Cerebus 1 a more valuable key than Hulk 181? Really Overstreet? Poll on Page 87 3 3

[RockMyAmadeus]

like minds are free to disagree. (thumbs u

 

-J.

 

You have repeated this...it doesn't mean what you think it means. If you disagree, by definition, you are NOT "like minded."

 

What *I* mean by it is two intelligent, and intelligently debating comic book enthusiasts.

 

-J.

 

I understand what *you* mean by it...it's still incorrect.

 

If I say "Bubble gum is chewy" but I *really* mean "The US Constitution is a valuable contract", I have failed to communicate properly, by using the language incorrectly.

 

Not minutiae. Critical to understanding.

[RockMyAmadeus]

The 9.4 sale is actually 15% below the peak price paid for the grade ten years ago, and if you look at all the sales in between, the needle hasn't moved in that grade since GPA started keeping records.

 

This is not true.

 

There has only been a single recorded sale, ever, of a 9.4 Universal Cerebus #1.

 

By definition, it has neither gone up NOR down.

 

The sale you keep citing is a SS 9.4, and the SS market is different from the Universal market. They cannot be reasonably compared.

 

RIP and I have been inter changing blue/yellow sales due simply to the lack of significant sales data for the cerebus 1

But like I said before, if you want to compare like to like, the hulk 181 SS that sold for $3700 utterly destroys anything a 9.2 cerebus 1 SS has ever sold for.

 

You cannot compare extremely rare books, with a handful of recorded sales over years, to the highest ever sale of a book that sells in every grade on a regular basis.

 

Why do you leave out relevant information? You can see, with your own two eyes, that the $3700 sale you cite here is a Sig Series copy signed by Stan Lee, Len Wein, Herb Trimpe, and John Romita Sr. It is the highest sale, by far, of this book in this grade. It is also $1,000 higher than the NEXT highest sale EVER of an SS book in this grade, and $500 higher than the highest Universal copy EVER (and $950 higher than the next highest Universal)..which sales have taken place in the last month.

 

These are relevant, pertinent details...and yet...nothing. No mention by you whatsoever. No context for this sale provided by you at all. None.

 

And your argument is littered...absolutely littered...with such tactics. It is intellectually dishonest, and yet....you keep doing it.

 

You cite the most outlying examples, completely fail to provide actual context for these sales, and post as if it's typical.

 

You grant nothing, allow nothing, concede nothing, admit nothing.

 

You are trying to compare what cannot be compared, and this is not reasonable.

 

Though I am sure that won't stop you from fantasizing what one "might" sell for. I would wager around $2500-$2800 on a good day. Feel free to disagree if you want. Doesn't make me wrong or you right.

 

-J.

 

That is correct. It also doesn't make me wrong or you right, which is precisely the point that has been made the entire time. Without reliable data, it comes down to what is reasonable.

 

When you draw conclusions, it is "based on data and context." When other, much more experienced, much more educated in the market people draw opposing conclusions, they are just "speculating."

 

 

[Rip]

The 9.4 sale is actually 15% below the peak price paid for the grade ten years ago, and if you look at all the sales in between, the needle hasn't moved in that grade since GPA started keeping records.

 

This is not true.

 

There has only been a single recorded sale, ever, of a 9.4 Universal Cerebus #1.

 

By definition, it has neither gone up NOR down.

 

The sale you keep citing is a SS 9.4, and the SS market is different from the Universal market. They cannot be reasonably compared.

 

RIP and I have been inter changing blue/yellow sales due simply to the lack of significant sales data for the cerebus 1

But like I said before, if you want to compare like to like, the hulk 181 SS that sold for $3700 utterly destroys anything a 9.2 cerebus 1 SS has ever sold for. Though I am sure that won't stop you from fantasizing what one "might" sell for. I would wager around $2500-$2800 on a good day. Feel free to disagree if you want. Doesn't make me wrong or you right.

 

-J.

 

The 9.4 sale is actually 15% below the peak price paid for the grade ten years ago, and if you look at all the sales in between, the needle hasn't moved in that grade since GPA started keeping records.

 

This is not true.

 

There has only been a single recorded sale, ever, of a 9.4 Universal Cerebus #1.

 

By definition, it has neither gone up NOR down.

 

The sale you keep citing is a SS 9.4, and the SS market is different from the Universal market. They cannot be reasonably compared.

