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Potential Comic Art Fans Scam Alert
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199 posts in this topic

Here you go:

 

Go right ahead Bill! Your site is not the center of my world.

Glad to know how much you care about your members and if they get ripped off.

 

Ankur

 

From: Bill Cox

To: Ankur Jetley

Sent: Thursday, January 14, 2016 10:24 PM

Subject: Re: ComicArtFans.com Contact Results

 

Whatever you say, Ankur. I shut her gallery down when you emailed me this morning. I'll shut yours down now as well.

 

 

I support you 100%...why PUNISH YOU...you are not the crook, you just want what you paid for...the CAF is upside down....hello Mr Bill Shot, I mean Mr. Big shot....have you ever heard of e-bay...probably not...that is why you are afraid to come on the boards...please ask e-bay if ban the BUYERs after they get ripped off and also get kicked off the system..and as far as third party posting....that is shows who we are dealing with..somebody who is aware of the boards..yet afraid to face tough questions..

 

 

 

 

Mitch, pump the brakes. Literally everything you wrote is incorrect, misguided and misinformed.

 

Bill is the guy who has single handedly transformed the OA collecting hobby in th least 12 years with very little benefit to himself. He is free to run his site as he sees fit. He's not afraid of anything. He's busy running his site and his business and doesn't need to entertain every attempted character assassination on every message board to prove to you he's a big strong brave man.

 

On the flip side we've got collectors attaching themselves like a remora to the underbelly of CAF never contributing one thin dime or one small moment of earnest appreciation to the site or Bill, and reaping the benefits of buying and selling and profiting for well over a decade. Then, when a too good to be true deal blows in in their face and they think that Bill is not moving fast enough, they are quick to imply that Bill owes them something beyond everything they've already taken for free and without heaitation.

 

Just once try and figure out what's going on before launching into the usual silliness.

 

From your statement - Bill/CAF owes nothing. The flip side of that coin is that they owe nothing in return. He provides a free service that you can if you want move into a paid account. He doesn't force users to do that and it appears he doesn't expect users to be paying members. If he did then he should change the site into a pay site.

 

Actually, you misunderstand. Bill has already provided everything. For free. To everyone. The result of that is people can and do transact at their own risk. When their greed or desire outpaces their common sense and they run into an issue they are not in a position to make demands of Bill and the site off of which they have sought to profit without fee or cost.

 

I've run into scammers on caf before. I make note of it to Bill and he handles it. Like he handled it here. He had blocked the sellers account 12 hours before Ankur demanded he do so implying CAF owed him something, and without realizing it had already been done.

 

Then he began his campaign here.

 

Bill,has already provided the site, for free, to everyone. The least we can return is respect towards him when a problem arises beyond implications that more is owed and demanded.

 

If Bill doesn't place cookies and then sell the data collected from them then I would agree with your statement. However, if the cookies track users and where they venture to on the internet and that data is sold then we have a different ball game going on. The free service is used for a benefit.

 

I have no idea if that is the case. If it isn't then he is missing a LARGE revenue stream.

 

 

If you think that's a large enough revenue stream to overcome the constant need for bandwidth, upgraded servers and other expenses then you just might be overestimating the size and scope of that revenue stream on a site like CAF.

 

I didn't say it was a charity site. I said the site isn't a cash cow for Bill. That's especially true when you factor in and average the 12 plus years of operation, and all the expenses appurtenant. Then add in the free users, some of which buying and selling 5 figure pieces on a regular basis yet contributing nothing to the site other than strain on bandwidth and storage space and you'll see that there is as much giving from Bill than taking by him, if not more.

 

None of which is relevant to what is being discussed here of course. People getting something for free, then blaming the person who gave it to them for free for not ceding immediately to their demands, when the blame lies with the seller who screwed them.

 

So this site was set up out of the goodness of the owner's heart? There is no benefit to him? I think Ankur is getting unjustly set upon and Bill is getting a massive reach around. Do you guys also think the banks had nothing to do with the collapse in 07?

 

 

This of course is just my opinion. No one is responsible for anything anymore.

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Here you go:

 

Go right ahead Bill! Your site is not the center of my world.

Glad to know how much you care about your members and if they get ripped off.

 

Ankur

 

From: Bill Cox

To: Ankur Jetley

Sent: Thursday, January 14, 2016 10:24 PM

Subject: Re: ComicArtFans.com Contact Results

 

Whatever you say, Ankur. I shut her gallery down when you emailed me this morning. I'll shut yours down now as well.

