~~THE~~GIVING~~TREE~~ 5 5

[HarveySwick]

Everyone needs to realize - that not EVERYTHING is black and white.

 

There is a lot of grey area to deal with. I'm trying to prevent people from taking advantage of the thread and other's generosity while also trying to NOT appear to be a oppressive tyrant and scaring lurkers off from joining in. I've now had to field several PM's about this recent "development" so here goes. Once again I feel drained by having to explain every single one of my actions, but I'll try to appease everyone by at least TRYING.

 

1) Tamwood - this guy is new. The thread was new. He poked around, jumped in at free books, got upset off when people criticized his "offerings", didn't care about the possibility of receiving a strike and rescinded his offer.

 

--> at this point, I never even had considered a rescission of an offer. But again, the thread was brand new. I thought it might be an isolated incident. I didn't want to seem overly harsh. So I colored his name in RED so it would stand out and didn't hand out a strike. I thought that would be deterrence enough in the future from someone rescinding an offer. Who the heck wants to stand out from everyone else in a list by their name being colored RED?

 

2) Apparently Meeklo wasn't really concerned about that. It's been discussed ad nauseam. From a reasonable person standpoint, it was clear that 1Cool was going to use a veto after discussions in PM. Meeklo essentially tried to trump being fired by quitting.

 

3) EvenInHisYouth - this situation was difficult as it immediately followed the Meeklo incident. I don't think the guy was being malicious. But I think this would lead to precedent. I couldn't give him a strike because there was no rule in place. So again, I put him in red and didn't give him a strike, but made a new rule.

 

4) fmaz. I didn't see it. I woke up to a PM from fmaz admitting that he took the offer because he wants to jump in, but didn't know if his offer was "good enough" so he was nervous. I had believed he had immediately retracted his offer. It was one of those things that I HOPED no one saw it and we'd let it go. Nope. Apparently people want blood. I get it - it looks inconsistent. But after this PM, I've been coaching him and encouraging him and he had completely honest and fair intentions. He admitted early on that he cared more for the thread than claiming an offer and stalling the thread. This "rescission" was NOT the intention I wanted to protect against by the formation of the rule.

 

Everyone needs to realize - moderating this thread is NOT easy. I don't like it. Part of me wants to close down this thread and be done with it. But I'm trying. Luckily I have some good friends behind the scenes that are encouraging me. But it's not easy. I've asked people repeatedly to not just dump their ideas, suggestions, complaints, what not in the thread. Feel free to PM me.

 

But that is my reasoning for the decisions I have made. You don't have to agree with them. I'm not going to address them again. If that makes me a dictator/tyrant with "righteous indignation" so be it. I started the thread. No one else. PIF existed for a long time before I even got here. I just couldn't take watching others screw the system that had such great altruistic intentions behind it.

 

People have said it from the start - I have as well. And it's not meant to be snide or snarky. But no one is forced to participate in this thread. This thread could end tomorrow and I'd be okay with that. I can moderate it to death, but I can't force people to participate. I want to encourage new people to join in and at times I will need to make unpopular decisions. Please realize - there is a lot of grey though and I'm trying my best.

 

Best way to summarize:

 

“You can please some of the people some of the time all of the people some of the time some of the people all of the time but you can never please all of the people all of the time.”

[Shadow Images]

I just think think you guys like to argue and have nothing better to do some times.

[Jiminy_Cricket-migration]

Some people just wanna watch the world burn.

[Kystix]

Some people just wanna watch the world burn.

 

[Awax]

 

 

Just running through

[jsilverjanet]

 

Just running through

I thought you were using a cane?

[Meeklo]

2) Apparently Meeklo wasn't really concerned about that. It's been discussed ad nauseam. From a reasonable person standpoint, it was clear that 1Cool was going to use a veto after discussions in PM. Meeklo essentially tried to trump being fired by quitting.

 

Yeah...except that's not what happened and most people on here see it now. Every time you re-iterate what you think happened, you shoot yourself in the foot.