 

RIP and I have been inter changing blue/yellow sales due simply to the lack of significant sales data for the cerebus 1

But like I said before, if you want to compare like to like, the hulk 181 SS that sold for $3700 utterly destroys anything a 9.2 cerebus 1 SS has ever sold for. Though I am sure that won't stop you from fantasizing what one "might" sell for. I would wager around $2500-$2800 on a good day. Feel free to disagree if you want. Doesn't make me wrong or you right.

 

-J.

I fail to see how repeating this point advances your position when it was already discussed pages ago. I agree the $3700 H181 signed by many people utterly destroys the 9.2 Cerebus 1 SS sale. Is there a new point

 

 

Do you believe is it possible a Blue Cerebus 9.2 might go for more than a Blue Hulk 181 9.2

As a seller what would your BIN for a Blue Cerebus 1 CGC 9.2 be?

A. $3000 Even better than "a good day"

B. $3000-3500

C. $3500-4000

D. More than $4000

 

Would anyone here pick something other than D?

Now it doesn't mean it will sell but now then what would you price the BIN on a Hulk 9.2,... lower or higher than the Cerebus?

 

This question is for everyone.

Edited September 9, 2014 by Rip

[RockMyAmadeus]

I feel this has been the problem more or less with a lot of the responses in this thread... seizing upon the minutiae of a post and glossing over the main points of a post..

 

On the one hand, you are the only one "posting your arguments with data and context", and on the other hand, when other people post their arguments with data and context, they are "seizing upon the minutiae of a post and glossing over the main points."

 

It is genuinely (no sarcasm) breathtaking watching you post, Jaydog. You are a master of propaganda. I have no doubt, if you were of a mind, you could be an extremely successful politician.

 

.....or salesman.

 

-J.

 

No, that's not true. Salesmen cannot deliberately lie and expect to be successful in the long term. Politicians can. In fact, they must.

 

Except I haven't "lied" about anything. If anything, that kind of inflammatory mis-characterization is better suited in politics.

 

-J.

 

Yes, you have. You were clearly corrected on the "15% decline" statement, which isn't true, but you keep repeating it. If you keep repeating something that isn't true, after you have been corrected about it multiple times, what other conclusion is there...?

 

There has only been a single sale of a 9.4 Universal Cerebus #1. Therefore, by definition, it can neither have risen nor declined in value. You keep trying to compare it to a Sig Series 9.4, and the two aren't comparable.

 

You have been informed of this, repeatedly, but you have ignored it and continued to repeat your claim.

 

Is that not the heart of a lie? Saying something you know isn't true?

 

Why do you put "lied" in quotes?

[Prince Namor]

The 9.4 sale is actually 15% below the peak price paid for the grade ten years ago, and if you look at all the sales in between, the needle hasn't moved in that grade since GPA started keeping records.

 

This is not true.

 

There has only been a single recorded sale, ever, of a 9.4 Universal Cerebus #1.

 

By definition, it has neither gone up NOR down.

 

The sale you keep citing is a SS 9.4, and the SS market is different from the Universal market. They cannot be reasonably compared.

 

RIP and I have been inter changing blue/yellow sales due simply to the lack of significant sales data for the cerebus 1

But like I said before, if you want to compare like to like, the hulk 181 SS that sold for $3700 utterly destroys anything a 9.2 cerebus 1 SS has ever sold for. Though I am sure that won't stop you from fantasizing what one "might" sell for. I would wager around $2500-$2800 on a good day. Feel free to disagree if you want. Doesn't make me wrong or you right.

 

-J.

 

Once again...

For a book with so few 9.0 and up copies in blue label, it's appeal in that blue label increases for HG collector.

 

IT becomes the white whale. The pretty girl who is unavailable.

It's enchantment will draw a bigger game hunter.

 

You simply do not understand the marketplace.

[RockMyAmadeus]

 

RIP and I have been inter changing blue/yellow sales due simply to the lack of significant sales data for the cerebus 1

But like I said before, if you want to compare like to like, the hulk 181 SS that sold for $3700 utterly destroys anything a 9.2 cerebus 1 SS has ever sold for. Though I am sure that won't stop you from fantasizing what one "might" sell for. I would wager around $2500-$2800 on a good day. Feel free to disagree if you want. Doesn't make me wrong or you right.

 

-J.

 

Once again...