 

 

I support you 100%...why PUNISH YOU...you are not the crook, you just want what you paid for...the CAF is upside down....hello Mr Bill Shot, I mean Mr. Big shot....have you ever heard of e-bay...probably not...that is why you are afraid to come on the boards...please ask e-bay if ban the BUYERs after they get ripped off and also get kicked off the system..and as far as third party posting....that is shows who we are dealing with..somebody who is aware of the boards..yet afraid to face tough questions..

 

 

 

 

Mitch, pump the brakes. Literally everything you wrote is incorrect, misguided and misinformed.

 

Bill is the guy who has single handedly transformed the OA collecting hobby in th least 12 years with very little benefit to himself. He is free to run his site as he sees fit. He's not afraid of anything. He's busy running his site and his business and doesn't need to entertain every attempted character assassination on every message board to prove to you he's a big strong brave man.

 

On the flip side we've got collectors attaching themselves like a remora to the underbelly of CAF never contributing one thin dime or one small moment of earnest appreciation to the site or Bill, and reaping the benefits of buying and selling and profiting for well over a decade. Then, when a too good to be true deal blows in in their face and they think that Bill is not moving fast enough, they are quick to imply that Bill owes them something beyond everything they've already taken for free and without heaitation.

 

Just once try and figure out what's going on before launching into the usual silliness.

 

From your statement - Bill/CAF owes nothing. The flip side of that coin is that they owe nothing in return. He provides a free service that you can if you want move into a paid account. He doesn't force users to do that and it appears he doesn't expect users to be paying members. If he did then he should change the site into a pay site.

 

Actually, you misunderstand. Bill has already provided everything. For free. To everyone. The result of that is people can and do transact at their own risk. When their greed or desire outpaces their common sense and they run into an issue they are not in a position to make demands of Bill and the site off of which they have sought to profit without fee or cost.

 

I've run into scammers on caf before. I make note of it to Bill and he handles it. Like he handled it here. He had blocked the sellers account 12 hours before Ankur demanded he do so implying CAF owed him something, and without realizing it had already been done.

 

Then he began his campaign here.

 

Bill,has already provided the site, for free, to everyone. The least we can return is respect towards him when a problem arises beyond implications that more is owed and demanded.

 

If Bill doesn't place cookies and then sell the data collected from them then I would agree with your statement. However, if the cookies track users and where they venture to on the internet and that data is sold then we have a different ball game going on. The free service is used for a benefit.

 

I have no idea if that is the case. If it isn't then he is missing a LARGE revenue stream.

 

 

If you think that's a large enough revenue stream to overcome the constant need for bandwidth, upgraded servers and other expenses then you just might be overestimating the size and scope of that revenue stream on a site like CAF.

 

I didn't say it was a charity site. I said the site isn't a cash cow for Bill. That's especially true when you factor in and average the 12 plus years of operation, and all the expenses appurtenant. Then add in the free users, some of which buying and selling 5 figure pieces on a regular basis yet contributing nothing to the site other than strain on bandwidth and storage space and you'll see that there is as much giving from Bill than taking by him, if not more.

 

None of which is relevant to what is being discussed here of course. People getting something for free, then blaming the person who gave it to them for free for not ceding immediately to their demands, when the blame lies with the seller who screwed them.

 

So this site was set up out of the goodness of the owner's heart? There is no benefit to him? I think Ankur is getting unjustly set upon and Bill is getting a massive reach around. Do you guys also think the banks had nothing to do with the collapse in 07?

 

 

This of course is just my opinion. No one is responsible for anything anymore.

 

 

lol. Massive stretch comparing a website that doesn't make a penny off of transactions and specifically states that people transact at their own risk as a term of service agreed to before the account can activated to banks that actually perpetuated, aggravated, and participated in the collapse of 2007.

 

Why don't you ask cgc how many years it took for them to turn a profit ? They actually sell a product and service that's been the leader in the field for years and I guarantee you it took them the better part of a decade.

 

 

Maybe you should get to know Ankur and get to know Bill before choosing a position on this, you may be grateful that you did. More information is always better than less.

 

I am sure Ankur would be thankful for the support if he wasn't content that the spotlight hamdniw moved on to another thread instead of this one.

