Warlock First Appearance - Marvel Premiere 1

[Lonzilla]

 

It's like saying JIM 83 was only a cameo for Thor's hammer because it didn't spell out its origin, all of its powers, spelled the name wrong, etc. Same with Hulk 181 - it didn't tell us anything about the actual Wolverine character, and Claremont provided all that in X-Men. Same with Punisher - we knew next to nothing about him for years after ASM 129.

Marvel Super Action #1 1975, origin of The Punisher, was only a year after ASM 129.

 

Adam's 3 evolutionary steps would be

Thor - 1st full Him

MP 1 - 1st Warlock

Strange Tales 178 - 1st Starlin

[shadroch]

Punishers first app.- Spidey 129

2nd app- last page of Spidey 134, full story 135.

Origin was in Super Action, which was no later than two years after 129, perhaps sooner.

 

I have not read the earlier Warlock series in years, but I don't remember his Soul Gem behaving anything like it did in the Starlin series.

[Crimebuster]

Punishers first app.- Spidey 129

2nd app- last page of Spidey 134, full story 135.

Origin was in Super Action, which was no later than two years after 129, perhaps sooner.

 

I have not read the earlier Warlock series in years, but I don't remember his Soul Gem behaving anything like it did in the Starlin series.

 

I don't think it did, though I haven't read the original series myself in probably 20 years at least.

 

Here's an examination of the slow development of the Soul Gem and the other Infinity Gems:

 

http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/2013/11/19/when-we-first-met-the-infinity-stones/

 

 

[joe_collector]

Marvel Super Action #1 1975, origin of The Punisher, was only a year after ASM 129.

 

I didn't think that was the real/full origin (wasn't it retconned and shown in PPSM?), and to those with time learning disabilities, it was 1 month shy of 2 years (feb 1974 to Jan 1976).

[joe_collector]

Here's an examination of the slow development of the Soul Gem and the other Infinity Gems:

 

http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/2013/11/19/when-we-first-met-the-infinity-stones/

 

That's interesting, and I didn't know about the Captain Marvel story, with the "fat soul gem".

[boomtown]

Punishers first app.- Spidey 129

2nd app- last page of Spidey 134, full story 135.

Origin was in Super Action, which was no later than two years after 129, perhaps sooner.

 

I have not read the earlier Warlock series in years, but I don't remember his Soul Gem behaving anything like it did in the Starlin series.

 

I don't think it did, though I haven't read the original series myself in probably 20 years at least.

 

Here's an examination of the slow development of the Soul Gem and the other Infinity Gems:

 

http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/2013/11/19/when-we-first-met-the-infinity-stones/

 

 

That's a great link!

 

Remember most of it, but had no idea that the 6 gems were first mentioned in Captain Marvel #45, long after Starlin had left the book. Wonder if Starlin had mentioned to Englehart his plans for the gems, or whether Englehart came up with it & Starlin ran with it later.

[joe_collector]

Wonder if Starlin had mentioned to Englehart his plans for the gems, or whether Englehart came up with it & Starlin ran with it later.

 

Probably a combination of both, as back then, Marvel writers would get together, talk, drink, smoke, etc. and trade ideas back and forth.

 

The Starlin sequence in Warlock sounds a lot more like the "origin" of the multiple soul gems, while CM seems more like a reference to it.

[Prince Namor]

ASM 129 - February 1974

ASM 134-135 - July/August 1974

Giant Size Spider-man 4 - April 1975

Marvel Super Action #1 - January of 1976

 

Four appearances in just under two years.

[joe_collector]

Four appearances in just under two years.

 

And that was a record for a villain/co-star back in the 70's, where they would go years between appearances. And each time, the ASM letter's page would explode in fanboy love for the Punisher.

[joe_collector]

Okay, so if Marvel Premiere is *not* the first appearance of Warlock, then why is Strange Tales 178 noted as the "1st app. of Magus"?

 

Magus is Warlock with an afro - he has the same costume, wears a soul gem, etc. and is a direct link to the Warlock of MP 1, rather than the Speedo-wearing, caveman template of Him.

[whetteon]

Okay, so if Marvel Premiere is *not* the first appearance of Warlock, then why is Strange Tales 178 noted as the "1st app. of Magus"?

 

Magus is Warlock with an afro - he has the same costume, wears a soul gem, etc. and is a direct link to the Warlock of MP 1, rather than the Speedo-wearing, caveman template of Him.

 

I think you just jumped the shark.

[joe_collector]

Who cares, I' just like to see some consistency for once.

