Answer from CGC.........

[THE_BEYONDER]

Chris will not send his customers’ books to CGC once his work is finished

 

Of course not. No reason to give CGC's new resto guy the ' head's up '.

 

I wonder if Chris will be offering "aged trimming"....

[Red Hook]

But then it just becomes a game of musical slabs. Why not just continue the pre-screening of books for "grade improveablity", and then send them directly to Chris? Why bother with the facade?

 

And it'll cut down on slab damage.

[COI]

Part of the reason is that pressing doesn't bother me at all. Not one iota. So I don't see, and have never seen, what the huge deal is. How it could morph into the 800 pound gorilla it's morphed into around here mystifies me.

 

 

[bucketofwasabi]

So as a newcomer.....what exactly is going on that is the problem?

 

 

Just because CGC's stance is that "PRESSING IS NOT RESTORATION", doesn't mean that it isn't.

 

Because CGC holds a monopoly right now, they apparently feel that they can DICTATE the terms of the comic market.

 

The problem?

 

Their entire business relies on CONSUMER CONFIDENCE . Without it...they have nothing.

 

Ahh I follow you. I can see why this would be a problem for some.

 

But isn't the CGC a privately owned company? Being a privately owned company aren't they reserved the right to determine what their grading practices are? If they come out as saying Pressing is not Restoration, and pressed books are submitted for grading what is the problem? If I had a set of books in my collection that might come out nicer in appearance (flatten out the warping or whatnot) by pressing and I was going to submit them to the CGC for grading and slabbing what is the problem. Maybe I am looking at it from the wrong point of view? I see slabbed books as collection pieces that I will hold onto until I am passed.

 

To me the problem doesn't seem to be the CGC or the pressers, it is the people (dealers / sellers / whomever) that are gouging us on prices by selling the HG books for many multiples over guide value because they think (and in most cases this is true) people will still buy them at these inflated prices. In the CBG it shows that sometime a 9.8 slab can get up to 10X OS guide value. If that is not gouging I do not know what is.

 

But alas, I am still green in these here parts. If I buy a slab I am buying it because it looks great sitting in the slab and I want to keep it that way for a long time. If it is pressed or not, that is no concern to me. Appearance and price are my main goals in buying slabs. If pressing increases the amount of super HG comics in the market I don't see the problem as that market is way to expensive to begin with.

 

Be gentle, .

 

-Brian

[Illiterati-migration]

Part of the reason is that pressing doesn't bother me at all. Not one iota. So I don't see, and have never seen, what the huge deal is. How it could morph into the 800 pound gorilla it's morphed into around here mystifies me.

 

 

 

Hell, restoration itself doesn't even bother me... but I can sure recognize hypocrisy and a conflict of interests when I see one.

[THE_BEYONDER]

So as a newcomer.....what exactly is going on that is the problem?

 

Pressing REALLY REALLY REALLY bothers some people.

 

Why attempt to trivialize our concerns? Maybe you enjoy the overwhelming GREED that has infected this hobby once again, but some of us are sickened by it.

 

Part of the reason is that pressing doesn't bother me at all. Not one iota. So I don't see, and have never seen, what the huge deal is. How it could morph into the 800 pound gorilla it's morphed into around here mystifies me.

 

The entire comic market revolves around a structural grade . Taking a 9.2 and pressing it into a 9.8 is....for lack of a better word... cheating .

 

It's about

MONEY

, plain and simple.

 

If it really doesn't matter, then why don't sellers disclose pressing?

 

Oh...that's right. Because noone would pay insane multiples anymore.

[Darthdiesel]

well darth, i'm glad you're understanding this perfectly well and are satisfied.

 

i'm still not sure what i just read answers the questions raised. i think there's much more to shake out here...............

 

 

There is and i'm waiting before I start with the doom and gloom...from what I read, nothing is set in stone except that Friesen is leaving CGC.

 

Is he going to do NDP pressing - SPECULATION

 

Can he get restored books past CGC's new resto expert? - Just as much of a chance as folks like Matt and Susan's work - although if CGC hires Susan, then no resto would go unPLOD'ed since she claims she can detect all and the folks on here seem to take this statement as gospel.

 

Is Friesen's new venture going to be part of CCG services - they are a huge group and can absorb it if Friesen decides he wants to go that route, but to assume that CGC will damage its reputation and integrity by giving Friesen's resto work a pass every time, well, that's plain ludicrous. And to all those of you who are already impugning CGC's integrity and that they'll be whoring out blue labels to the highest paying dealer, Friesen's CCS is not part of CCG yet or may never be. His company right now is pretty much like Susan's and Matt's. I know a few people who used to work for CGC but no longer do and sell comics. Should their former employment with CGc cast a dark cloud on their current business because they have a inner working knowledge of the CGC system?

