Copper's Heating/Selling Well on Ebay 33 33

[RockMyAmadeus]

I've said it once, I'll say it again, print runs are overrated as long as the demand is there, Don't believe me? ASM 300, NM98, Hulk 181, GS X-Men 1, BA 12. No matter how many of them there are, people will continue to hunt for big 1st appearances, X-Factor 6 is showing no signs of slowing down. For a book that is "common" they certainly aren't readily available on the cheap.

 

None of the books you mentioned had anything other than average print runs. That's why they are so expensive, while Spiderman #1, for example, is not.

 

X-Force #2 had an average print run for its time period as well........

 

 

X-Force #2 didn't have an average print run at all. It was the 4th highest selling book of all of 1991, after X-Men #1, X-Force #1, and Robin II: The Joker's Wild #1. But you knew that.

 

I think his point was that despite ample supply books will still run up in value. I have to agree with that.

 

I understand his point, and it's still inaccurate. The books he cited all had print runs in the 200-400k range...not the million+ range (and for BA #12, even lower...the Cap City orders for that book were 19,200! )

 

Add to that, the fact that most of them were ignored for years, sometimes decades, after they came out, and attrition took its toll. The OPG for GSXM #1 in 1978? $1.80.

 

That is why they have value. Hulk #181 may appear to be ubiquitous, but it's not any more common than any other book of its era, and certainly LESS common than, say, the average Amazing Spiderman from the same period. I know that may not make sense intuitively, because we see Hulk #181 everywhere...but that's only because the demand is crazy.

 

 

While I agree with nearly everything you've written here, one small quibble - GSXM 1 was selling for much more than that in 1978 routinely at conventions. It popped in the summer. Although by "much more" I mean about $15.

 

Yeah, as I said to Logan later on (and in other threads) that summer was when it really started to catch on. Still, $15 was pretty impressive at a time when new books were 35 cents.

 

But how to explain the OPG prices all the way up to 1980?

 

That I don't know - the end of the 1970s didn't show a whole lot of jumping in prices, which is surprising in hindsight, given both inflation and the huge jump in 1980-81. I can tell you that I made a lot of money as a high school student flipping X-Men books at shows in the Chicago area.

 

When John Byrne was a superstar the likes of which comics had never seen....and probably never would again. McFarlane shows up, and lines are around the block? Byrne could fill an entire convention center.

 

I don't know that it's possible to overstate how big John Byrne and the X-Men were from 1980-1984.

[FlyingDonut]

We used to joke that the big collectible would be X-Men books NOT signed by Byrne.

[slym2none]

Everyone here is forgetting the MVS factor for Hulk 181 - there are a ton of incomplete issues out there, add this and the print run doesn't matter. High grade numbers are less common then any copper issues, and the only relate-able issue would be Amazing Spider-man 238 with tattoos removed.

 

Wolverine's first full appearance is non comparable to Legends 3, Spider-man 300 and 361 not even close.

 

Just my 2cents

 

Wolverine's 1st appearance is IH#180...

 

 

 

-slym

[thehumantorch]

Everyone here is forgetting the MVS factor for Hulk 181 - there are a ton of incomplete issues out there, add this and the print run doesn't matter. High grade numbers are less common then any copper issues, and the only relate-able issue would be Amazing Spider-man 238 with tattoos removed.

 

Wolverine's first full appearance is non comparable to Legends 3, Spider-man 300 and 361 not even close.

 

Just my 2cents

 

Wolverine's 1st appearance is IH#180...

 

 

 

-slym

 

spoon Now you've done it

[RockMyAmadeus]

Everyone here is forgetting the MVS factor for Hulk 181 - there are a ton of incomplete issues out there, add this and the print run doesn't matter. High grade numbers are less common then any copper issues, and the only relate-able issue would be Amazing Spider-man 238 with tattoos removed.

 

Wolverine's first full appearance is non comparable to Legends 3, Spider-man 300 and 361 not even close.

 

Just my 2cents

 

I think it's safe to say that no one's forgotten the MVS factor. It certainly does play an interesting role in the issue.

 

However...the discussion was about something being "common", and the examples were Hulk #181, GSXM #1, Spidey #300, BA #12, and NM #98.

 

So the responses were tailored to that criteria.

 

Print runs always matter, because that is the starting point from which any discussion of supply must begin. Even the print run of Action #1...200,000...is discussed, even though perhaps less than 1/10th of 1% of that print run still exists.

 

Everything is comparable in one way or another. It's all relative.

[slym2none]

Everyone here is forgetting the MVS factor for Hulk 181 - there are a ton of incomplete issues out there, add this and the print run doesn't matter. High grade numbers are less common then any copper issues, and the only relate-able issue would be Amazing Spider-man 238 with tattoos removed.