For a book with so few 9.0 and up copies in blue label, it's appeal in that blue label increases for HG collector.

 

IT becomes the white whale. The pretty girl who is unavailable.

It's enchantment will draw a bigger game hunter.

 

You simply do not understand the marketplace.

 

And if I may be so bold as to speak for Chuck, he's not saying you're stupid, or incapable of learning. It's nothing personal. You just don't understand it now.

 

That's why I rarely post in Gold. I know next to nothing about that market. I may know a good deal about the history of the era, and I may know which issues are important, but the market for them? Outside of my beloved Batman, very little clue, because it's not what I deal with (and, frankly, don't want to know...it is doubtless a field of endless heartbreak and frustration.)

 

There are several people who betray their lack of understanding of this market just by what they say (and don't say), like the fellow who tried to compare GL #76 to Cerebus #1. GL #76 has nearly 1200 copies just on the CGC census. That's 60% of the entire print run of Cerebus #1 when it was brand new in 1977, never mind the raw copies of GL #76, which exist by the tens of thousands, and the copies of Cerebus #1 that have been lost to time.

 

 

[rjrjr]

Comiclink is pretty transparent, but they are in the business of comic book sales. They will give you whatever data you need, but you have to call them up and ask them for it. They want to get you on the phone, which is smart business, so they can ask if you would like to consign anything in the next auction.

As far as the Cerebus back issues, it was 25% of OPG, not .25%.

If you saw two raw copies of 181 and Cerebus #1, and they both looked 9.2/9.4, and you had $2200 and had to buy one you have to choose the Cerebus. If you chose the Hulk, and the Cerebus 1 came in 9.4 after a press, you would have just left 3-5k on the table.

 

Thank you Blaze I have made that correction in my post regarding the 25% of OPG. (thumbs u

 

I feel this has been the problem more or less with a lot of the responses in this thread... seizing upon the minutiae of a post and glossing over the main points of a post.

 

And I'm not a dealer, I don't look at comics that way. I understand that you are and you do, and I understand that is why a lot of DEALERS would take the cerebus.

 

I, on the other hand (like the vast majority of buyers) am a collector, not a dealer. If I was a dealer that looked for flipping potential in a book after much effort (ie pressing), and I had time to wait for an interested buyer to eventually show up I would probably pick the cerebus 1. If I found a hulk 181 9.2 for a song, that looked pressable and I needed money quickly, I would take the 181. I might make less money in the long run, but at least I know I would have a quick turnaround on my investment. Time is money.

 

But this isn't about what a dealer would do. Again, this thread is about the real world values of a hulk 181/cerebus 1, 9.2 versus what OPG reported in the 2014 guide, and how it skewed his BA rankings.

 

-J.

 

I'm not so much a dealer as an investor. I try to use arbitrage to upgrade my collection. If I need cash for stuff like taxes or medical deductibles then I will take some money off the table. I don't work shows and stuff so I have to rely on guys like Dale, Donut and TopNotch for non Internet related sales info.

I've stated before this is a close call. The recent strong sales of 181 weren't accessible when the 2014 OPG was released. I don't think anyone knew the Hulk keys, #'s 1, 181, 271, would perform so well. Next year these two might flip again. I, however, do feel the upside of the Cerebus #1 and the facts associated such as no recent sales in high grade=pent up demand, 5 digit sales in 9.4, no copies in 9.6, equate to it being the more desirable book for a dealer/investor in the market right now this very second.

If you have not watched the comiclink auctions before there are some great books in the one ending tonight. Sometimes some sell at blow out gpa prices, and other times you can score some deals. They usually have some real nice FF's you could add to that awfully nice sig line you've got already.

 

Thank you Blaze. I am definitely lurking in the weeds in a few lots in that C-Link auction.

 

I am agreeing with your points 100% as a matter of fact. And yes your points expose a flaw in OPG's now out dated methodology. No, he could not have known what a hulk 181 would do this year. Yet his guide cites "2014" values. If the guide reported on 2013 values, in his 2014 edition, I personally would have no gripe, and I doubt the OP would have started the thread.

 

But yes, I would imagine that, after the year the 181 has had, the 2015 OPG will have it handily over the Cerebus. Time will tell...

 

-J.

 

So, the 100+ pages of posts on this subject boil down to the year? Isn't it common sense that OSPG would be reporting on data it received, not data it hasn't received?

