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Second Action 1 9.0 to hit the census

Started by Gotham Kid,

723 posts in this topic

Tsp99

Tsp99

Posted
Posted
this book was on the census...maybe it didn't stay in an 8.0 slab long so cgc removed from census

 

There were 2 cgc 8.0 entries on the census for 2 1/2 years, and of course we know the "known" copy is the KC.

 

Why, then, did everyone say this book was hidden from the census starting in 2010?

 

I think people are generally relying on the concept that a major book is going to show up at a major venue and/or at least have a scan surface publicly at this point... which has not happened in several cases.

 

In addition to the "unknown" 8.0 and 8.5 entries, there's also the 7.5 which has been on the census for ages, and I think you have it noted as a 2002 sale, but I don't think there's a scan of it out there and it's rarely mentioned when we talk about hg Action #1's here... but certainly one of the best books out there in a slab.

 

So, out of sight, out of mind, I think.

 

Though by comparison, the top of the Tec 27 census hasn't changed nearly as much in recent years, and the top 3 slabbed copies of Supes 1 have been on the census since 2004 (!), which is pretty remarkable.

 

Yeah, Superman #1 is a nutty book. Plentiful in low grade and rare as hen's teeth in high grade.

 

I'm surprised at the stagnation on Detective 27 as well. You would think the big story of the sale would have shaken out something new. I guess not.

 

I wouldn't characterize Superman 1 as plentiful in any grade. The census supports my theory.

 

Universal copies on census:

 

Superman #1 - 38

Action Comics #1 - 27 35 :hi:

Detective #27 - 29

Batman #1 - 86

Captain America #1 - 63

 

It is much more aligned with Action 1 and Tec 27 than Bat 1 or Cap 1, which are considered "plentiful" for GA key books

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Marvel Zombie

Marvel Zombie

Posted
Posted
this book was on the census...maybe it didn't stay in an 8.0 slab long so cgc removed from census

 

There were 2 cgc 8.0 entries on the census for 2 1/2 years, and of course we know the "known" copy is the KC.

 

Why, then, did everyone say this book was hidden from the census starting in 2010?

 

I think people are generally relying on the concept that a major book is going to show up at a major venue and/or at least have a scan surface publicly at this point... which has not happened in several cases.

 

In addition to the "unknown" 8.0 and 8.5 entries, there's also the 7.5 which has been on the census for ages, and I think you have it noted as a 2002 sale, but I don't think there's a scan of it out there and it's rarely mentioned when we talk about hg Action #1's here... but certainly one of the best books out there in a slab.

 

So, out of sight, out of mind, I think.

 

Though by comparison, the top of the Tec 27 census hasn't changed nearly as much in recent years, and the top 3 slabbed copies of Supes 1 have been on the census since 2004 (!), which is pretty remarkable.

 

Yeah, Superman #1 is a nutty book. Plentiful in low grade and rare as hen's teeth in high grade.

 

I'm surprised at the stagnation on Detective 27 as well. You would think the big story of the sale would have shaken out something new. I guess not.

 

I wouldn't characterize Superman 1 as plentiful in any grade. The census supports my theory.

 

Universal copies on census:

 

Superman #1 - 38

Action Comics #1 - 27 35 :hi:

Detective #27 - 29

Batman #1 - 86

Captain America #1 - 63

 

It is much more aligned with Action 1 and Tec 27 than Bat 1 or Cap 1, which are considered "plentiful" for GA key books

 

 

from the census it seems tec 27 is clearly RARER than action 1 ... hm

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Twistty1

Twistty1

Posted
Posted
this book was on the census...maybe it didn't stay in an 8.0 slab long so cgc removed from census

 

There were 2 cgc 8.0 entries on the census for 2 1/2 years, and of course we know the "known" copy is the KC.

 

Why, then, did everyone say this book was hidden from the census starting in 2010?

 

I think people are generally relying on the concept that a major book is going to show up at a major venue and/or at least have a scan surface publicly at this point... which has not happened in several cases.