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So this site was set up out of the goodness of the owner's heart?

 

Yes it was actually. I wanted to get to know other collectors and I felt giving them a place to show their collections would be my way of introducing myself to them. We never had ads on the site, or made any revenue for many years until dealers asked to advertise on the site.

 

There is no benefit to him?

 

What does that have to do with Ankur striking a deal with a seller? The answer would be "absolutely nothing".

 

I think Ankur is getting unjustly set upon and Bill is getting a massive reach around.

 

I've got no opinion about Ankur on a personal level, only that he is clearly in the wrong by suggesting CAF be responsible for his lack of due diligence in vetting a seller.

 

And if that was a reach around I guess I missed the happy ending.

 

Do you guys also think the banks had nothing to do with the collapse in 07?

 

You're seriously trying to compare CAF to that? This would be the exact same thing as Ankur meeting a collector at a Con and deciding to buy a piece of artwork after the Con via email. Is the Con responsible for Ankur to have a successful transaction? Not at all.

 

I hope the Seller loses their Square account. I cannot stand people like this. If asked by the appropriate authority I'd love to provide this woman's email addresses I have on file and her IP addresses. It was really easy for me to find her ebay account and professional websites based on it. She deserves to be punished for whatever scheme this might be.

 

But once again suggesting we are responsible is ridiculous. And posts like yours are exactly why I don't frequent boards like these. I won't return. People know how to reach me if they need to.

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Here you go:

 

Go right ahead Bill! Your site is not the center of my world.

Glad to know how much you care about your members and if they get ripped off.

 

Ankur

 

From: Bill Cox

To: Ankur Jetley

Sent: Thursday, January 14, 2016 10:24 PM

Subject: Re: ComicArtFans.com Contact Results

 

Whatever you say, Ankur. I shut her gallery down when you emailed me this morning. I'll shut yours down now as well.

 

 

I support you 100%...why PUNISH YOU...you are not the crook, you just want what you paid for...the CAF is upside down....hello Mr Bill Shot, I mean Mr. Big shot....have you ever heard of e-bay...probably not...that is why you are afraid to come on the boards...please ask e-bay if ban the BUYERs after they get ripped off and also get kicked off the system..and as far as third party posting....that is shows who we are dealing with..somebody who is aware of the boards..yet afraid to face tough questions..

 

 

 

 

Mitch, pump the brakes. Literally everything you wrote is incorrect, misguided and misinformed.

 

Bill is the guy who has single handedly transformed the OA collecting hobby in th least 12 years with very little benefit to himself. He is free to run his site as he sees fit. He's not afraid of anything. He's busy running his site and his business and doesn't need to entertain every attempted character assassination on every message board to prove to you he's a big strong brave man.

 

On the flip side we've got collectors attaching themselves like a remora to the underbelly of CAF never contributing one thin dime or one small moment of earnest appreciation to the site or Bill, and reaping the benefits of buying and selling and profiting for well over a decade. Then, when a too good to be true deal blows in in their face and they think that Bill is not moving fast enough, they are quick to imply that Bill owes them something beyond everything they've already taken for free and without heaitation.

 

Just once try and figure out what's going on before launching into the usual silliness.

 

From your statement - Bill/CAF owes nothing. The flip side of that coin is that they owe nothing in return. He provides a free service that you can if you want move into a paid account. He doesn't force users to do that and it appears he doesn't expect users to be paying members. If he did then he should change the site into a pay site.

 

Actually, you misunderstand. Bill has already provided everything. For free. To everyone. The result of that is people can and do transact at their own risk. When their greed or desire outpaces their common sense and they run into an issue they are not in a position to make demands of Bill and the site off of which they have sought to profit without fee or cost.

 

I've run into scammers on caf before. I make note of it to Bill and he handles it. Like he handled it here. He had blocked the sellers account 12 hours before Ankur demanded he do so implying CAF owed him something, and without realizing it had already been done.

 

Then he began his campaign here.

 

Bill,has already provided the site, for free, to everyone. The least we can return is respect towards him when a problem arises beyond implications that more is owed and demanded.

 

If Bill doesn't place cookies and then sell the data collected from them then I would agree with your statement. However, if the cookies track users and where they venture to on the internet and that data is sold then we have a different ball game going on. The free service is used for a benefit.

 

I have no idea if that is the case. If it isn't then he is missing a LARGE revenue stream.