 

I don't like jumping to conclusions and I don't make accusations lightly without having the concrete evidence behind them. It seems everyone on here like to grandstand a bit and play the FDQ in several of their posts. I didn't care when Wizard First was announced and everyone was predicting that CGC would go down in flames and the consumer trust in the product would drop and that prices would soon follow... maybe some of the folks on here will be liquidating their slabbed collections - good luck and I hope I'm on the receiving end of some of these depressed steals but I WON'T BEHOLDING MY BREATH since this is just a lot of folks blowing SMOKE UP OUR COLLECTIVE CAPTIVE AUDIENCE ARSES...

[rob_react]

Part of the reason is that pressing doesn't bother me at all. Not one iota. So I don't see, and have never seen, what the huge deal is. How it could morph into the 800 pound gorilla it's morphed into around here mystifies me.

 

 

 

Hell, restoration itself doesn't even bother me... but I can sure recognize hypocrisy and a conflict of interests when I see one.

 

I think this idea is a bad one, don't get me wrong. Whatever Chris does, if it's under the same umbrella corp as CGC, I think it's a mistake.

 

That doesn't mean I suddenly care about pressing in and of itself. Pressing will continue to be a non-issue with me.

[Darthdiesel]

Because CGC holds a monopoly right now, they apparently feel that they can DICTATE the terms of the comic market.

 

Sorry Chris - CGC has no say in what I spend my money on. The comic market controls its own fate and votes on its direction with consumer dollars.

 

Their entire business relies on CONSUMER CONFIDENCE . Without it...they have nothing.

 

It depends on submissions. When I see large dealers no longer submitting books for CGC slabbing then I'll worry b/c that'll mean they have no buyers for 'em.

[LordRahl]

Not replying to anyone in particular but let's see if I get a rational response not involving the great crash this will allegedly precipitate or the evil that is CGC. So Chris decides to leave CGC and open up his own business. Is there anything CGC can do about this? Do we know if he's going to be doing pressing only or is he opening up a restoration service like Matt Nelson's? Does anyone's opinion change if he's opening up a full fledged resto service? What if the details don't work out and he opens his service outside of the Certified Collectibles Group? How can CGC be held responsible for what an individual does, who happens to be no longer employed by them? It seems everyone is getting their panties in a bunch and blaming CGC over something that does not sound to me to be in CGC's control. Is CGC resposible for the resto services now offered by Matt Nelson and Matt Wilson? How one more resto service, currently available from Nelson and Wilson is going to kill the hobby is completely beyond me.

[Red Hook]

 

Part of the reason is that pressing doesn't bother me at all. Not one iota. So I don't see, and have never seen, what the huge deal is. How it could morph into the 800 pound gorilla it's morphed into around here mystifies me.

 

Rob, you know when it will bother me less?

 

When I see half a dozen of the biggest dealers and collectors get together and make a group announcement that they do indeed press books, collect and sell those pressed books and don't give a Flying F what anyone thinks, because THEY don't REALLY think there's anything wrong with it.

 

They sure ACT 100% like there's something wrong with it. Not one of them wants to go within 100 miles of an admission about it.

[OldGuy]

Why attempt to trivialize our concerns? Maybe you enjoy the overwhelming GREED that has infected this hobby once again, but some of us are sickened by it.

 

Part of the reason is that pressing doesn't bother me at all. Not one iota. So I don't see, and have never seen, what the huge deal is. How it could morph into the 800 pound gorilla it's morphed into around here mystifies me.

 

What's the other part of the reason why you try to trivialize concerns over pressing?

 

Isn't this a little like when some here say that modern comics suck just because they prefer to collect Golden Age comics? Because pressing isn't important to you it shouldn't be important to anyone?

[bucketofwasabi]

So as a newcomer.....what exactly is going on that is the problem?

 

Pressing REALLY REALLY REALLY bothers some people.

 

Why attempt to trivialize our concerns? Maybe you enjoy the overwhelming GREED that has infected this hobby once again, but some of us are sickened by it.

 

Part of the reason is that pressing doesn't bother me at all. Not one iota. So I don't see, and have never seen, what the huge deal is. How it could morph into the 800 pound gorilla it's morphed into around here mystifies me.

 

The entire comic market revolves around a structural grade . Taking a 9.2 and pressing it into a 9.8 is....for lack of a better word... cheating .

 

It's about

MONEY

, plain and simple.

 

If it really doesn't matter, then why don't sellers disclose pressing?

 

Oh...that's right. Because noone would pay insane multiples anymore.

 

THE_BEYONDER - I cannot agree with you more in what you said. Pressing done for the reason of squeaking out a 9.2 to a 9.8 is pure insanity. It just shows the greed level that some dealers will stoop to-to get a few extra (or more) bucks.

 

On the flip side though, as a collector, I see pressing out a comic to fix a warped cover or slightly wavy cover as being alright. From the collector standpoint as long as it looks great in the slab I could really care less if the grade changed. This is one of the reasons that I don't bid on the ASM issues with the misaligned covers. To me they are not a showpiece even if they are a 10.

 

I don't see it as a conflict of interest probably because I am looking at it from the collectors standpoint and not the dealer.

