Cole Schave collection: face jobs?

[Green]

Other people don't care because you don't know if the shrinking is from the poor pressing or a natural occurrence and heck, the number in the upper left hand corner is bigger so that's more money.

 

This is utter BS. Not a single person has said it's OK, so let's stop perpetuating this untruth.

 

The books are in blue labels with some sporting higher grades, looks like the CGC thinks things are ok. Nothing to see here.

[Mr.Diggler]

Other people don't care because you don't know if the shrinking is from the poor pressing or a natural occurrence and heck, the number in the upper left hand corner is bigger so that's more money.

 

This is utter BS. Not a single person has said it's OK, so let's stop perpetuating this untruth.

 

The books are in blue labels with some sporting higher grades, looks like the CGC thinks things are ok. Nothing to see here.

Beat ya to it.

[comicdonna]

Thank you. Its almost as if we are getting lost in semantics and side arguments again, trying to justify why we shouldn't be upset or shocked at what we are seeing.

 

Nobody is lost in semantics.

 

The discussion is not about whether people like it or not, that much has been uniformly established. Everyone dislikes it, admittedly to varying degrees.

 

The discussion is now about how to deal with it.

 

 

 

i suspect the guy who received the grades bumps didn't mind.

I was thinking the same thing. (thumbs u

[VintageComics]

Thank you. Its almost as if we are getting lost in semantics and side arguments again, trying to justify why we shouldn't be upset or shocked at what we are seeing.

 

Nobody is lost in semantics.

 

The discussion is not about whether people like it or not, that much has been uniformly established. Everyone dislikes it, admittedly to varying degrees.

 

The discussion is now about how to deal with it.

 

 

 

i suspect the guy who received the grades bumps didn't mind.

I was thinking the same thing. (thumbs u

 

You guys are right.

 

 

Although I thought I was clear that I meant everyone excluding the submitter and the presser.

 

 

[Bomber-Bob]

Other people don't care because you don't know if the shrinking is from the poor pressing or a natural occurrence and heck, the number in the upper left hand corner is bigger so that's more money.

 

This is utter BS. Not a single person has said it's OK, so let's stop perpetuating this untruth.

 

Roy speaks the truth. No one has said this is okay.

[batman_fan]

Other people don't care because you don't know if the shrinking is from the poor pressing or a natural occurrence and heck, the number in the upper left hand corner is bigger so that's more money.

 

This is utter BS. Not a single person has said it's OK, so let's stop perpetuating this untruth.

 

Roy speaks the truth. No one has said this is okay.

 

Obviously Matt was okay with it and Doug is okay with it. I suspect the Wilson family is okay with it. Maybe the new seller on eBay with some of these is okay as well. Not sure about the folks that bought the books, especially if they read this thread.

[Mr.Diggler]

Other people don't care because you don't know if the shrinking is from the poor pressing or a natural occurrence and heck, the number in the upper left hand corner is bigger so that's more money.

 

This is utter BS. Not a single person has said it's OK, so let's stop perpetuating this untruth.

 

Roy speaks the truth. No one has said this is okay.

[thehumantorch]

Thank you. Its almost as if we are getting lost in semantics and side arguments again, trying to justify why we shouldn't be upset or shocked at what we are seeing.

 

Nobody is lost in semantics.

 

The discussion is not about whether people like it or not, that much has been uniformly established. Everyone dislikes it, admittedly to varying degrees.

 

The discussion is now about how to deal with it.

 

 

 

i suspect the guy who received the grades bumps didn't mind.

I was thinking the same thing. (thumbs u

 

You guys are right.

 

 

Although I thought I was clear that I meant everyone excluding the submitter and the presser.

 

 

And unfortunately, anyone in the future who cares more about the CGC grade than the book.

[Bomber-Bob]

In fairness, Matt also said his shop would try to reduce the problem going forward. I, for one, will be paying attention to how well they do on that.

 

Matt also said this was not a big deal, leaving it suspect that he will do anything. He also said we are the Bad Guys.