 

In addition to the "unknown" 8.0 and 8.5 entries, there's also the 7.5 which has been on the census for ages, and I think you have it noted as a 2002 sale, but I don't think there's a scan of it out there and it's rarely mentioned when we talk about hg Action #1's here... but certainly one of the best books out there in a slab.

 

So, out of sight, out of mind, I think.

 

Though by comparison, the top of the Tec 27 census hasn't changed nearly as much in recent years, and the top 3 slabbed copies of Supes 1 have been on the census since 2004 (!), which is pretty remarkable.

 

Yeah, Superman #1 is a nutty book. Plentiful in low grade and rare as hen's teeth in high grade.

 

I'm surprised at the stagnation on Detective 27 as well. You would think the big story of the sale would have shaken out something new. I guess not.

 

I wouldn't characterize Superman 1 as plentiful in any grade. The census supports my theory.

 

Universal copies on census:

 

Superman #1 - 38

Action Comics #1 - 27 35 :hi:

Detective #27 - 29

Batman #1 - 86

Captain America #1 - 63

 

It is much more aligned with Action 1 and Tec 27 than Bat 1 or Cap 1, which are considered "plentiful" for GA key books

 

 

from the census it seems tec 27 is clearly RARER than action 1 ... hm

this book was on the census...maybe it didn't stay in an 8.0 slab long so cgc removed from census

 

There were 2 cgc 8.0 entries on the census for 2 1/2 years, and of course we know the "known" copy is the KC.

 

Why, then, did everyone say this book was hidden from the census starting in 2010?

 

I think people are generally relying on the concept that a major book is going to show up at a major venue and/or at least have a scan surface publicly at this point... which has not happened in several cases.

 

In addition to the "unknown" 8.0 and 8.5 entries, there's also the 7.5 which has been on the census for ages, and I think you have it noted as a 2002 sale, but I don't think there's a scan of it out there and it's rarely mentioned when we talk about hg Action #1's here... but certainly one of the best books out there in a slab.

 

So, out of sight, out of mind, I think.

 

Though by comparison, the top of the Tec 27 census hasn't changed nearly as much in recent years, and the top 3 slabbed copies of Supes 1 have been on the census since 2004 (!), which is pretty remarkable.

 

Yeah, Superman #1 is a nutty book. Plentiful in low grade and rare as hen's teeth in high grade.

 

I'm surprised at the stagnation on Detective 27 as well. You would think the big story of the sale would have shaken out something new. I guess not.

 

I wouldn't characterize Superman 1 as plentiful in any grade. The census supports my theory.

 

Universal copies on census:

 

Superman #1 - 38

Action Comics #1 - 27 35 :hi:

Detective #27 - 29

Batman #1 - 86

Captain America #1 - 63

 

It is much more aligned with Action 1 and Tec 27 than Bat 1 or Cap 1, which are considered "plentiful" for GA key books

 

 

from the census it seems tec 27 is clearly RARER than action 1 ... hm

Yes.

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Bronty

Bronty

Posted
Posted

Its as simple as this IMO

 

action 1 1938

tec 27 1939

superman 1 1939

batman 1 1940

cap 1 1941

 

the later the date the more common the book (generally). Its the same sort of thing that applies to the second hero wave as well, a 1962 marvel is going to be tougher than a 1966. As the superhero ages ramped up, more copies are saved.

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Crowzilla

Crowzilla

Posted
Posted

 

I wouldn't characterize Superman 1 as plentiful in any grade. The census supports my theory.

 

Universal copies on census:

 

Superman #1 - 38

Action Comics #1 - 27

Detective #27 - 29

Batman #1 - 86

Captain America #1 - 63

 

It is much more aligned with Action 1 and Tec 27 than Bat 1 or Cap 1, which are considered "plentiful" for GA key books

 

That's a horrible comparison Bill.

There are more restored Superman 1s on the census than there are either combined universal/restored Tec 27s or combined universal/restored Action 1s.- or more than the combined universal Action #1s/Tec 27s.

 

It's not common like Bat 1 and Cap 1, but nowhere near Action 1/Tec 27 either

Everyone and their brother used to get Supes 1 restored and those numbers are being borne out on the census as it's weighted better than 5 to 3 towards restored copies.