 

 

If you think that's a large enough revenue stream to overcome the constant need for bandwidth, upgraded servers and other expenses then you just might be overestimating the size and scope of that revenue stream on a site like CAF.

 

I didn't say it was a charity site. I said the site isn't a cash cow for Bill. That's especially true when you factor in and average the 12 plus years of operation, and all the expenses appurtenant. Then add in the free users, some of which buying and selling 5 figure pieces on a regular basis yet contributing nothing to the site other than strain on bandwidth and storage space and you'll see that there is as much giving from Bill than taking by him, if not more.

 

None of which is relevant to what is being discussed here of course. People getting something for free, then blaming the person who gave it to them for free for not ceding immediately to their demands, when the blame lies with the seller who screwed them.

 

So this site was set up out of the goodness of the owner's heart? There is no benefit to him? I think Ankur is getting unjustly set upon and Bill is getting a massive reach around. Do you guys also think the banks had nothing to do with the collapse in 07?

 

 

This of course is just my opinion. No one is responsible for anything anymore.

 

 

lol. Massive stretch comparing a website that doesn't make a penny off of transactions and specifically states that people transact at their own risk as a term of service agreed to before the account can activated to banks that actually perpetuated, aggravated, and participated in the collapse of 2007.

 

Why don't you ask cgc how many years it took for them to turn a profit ? They actually sell a product and service that's been the leader in the field for years and I guarantee you it took them the better part of a decade.

 

 

Maybe you should get to know Ankur and get to know Bill before choosing a position on this, you may be grateful that you did. More information is always better than less.

 

I am sure Ankur would be thankful for the support if he wasn't content that the spotlight hamdniw moved on to another thread instead of this one.

 

 

 

I have eyes. I just saw the jackals circling Ankur and figured it out myself.

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I have eyes. I just saw the jackals circling Ankur and figured it out myself.

 

 

I won't dispute your having eyes.

 

I may dispute whether or not you need to have them checked if you read this entire thread and THAT was your take away.

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On a positive note, I'm glad it was ONLY TWO Caf members that were taken in the scam. Had I not created this thread it could have been much worse. Thank you for CAF for stepping in and shutting the scammers gallery down. That is all I had asked about in the first place.

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I attribute the growth trend by year to the simple fact that CAF exposed a great number of people over a few short years to either start to collect original art, or having a place to enjoy or share it. It coincides with the explosion in comic art prices as well. Like I mentioned, we still get over 200k unique people each month on CAF, and 55% + visits are from returning people - so a very regular loyal viewership. We still get 20+ signups every day so it isn't like it isn't growing.

 

Bill, I am not a member, but have thought about finally joining after reading through some of your posts. I've received recommendations from members of these boards in the past, but just have never gone through the motions. One thing I can definitely see being of value is the classifieds section. Although I did want to ask about something I noticed - after performing a search, I noticed several pieces I was interested in having "NFS" under the selling status. I'm not sure I understand what the person is attempting to accomplish by listing a piece in the classified section that isn't for sale. Are certain members using the classifieds as an extension of their gallery, or using it to get eyes on their art? I had intentions of messaging the person, but when I saw the "NFS" I didn't bother. Also, does the classifieds show past sales information? Is the reporting of a final sale price made mandatory, or is it left to the discretion of the buyer and seller? Appreciate your time in responding.

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I attribute the growth trend by year to the simple fact that CAF exposed a great number of people over a few short years to either start to collect original art, or having a place to enjoy or share it. It coincides with the explosion in comic art prices as well. Like I mentioned, we still get over 200k unique people each month on CAF, and 55% + visits are from returning people - so a very regular loyal viewership. We still get 20+ signups every day so it isn't like it isn't growing.

 

Bill, I am not a member, but have thought about finally joining after reading through some of your posts. I've received recommendations from members of these boards in the past, but just have never gone through the motions. One thing I can definitely see being of value is the classifieds section. Although I did want to ask about something I noticed - after performing a search, I noticed several pieces I was interested in having "NFS" under the selling status. I'm not sure I understand what the person is attempting to accomplish by listing a piece in the classified section that isn't for sale. Are certain members using the classifieds as an extension of their gallery, or using it to get eyes on their art? I had intentions of messaging the person, but when I saw the "NFS" I didn't bother. Also, does the classifieds show past sales information? Is the reporting of a final sale price made mandatory, or is it left to the discretion of the buyer and seller? Appreciate your time in responding.