'But like RSR, the point of all of this is that the issue at hand is not as big as some people on the boards try to make it out to be. It's disheartening to see people create paranoia and trash other people's books here, which only hurts the hobby. '

 

 

[jimbo_707]

In fairness, Matt also said his shop would try to reduce the problem going forward. I, for one, will be paying attention to how well they do on that.

 

Matt also said this was not a big deal, leaving it suspect that he will do anything. He also said we are the Bad Guys.

'But like RSR, the point of all of this is that the issue at hand is not as big as some people on the boards try to make it out to be. It's disheartening to see people create paranoia and trash other people's books here, which only hurts the hobby. '

 

Unlike ruining pedigree books, which helps the hobby (as does shill bidding, or so I've heard).

 

I wonder what Cole Schave would say if he knew the books he had accumulated had been trashed in the pursuit of wealth..

[jimbo_707]

Other people don't care because you don't know if the shrinking is from the poor pressing or a natural occurrence and heck, the number in the upper left hand corner is bigger so that's more money.

 

This is utter BS. Not a single person has said it's OK, so let's stop perpetuating this untruth.

 

 

Matt Nelson and Paul Litch have both made it clear its alright. No biggie. Nothing to see here. Move along.

CGC employee plitch gave a noncommittal, disingenuous, "good company man" response. I hope the CGC owners gave him 30 pieces of silver as a bonus for that post - he certainly earned it.

[drbanner]

Because let's face it, when a book looks worse after a pressing than it did before, it was a bad pressing. And when it looks worse but gets a better grade, the grading was bad, too.

And when a book looks worse than when it started and still gets a higher grade because it was pressed and graded in-house, it's a conflict of interest. (thumbs u

[THE_BEYONDER]

In fairness, Matt also said his shop would try to reduce the problem going forward. I, for one, will be paying attention to how well they do on that.

 

Matt also said this was not a big deal, leaving it suspect that he will do anything. He also said we are the Bad Guys.

'But like RSR, the point of all of this is that the issue at hand is not as big as some people on the boards try to make it out to be. It's disheartening to see people create paranoia and trash other people's books here, which only hurts the hobby. '

 

Unlike ruining pedigree books, which helps the hobby (as does shill bidding, or so I've heard).

 

I wonder what Cole Schave would say if he knew the books he had accumulated had been trashed in the pursuit of wealth..

 

According to Mr. Schmell, “The early Silver Age Marvel books come from the private collection of Cole Schave, a noted collector out of Green Bay, Wisc. As many dealers know, Mr. Schave is a very picky, high-grade CGC buyer who does not buy a book solely for the grade on the label. He focuses on superior page quality, registration and eye appeal, and would routinely pass on many books he needed for his collection if they did not meet his strict criteria. Therefore, all the books in his collection have superior page quality (white or off-white to white, with only a couple with off-white), structure, centering and presentation, with no date stamps, writings, etc.

[batman_fan]

Personally I think this is a tough spot for CGC. If they change their grading policy to downgrade the page edge protrusion, what do you do about all the books already with big numbers that have the defect? I would like to see them change their stance on so called production defects and just treat everything equal. It seems like now they either have to play the guessing game or just assume something like this cover shrinkage is always a production error, even if it isn't.

[skypinkblu]

Other people don't care because you don't know if the shrinking is from the poor pressing or a natural occurrence and heck, the number in the upper left hand corner is bigger so that's more money.

 

This is utter BS. Not a single person has said it's OK, so let's stop perpetuating this untruth.

 

 

Matt Nelson and Paul Litch have both made it clear its alright. No biggie. Nothing to see here. Move along.

CGC employee plitch gave a noncommittal, disingenuous, "good company man" response. I hope the CGC owners gave him 30 pieces of silver as a bonus for that post - he certainly earned it.

 

He's talking as a representative of the company because he works for the company.

 

I'm not sure what else you would expect him to say?

 

He's always seemed like a very reasonable person to deal with,.

 

What he said was that their grades met grading standards, I would not compare him to Judas for that.