 

Him: Speedo-wearing Caveman

 

Warlock: Costumed super-hero with a new costume, new world, new powers, new name, new personalty, and new soul gem.

 

Magus: Warlock with an Afro

 

How the heck can Magus warrant a full "first appearance" but Warlock does not?

[Lonzilla]

Same reason that the 1st Marvel Girl, 1st Phoenix and 1st Dark Phoenix are different.

[joe_collector]

Same reason that the 1st Marvel Girl, 1st Phoenix and 1st Dark Phoenix are different.

 

Huh? Are you with me, or against me?

 

Marvel Premiere 1 says "Origin Warlock"

Strange Tales 178 says "1st Appearance Magus"

 

[AGGIEZ]

Who cares, I' just like to see some consistency for once.

 

Him: Speedo-wearing Caveman

 

Warlock: Costumed super-hero with a new costume, new world, new powers, new name, new personalty, and new soul gem.

 

Magus: Warlock with an Afro

 

How the heck can Magus warrant a full "first appearance" but Warlock does not?

 

I think, when I boil it all down for me, this is what it comes down to...I want some consistency. How can we say that the 1st appearance of Ant-Man is a dorky scientist in some pre-hero afterthought book but Marvel Premiere #1 is the first appearance of Warlock...or vice versa. No consistency....the market seems to like the first 'full' appearance of Him the best here:

 

90-day CGC Average

 

Thor #165 - 9.0=$468, 9.4=$1,050

Fantastic Four #67 - 9.0=$310, 9.4=$850

Marvel Premiere #1 - 9.0=$75, 9.4=$320

[___]

For me the two keys are still FF#67 and MP#1. Am I one of the only ones here who has read MP1? Look how it even references FF66-67 but only mentions thor fight and says its his SECOND Trip to earth as HIM.

 

MP#1 has first counter-earth and first soul gem all key to Warlocks development.

[Hiro]

ASM 129 - February 1974

ASM 134-135 - July/August 1974

Giant Size Spider-man 4 - April 1975

Marvel Super Action #1 - January of 1976

 

Four appearances in just under two years.

 

ASM 129 - February 1974

ASM 134 - July 1974

ASM 135 - August 1974

Giant Size Spider-man 4 - April 1975

Marvel Preview #2 - August 1975

Marvel Super Action #1 - January 1976

 

Six appearances in just under two years.

 

No disrespect meant and not trying to derail the original discussion, but

had to fix that. Now back to the originally scheduled discussion..................Warlock!

[joe_collector]

[the market seems to like the first 'full' appearance of Him the best here

 

You keep posting that Luthor, without understanding the very basic fact that one is a SILVER AGE book and the other is a BRONZE AGE book. In the face of even equivalent-level books, the SILVER AGE book, being older and subject to greater attrition, is worth LESS than the BRONZE AGE book.

 

I know even you can't be this lame.

 

What's next on your agenda, trying to prove that Wolverine sucks because it's not worth as much as AF 15, Hulk 1 or FF 1?

[joe_collector]

Am I one of the only ones here who has read MP1?

 

MP#1 has first counter-earth and first soul gem all key to Warlocks development.

 

I am beginning to think that reading comics on a CGC Forum is a lost art, and all these guys do is stare at pretty pictures behind slabbed plastic.

 

There was even some great quotes about wanting to create a new Adam Warlock character using religious overtones, and just using the old Speedo-wearing caveman Him as the template so as not to worry about Marvel's copyright.

[vaillant]

Who cares, I' just like to see some consistency for once.

 

Him: Speedo-wearing Caveman

 

Warlock: Costumed super-hero with a new costume, new world, new powers, new name, new personalty, and new soul gem.

 

Magus: Warlock with an Afro

 

How the heck can Magus warrant a full "first appearance" but Warlock does not?

 

Him is not a "speedo wearing caveman". His features are obviously meant to represent physical beauty ("perfection") following the canons of the greek-latin classical world, reflecting the fact that Warlock is a man "created" by man, with the presumption to give life a "perfect man".

 

Also: Warlock is not, strictly speaking, a "super-hero": he does not respond to a specific vocation to heroism but rather a very peculiar character (like, say, Werewolf by Night, Machine Man or Morbius, to make a few examples), which follows his personal search for meaning and happens to find himself acting heroically.

 

Also, Magus is not a caricature of Warlock: it is his future self, hypotizing Warlock embraces evil, and thus the disturbing dissonance between similarities and differences in his features (skin color, hairdo, etc.).

 

Allow me to say you are being a bit superficial for being such a passionate Warlock fan…