Stubborn eBay Sellers...what's their game plan?

[PowderedH2O]

I think ebay is just fine. Deals can be found. You just have to work a little sometime. I've made a number of 50% offers on comics, cards, and autographs and ended up negotiating a deal with the seller that I was quite happy with. Occasionally, the first lowball is accepted. But, if I run into a stubborn seller that either won't give me the courtesy of a response or a counteroffer, I just put that seller into my list of people I won't deal with for the future. No biggie.

[davedawgbg]

They just aren't interested in selling. I personally enjoy seeing them on eBay. It makes my already reasonable pricing look like a steal.

 

Agree on both points.

 

There is also a difference between wanting to sell something, and wanting someone to buy something from you.

 

If I decided to sell something that's exactly what I'm going to do, sell it. I don't feel I'm entitled to a certain price or certain amount more than I may have paid for it, so no-reserve auction it is. Many times those with obscenely high BIN prices on items either feel the item is actually worth that much, feel in their mind it is only worth selling for that much, or have no intention of actually selling and are just showing off. Certainly there are other reasons but I think those are the majority of the scenarios.

 

Unless they're paying rent don't let these people occupy any space in your head, and don't try to rationalize or justify what others are doing, especially if it is clearly unreasonable as you'll just make yourself crazy.

[miraclemet]

1. I agree sellers get to set their prices. Its their stuff, its their call.

2. BUT to say that setting BIN prices at 200%+ of market (and fishing for a whale or a very uninformed buyer with money to burn) has no negative effect is not realistic either...

 

Negative effects on the market

- the clutter of ebay of auto-relist BINs at multiples of the market rate creates a ton of noise that get in the way of people trying to sell books in either true auctions or market rate BINs. Ebay used to be mostly auctions, with some BINs, now its mostly BINS (or auctions with 100% market rate opening bids) and very few actual auctions.

 

- the effect that these published "prices" have on the uninformed public. Collection buyers already have to educate uninformed sellers about condition effects on prices, now they have to explain that the book someone is trying to sell on ebay for 5x market is really only worth 20% of the asking price, and that price is full retail... it just makes more work for people who are actually bringing books into the market (by buying collections). If nothing else just so that we dont have to listen to the Pawn Star guys say "well they can ask what ever the want online, but what did it sell for?" every week on their show.

 

- the effect that the published prices have had on some of the talent. It was cited previously in other threads that nothing affected signing fees by artists/creators more than them seeing their signed books being listed for big dollars. Only problem is, the books weren't actually selling at those prices. They were just seeing someone (Blackstar or whoever it was that put their SS slabs on a pedestal) taking a book their signed (that was maybe worth $100, and then listing on eBay for $500. As a result some creators just stopped signing. Others raised their prices. [Note: Im not saying anything against flipping a book at market prices, or at TCO price (total cost for creating the SS book), but the 200%+ markups are excessive.

 

so while I agree as an informed buyer the only negative effect these listing have on me is that I have to weed thru them to get to the stuff I ACTUALLY might want to bid on or buy.

 

but there are certainly negative effects on other sellers, the uninformed public, and on the creators seeing their SSed books listed for ridiculous prices (that the market doesn't support).

[kav]

I know i've seen books on their for years and years-they will never sell, ever....

 

[cousin itt]

My theory: "shelf space". I don't actually sell on ebay, but I assume some people must be able to list for free. So, these people just flood ebay with stuff that they know is highly unlikely to sell, but it increases their visibility, and just gives them the appearance of being a real "supermarket" rather than just some nobody. In short, it's advertising, and a way to crowd out the fair-priced nobodies, and nothing more. And, hey, if they sell something for double market value, they ain't complainin'.

 

My personal pet peeve is seeing something I was interested in sell on a heritage, comic connect or comic link auction, then seeing that EXACT same thing then show up on ebay (sometimes within a few days) for nearly double what they just paid for it. I mean... if you were the high bidder just a few days ago, what makes you think there's going to be another even much-higher-bidder now? It reminds me of that commercial for some brokerage, where a guy wins an auction, then stands up and says, "okay, I'd like to sell it now".

[N/A]

I will admit it that I do it.

 

A few reasons.

 

First off I sell ZERO comics on FleaBay- I sell other collectibles.

 

But it does draw attention to it.

 

But I ALWAYS place a best offer feature on it. I let it draw eyes cause we all sort by highest price too and I always sell it for a reasonable price when an offer is made. I do stay in reality and not think a $500 item is worth $1,000 and just be foolish about it.

 

But why not place a high price on it and let them offer more than I would have taken if I had put a buy it now on it with no best offer.

 

It's all a game at the end of the day and no different than going to a con. The difference is you see eBay everyday and cons come and go so I bet it happens more than you think.

