise than Spidey. So in conclusion TOS 39 is the winner and maybe someday will give AF 15 a run for its money. Iron Man is the perfect hero for the modern audience. He will adapt well while a lot of those others won`t.

 

That's a bit of a hasty conclusion... while I DO believe the Iron Man movies (and following Avengers films) will certainly solidify Iron Man as a top tier character now, I don't think it will be sufficient to move him past Spider-Man. Again, IM has had 2-3 years of being in the mainstream spotlight whereas Spidey has been swinging in pop culture's limelight for decades. It's like comparing Spider-Man to Superman...

This is a tough one that definately goes to Spidey right now but let`s look at this again after Iron Man 3. I have noticed Spidey has slipped just a little saleswise over the last year and half with this Brand New Day storyline, maybe just maybe Spidey is not the given holy three icon he was, Two years ago everybody said Batman,Superman and Spider-man, I see Spidey maybe getting passed up by either Ironman or Green Lantern in overall popularity over the next 5 years. Just a maybe now that it could happen but it probally won`t. Spidey just doesn`t seem as iconic lately as he did in 2008 for some reason.

 

Green Lantern? Really? I will gladly eat crow if Green Lantern lasts any longer than Daredevil. Ben Affleck had a "few" good movies under his belt. Ryan Reynolds? GL is benefiting strictly from movie hype here. At least IM had good actors going into the first film (RDJ, Paltrow, Bridges, Jackson, etc, etc) and continued to bring in good talent. I don't think you're going to find very many collectors who will stand behind you on this one. GL just doesn't have the chops either cinematically or in the comics.

 

P.S. This probably has to be one of the most enjoyable threads I've participated in in a LONG time. (thumbs u

I am using a combination of what I have been seeing with GL as the hottest character in silver age with Showcase 22, the buzz about the movie and something that may be the most important, Green Lantern and all his family of comics right now are the number one monthly sellers, yes the monthly GL comic outsells Batman and X-men! What really gave me the tip off as to how hot Green Lantern is go to Amazon top 10 graphic novel sellers, Green Lantern has 3 of the top ten best sellers in mainstream America, no other mainstream super hero makes the list, you don`t see Spider-man in the top 50 of the Amazon top selling list but there is Green Lantern duking it out with Diary of a Wimpy kid and Scott Pilgrim for the top spot, definately right now mainstream America in more in tune with GL then Spidey. Will it last? I have no clue,these are just my observations right now and it will not surprise me at all that Green Lantern will have the biggest box office take of big three super movies next year.( Thor,Captain America.Green Lantern).

 

Then maybe we should restrict the aurgument to "importance to us somewhat middleaged funny book nerds that found this cool site to hang out at" since we determined the vast majority here were between the ages of 35-45 some time ago. I mean really , for all we know someday our kids may be running around in Brother Voodoo speedos and tank-tops after some big movie release and Harry Potter type book run.

[ComicConnoisseur]

My criteria is simple, its what of these four books will be easier to sell in three to five years for the most profit? Will it be Tos 39, JIM 83,Hulk 1 or Avengers 4? Hands down it will be TOS 39,According to the Disney stockbrokers Iron Man last year sold more merchandise than Spidey. So in conclusion TOS 39 is the winner and maybe someday will give AF 15 a run for its money. Iron Man is the perfect hero for the modern audience. He will adapt well while a lot of those others won`t.

 

That's a bit of a hasty conclusion... while I DO believe the Iron Man movies (and following Avengers films) will certainly solidify Iron Man as a top tier character now, I don't think it will be sufficient to move him past Spider-Man. Again, IM has had 2-3 years of being in the mainstream spotlight whereas Spidey has been swinging in pop culture's limelight for decades. It's like comparing Spider-Man to Superman...

This is a tough one that definately goes to Spidey right now but let`s look at this again after Iron Man 3. I have noticed Spidey has slipped just a little saleswise over the last year and half with this Brand New Day storyline, maybe just maybe Spidey is not the given holy three icon he was, Two years ago everybody said Batman,Superman and Spider-man, I see Spidey maybe getting passed up by either Ironman or Green Lantern in overall popularity over the next 5 years. Just a maybe now that it could happen but it probally won`t. Spidey just doesn`t seem as iconic lately as he did in 2008 for some reason.

 

Green Lantern? Really? I will gladly eat crow if Green Lantern lasts any longer than Daredevil. Ben Affleck had a "few" good movies under his belt. Ryan Reynolds? GL is benefiting strictly from movie hype here. At least IM had good actors going into the first film (RDJ, Paltrow, Bridges, Jackson, etc, etc) and continued to bring in good talent. I don't think you're going to find very many collectors who will stand behind you on this one. GL just doesn't have the chops either cinematically or in the comics.

