mattn792 Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, fantastic_four said: They're not going to fire the most accomplished female producer in Hollywood history handpicked by Lucas to helm his company just because of Solo and the same handful of fringe fans that screamed throughout the aughts about the prequels. Her resume is almost unparalleled and reads like a highlight list of box office smashes. She's been in the top ten of the top box office list among all producers for three decades and is currently second behind Feige. Fans need to focus their ire somewhere else. Kennedy is untouchable. I think your conclusion is correct at present. Ultimately no one is untouchable, but it would take a string of several failures in a row for Disney to oust her. And with the Star Wars brand, that seems very unlikely to occur. I said it earlier that I think IX will make a billion dollars just by showing up at the box office. For a moment, let's assume the worst about the movie -- its derided by the same core group as being as bad as TLJ, while it still manages to match or slightly underperform TLJ's total box office. Does Disney see that as another success? Or do they view it as an opportunity lost? I believe they'll see it as the former, while I'd argue they should see it as the latter. I will drop everything to watch The Force Awakens -- well cast, a blast to watch, renewed sense of "realness", foibles and all. That said, there's no reason any of the subsequent Episodes shouldn't be able to blow past it's box office total. VII should be seen as setting the base, not the ceiling. Edited August 28, 2018 by mattn792 You're vs your, the eternal struggle... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhamlau Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 1 hour ago, fantastic_four said: They're not going to fire the most accomplished female producer in Hollywood history handpicked by Lucas to helm his company just because of Solo and the same handful of fringe fans that screamed throughout the aughts about the prequels. Her resume is almost unparalleled and reads like a highlight list of box office smashes. She's been in the top ten of the top box office list among all producers for three decades and is currently second behind Feige. Third on the all-time list is her husband Frank Marshall. Fans need to focus their ire somewhere else. Kennedy is untouchable. It's like idle speculation about how the Warriors will be trading Steph Curry or the Patriots will be trading Tom Brady because they didn't win the Finals or Super Bowl by enough points. TJL made nearly 1 billion dollar less then TFA.That can very easily kill a career in a town where you seem to only be as good as your last outing. They did not make that film and spent that money to expect to do close to 40% less than the previous outing. I don't think they were expecting this level of deep and sustained fan backlash and apathy leading to lack of interest in future products. TFA and its spin-off follow up Rogue One combined did 3.3 Billion. TJL and its follow up Spin Off Solo did 1.7 Billion.That's not normal fall off, especially considering these films were unworldly ({un intended?) expensive to make. I feel that fall off in huge part is directly tied to TLJ and the choices greenlight by KK in that movie, im not alone by any means in that analysis. Past performance I think has to be factored you are right, but again Disney will only go so long with someone helming a ship that appears to be sinking. Cancelling spinoff movies, to me, speaks volumes. I also think the completely debacle of the director hiring/firing through Solo cant be waved away either. That you could have such a fundamental misunderstanding of what the project was supposed to be, this far into it, is mind blowing. I'd LOVE to see how much money TJL made in licensing versus TFA, that would tell the truest story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fantastic_four Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 9 minutes ago, zhamlau said: TJL made nearly 1 billion dollar less then TFA.That can very easily kill a career in a town where you seem to only be as good as your last outing. And won the box office anyway for 2017. This is like speculating that they're going to fire Bellichick for winning the Super Bowl but not by enough points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhamlau Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 45 minutes ago, mattn792 said: I said it earlier that I think IX will make a billion dollars just by showing up at the box office. I think this is a key point. These core films, on title alone, would make 1 billion each (if one didnt, there would be more then one firing lol). Again, i would be Disney isnt looking at the fact that it made the default threshold and be satisfied. I think they look at TFA and think "this is what we can get if we hit our audience right". This thread alone seems to be proof of the fan divide and on some level anger. Thats NOT something Disney wants. They want to sell mugs, teeshirts, and plastic figures. They want something that appeals across the board, and branches out into foreign markets, namely China. You wanna see something interesting, look at the fall off in China (aka what disney thinks is its future by way of its film productions and expanding presence there). TFA did 124 million in China TJL did 42 Million in China For Spin offs Rogue one did 62 million (also seen 69 million before but cant find now) Solo did 9 million (!!!) Thats dangerous to Disney, that is the exact opposite of what they want to see considering their push there. I think that alone is giving them pause. The brand under her seems to be dying in their hopeful future playground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhamlau Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 (edited) 6 minutes ago, fantastic_four said: 17 minutes ago, zhamlau said: TJL made nearly 1 billion dollar less then TFA.That can very easily kill a career in a town where you seem to only be as good as your last outing. And won the box office anyway for 2017. This is like speculating that they're going to fire Bellichick for winning the Super Bowl but not by enough points. No its not, its showing failure to maintain. Also TFA had to fend off Jurassic Park, An Avengers Movie, and a Disney Pixar Movie. TLJ had to beat Jumanji 2.0 and a remake of Beauty and the beast (which it just BARELY edged out). Edited August 28, 2018 by zhamlau Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince Namor Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 Your opinion isn’t in question. Only when you present opinion as fact. No credible source is saying she’s going to be fired or that all the movies are on hold. If it was true it’d be MAJOR news. Its just NOT true. No matter how badly people want it to be. Nothing personal is involved. It’s just a fact. Gatsby77 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WernerVonDoom Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 Kathleen Kennedy has been involved with too many amazing movies to count. Unfortunately, she also oversaw the steaming pile that was TLJ and cost the studio likely $500M to $1B. If she was anyone but KK, she be fired and deservedly so. I like pie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince Namor Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 36 minutes ago, Werner_Von_Doom said: Kathleen Kennedy has been involved with too many amazing