 

Call it crappy if ya want....I just call it running a business and making money to just cover all my losses and other vices.

 

It's called running a small volume business. (thumbs u

[kav]

you can justify it any way you want whenever i see those i just go what a dumb

[RockMyAmadeus]

Haven't seen this mentioned yet: there are sellers who value their books more highly than the market does, at least at the time of the listing, and are perfectly content keeping the book until and if they meet someone who likes the book more than the seller does.

 

I have tons of books that I have no intention of selling. None. Listing is free, and I have some pretty spectacular books in my niche. But, if someone comes along and *realllllly* wants the book, and is willing to pay at, or close to, what I have listed it for...clearly, I don't love it *that* much.

 

Powers #1 CGC 9.8. Got it slabbed last year (or 2012), and have been sitting on it at $180 BIN, wayyy over "market value."

 

Had lots of offers for as long as I've had it listed (a year?) $80, $100, $60, $75.

 

Refused. It was worth more than that to me.

 

Then, fortuitously, the Powers TV series gets announced...and within 6 hours, I had three offers on it ($100, $120, $125.)

 

I counter all of them to $160 (or $165.)

 

$160 was my price. I was willing to sell at that price, which, again, is substantially over anything the book has sold for in a year...but more importantly, there have only been three sales in that time.

 

The next morning, I wake up....it's sold for my $180 BIN.

 

Bonus.

 

But most of you in this thread would complain about the fact that I had it listed for a long time at "two to four times market."

 

Sometimes, especially for books that aren't common (we're not talking about Amazing Spiderman #300 in 9.2, after all), you have to want the book more than the seller does.

 

Now, if someone has a book that sells multiple times a month for $200 (like Spidey #300 up there), and someone has it listed for $500....then you'd have a point.

 

I enjoy what I do immensely. I love being in the comics industry, in all the various ways I do it. But, with auctions, I simply could not make a go of it, and had to work "in the real world" for a long time. It was breaking me to list stuff for auction at either 99 cents, and watch it sell for nothing (if only one person wants it, it sells for 99 cents, regardless of what that one person is willing to pay. That's how I have picked up Totleben (Swampy #27) and Kieth (Tec #660) sig series books for $12 each, which is criminal.)

 

Now, I can negotiate with people who are willing to pay for what they want, because they are effectively "bidding" against someone else...in this case, the seller.

 

If it doesn't sell...oh well. The stuff I no longer give away has more than made up for the stuff that doesn't sell.

[RockMyAmadeus]

Something else that's not been mentioned:

 

When you have a BIN, you are guaranteed not to be shilled. You know the price upfront, and can almost always make an offer...which means you are in control of the process the entire time.

 

No "thrill bidding", no shilling, no auction fever driving the price up. You can take your time, and determine if the item is worth what the seller is asking (or countering), and if it's not, you can move on and look elsewhere.

 

In other words, the price you pay is the price you and the seller are willing to trade for, rather than being secretly forced to pay more because you aren't aware that you're bidding against the seller.

 

I don't know if I've ever had BINs returned because of buyer's remorse, and buyers simply not paying, while still happening, is not anywhere near as often.

 

Sure, I understand that I can miss out on a frenzy for a particular book, and I may end up selling it for much less than it would have sold in an auction...but slow and steady wins the race. The other items that I have gotten the prices I want have more than made up for the occasional "give away."

 

 

[kav]

I guess the guys I'm talking about are the ones listing like 10 or even 50 times market or higher....twice market i can live with. If it's the only listing you can ask whatever you want but if there are dozens of copies in same condn for way cheaper it's pointless. I've seen a listing of 8 issues of the x men reprint comic amazing adventures for $1400. or a romita romita lee signed piece of paper for $17,000. that type of stuff.

[Ryan.]

Buyers who make best offers when that option is available almost always, in my experience, offer 50% of the list price as a starting point. Therefore I usually price my books at a certain percentage above what I expect to actually sell the book for, somewhere in the 40% range. Also in my experience, buyers will ignore BiNs without a best offer option, perhaps assuming that the book will be there waiting should they ever decide to purchase.

[RockMyAmadeus]

Oh, and one more thing...there have been entire markets created by sellers with rare items who have chosen not to sell for what "the market will bear at the time."

 

Sure, for Spidey #300, X-Men #137, etc. No shortage of copies available, in almost any grade.

 

But what about the only 9.8 copy of a popular niche book?

 

Or a book that only 4 are positively confirmed to exist?

 

There are countless examples, but take the Maxx ashcans. One of the #3 blacks sold for near $2,000 a while back, in a private sale. Would it have sold for anywhere near that amount if my copy was not consistently listed on eBay, for years, at my asking price?

 

No way.