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tth2

tth2

Posted
Posted

 

I wouldn't characterize Superman 1 as plentiful in any grade. The census supports my theory.

 

Universal copies on census:

 

Superman #1 - 38

Action Comics #1 - 27

Detective #27 - 29

Batman #1 - 86

Captain America #1 - 63

 

It is much more aligned with Action 1 and Tec 27 than Bat 1 or Cap 1, which are considered "plentiful" for GA key books

 

That's a horrible comparison Bill.

There are more restored Superman 1s on the census than there are either combined universal/restored Tec 27s or combined universal/restored Action 1s.- or more than the combined universal Action #1s/Tec 27s.

 

It's not common like Bat 1 and Cap 1, but nowhere near Action 1/Tec 27 either

Everyone and their brother used to get Supes 1 restored and those numbers are being borne out on the census as it's weighted better than 5 to 3 towards restored copies.

Great point.

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ciorac

ciorac

Posted
Posted

 

I wouldn't characterize Superman 1 as plentiful in any grade. The census supports my theory.

 

Universal copies on census:

 

Superman #1 - 38

Action Comics #1 - 27

Detective #27 - 29

Batman #1 - 86

Captain America #1 - 63

 

It is much more aligned with Action 1 and Tec 27 than Bat 1 or Cap 1, which are considered "plentiful" for GA key books

 

That's a horrible comparison Bill.

There are more restored Superman 1s on the census than there are either combined universal/restored Tec 27s or combined universal/restored Action 1s.- or more than the combined universal Action #1s/Tec 27s.

 

It's not common like Bat 1 and Cap 1, but nowhere near Action 1/Tec 27 either

Everyone and their brother used to get Supes 1 restored and those numbers are being borne out on the census as it's weighted better than 5 to 3 towards restored copies.

Great point.

 

It's a valid point, when taken out of the context in which I replied.

 

It is still laced with the same hyperbole the person I was responding to used. Plentiful and Superman #1 shouldn't be used in the same sentence.

 

Nor should "everyone and their brother used to get Supes 1 restored" be considered a valid, let alone great, point. I didn't, and neither did my brother.

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tth2

tth2

Posted
Posted

 

I wouldn't characterize Superman 1 as plentiful in any grade. The census supports my theory.

 

Universal copies on census:

 

Superman #1 - 38

Action Comics #1 - 27

Detective #27 - 29

Batman #1 - 86

Captain America #1 - 63

 

It is much more aligned with Action 1 and Tec 27 than Bat 1 or Cap 1, which are considered "plentiful" for GA key books

 

That's a horrible comparison Bill.

There are more restored Superman 1s on the census than there are either combined universal/restored Tec 27s or combined universal/restored Action 1s.- or more than the combined universal Action #1s/Tec 27s.

 

It's not common like Bat 1 and Cap 1, but nowhere near Action 1/Tec 27 either

Everyone and their brother used to get Supes 1 restored and those numbers are being borne out on the census as it's weighted better than 5 to 3 towards restored copies.

Great point.

 

It's a valid point, when taken out of the context in which I replied.

 

It is still laced with the same hyperbole the person I was responding to used. Plentiful and Superman #1 shouldn't be used in the same sentence.

It`s all relative, Bill. None of these books--Action 1, Tec 27 or Superman 1--is considered a rare or scarce book in any way, unless you start talking about high grade.

 

Nor should "everyone and their brother used to get Supes 1 restored" be considered a valid, let alone great, point. I didn't, and neither did my brother.

:eyeroll:

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rob_react

rob_react

Posted
Posted

 

I wouldn't characterize Superman 1 as plentiful in any grade. The census supports my theory.

 

Universal copies on census:

 

Superman #1 - 38

Action Comics #1 - 27

Detective #27 - 29

Batman #1 - 86

Captain America #1 - 63

 

It is much more aligned with Action 1 and Tec 27 than Bat 1 or Cap 1, which are considered "plentiful" for GA key books

 

That's a horrible comparison Bill.

There are more restored Superman 1s on the census than there are either combined universal/restored Tec 27s or combined universal/restored Action 1s.- or more than the combined universal Action #1s/Tec 27s.