 

I remember the argument starting that there were not enough sales of Cerebus 1 for it to be listed higher than IH 181, then the arguments shifted to which character was more popular, then there were lots of numbers (GPA and otherwise) thrown around, and we are now saying OSPG messed up by using the wrong year.

[Jaydogrules]

The 9.4 sale is actually 15% below the peak price paid for the grade ten years ago, and if you look at all the sales in between, the needle hasn't moved in that grade since GPA started keeping records.

 

This is not true.

 

There has only been a single recorded sale, ever, of a 9.4 Universal Cerebus #1.

 

By definition, it has neither gone up NOR down.

 

The sale you keep citing is a SS 9.4, and the SS market is different from the Universal market. They cannot be reasonably compared.

 

RIP and I have been inter changing blue/yellow sales due simply to the lack of significant sales data for the cerebus 1

But like I said before, if you want to compare like to like, the hulk 181 SS that sold for $3700 utterly destroys anything a 9.2 cerebus 1 SS has ever sold for. Though I am sure that won't stop you from fantasizing what one "might" sell for. I would wager around $2500-$2800 on a good day. Feel free to disagree if you want. Doesn't make me wrong or you right.

 

-J.

 

Once again...

For a book with so few 9.0 and up copies in blue label, it's appeal in that blue label increases for HG collector.

 

IT becomes the white whale. The pretty girl who is unavailable.

It's enchantment will draw a bigger game hunter.

 

You simply do not understand the marketplace.

 

....and there you go, arguing out of both sides of your mouth again.

 

Your "white whale" theory is junk. In fact, it only makes the fact that the 9.4 blue cerebus 1 sold for 15% LESS than the 9.4 SS 10 years earlier look even more sad.

 

By your own unfounded and speculative "logic" buyers should have been lining up out the door for the unique opportunity to obtain an elusive example of a blue label 9.4, and that it should have gone for MORE than the SS copy ten years earlier.

 

When in reality, and unfortunately to your own "argument" the book tanked in its very top grade, failing even to reach the heights of its "less desirable" yellow label copy from a decade earlier. Factoring in inflation, and the "blue label bump" that you claim exists, how much would you say that 15% drop in value actually was?

 

Yet you and your compadres still attempt to argue (now counter even to OPG I might add), that a 9.2 would somehow scale the heights of GPA record books and shatter the $3k mark in a blue label, in spite of the fact that the last recorded sale of the 9.2 label SS sold for $2100 (nine years ago) and would more likely than not follow its 9.4 counterpart into a 10-15% price slide in a worst case scenario, or, in a better case scenario, equal the sales price of that SS copy, which also would be, not coincidentally, its OPG value.

 

Your statements are generally spurious, and borderline offensive in your attempts to be condescending and personal. I would recommend that you compare crib notes with your compadres before you click "submit" on your next post so that you are at least walking in the same chorus line in your cerebus 1/OPG apologist parade.

 

-J.

 

[rjrjr]

Forgot to add:

 

I have no doubt IH 181 will be listed higher on the most valuable BA comics list that Cerebus 1 next year. It has gone up this year and I don't have any reason to believe that will change in the next 4-5 months.

Edited September 9, 2014 by rjrjr

[Jaydogrules]

Comiclink is pretty transparent, but they are in the business of comic book sales. They will give you whatever data you need, but you have to call them up and ask them for it. They want to get you on the phone, which is smart business, so they can ask if you would like to consign anything in the next auction.

As far as the Cerebus back issues, it was 25% of OPG, not .25%.

If you saw two raw copies of 181 and Cerebus #1, and they both looked 9.2/9.4, and you had $2200 and had to buy one you have to choose the Cerebus. If you chose the Hulk, and the Cerebus 1 came in 9.4 after a press, you would have just left 3-5k on the table.

 

Thank you Blaze I have made that correction in my post regarding the 25% of OPG. (thumbs u

 

I feel this has been the problem more or less with a lot of the responses in this thread... seizing upon the minutiae of a post and glossing over the main points of a post.

 

And I'm not a dealer, I don't look at comics that way. I understand that you are and you do, and I understand that is why a lot of DEALERS would take the cerebus.