 

I'm done explaining it over again. Like Hector said, we need to stop arguing about this.

 

If you want to moderate, then listen to everyone's POV. Otherwise you have chaos. You never once PM'd me and allow me to explain what I did...you just made assumptions. That's not how you moderate a thread.

[Jiminy_Cricket-migration]

I'd like to thank HS for doing such a tremendous job with this thread. You are a true asset to this community.

[1Cool]

If you want to moderate, then listen to everyone's POV. Otherwise you have chaos. You never once PM'd me and allow me to explain what I did...you just made assumptions. That's not how you moderate a thread.

 

Chaos is the absence of order. Having one person deciding on the slight variations seems pretty orderly. Not democratic but very orderly.

[DeadpoolJr.]

This is not a democracy its comic general!

[KPR Comics]

2) Apparently Meeklo wasn't really concerned about that. It's been discussed ad nauseam. From a reasonable person standpoint, it was clear that 1Cool was going to use a veto after discussions in PM. Meeklo essentially tried to trump being fired by quitting.

 

Yeah...except that's not what happened and most people on here see it now. Every time you re-iterate what you think happened, you shoot yourself in the foot.

 

I'm done explaining it over again. Like Hector said, we need to stop arguing about this.

 

If you want to moderate, then listen to everyone's POV. Otherwise you have chaos. You never once PM'd me and allow me to explain what I did...you just made assumptions. That's not how you moderate a thread.

 

[1Cool]

This is not a democracy its comic general!

 

This whole message board is not a democracy. The higher ups issue changes to the boards and we adjust. Some people try to fight and complain to get things changed back to the way it was but in the end its not a democracy.

[Jiminy_Cricket-migration]

2) Apparently Meeklo wasn't really concerned about that. It's been discussed ad nauseam. From a reasonable person standpoint, it was clear that 1Cool was going to use a veto after discussions in PM. Meeklo essentially tried to trump being fired by quitting.

 

Yeah...except that's not what happened and most people on here see it now. Every time you re-iterate what you think happened, you shoot yourself in the foot.

 

I'm done explaining it over again. Like Hector said, we need to stop arguing about this.

 

If you want to moderate, then listen to everyone's POV. Otherwise you have chaos. You never once PM'd me and allow me to explain what I did...you just made assumptions. That's not how you moderate a thread.

 

This thread has a No PMs with Amazon Drop Shipper's Rule.

[Meeklo]

2) Apparently Meeklo wasn't really concerned about that. It's been discussed ad nauseam. From a reasonable person standpoint, it was clear that 1Cool was going to use a veto after discussions in PM. Meeklo essentially tried to trump being fired by quitting.

 

Yeah...except that's not what happened and most people on here see it now. Every time you re-iterate what you think happened, you shoot yourself in the foot.

 

I'm done explaining it over again. Like Hector said, we need to stop arguing about this.

 

If you want to moderate, then listen to everyone's POV. Otherwise you have chaos. You never once PM'd me and allow me to explain what I did...you just made assumptions. That's not how you moderate a thread.

 

This thread has a No PMs with Amazon Drop Shipper's Rule.

 

There is nothing wrong with buying them from Amazon. Me spending money that I barely have hurts as well. I'm not quite sure where this negative opinion of Amazon came from but it should probably stop.

[Gunnz]

This is not a democracy its comic general!

 

[ChrisInBaltimore]

2) Apparently Meeklo wasn't really concerned about that. It's been discussed ad nauseam. From a reasonable person standpoint, it was clear that 1Cool was going to use a veto after discussions in PM. Meeklo essentially tried to trump being fired by quitting.

 

Yeah...except that's not what happened and most people on here see it now. Every time you re-iterate what you think happened, you shoot yourself in the foot.

 

I'm done explaining it over again. Like Hector said, we need to stop arguing about this.

 

If you want to moderate, then listen to everyone's POV. Otherwise you have chaos. You never once PM'd me and allow me to explain what I did...you just made assumptions. That's not how you moderate a thread.

