THE AMAZING FANTASY #15 CLUB 39 39

[yanksarod22]

People may be hoping for a pullback or definitely feel they know the market my personal feeling is it’s just going to keep going up as far as non chipped copies are concerned.....look at the 52 topps mantle still setting records and most think baseball cards are dead  they are very much alive

Edited October 24, 2017 by yanksarod22

[yanksarod22]

Time will tell boys but I’m betting on comics for the next decade

[yanksarod22]

I’m also A big believer that once repatriation hits comic books go up even more because there’s gonna be more money out there for people to spend

[exitmusicblue]

3 hours ago, delekkerste said:

It is true that there are a lot more Spidey fans now than 20 years ago, but, you and others keep conflating fans of the movies & merchandising with fans of the comics.  None of those new fans who only get their Spidey fix from movies and merchandising is a potential AF #15 buyer.  Yes, the greater sized fan base may embolden existing comic collectors (or maybe even lapsed comic collectors re-entering the fold) to stretch and buy an AF #15 (which is exactly what has been happening over the past 15 years), but, this cohort is not growing meaningfully and has, on balance, aged considerably since the first Spidey movie was released in 2002.  

Just wishing something to be true does not make it true.  

None of the new fans are potential AF15 buyers?  Including the ones who watch while young and grow up and get rich?  Who made you Professor X?

The X-Men cartoon was a huge influence for my comic collecting self.  I’m positive I’m not alone.

[Kevin76]

Greg is right, and I've said it in the past, This is more of a long term game, Instead of people saying "I grew up reading Spider-man, Batman ect...People will be saying  "I grew up watching those movies"  The way prices have been going, it almost doesn't matter if it's a 1.5 or a 3.0..people still want them. Start buying those mega keys even in low grades and hang onto them for as long as you can.  

[exitmusicblue]

Plus, in our advanced age, peeps often don’t realize how formative the best superhero flicks and shows can be for youths.  To us wizened souls it can feel like we’ve seen it all, but put yourself in a kid’s shoes, watch through a child’s eyes.  The good stuff becomes a part of one’s childhood.

[peewee22]

2 hours ago, gregreece said:

Thought I'd weigh in as a dealer. We have many, many 25-50 year olds buying 4 and 5 figure comics who never read them as kids. And we have many 24-30 year olds buying all kinds of Golden Age. The market has grown exponentially in the last 20 years. Interestingly, there are a larger % than you might think who got in as a result of the movies. And they are not all motivated by future profit potential. They simply have the disposable income and enjoy being around the hobby. Couple that with long time collectors and you have tremendous demand for limited supply. I'll state the obvious: comics were not manufactured collectibles (beanie babies, etc). What's out there is out there. I think we will see an ever widening gap between the blue chips and everything else. There will be break out books of course, but an Action Comics #1, Detective Comics #27, Amazing Fantasy #15 etc. have transcended comicdom and are trophies for the wealthy whether they've read a comic or not in many cases. Will their be corrections in price going forward? Likely. But if I were a betting man I'd bet on the blue chips 15-20 years out. I've enjoyed following the thread. Best, Greg

Good info Greg. Thanks for sharing.

Great news for the AF15 lovers, bad news for the non believers. 

[peewee22]

2 minutes ago, exitmusicblue said:

Plus, in our advanced age, peeps often don’t realize how formative the best superhero flicks and shows can be for youths.  To us wizened souls it can feel like we’ve seen it all, but put yourself in a kid’s shoes, watch through a child’s eyes.  The good stuff becomes a part of one’s childhood.

Look around in the theatres when you go to a superhero flick. All ages. I saw some elderly women together in the Homecoming movie. And they weren't there for the popcorn.

[delekkerste]

3 minutes ago, exitmusicblue said:

None of the new fans are potential AF15 buyers?  Including the ones who watch while young and grow up and get rich?  Who made you Professor X?

The X-Men cartoon was a huge influence for my comic collecting self.  I’m positive I’m not alone.

They grow up and get rich and...so what?  They decide they need an AF #15?    

Seriously, what planet are you guys living on...Planet Comics (not to be confused with the Golden Age title of the same name), apparently.  In the real world, the people who get rich and buy comics are the ones who were comic book readers/fans before they got rich.  Not movie fans.  Not videogame players.  Not guys who just wore Spider-Man t-shirts.

How many people with no interest in comic collecting saw the X-Men cartoon and became comic collectors and eventually decided they needed to buy an X-Men #1 and then AF #15?  Empirically, comics are the gateway to buying more expensive comics.  Not movies, TV, videogames or merchandising.  They may have an influence, but, unless you're already into comics themselves, you don't get rich and then decide you need to go back and buy an AF #15.  You don't need to be Professor X to realize that; you just need a bit of common sense.  

[ComicConnoisseur]

2 minutes ago, exitmusicblue said:

Plus, in our advanced age, peeps often don’t realize how formative the best superhero flicks and shows can be for youths.  To us wizened souls it can feel like we’ve seen it all, but put yourself in a kid’s shoes, watch through a child’s eyes.  The good stuff becomes a part of one’s childhood.

My son loved Spider-Man Homecoming. He thought it was cool. 

[peewee22]

Just now, delekkerste said:

They grow up and get rich and...so what?  They decide they need an AF #15?    

Seriously, what planet are you guys living on...Planet Comics (not to be confused with the Golden Age title of the same name), apparently.  In the real world, the people who get rich and buy comics are the ones who were comic book readers/fans before they got rich.  Not movie fans.  Not videogame players.  Not guys who just wore Spider-Man t-shirts.