 

Honestly, I don't expect people to work for CGC to throw themselves under trains because of these books, I do hope they have some meetings and this thread is causing some discussion, but that's not going to happen if they can point to over the top posts and say..."look, these are just over the top"

 

I see the passion in your posts and I understand, but I know "I" would not expect people to quit or try to get fired, especially if they are reasonable people who might effect some reasonable change.

 

Remember Paul was here when the tape rules were changed. That's a good thing.

[Mmehdy]

CGC(not the) needs to revise and end confusion by eliminating color labels and get OUT of the restoration business.......PERIOD

[VintageComics]

He's talking as a representative of the company because he works for the company.

 

I'm not sure what else you would expect him to say?

 

He's always seemed like a very reasonable person to deal with,.

 

What he said was that their grades met grading standards, I would not compare him to Judas for that.

 

Honestly, I don't expect people to work for CGC to throw themselves under trains because of these books, I do hope they have some meetings and this thread is causing some discussion, but that's not going to happen if they can point to over the top posts and say..."look, these are just over the top"

 

I see the passion in your posts and I understand, but I know "I" would not expect people to quit or try to get fired, especially if they are reasonable people who might effect some reasonable change.

 

Remember Paul was here when the tape rules were changed. That's a good thing.

 

Insight, wisdom, a bit of patience - all rolled into one.

 

Good post.

 

 

[jimbo_707]

I certainly don't want to sound anti-CGC, because I do value their restoration check pretty highly and plan to continue to buy slabbed books (with a strong preference for old-label books, however).

 

I also want to strive to avoid getting personal, because it is ultimately counterproductive.

 

However, in the case of these books, I do feel betrayed by the folks in Sarasota. Form a business standpoint, the employees are mouthpieces for the owners, who only care about the major submitters. However, the CGC graders are supposed to be "comic book people," not bankers or accountants, so they should have at least some loyalty to the collecting community--in other words, the people without whom their company wouldn't exist.

 

PS - I have worked for corporations before, and I always said exactly what I thought, without any editing for the sake of toeing the company line. Someone can work for a company and still be his own man. (It does make getting promoted kind of tough...)

[VintageComics]

Personally I think this is a tough spot for CGC. If they change their grading policy to downgrade the page edge protrusion, what do you do about all the books already with big numbers that have the defect? I would like to see them change their stance on so called production defects and just treat everything equal. It seems like now they either have to play the guessing game or just assume something like this cover shrinkage is always a production error, even if it isn't.

 

And that was the main point I was trying to make.

 

You start dinging books for something nobody has dinged before and you rock the foundations of all high grade books.

 

"Sorry sir, you're $250,000 Marvel key is now worth $50,000"

 

That's going to go over really well.

 

If CGC cares enough about the hobby (and it seems they should because ultimately it affects their bottom line...and they do, as they are listening to what people with credibility say) then they need to work with CCS in stopping this from happening.

 

 

[pickycollector]

Thank you. Its almost as if we are getting lost in semantics and side arguments again, trying to justify why we shouldn't be upset or shocked at what we are seeing.

 

Nobody is lost in semantics.

 

The discussion is not about whether people like it or not, that much has been uniformly established. Everyone dislikes it, admittedly to varying degrees.

 

The discussion is now about how to deal with it.

 

 

 

i suspect the guy who received the grades bumps didn't mind.

I was thinking the same thing. (thumbs u

 

You guys are right.

 

 

Although I thought I was clear that I meant everyone excluding the submitter and the presser.

 

 

And unfortunately, anyone in the future who cares more about the CGC grade than the book.

Sad but true

 

People should always buy the book, not the label. I have seen many CGC 8.0/8.5 books that look way better than some of those 9.2/9.4/9.6 Costanzas. You would crack them out of their CGC holder and the Costanzas would be very hard to sell. But it seems now that many people only care about the big number on the upper left, whatever the eye-appeal of the book. As long as this continues, you will see many of these examples as money is the only and single explanation for all this..