 

I, on the other hand (like the vast majority of buyers) am a collector, not a dealer. If I was a dealer that looked for flipping potential in a book after much effort (ie pressing), and I had time to wait for an interested buyer to eventually show up I would probably pick the cerebus 1. If I found a hulk 181 9.2 for a song, that looked pressable and I needed money quickly, I would take the 181. I might make less money in the long run, but at least I know I would have a quick turnaround on my investment. Time is money.

 

But this isn't about what a dealer would do. Again, this thread is about the real world values of a hulk 181/cerebus 1, 9.2 versus what OPG reported in the 2014 guide, and how it skewed his BA rankings.

 

-J.

 

I'm not so much a dealer as an investor. I try to use arbitrage to upgrade my collection. If I need cash for stuff like taxes or medical deductibles then I will take some money off the table. I don't work shows and stuff so I have to rely on guys like Dale, Donut and TopNotch for non Internet related sales info.

I've stated before this is a close call. The recent strong sales of 181 weren't accessible when the 2014 OPG was released. I don't think anyone knew the Hulk keys, #'s 1, 181, 271, would perform so well. Next year these two might flip again. I, however, do feel the upside of the Cerebus #1 and the facts associated such as no recent sales in high grade=pent up demand, 5 digit sales in 9.4, no copies in 9.6, equate to it being the more desirable book for a dealer/investor in the market right now this very second.

If you have not watched the comiclink auctions before there are some great books in the one ending tonight. Sometimes some sell at blow out gpa prices, and other times you can score some deals. They usually have some real nice FF's you could add to that awfully nice sig line you've got already.

 

Thank you Blaze. I am definitely lurking in the weeds in a few lots in that C-Link auction.

 

I am agreeing with your points 100% as a matter of fact. And yes your points expose a flaw in OPG's now out dated methodology. No, he could not have known what a hulk 181 would do this year. Yet his guide cites "2014" values. If the guide reported on 2013 values, in his 2014 edition, I personally would have no gripe, and I doubt the OP would have started the thread.

 

But yes, I would imagine that, after the year the 181 has had, the 2015 OPG will have it handily over the Cerebus. Time will tell...

 

-J.

 

So, the 100+ pages of posts on this subject boil down to the year? Isn't it common sense that OSPG would be reporting on data it received, not data it hasn't received?

 

I remember the argument starting that there were not enough sales of Cerebus 1 for it to be listed higher than IH 181, then the arguments shifted to which character was more popular, then there were lots of numbers (GPA and otherwise) thrown around, and we are now saying OSPG messed up by using the wrong year.

 

Actually the only shifting sands have been those arguing in advance of the cerebus 1. See my post above. And yes OPG got the "2014 value" for hulk 181 wrong. Way wrong. Also part of the OP'S original point and the identical one I am still making now beneath the quick sand of logic being spouted by the opposing position. Oy vay I'm starting to sound like RMA . That's probably my cue to bow out.

 

-J.

[bababooey]

[bronze johnny]

Forgot to add:

 

I have no doubt IH 181 will be listed higher on the most valuable BA comics list that Cerebus 1 next year. It has gone up this year and I don't have any reason to believe that will change in the next 4-5 months.

 

One thing I want to add and it goes back to my bringing attention to OAAW 83 being excluded from the top 20 Silver Age books even after the well respected writers of the War Report lobbied Overstreet to have the Rock's 1st app. included (see the War Report where they mention this). I also want to bring attention to the fact that Fantastic Four 4 was also excluded from the list when it has the same current value as Fantastic Four 2. It was not an oversight to exclude OAAW 83 from the list since it was publicly announced that such lobbying with Overstreet took place. Nor was it a conspiracy. Perhaps it's just Overstreet using his discretion? This is the most plausible explanation for me and I don't have a problem with it since it's Bob's book and he has his reasons (editorial discretion?) and it's his right. Now if there's room for discretion to decide which books go or stay on the list, why would it be unreasonable to make discretionary decisions about other books and whether they belong on a particular list?

 

Also, if you look at Gator's thread over in CG about Baltimore Comic Con, he mentions selling 70 copies of Hulk 181!

[Prince Namor]

The 9.4 sale is actually 15% below the peak price paid for the grade ten years ago, and if you look at all the sales in between, the needle hasn't moved in that grade since GPA started keeping records.

 

This is not true.

 

There has only been a single recorded sale, ever, of a 9.4 Universal Cerebus #1.

 

By definition, it has neither gone up NOR down.

 

The sale you keep citing is a SS 9.4, and the SS market is different from the Universal market. They cannot be reasonably compared.