 

P.S. This probably has to be one of the most enjoyable threads I've participated in in a LONG time. (thumbs u

I am using a combination of what I have been seeing with GL as the hottest character in silver age with Showcase 22, the buzz about the movie and something that may be the most important, Green Lantern and all his family of comics right now are the number one monthly sellers, yes the monthly GL comic outsells Batman and X-men! What really gave me the tip off as to how hot Green Lantern is go to Amazon top 10 graphic novel sellers, Green Lantern has 3 of the top ten best sellers in mainstream America, no other mainstream super hero makes the list, you don`t see Spider-man in the top 50 of the Amazon top selling list but there is Green Lantern duking it out with Diary of a Wimpy kid and Scott Pilgrim for the top spot, definately right now mainstream America in more in tune with GL then Spidey. Will it last? I have no clue,these are just my observations right now and it will not surprise me at all that Green Lantern will have the biggest box office take of big three super movies next year.( Thor,Captain America.Green Lantern).

 

Then maybe we should restrict the aurgument to "importance to us somewhat middleaged funny book nerds that found this cool site to hang out at" since we determined the vast majority here were between the ages of 35-45 some time ago. I mean really , for all we know someday our kids may be running around in Brother Voodoo speedos and tank-tops after some big movie release and Harry Potter type book run.

even that specific aged market has turned to videogames but if you stay with the silver age keys(the benchmark) you should do good. (thumbs u

[Mac Man]

My criteria is simple, its what of these four books will be easier to sell in three to five years for the most profit? Will it be Tos 39, JIM 83,Hulk 1 or Avengers 4? Hands down it will be TOS 39,According to the Disney stockbrokers Iron Man last year sold more merchandise than Spidey. So in conclusion TOS 39 is the winner and maybe someday will give AF 15 a run for its money. Iron Man is the perfect hero for the modern audience. He will adapt well while a lot of those others won`t.

 

That's a bit of a hasty conclusion... while I DO believe the Iron Man movies (and following Avengers films) will certainly solidify Iron Man as a top tier character now, I don't think it will be sufficient to move him past Spider-Man. Again, IM has had 2-3 years of being in the mainstream spotlight whereas Spidey has been swinging in pop culture's limelight for decades. It's like comparing Spider-Man to Superman...

This is a tough one that definately goes to Spidey right now but let`s look at this again after Iron Man 3. I have noticed Spidey has slipped just a little saleswise over the last year and half with this Brand New Day storyline, maybe just maybe Spidey is not the given holy three icon he was, Two years ago everybody said Batman,Superman and Spider-man, I see Spidey maybe getting passed up by either Ironman or Green Lantern in overall popularity over the next 5 years. Just a maybe now that it could happen but it probally won`t. Spidey just doesn`t seem as iconic lately as he did in 2008 for some reason.

 

Green Lantern? Really? I will gladly eat crow if Green Lantern lasts any longer than Daredevil. Ben Affleck had a "few" good movies under his belt. Ryan Reynolds? GL is benefiting strictly from movie hype here. At least IM had good actors going into the first film (RDJ, Paltrow, Bridges, Jackson, etc, etc) and continued to bring in good talent. I don't think you're going to find very many collectors who will stand behind you on this one. GL just doesn't have the chops either cinematically or in the comics.

 

P.S. This probably has to be one of the most enjoyable threads I've participated in in a LONG time. (thumbs u

I am using a combination of what I have been seeing with GL as the hottest character in silver age with Showcase 22, the buzz about the movie and something that may be the most important, Green Lantern and all his family of comics right now are the number one monthly sellers, yes the monthly GL comic outsells Batman and X-men! What really gave me the tip off as to how hot Green Lantern is go to Amazon top 10 graphic novel sellers, Green Lantern has 3 of the top ten best sellers in mainstream America, no other mainstream super hero makes the list, you don`t see Spider-man in the top 50 of the Amazon top selling list but there is Green Lantern duking it out with Diary of a Wimpy kid and Scott Pilgrim for the top spot, definately right now mainstream America in more in tune with GL then Spidey. Will it last? I have no clue,these are just my observations right now and it will not surprise me at all that Green Lantern will have the biggest box office take of big three super movies next year.( Thor,Captain America.Green Lantern).

 

Then maybe we should restrict the aurgument to "importance to us somewhat middleaged funny book nerds that found this cool site to hang out at" since we determined the vast majority here were between the ages of 35-45 some time ago. I mean really , for all we know someday our kids may be running around in Brother Voodoo speedos and tank-tops after some big movie release and Harry Potter type book run.

 

Well... unfortunately, I don't fit into your old man bracket

 

And no waffling nice copies of Avengers #4 for my sake!

[maloney414]

In my opinion AF #15, FF #1 and Hulk #1 are the big SA Marvel books.

 

ToS #39 and JIM #83 are only up due to movie hype.

 

Yes, Avengers #4 is a much better book than Avengers #1.

 

Avengers #1 isn't the 1st appearance of anyone.

 

While Avengers #4 isn't the 1st appearance of Steve Rogers it is THE Captain America story. The story of Bucky's "death" and Cap getting frozen in ice is never going away and will always be a cool book new readers will hunt down.

 

Plus, the cover of the book is an iconic Kirby cover. If that was the cover to Avengers #1 and Cap came back in #1...

[Raphael]

If Avengers #4 was really Avengers #1, that would have been something! Maybe in some alternate reality.

[RockMyAmadeus]

Yeah, but it was March of 64, so still not terribly long after the whole shabang.

 

And FWIW, my upgrade copy came in today!

 

And it came OUT in 1963.

 

(thumbs u