 

It's not common like Bat 1 and Cap 1, but nowhere near Action 1/Tec 27 either

Everyone and their brother used to get Supes 1 restored and those numbers are being borne out on the census as it's weighted better than 5 to 3 towards restored copies.

Great point.

 

It's a valid point, when taken out of the context in which I replied.

 

It is still laced with the same hyperbole the person I was responding to used. Plentiful and Superman #1 shouldn't be used in the same sentence.

 

Nor should "everyone and their brother used to get Supes 1 restored" be considered a valid, let alone great, point. I didn't, and neither did my brother.

 

I've been guilty of hyperbole before, but omitting the work "relatively" when comparing the availability of Superman #1 and Action #1 and Detective #27 isn't one of my greatest crimes.

 

And my actual point remains, it's a weird book in high grade, with potentially NO 9+ copies (shrug)

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MrBedrock

MrBedrock

Posted
Posted

Nor should "everyone and their brother used to get Supes 1 restored" be considered a valid, let alone great, point. I didn't, and neither did my brother.

I know that you bought your copy restored, but I heard that your brother sent his to Matt.

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ciorac

ciorac

Posted
Posted

Nor should "everyone and their brother used to get Supes 1 restored" be considered a valid, let alone great, point. I didn't, and neither did my brother.

I know that you bought your copy restored, but I heard that your brother sent his to Matt.

 

Only for a pressing

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MrBedrock

MrBedrock

Posted
Posted

Nor should "everyone and their brother used to get Supes 1 restored" be considered a valid, let alone great, point. I didn't, and neither did my brother.

I know that you bought your copy restored, but I heard that your brother sent his to Matt.

 

Only for a pressing

Who did the piece replacement?

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Ze-man

Ze-man

Posted
Posted

Nor should "everyone and their brother used to get Supes 1 restored" be considered a valid, let alone great, point. I didn't, and neither did my brother.

I know that you bought your copy restored, but I heard that your brother sent his to Matt.

 

Only for a pressing

Who did the piece replacement?

 

A brother from another mother?

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medusanyc

medusanyc

Posted
Posted

i may have missed it but i just read on the it's just comics blog that the book was on the census for 2 1/2 years but it was held back etc....

 

why would a book be held back from the census? the seems very dishonest. i always took the census as a fact and truth. now i find out that books can be held back from being listed. seems a little fishy as if requested a book can be not mentioned as to make another similar copy more valuable etc...

 

anyone else have an opinion on this piece of news

 

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G.A.tor

G.A.tor

Posted
Posted
i may have missed it but i just read on the it's just comics blog that the book was on the census for 2 1/2 years but it was held back etc....

 

why would a book be held back from the census? the seems very dishonest. i always took the census as a fact and truth. now i find out that books can be held back from being listed. seems a little fishy as if requested a book can be not mentioned as to make another similar copy more valuable etc...

 

anyone else have an opinion on this piece of news

that's incorrect information, but it has been discussed to death in previous posts in this thread (thumbs u
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markseifert

markseifert

Posted
Posted
i may have missed it but i just read on the it's just comics blog that the book was on the census for 2 1/2 years but it was held back etc....

 

why would a book be held back from the census? the seems very dishonest. i always took the census as a fact and truth. now i find out that books can be held back from being listed. seems a little fishy as if requested a book can be not mentioned as to make another similar copy more valuable etc...

 

anyone else have an opinion on this piece of news

that's incorrect information, but it has been discussed to death in previous posts in this thread (thumbs u

 

CGCdata.com shows:

 

2 entries at 8.0 from Nov 14 2011 to July 22 2014 (and obviously one could draw conclusions from the end date there)

 

[The second 9.0 appears on July 29 2014, the next week's data dump]

 

2 entries at 8.5 from Dec 11 2011 to Aug 17 2013

 

http://cgcdata.com/cgc/search/comicid/1995

 

So, I'm presuming the accuracy of that, at least as far as what he's been given. I also haven't asked, but would presume he doesn't get legacy data when he gets the dumps (just the most recent census, because it wouldn't seem to make much sense for them to give him the old data again), so if either of those are in error, the errors have probably been around awhile.