 

RIP and I have been inter changing blue/yellow sales due simply to the lack of significant sales data for the cerebus 1

But like I said before, if you want to compare like to like, the hulk 181 SS that sold for $3700 utterly destroys anything a 9.2 cerebus 1 SS has ever sold for. Though I am sure that won't stop you from fantasizing what one "might" sell for. I would wager around $2500-$2800 on a good day. Feel free to disagree if you want. Doesn't make me wrong or you right.

 

-J.

 

Once again...

For a book with so few 9.0 and up copies in blue label, it's appeal in that blue label increases for HG collector.

 

IT becomes the white whale. The pretty girl who is unavailable.

It's enchantment will draw a bigger game hunter.

 

You simply do not understand the marketplace.

 

....and there you go, arguing out of both sides of your mouth again.

 

No. You simply DON'T understand the marketplace. You're embarrassing yourself.

 

Your "white whale" theory is junk.

 

Some of the biggest prices ever achieved in this hobby are based upon it. You really DON'T understand, do you?

 

In fact, it only makes the fact that the 9.4 blue cerebus 1 sold for 15% LESS than the 9.4 SS 10 years earlier look even more sad.

 

Ten years earlier (going into, what, CGC's fourth year?) and it was the highest graded copy EVER. There were no other UHG copies around.

(According to GPA, a 7.0? was the next highest?)

You DO realize how that would impact it's value and demand...right? RIGHT?

So it sold big.

That's how the market works. It was a white whale. It sold big.

There was A LOT of that going on in the early days.

Comparing a 2004 Bronze 9.4 sale to a 2014 Bronze 9.4 sale, in just about anything, is going to give you some weird numbers because of how the market has changed.

But if you understood the market, you'd know that.

 

By your own unfounded and speculative "logic" buyers should have been lining up out the door for the unique opportunity to obtain an elusive example of a blue label 9.4, and that it should have gone for MORE than the SS copy ten years earlier.

 

It did sell for more. The 9.4 SS had settled into a $7700 price range and the blue label sold for $9000. That's an increase.

BASED UPON NUMBERS TOO SMALL TO MAKE A DEFINITIVE STATEMENT OF FMV.

Only someone who didn't understand the market would try to use a 10 year old ONLY HG copy EVER AT THE TIME sale to compare it.

You really don't understand this do you?

 

When in reality, and unfortunately to your own "argument" the book tanked

 

tanked?

 

Even IF, you were having an argument with someone as less understanding of the market as you, and you were to make the comparison, as two people who were clueless as to what they were talking about, it would be a complete exaggeration to refer to $10,600 to $9000 as having 'tanked'.

 

But that's the sort of intellectual dishonesty you consistently display.

 

Even in your inability to understand the numbers, you have to come up with exaggerations.

 

in its very top grade, failing even to reach the heights of its "less desirable" yellow label copy from a decade earlier. Factoring in inflation, and the "blue label bump" that you claim exists, how much would you say that 15% drop in value actually was?

 

 

Yet you and your compadres still attempt to argue (now counter even to OPG I might add), that a 9.2 would somehow scale the heights of GPA record books and shatter the $3k mark in a blue label, in spite of the fact that the last recorded sale of the 9.2 label SS sold for $2100 (nine years ago) and would more likely than not follow its 9.4 counterpart into a 10-15% price slide in a worst case scenario, or, in a better case scenario, equal the sales price of that SS copy, which also would be, not coincidentally, its OPG value.

 

All I hear is "I'll protect you Wolverine!"

 

Your statements are generally spurious, and borderline offensive in your attempts to be condescending and personal.

 

Your statements are completely spurious, and borderline offensive in their lack of understanding of what it is you think you're an authority on. It can get messy in here, you might want to wear a helmet.

But I WILL apologize, if anything I've said, you feel I meant as a personal attack. Sorry.

 

I would recommend that you compare crib notes with your compadres before you click "submit" on your next post so that you are at least walking in the same chorus line in your cerebus 1/OPG apologist parade.

-J.

 

See and then you have to go and say that.

 

[Prince Namor]

Forgot to add:

 

I have no doubt IH 181 will be listed higher on the most valuable BA comics list that Cerebus 1 next year. It has gone up this year and I don't have any reason to believe that will change in the next 4-5 months.