 

So, the seller has me to thank. I say that jokingly, but it's still true. My unwillingless to sell a book with 4 confirmed copies in existence for less than $2,000 or so has benefited someone else tremendously...someone who had no idea that the book was worth anything at one time. He/she saw it on eBay, and more importantly, it was there to be seen.

 

And the buyer also has me to thank. Why? Because the seller became aware of the book's value, and didn't just sell it to someone for nothing, someone who also may not have appreciated the scarcity of the item, and thus when the buyer came looking, the seller actually had the item for the buyer to obtain. And the buyer, having paid a small fortune for it, appreciates and cares for it far, far more than someone who might have bought it for $5.

 

How many books have YOU been looking for, that you can never find, simply because the people who have them, and are willing to sell them, don't realize that someone is willing to buy them?

 

Countless times, over countless years, I have been frustrated by that.

 

I've been looking for a particularly rare 3rd print Supergirl #1 for years...going on 15 years now. 15 years! They weren't on eBay, they were nowhere.

 

Now? I have my pick. Will I pay more than I want to? Yes...but after 15 years, come on! I'm not immortal, how long will I wait to maybe find it at the price I want to pay...? Sure, it costs money, but it's only money. Money comes and money goes...but that item that you *really* want? Who knows...?

 

Interesting things to consider.

[kav]

why a third print?

[comix4fun]

What's the game plan?

 

 

 

Exerting control in the one and only place for which the universe allows them.

[kav]

What's the game plan?

 

 

 

Exerting control in the one and only place for which the universe allows them.

 

I think you nailed it

[RockMyAmadeus]

What's the game plan?

 

 

 

Exerting control in the one and only place for which the universe allows them.

 

 

From the petty postal clerk, to the petty bureaucrat, to the petty eBay seller, to the petty middle manager, there's nothing quite like exercising control over other human beings in a limited capacity.

 

[miraclemet]

Simple solution is that eBay creates a filter so I can exclude "re-lists".

 

Wouldn't be perfect, but woul help.

[krighton]

Some are definitely using the auto relist....I see quite a few Roalex Slide Puzzles for crazy high prices week after week.

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/HUCKLEBERRY-HOUND-YOGI-BEAR-ROALEX-SLIDE-PUZZLE-MOC-/120469053308?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c0c83df7c

 

Bought a similar one recently for $18 or so (not as nice but that's not an MOC either).

[Dr. Balls]

I recall a seller here in town back in the 90s who would have let a $250 book sit on his wall for years rather than sell it for $240. He simply didn't believe in giving discounts and if no one bought it, he'd let it sit. Whenever you'd ask if he'd come down or if you shot him an offer, he'd just say "Nah, that's the lowest I can go."

 

On or off Ebay, there are some sellers that think flexibility in price is a big no-no.

[Dr. Balls]

Oh, and one more thing...there have been entire markets created by sellers with rare items who have chosen not to sell for what "the market will bear at the time."

 

Sure, for Spidey #300, X-Men #137, etc. No shortage of copies available, in almost any grade.

 

But what about the only 9.8 copy of a popular niche book?

 

Or a book that only 4 are positively confirmed to exist?

 

There are countless examples, but take the Maxx ashcans. One of the #3 blacks sold for near $2,000 a while back, in a private sale. Would it have sold for anywhere near that amount if my copy was not consistently listed on eBay, for years, at my asking price?

 

No way.

 

So, the seller has me to thank. I say that jokingly, but it's still true. My unwillingless to sell a book with 4 confirmed copies in existence for less than $2,000 or so has benefited someone else tremendously...someone who had no idea that the book was worth anything at one time. He/she saw it on eBay, and more importantly, it was there to be seen.

 

And the buyer also has me to thank. Why? Because the seller became aware of the book's value, and didn't just sell it to someone for nothing, someone who also may not have appreciated the scarcity of the item, and thus when the buyer came looking, the seller actually had the item for the buyer to obtain. And the buyer, having paid a small fortune for it, appreciates and cares for it far, far more than someone who might have bought it for $5.

 

How many books have YOU been looking for, that you can never find, simply because the people who have them, and are willing to sell them, don't realize that someone is willing to buy them?

 

Countless times, over countless years, I have been frustrated by that.

 

I've been looking for a particularly rare 3rd print Supergirl #1 for years...going on 15 years now. 15 years! They weren't on eBay, they were nowhere.

 

Now? I have my pick. Will I pay more than I want to? Yes...but after 15 years, come on! I'm not immortal, how long will I wait to maybe find it at the price I want to pay...? Sure, it costs money, but it's only money. Money comes and money goes...but that item that you *really* want? Who knows...?

 

Interesting things to consider.

 

+1

 

I am in absolute agreement with RMA on this.