Avengers # 4 Grading is Subjective

[mikeyc67]

Bought this on ebay. Seller graded as fine but did say grading is matter of opinion so judge for yourself form pictures.

 

Pictures from a distance but showed cover as white, Could see crease on front lower left and faint writing on back cover which also showed white.

 

Let me know what you think if I can take issue as don't think anywhere near fine and not just down to difference of opinion but fundamental and indisputable lower grade.

 

Front cover looks trimmed to me - comic code cut off also edge is not straight

 

Generally more wear and general creasing than allowable for grade plus there is the writing on the back cover

 

Two interior centrefold wraps detached which never mentioned and tears on these

 

Comments appreciated.

 

Thanks Mikey

 

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[tjanse]

3.0 at best in my opinion

[NewWorldOrder]

2.0 is it for that book

[Mutant Manatee]

And if the right edge has been trimmed... "restored".

 

(And it does kind of look like it, especially near the CCA stamp where it appears that the trimming is crooked.)

[mikeyc67]

Thanks for the comments.

 

I have never argued for return of a book before (I blame myself if don't spot things or over optimistic) but think I will here given the value.

 

Kind regards

 

Mikey

[thunsicker]

2.5

[VintageComics]

I would say the seller's eyesight is subjective.

 

 

[mikeyc67]

I'm glad not just me, thanks guys.

[W16227]

Definitely one to ask for return or discount - I use the subjective statement myself - but I also list any defects that might not be obvious for a scan -like any detached staples. Plus - I do not do it to disavow my grades ( but that is me) - but more for someone to make sure that they use their best judgement,.

 

When you open the case - make sure to use the hidden defects (and list any that were not evident from the initial listing and pictures) as well as what those defects do to the overall grade as the reasoning. Be sure to attach pics, this will help protect you in case the seller is a tool.

 

 

[Sqeggs]

Send it back. With the detached centerfolds, wear, and staining, that book is a Good, not a Fine. More like a 2.0 than a 6.0.

[zosocane]

If I'm you, I absolutely send it back. That book at best is a 2.5 I'm assuming the description never disclosed that the book had detached pages, which automatically takes it out of blue labe fine range. I would be pretty upset.

[mikeyc67]

Yes detached pages never disclosed nor any mention of trim.

 

I asked seller for his comments and he never responded. When I opened a case he said grading is opinion and he had said fine but that to judge for yourself so I have no case to ask for a refund. He also said he is a very strict grader and never been questioned before.

 

I have posted pictures with comment on what they disclose together with overstreet definition of fine. I hope eBay agree.

 

Thanks again for comments and advice.

 

Mikey

 

[The Kaptain]

I would be shocked if eBay did NOT agree with you. If you file a case for "significantly not as described", but buyer almost always wins.

[telerites]

Unless, he just used an F and is claiming he meant Fair, that book doesn't sniff at Fine.

 

 

[thehumantorch]

Return it, it's far from the advertised grade.

[Ghost Rider]

No way this book is anywhere near a fine. He has never been taken to task about his grading? I take it he doesn't sell comic books very often. Either he is blind. Or he is trying to pull a fast one on somebody. Return it. Be sure to list all the defects not mentioned in the listing to Pay Pal.

[W16227]

Yes detached pages never disclosed nor any mention of trim.

 

I asked seller for his comments and he never responded. When I opened a case he said grading is opinion and he had said fine but that to judge for yourself so I have no case to ask for a refund. He also said he is a very strict grader and never been questioned before.

 

I have posted pictures with comment on what they disclose together with overstreet definition of fine. I hope eBay agree.

 

Thanks again for comments and advice.

 

Mikey

 

Make sure you list all defects that could not be seen in the original sale - down to any creasing and wrinkling. - always be polite (for ebays sake - helps your case) - I would also suggest politely that he probably should not include any grade on his auction if he is not going to stand behind it. Maybe make him an offer on a fair price for the book. All of this will help you by showing the seller that you are an educated consumer - and shows ebay that you are trying to work through the situation. Makes your case that much stronger.

 

 

 

 

[comicshark]

Here is the problem and I have seen it before. If he has a return policy, return it but contact eBay regarding the issues. If he doesn't have a return policy, sold as is, your going to have a problem and are probably gonna go through resolution. His argument will be is that you didn't ask for more information or pictures, and I am not sure if you did...but if you did and you got different pictures, then your up....if not...and show pictures after you got the book...then he could say that it isn't his book and you have an alternate copy with interior pictures....Also, know as you are asking questions of us, he could be monitoring these posts. People have been posting scam artists on CGC forum but I am not sure how that is working out or how ethical that is since they are so many sides. I think the book is a 1.5. Best of luck to you.

[mikeyc67]

Thanks again for all the advice. Seller is insisting is fine and no internal defects when he had the comic.

Up to eBay. Just have to be philosophical - may have overpaid but worst case still Avengers # 4.

thanks all

Mikey

[Red84]

The grade designation is not the issue. The lack of disclosure of 2 detached wraps is and is enough to warrant a return and full refund. You don't have x-ray vision and the seller should have disclosed the detached pages.