movies to count. Unfortunately, she also oversaw the steaming pile that was TLJ and cost the studio likely $500M to $1B. If she was anyone but KK, she be fired and deservedly so. How do you figure? Episode 8 did 34% less than Episode 7 domestically and about 37% less Worldwide. The first movie did much better than the first. But Episode 2 did about 34% less than Episode 1 domestically and about 37% less Worldwide. Its virtually the same statistical drop. The time between the first movie of each of those trilogies automatically builds up a strong desire to see them multiple times. And realistically both 2nd movies performed about the same percentage down from the first. No one lost money - that’s just how the business works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WernerVonDoom Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 3 minutes ago, Chuck Gower said: How do you figure? Episode 8 did 34% less than Episode 7 domestically and about 37% less Worldwide. The first movie did much better than the first. But Episode 2 did about 34% less than Episode 1 domestically and about 37% less Worldwide. Its virtually the same statistical drop. The time between the first movie of each of those trilogies automatically builds up a strong desire to see them multiple times. And realistically both 2nd movies performed about the same percentage down from the first. No one lost money - that’s just how the business works. Are you honestly trying to say that if TLJ had an 90% audience rating it would have made the same as the one with a 46% rating? That the only factor was that it was the second movie? Come on. If you want to argue the amount of drop, that is a discussion. But there is no way there was no loss of money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattn792 Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 1 hour ago, Chuck Gower said: How do you figure? Episode 8 did 34% less than Episode 7 domestically and about 37% less Worldwide. The first movie did much better than the first. But Episode 2 did about 34% less than Episode 1 domestically and about 37% less Worldwide. Its virtually the same statistical drop. The time between the first movie of each of those trilogies automatically builds up a strong desire to see them multiple times. And realistically both 2nd movies performed about the same percentage down from the first. No one lost money - that’s just how the business works. The figures being what they are, wouldn’t you think Disney would want to aim for a higher bar than “well, let’s keep with the trend of a 66% take from the prior movie”? I like pie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockMyAmadeus Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 Episode IX will have flying Super Ewoks doing hands-free light saber tricks with Darth Maul. You mark my words. You heard it here first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockMyAmadeus Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 On 7/26/2018 at 6:40 AM, mattn792 said: THE REITSISTANCE ...what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number 6 Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 6 minutes ago, RockMyAmadeus said: Episode IX will have flying Super Ewoks doing hands-free light saber tricks with Darth Maul. You mark my words. You heard it here first. Interest rising.... zhamlau 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattn792 Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 7 minutes ago, RockMyAmadeus said: ...what? You mean you DON’T want to see Leia single handedly take down the First Order by utilizing the stock market while at the same time paying her shareholders a hefty quarterly dividend? What happened to you RMA? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince Namor Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 42 minutes ago, mattn792 said: The figures being what they are, wouldn’t you think Disney would want to aim for a higher bar than “well, let’s keep with the trend of a 66% take from the prior movie”? Opening weekend it hit expectations. Long term, the movie did over a BILLION dollars. It was #1 BluRay/DVD seller of the year. Did they want more? They always want more. No ones getting fired over it. That’s just silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockMyAmadeus Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 25 minutes ago, mattn792 said: You mean you DON’T want to see Leia single handedly take down the First Order by utilizing the stock market while at the same time paying her shareholders a hefty quarterly dividend? What happened to you RMA? I used to be an OK guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince Namor Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, Werner_Von_Doom said: Are you honestly trying to say that if TLJ had an 90% audience rating it would have made the same as the one with a 46% rating? That the only factor was that it was the second movie? Come on. If you want to argue the amount of drop, that is a discussion. But there is no way there was no loss of money. 46% rating? on IMDb.com, which has about 200,000 more votes than ‘rotten tomatoes’ it has a 7.2 out of 10. CinemaScore which most all studios use for matching up ratings with success was at 89%. Critics loved it. And it was the #1 selling DVD/bluRay of the year - despite constant online backlash, plenty of people still wanted to buy it. And most importantly - Disney CEO Bob Iger loved it. Edited August 29, 2018 by Chuck Gower Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince Namor Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 2 hours ago, Werner_Von_Doom said: Are you honestly trying to say that if TLJ had an 90% audience rating it would have made the same as the one with a 46% rating? That the only factor was that it was the second movie? Come on. If you want to argue the amount of drop, that is a discussion. But there is no way there was no loss of money. Let me put it another way. If you have expectations for your movie to do $1 Billion worldwide and it does $2 Billion... and then you do a sequel, with the same expectations ($1 Billion), and it makes $1 Billion... You didn't lose any money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WernerVonDoom Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 15 minutes ago, Chuck Gower said: 46% rating? on IMDb.com, which has about 4 times the votes of ‘rotten tomatoes’ it has a 7.2 out of 10. CinemaScore which most all studios use for matching up ratings with success was at 89%. Critics loved it. And it was the #1 selling DVD/bluRay of the year - despite constant online backlash, plenty of people still wanted to buy it. And most importantly - Disney CEO Bob Iger loved it. Force Awakens had home sales of $189M. Last Jedi $83M. New Hope had home sales of $30M. Empire Strikes Back $27M. $100M loss, not counting missed repeat ticket sales and Solo. Disney accountants definitely are not pleased. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince Namor Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 4 minutes ago, Werner_Von_Doom said: Force Awakens had home sales of $189M. Last Jedi $83M. New Hope had home sales of $30M. Empire Strikes Back $27M. $100M loss, not counting missed repeat ticket sales and Solo. Disney accountants definitely are not pleased. So if I make $10 at my lemonade stand one day and only $5 the next, that means I lost $5? What kind of math is that? mattn792 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