 

-Brian

[Illiterati-migration]

Is Friesen's new venture going to be part of CCG services - they are a huge group and can absorb it if Friesen decides he wants to go that route, but to assume that CGC will damage its reputation and integrity by giving Friesen's resto work a pass every time, well, that's plain ludicrous. And to all those of you who are already impugning CGC's integrity and that they'll be whoring out blue labels to the highest paying dealer, Friesen's CCS is not part of CCG yet or may never be. His company right now is pretty much like Susan's and Matt's. I know a few people who used to work for CGC but no longer do and sell comics. Should their former employment with CGc cast a dark cloud on their current business because they have a inner working knowledge of the CGC system?

 

Darth, I think you're missing the point.

 

CGC loses its IMPARTIALITY when it starts providing a SERVICE to IMPROVE books. Why would someone be concerned with improving a grade? So they can get it slabbed and sell it for more money. Do you see how this is CGC scratching CGC's back?

 

If this goes through, then CGC will no longer be a third-party grading company.

 

Your entire bit leading to the part about the "inner working knowledge of the CGC system" is completely irrelevant.

[COI]

Part of the reason is that pressing doesn't bother me at all. Not one iota. So I don't see, and have never seen, what the huge deal is. How it could morph into the 800 pound gorilla it's morphed into around here mystifies me.

 

 

 

Hell, restoration itself doesn't even bother me... but I can sure recognize hypocrisy and a conflict of interests when I see one.

 

Can you also recognize the fact that topics on this board tend to get blown way out of proportion? With most of you working in offices, I tend to think that the "800lb gorillas" started here are more out of boredom than of concern for the hobby. Discussions where all parties truly care about what they are discussing tend to consist of a search for truth, not controversy.

 

Anyway, why does this "conflict of interest" upset you so much? Do you even collect comics?

[rob_react]

 

The entire comic market revolves around a structural grade . Taking a 9.2 and pressing it into a 9.8 is....for lack of a better word... cheating .

 

It's about

MONEY

, plain and simple.

 

If it really doesn't matter, then why don't sellers disclose pressing?

 

Oh...that's right. Because noone would pay insane multiples anymore.

 

Are you trying to explain something to me? Did you really just do a recap of the pressing issue for me? Are you kidding? Do you honestly think I had no idea what the arguments were? Half of the threads around here have been about pressing for ages now, do you seriously think none of that information had filtered down to me? I know all of the arguments AND I STILL DON'T CARE ABOUT PRESSING. I. Don't. Care.

[Illiterati-migration]

Not replying to anyone in particular but let's see if I get a rational response not involving the great crash this will allegedly precipitate or the evil that is CGC. So Chris decides to leave CGC and open up his own business. Is there anything CGC can do about this? Do we know if he's going to be doing pressing only or is he opening up a restoration service like Matt Nelson's? Does anyone's opinion change if he's opening up a full fledged resto service? What if the details don't work out and he opens his service outside of the Certified Collectibles Group? How can CGC be held responsible for what an individual does, who happens to be no longer employed by them? It seems everyone is getting their panties in a bunch and blaming CGC over something that does not sound to me to be in CGC's control. Is CGC resposible for the resto services now offered by Matt Nelson and Matt Wilson? How one more resto service, currently available from Nelson and Wilson is going to kill the hobby is completely beyond me.

 

It's not about whether someone (ANYONE) starts a restoration service. The main issue is that CGC has SPECIFICALLY remained on the fence about "pressing as restoration" simply so that they may leave this particular door open.

 

This way, CGC can give the PERCEPTION of impartiality, while CCG can make even MORE money as people are submitting books to their pressing (restoration) service so that the books can be then submitted to CGC. (The premise, of course, being that only ALREADY high grade books are worth pressing and thus are worth slabbing.)

 

It's not complicated, but I think everyone is getting turned-around in the litany of postings.

[1962]

Pressing doesn't bother me to much either. Lets face it there are only so many books that have certain defects where pressing will make a difference in the grade. Thats not even taking into consideration the few number of candidates where it makes sense monetarily to press the book.

 

Overall I doubt pressing is going to have much of an impact on the number of HG copies floating around, although the difference will be felt in Silver and Bronze far more than anywhere else.

 

I knew I should have been a dry cleaner.

[Red Hook]

I've never suggested that anyone who doesn't care about pressing be rescued from some "dark side". Good for you Rob. But I do care, and I want that information made available to me. Can you understand that?

[Illiterati-migration]

Part of the reason is that pressing doesn't bother me at all. Not one iota. So I don't see, and have never seen, what the huge deal is. How it could morph into the 800 pound gorilla it's morphed into around here mystifies me.

 

 

 

Hell, restoration itself doesn't even bother me... but I can sure recognize hypocrisy and a conflict of interests when I see one.

 

Can you also recognize the fact that topics on this board tend to get blown way out of proportion? With most of you working in offices, I tend to think that the "800lb gorillas" started here are more out of boredom than of concern for the hobby. Discussions where all parties truly care about what they are discussing tend to consist of a search for truth, not controversy.

 

Anyway, why does this "conflict of interest" upset you so much? Do you even collect comics?

 

Thanks for your usual "insightful" contributions, COI.