 

Wolverine's first full appearance is non comparable to Legends 3, Spider-man 300 and 361 not even close.

 

Just my 2cents

 

Wolverine's 1st appearance is IH#180...

 

spoon Now you've done it

 

 

 

 

-slym

[thecopperagekids]

Doctor Strange : Into Shambala is selling pretty damn briskly.

 

For those who don't know, this book has been said to serve as the storyline for the upcoming Doctor Strange movie....

 

Here's what looks to be nothing better than a FN 6.0 , which moved at $100 on eBay.

 

I think getting this copy in genuine high grade ,unlike the

"unread high grade" condition touted by the eBay seller below, will yield a very nice return.Hell, even a mid grade copy moved at a hundred.

 

Regarding the difficulty in high grade, I say this because it is a oversized graphic novel with a thick card stock black cover.These sorts of covers are tough in grade due to marring/light abrasion/color loss of the black cardstock cover and corner denting, which is more common in oversized graphic novels than comics.

 

 

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Doctor-Strange-Into-Shamballa-Marvel-1986-Green-DeMatties-Dr-Strange-/201247047017?pt=US_Comic_Books&hash=item2edb423d69&nma=true&si=1gSiHZ4orxO0VwePSO0mFHEweHY%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

 

 

Edited December 29, 2014 by CopperAgeKids

[Lazyboy]

Doctor Strange : Into Shambala is selling pretty damn briskly.

An average of two sales per week (on eBay) over the past two months? You might want to get a new dictionary.

 

Oh, and people are dumb. At least the people who've been sitting on unmovable MGN for the last three decades are happy.

[500Club]

 

Amazing #350 - 75,600

#351 - not reported

#352 - 65,400

#353 - 79,200

#354 - 76,800

#355 - 78,300

#356 - 79,500

#357 - 76,500

#358 - 98,400

#359 - 60,600

#360 - 57,300

#361 - 68,700

#362 - 76,800

#363 - 102,600

#364 - 72,000

#365 - 221,700

#366 - 89,100

#367 - 77,700

#368 - 71,700

#369 - 71,100

#370 - 67,000

#371 - 66,400

 

 

#361 did NOT have a "huge print run", and the published numbers very clearly prove that to be true.

Thank you for using facts to dispel what is a commonly stated idea. (thumbs u

[Jimmy Linguini]

Doctor Strange : Into Shambala is selling pretty damn briskly.

An average of two sales per week (on eBay) over the past two months? You might want to get a new dictionary.

 

Oh, and people are dumb. At least the people who've been sitting on unmovable MGN for the last three decades are happy.

 

I put one on ebay that I had purchased for $10 and it sold within three hours on a Buy it now at $69.99. - there havn't been a lot of copies made available for sale on ebay.

[RockMyAmadeus]

 

Amazing #350 - 75,600

#351 - not reported

#352 - 65,400

#353 - 79,200

#354 - 76,800

#355 - 78,300

#356 - 79,500

#357 - 76,500

#358 - 98,400

#359 - 60,600

#360 - 57,300

#361 - 68,700

#362 - 76,800

#363 - 102,600

#364 - 72,000

#365 - 221,700

#366 - 89,100

#367 - 77,700

#368 - 71,700

#369 - 71,100

#370 - 67,000

#371 - 66,400

 

 

#361 did NOT have a "huge print run", and the published numbers very clearly prove that to be true.

Thank you for using facts to dispel what is a commonly stated idea. (thumbs u

 

I've been saying this forever, but apparently no one was paying attention, even with an immediate second printing starting them in the face. If it had a "huge print run", a second printing wouldn't have been necessary.

 

I'd sure like to know where this "ASM #361 had a huge print run" myth really came from.

 

[Lazyboy]

How many newsstand copies were printed? If it's hot enough to get an immediate second printing, it's hot enough for newsstands to have very high sell-through.

[Petey's Wheatcake]

#361 did NOT have a "huge print run", and the published numbers very clearly prove that to be true.

Thank you for using facts to dispel what is a commonly stated idea. (thumbs u

 

I've been saying this forever, but apparently no one was paying attention, even with an immediate second printing starting them in the face. If it had a "huge print run", a second printing wouldn't have been necessary.

 

I'd sure like to know where this "ASM #361 had a huge print run" myth really came from.

 

 

Yes, let's use facts to see who keeps using the words "huge print run" in reference to Amazing Spider-Man #361. This is what I wrote:

 

Because if that print run doesn't change things, then it certainly won't in regard to Legends #3.

 

And I do draw a comparison between Legends#3 and ASM #361 earlier in the thread also:

 

I still think that Amazing Spider-Man #361 is an excellent example. Plenty of copies, but demand has driven movement on the price. To be honest, maybe Legends #3 is an even better example. Time will tell.