How many people with no interest in comic collecting saw the X-Men cartoon and became comic collectors and eventually decided they needed to buy an X-Men #1 and then AF #15?  Empirically, comics are the gateway to buying more expensive comics.  Not movies, TV, videogames or merchandising.  They may have an influence, but, unless you're already into comics themselves, you don't get rich and then decide you need to go back and buy an AF #15.  You don't need to be Professor X to realize that; you just need a bit of common sense.  

Did you read the gregreece post?

[ComicConnoisseur]

10 minutes ago, exitmusicblue said:

None of the new fans are potential AF15 buyers?  Including the ones who watch while young and grow up and get rich?  Who made you Professor X?

The X-Men cartoon was a huge influence for my comic collecting self.  I’m positive I’m not alone.

That cartoon got me into X-Men more than any X-Men comic. Just like The Batman Animated Series got me into Batman more than any Batman comic ever did. 

[exitmusicblue]

3 minutes ago, delekkerste said:

They grow up and get rich and...so what?  They decide they need an AF #15?    

Seriously, what planet are you guys living on...Planet Comics (not to be confused with the Golden Age title of the same name), apparently.  In the real world, the people who get rich and buy comics are the ones who were comic book readers/fans before they got rich.  Not movie fans.  Not videogame players.  Not guys who just wore Spider-Man t-shirts.

How many people with no interest in comic collecting saw the X-Men cartoon and became comic collectors and eventually decided they needed to buy an X-Men #1 and then AF #15?  Empirically, comics are the gateway to buying more expensive comics.  Not movies, TV, videogames or merchandising.  They may have an influence, but, unless you're already into comics themselves, you don't get rich and then decide you need to go back and buy an AF #15.  You don't need to be Professor X to realize that; you just need a bit of common sense.  

Yep, you got it.  Comics are not the sole gateway they used to be, bub (as Wolvie might say).  B-)

For another example, look at the anime fandom out there.  Crazy.

[delekkerste]

2 hours ago, ComicConnoisseur said:

Also baseball is not dead. It continues to break attendance records and is talked about daily on social media.

CC, you know I love ya, bro, but this is yet another example of your worldview being completely unsupported by the facts.  Baseball attendance is down in 2017, and 2016 was already like the 11th highest in history, as attendance has been edging downward, while the average age of viewers keeps rising. 

Baseball, like comics, has a long-term demographic problem.  Hear me now and believe me later - this is going to be a trainwreck eventually for both. 

[delekkerste]

3 minutes ago, ComicConnoisseur said:

That cartoon got me into X-Men more than any X-Men comic. Just like The Batman Animated Series got me into Batman more than any Batman comic ever did. 

Sure, but, to be influenced more by the shows, you would have already had to be into comics.  NEXT! 

[exitmusicblue]

9 minutes ago, delekkerste said:

Sure, but, to be influenced more by the shows, you would have already had to be into comics.  NEXT! 

Incorrect.

Relatedly, you haven’t answered on anime fandom.  The cost of some of that merchandise...

[delekkerste]

5 minutes ago, peewee22 said:

Did you read the gregreece post?

You mean the one where he says that a correction is "likely"?  

Yeah, I read it.  First, the plural of anecdote is not evidence, and no one said there are no interested younger collectors.  Second, he says 25-50 year olds are buying up 4 and 5 figure books.  Most 25 year olds don't have a pot to pizz in, so that probably means more 35-50 year olds.  Seriously, people, wake up and do the math.  Demographically, the numbers do not, cannot, will not ever balance once you go out far enough and the Gen Xers no longer dominate the hobby.  Every single book out there owned by a Gen Xer is very likely to change hands at least once (and probably more) in the next 30 years.  Most Gen Xers couldn't even afford to buy back their own collections at current market prices, and you're telling me that the younger generations (with less exposure to comics and less financial resources and job prospects) are going to be able to absorb all this turnover at ever-escalating market values?  It doesn't even begin to be plausible.

Best case scenario I see is that we get a big cyclical correction at some point in the next 2-3 years, and then things stay relatively elevated for the remaining years of Gen X dominance (say, another 10-15 years), before we see a secular downturn in this hobby.  That said, I wouldn't necessarily bank on the best case scenario. 

 

[Sweet Lou 14]

9 minutes ago, delekkerste said:

CC, you know I love ya, bro, but this is yet another example of your worldview being completely unsupported by the facts.  Baseball attendance is down in 2017, and 2016 was already like the 11th highest in history, as attendance has been edging downward, while the average age of viewers keeps rising. 

Baseball, like comics, has a long-term demographic problem.  Hear me now and believe me later - this is going to be a trainwreck eventually for both. 

A lot of crapping all over baseball in this comic book thread.

Baseball has been declared dead many, many times and it keeps chugging along.  It competes with a million other ways for people to get their entertainment, to be sure.  And like all sports it's so easy and convenient to watch at home that ballpark attendance will naturally suffer -- that alone is not the true indicator of the sport's popularity.  Unlike the NFL, it doesn't have a massive concussion / injury problem that has moms refusing to allow their kids to play the sport.  Unlike the NBA, it doesn't have a massive competitive balance problem where players collude to form unbeatable super-teams, leaving most teams and fans with no chance of winning.

Let's stop beating up on baseball and stick to comics.

[delekkerste]

Just now, exitmusicblue said:

Incorrect.

Relatedly, you haven’t answered on anime fandom.  The cost of some of that merchandise...

No, correct.  He says he was more influenced by the shows than the comics to get deeper into the characters.  But, that implies he had the comics already as a basis of comparison.  

Don't care about anime fandom and am not going to waste any time on that. 

[exitmusicblue]

2 minutes ago, delekkerste said:

No, correct.  He says he was more influenced by the shows than the comics to get deeper into the characters.  But, that implies he had the comics already as a basis of comparison.  

Don't care about anime fandom and am not going to waste any time on that. 

Enjoy debating in your silo of one, then...