 

One thing I want to add and it goes back to my bringing attention to OAAW 83 being excluded from the top 20 Silver Age books even after the well respected writers of the War Report lobbied Overstreet to have the Rock's 1st app. included (see the War Report where they mention this). I also want to bring attention to the fact that Fantastic Four 4 was also excluded from the list when it has the same current value as Fantastic Four 2. It was not an oversight to exclude OAAW 83 from the list since it was publicly announced that such lobbying with Overstreet took place. Nor was it a conspiracy. Perhaps it's just Overstreet using his discretion? This is the most plausible explanation for me and I don't have a problem with it since it's Bob's book and he has his reasons (editorial discretion?) and it's his right. Now if there's room for discretion to decide which books go or stay on the list, why would it be unreasonable to make discretionary decisions about other books and whether they belong on a particular list?

 

Also, if you look at Gator's thread over in CG about Baltimore Comic Con, he mentions selling 70 copies of Hulk 181!

 

No one's debating the popularity of Hulk 181.

 

It's a hot book. It's a seller. No one's questioning that.

[bronze johnny]

Forgot to add:

 

I have no doubt IH 181 will be listed higher on the most valuable BA comics list that Cerebus 1 next year. It has gone up this year and I don't have any reason to believe that will change in the next 4-5 months.

 

One thing I want to add and it goes back to my bringing attention to OAAW 83 being excluded from the top 20 Silver Age books even after the well respected writers of the War Report lobbied Overstreet to have the Rock's 1st app. included (see the War Report where they mention this). I also want to bring attention to the fact that Fantastic Four 4 was also excluded from the list when it has the same current value as Fantastic Four 2. It was not an oversight to exclude OAAW 83 from the list since it was publicly announced that such lobbying with Overstreet took place. Nor was it a conspiracy. Perhaps it's just Overstreet using his discretion? This is the most plausible explanation for me and I don't have a problem with it since it's Bob's book and he has his reasons (editorial discretion?) and it's his right. Now if there's room for discretion to decide which books go or stay on the list, why would it be unreasonable to make discretionary decisions about other books and whether they belong on a particular list?

 

Also, if you look at Gator's thread over in CG about Baltimore Comic Con, he mentions selling 70 copies of Hulk 181!

 

No one's debating the popularity of Hulk 181.

 

It's a hot book. It's a seller. No one's questioning that.

 

 

I'd say selling 70 copies at one Con says it's a special book. But we are not debating the uniqueness of this book either?

[rjrjr]

Also, if you look at Gator's thread over in CG about Baltimore Comic Con, he mentions selling 70 copies of Hulk 181!

 

 

 

No one's debating the popularity of Hulk 181.

 

It's a hot book. It's a seller. No one's questioning that.

 

 

I'd say selling 70 copies at one Con says it's a special book. But we are not debating the uniqueness of this book either?

 

He didn't sell 70 copies at one con.

Edited September 10, 2014 by rjrjr

[HighStakesComics]

Those are his ytd sales.

[bronze johnny]

Also, if you look at Gator's thread over in CG about Baltimore Comic Con, he mentions selling 70 copies of Hulk 181!

 

 

 

No one's debating the popularity of Hulk 181.

 

It's a hot book. It's a seller. No one's questioning that.

 

 

I'd say selling 70 copies at one Con says it's a special book. But we are not debating the uniqueness of this book either?

 

He didn't sell 70 copies at one con.

 

Correct- my mistake - for the year.

[RockMyAmadeus]

In fact, it only makes the fact that the 9.4 blue cerebus 1 sold for 15% LESS than the 9.4 SS 10 years earlier look even more sad.

 

Finally.

 

Dragged, kicking and screaming the whole way, to an accurate representation of the facts.

 

 

You still, however, do not understand the market for very rare books.

[Prince Namor]

Also, if you look at Gator's thread over in CG about Baltimore Comic Con, he mentions selling 70 copies of Hulk 181!

 

 

 

No one's debating the popularity of Hulk 181.

 

It's a hot book. It's a seller. No one's questioning that.

 

 

I'd say selling 70 copies at one Con says it's a special book. But we are not debating the uniqueness of this book either?

 

He didn't sell 70 copies at one con.

 

Correct- my mistake - for the year.

 

No one is surprised that it's a huge seller for him. It's a huge seller for anyone.

 

No special insight of the marketplace needed to see that.