 

So I clearly believe that ASM #361 had "plenty of copies" printed, but I seem unsure as to whether or not the print run was greater than Legends #3. Hmmm. In the context of what I was writing, Legends #3 seemed to be "an even better example" mostly due to the possibility of an increase in demand attributable to a movie bump, not because of it's print run. And in the first quote, I do seem to be inferring that #361 had the higher print run because of the way in which I use the words "if that" followed later on by "then". In conclusion, it would appear I thought that they had relatively comparable print runs, but ASM #361 had the edge.

 

Hey, guess what? I'm right here, so I just asked myself, and it turns out this hypothesis is indeed correct. However, at no point did I use the words "huge print run". Not once.

 

What's weird though, is how you wrote "huge print run" three times, and "large print run" once. Huh.

 

By the way, did you ever dig up hard, factual numbers on which issue actually had the higher print run? I recall that the evidence seemed to imply that the final estimate was probably similar for both issues, but ASM #361 had the edge(strangely similar to what my fuzzy Lieberesque memory guesstimated).

 

Maybe this is another silly fallacy of mine though.

 

Either way, the facts seem to indicate that your statement should now be changed to "I'd sure like to know where this 'ASM #361 had plenty of copies' myth really came from."

 

Honestly, we could go back and forth dissecting the minutiae of every statement we both make, and we could both keep cheating by misquoting or selectively quoting each other's posts again and again, but I'd rather not. I'm not trying to win. Let's discuss "Copper's Heating/Selling Well on Ebay" instead.

 

"You can see from my previous posts that even if both issues sold 500,000 copies it would not alter my assertion that the demand will be greater than the supply" is a direct quote of mine. The exact print run of ASM #361 was always a tangential discussion as far as I was concerned; my main assertion is that Kevin76 and CopperAgeKids made some good points, and that popularity is usually more important than scarcity in terms of comic book investing. That's basically all I'm trying to get across at this point. Some very knowledgeable comic book enthusiasts disagree with that last statement, and I love a good discussion, but it feels like we've drifted way off course in this instance.

 

Edited December 29, 2014 by Petey's Wheatcake

[MK Ultra]

Hey at least you're at 100 posts now right? Are you the guy on that TV commercial that gets excited when their selfie gets 100 likes?

[fastballspecial]

I just want to see if which one wears down first this time.

 

 

[fastballspecial]

Asm 300 Chrome seems to have stayed the same while the regular higher print run asm 300 has skyrocketed as of recent. Weird.

 

There is no ASM 300 chromium. It's called Marvel Collectible Classics Amazing Spider-Man #1

 

and wasn't that for the longest time, worth more than a regular ASM 300?

 

I just think its weird that there has been no price correction for the ASM "chrome 300" - its pretty much stayed the same while the larger print, first print has been skyrocketing.

 

Case of price manipulation? Case of speculating on a book with the premise of rarity, with the print run being in the hands of a select few?

 

Who knows.

 

Perhaps people would rather put their cash into ASM 300, instead of a reprint with an albeit cool cover?

 

I could go with the premise of rarity. I never see that book at conventions and I have only ever had one copy over the years. I sold mine NM copy for $100 like 6 or 7 years ago on here and it has increase somewhat in price since then. I think collectors just like the book as well.

 

[ygogolak]

The inside "publishing date" says April 1995 but it was definitely published before then since it's for April solicitations so who knows

 

So here is Sandman #67:

Cover date Feb '95

Indica says March '95

Rear has solicitations for Jan '95, so I would suspect that's when it actually came out.

It also has an ad. for Absolute Vertigo which we know had a Preacher preview but it came out after the actual Preacher Preview.

 

[MrWeen]

I think we gravely underestimate the destruction of many of these comics. I personally had a comic book bonfire party and we lit case after case of Ex-Mutants #1. I estimate I reduced the available print run of that awful comic by 20,000.

 

And this increased demand for this awful comic not one tiny bit.

 

That's cause Harley Quinn isn't in it.

[MrWeen]

Everyone here is forgetting the MVS factor for Hulk 181 - there are a ton of incomplete issues out there, add this and the print run doesn't matter. High grade numbers are less common then any copper issues, and the only relate-able issue would be Amazing Spider-man 238 with tattoos removed.

 

Wolverine's first full appearance is non comparable to Legends 3, Spider-man 300 and 361 not even close.

 

Just my 2cents

 

Wolverine's 1st appearance is IH#180Foom 2...

 

 

 

-slym

 

Fixed.

[500Club]

How many newsstand copies were printed? If it's hot enough to get an immediate second printing, it's hot enough for newsstands to have very high sell-through.

Now THAT is a very good point.

 

It is very likely more newsstand copies of 361 (and 362, 363) got swept off the racks than surrounding issues of ASM. Thus, the actual supply may be skewed away from print run data somewhat.