 

Anyway, that's what I based that on. Definitely happy to be corrected if anybody has verifiable info. (thumbs u

 

[edit to add -- and of course, presuming that's accurate and given the "mystery" of the 8.5 entry, there are some other possibilities. But seeing a string of uninterrupted 8.0 entries from 2011 to last month is pretty suggestive.]

 

[edit 2 -- take the rumors that have popped up in this thread from credible individuals, and combine them with this data, and you could come up with a couple of plausible scenarios.]

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rob_react

rob_react

Posted
Posted
i may have missed it but i just read on the it's just comics blog that the book was on the census for 2 1/2 years but it was held back etc....

 

why would a book be held back from the census? the seems very dishonest. i always took the census as a fact and truth. now i find out that books can be held back from being listed. seems a little fishy as if requested a book can be not mentioned as to make another similar copy more valuable etc...

 

anyone else have an opinion on this piece of news

that's incorrect information, but it has been discussed to death in previous posts in this thread (thumbs u

 

CGCdata.com shows:

 

2 entries at 8.0 from Nov 14 2011 to July 22 2014 (and obviously one could draw conclusions from the end date there)

 

[The second 9.0 appears on July 29 2014, the next week's data dump]

 

2 entries at 8.5 from Dec 11 2011 to Aug 17 2013

 

http://cgcdata.com/cgc/search/comicid/1995

 

So, I'm presuming the accuracy of that, at least as far as what he's been given. I also haven't asked, but would presume he doesn't get legacy data when he gets the dumps (just the most recent census, because it wouldn't seem to make much sense for them to give him the old data again), so if either of those are in error, the errors have probably been around awhile.

 

Anyway, that's what I based that on. Definitely happy to be corrected if anybody has verifiable info. (thumbs u

 

[edit to add -- and of course, presuming that's accurate and given the "mystery" of the 8.5 entry, there are some other possibilities. But seeing a string of uninterrupted 8.0 entries from 2011 to last month is pretty suggestive of one scenario.]

 

I'll have to clarify the timeline on the site. I didn't realize that there was constant flow from the 8.0 to the 9.0 the next week. The book was never withheld then, just the grade bump was.

 

God this is confusing.

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markseifert

markseifert

Posted
Posted

God this is confusing.

 

Yep.

 

Actually, come to think it, if you put all the rumors in this thread in a bag with that info (again, presuming the accuracy of the CGCdata info), you could come up with a couple of plausible possibilities.

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medusanyc

medusanyc

Posted
Posted
i may have missed it but i just read on the it's just comics blog that the book was on the census for 2 1/2 years but it was held back etc....

 

why would a book be held back from the census? the seems very dishonest. i always took the census as a fact and truth. now i find out that books can be held back from being listed. seems a little fishy as if requested a book can be not mentioned as to make another similar copy more valuable etc...

 

anyone else have an opinion on this piece of news

that's incorrect information, but it has been discussed to death in previous posts in this thread (thumbs u

 

i have since just read this whole thread and know a lot more than i did before. but this is all i knew before hand based on what Rob had posted

 

WHICH WAS THIS (verbatim)

The book was in the census for two and a half years. It was only held back from the census after the upgrade in order to coincide with San Diego, the Overstreet Price Guide and the launch of eBay's page on the auction.

 

Accoring to Gator on the CGC forums the book will be starting at .99 with a reserve well below the $3,000,000 minimum bid/reserve we were speculating on earlier. This is a good move as far as I'm concerned.

 

The book sold in 2010, after the Kansas City copy for over a million dollars. We still don't have a confirmed price, but it must have been competitive to the other books that were selling at the time.

 

Now my bigger question is this. is all this talk about this book being a previous 8.0 and has been manipulated up to this 9.0 just conjecture or fact? not that it matters in light of it's current condition to me (i am not one that is bothered by pressing)

 

i am definately in the camp that i think it is dishonest to keep a book out of the census for any reason.

 

that all being said this is one pretty book with beautiful pages

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