 

This thread has a No PMs with Amazon Drop Shipper's Rule.

 

There is nothing wrong with buying them from Amazon. Me spending money that I barely have hurts as well. I'm not quite sure where this negative opinion of Amazon came from but it should probably stop.

 

Let me ask, have you watched this thread? Most of the items exchanged have been valued at $100+, correct? Have you noticed that fact?

 

As someone with a small budget, I know I can't participate. I could only return with small items like you offered. That is why I wouldn't participate.

 

Why did you try to participate know you didn't have the income?

 

I don't condone Harvey's response, but I'm curious about your motivation to take an offer…

[vaillant]

Harvey, it’s not about decisions, at least not for me.

 

It’s entirely about how people are treated. I think pretty much everyone (including Chip and Meeklo) agree or have agreed – more or less explicitly – that the offer(s) might have been inadequate. Meeklo did not even contest the strike (I did), and Chip was humble enough to come here and apologize by posting a very good offer.

 

But people (not only you) keep mocking, or insulting or deriding – to which end?

You just assume, and not only that, we continue to imply people are not generous, while they are simply not attuned to the thread rules.

MikeNYC pointed out I should not generalize the discourse reducing it on a dissertation on generosity: OK, but then once again, what we are speaking of is not always necessarily "generosity" as it seems implied?

 

I think that everything would settle pretty much nicely if you’d stop using those irritatingly silly emoticons too.

[HarveySwick]

Meeklo - you can't honestly feign innocence and being naive again.

 

You did this VERY same thing in the PIF thread months ago and were called out on it. It's not a one time, innocent mistake. It starts to look like a pattern.

 

LINK

 

[Meeklo]

2) Apparently Meeklo wasn't really concerned about that. It's been discussed ad nauseam. From a reasonable person standpoint, it was clear that 1Cool was going to use a veto after discussions in PM. Meeklo essentially tried to trump being fired by quitting.

 

Yeah...except that's not what happened and most people on here see it now. Every time you re-iterate what you think happened, you shoot yourself in the foot.

 

I'm done explaining it over again. Like Hector said, we need to stop arguing about this.

 

If you want to moderate, then listen to everyone's POV. Otherwise you have chaos. You never once PM'd me and allow me to explain what I did...you just made assumptions. That's not how you moderate a thread.

 

This thread has a No PMs with Amazon Drop Shipper's Rule.

 

There is nothing wrong with buying them from Amazon. Me spending money that I barely have hurts as well. I'm not quite sure where this negative opinion of Amazon came from but it should probably stop.

 

Let me ask, have you watched this thread? Most of the items exchanged have been valued at $100+, correct? Have you noticed that fact?

 

As someone with a small budget, I know I can't participate. I could only return with small items like you offered. That is why I wouldn't participate.

 

Why did you try to participate know you didn't have the income?

 

I don't condone Harvey's response, but I'm curious about your motivation to take an offer…

 

And that is the exact reason I'm not contesting the strike. I should have researched values better before posting a for that ASM #50. If anyone goes back…especially to the post I rescinded in, I say that is the reason for me rescinding.

 

I will contest the strike on the basis that "I rescinded to avoid an impending strike" like Harvey keeps saying over and over ad nauseum, which is not what happened. Most people seem to understand this now.

 

I know this is a hard job that Harvey made for himself, I would just like for him to give at least some of the benefit of the doubt and realize that his view may have been incorrect. If he is unable to have any understanding for the "offender" he will be repeating this again and again.

[Meeklo]

Meeklo - you can't honestly feign innocence and being naive again.

 

You did this VERY same thing in the PIF thread months ago and were called out on it. It's not a one time, innocent mistake. It starts to look like a pattern.

 

LINK

 

 

Yeah…that was when I first started and I offered junk. I did not have a clear understanding of that thread…perhaps I can say the same about this one. The difference this time is I did not offer junk. I have had plenty of people in this thread and in PMs say my offers on here were good and they would have been willing to take them. Sure it wasn't valued as much as that ASM #50, but it wasn't either.