 

I wouldn't be deterred by the NFS designation. Could be that the lister hasn't fully-updated all the description fields. Nothing to lose by enquiring.

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I attribute the growth trend by year to the simple fact that CAF exposed a great number of people over a few short years to either start to collect original art, or having a place to enjoy or share it. It coincides with the explosion in comic art prices as well. Like I mentioned, we still get over 200k unique people each month on CAF, and 55% + visits are from returning people - so a very regular loyal viewership. We still get 20+ signups every day so it isn't like it isn't growing.

 

Bill, I am not a member, but have thought about finally joining after reading through some of your posts. I've received recommendations from members of these boards in the past, but just have never gone through the motions. One thing I can definitely see being of value is the classifieds section. Although I did want to ask about something I noticed - after performing a search, I noticed several pieces I was interested in having "NFS" under the selling status. I'm not sure I understand what the person is attempting to accomplish by listing a piece in the classified section that isn't for sale. Are certain members using the classifieds as an extension of their gallery, or using it to get eyes on their art? I had intentions of messaging the person, but when I saw the "NFS" I didn't bother. Also, does the classifieds show past sales information? Is the reporting of a final sale price made mandatory, or is it left to the discretion of the buyer and seller? Appreciate your time in responding.

 

I wouldn't be deterred by the NFS designation. Could be that the lister hasn't fully-updated all the description fields. Nothing to lose by enquiring.

 

Thanks, I appreciate it. I didn't want to make an missteps even before becoming a member. In other collecting communities I'm a part of, it's fairly taboo to contact someone if they post NFS. It's mostly relating to sharing convention being founded on anti-pitch, anti-selling, and how annoying it can be when you are just sharing something and you get bombarded with comments or PM's asking "how much?" The other thing is I noticed a pattern of all this members listings having that NFS so I thought it was too deliberate to chalk it down to a situation where he hasn't updated the listing, unless he does his listings in batches.

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I attribute the growth trend by year to the simple fact that CAF exposed a great number of people over a few short years to either start to collect original art, or having a place to enjoy or share it. It coincides with the explosion in comic art prices as well. Like I mentioned, we still get over 200k unique people each month on CAF, and 55% + visits are from returning people - so a very regular loyal viewership. We still get 20+ signups every day so it isn't like it isn't growing.

 

Bill, I am not a member, but have thought about finally joining after reading through some of your posts. I've received recommendations from members of these boards in the past, but just have never gone through the motions. One thing I can definitely see being of value is the classifieds section. Although I did want to ask about something I noticed - after performing a search, I noticed several pieces I was interested in having "NFS" under the selling status. I'm not sure I understand what the person is attempting to accomplish by listing a piece in the classified section that isn't for sale. Are certain members using the classifieds as an extension of their gallery, or using it to get eyes on their art? I had intentions of messaging the person, but when I saw the "NFS" I didn't bother. Also, does the classifieds show past sales information? Is the reporting of a final sale price made mandatory, or is it left to the discretion of the buyer and seller? Appreciate your time in responding.

 

I wouldn't be deterred by the NFS designation. Could be that the lister hasn't fully-updated all the description fields. Nothing to lose by enquiring.

 

Thanks, I appreciate it. I didn't want to make an missteps even before becoming a member. In other collecting communities I'm a part of, it's fairly taboo to contact someone if they post NFS. It's mostly relating to sharing convention being founded on anti-pitch, anti-selling, and how annoying it can be when you are just sharing something and you get bombarded with comments or PM's asking "how much?" The other thing is I noticed a pattern of all this members listings having that NFS so I thought it was too deliberate to chalk it down to a situation where he hasn't updated the listing, unless he does his listings in batches.

 

Yeah you should by all means pursue the piece listed in the Classified section even if it has NFS on it. I've found it's mostly people didn't realize they forgot to post a price. Every once in a while you will find someone trying to get the most for the piece so they will ask you to make an offer.

 

As far as inquiring when the piece is listed as NFS and is not in the Classified section the reactions are varied. Most people will just say thanks but not interested. Every once in a while you will find someone at the right time and they are willing to sell, but don't waste everyone's time if you don't have the money to go forward with the purchase. You will find a lot of "tire kickers" out there once you start posting artwork. Don't be surprised that once you start posting your work people may inquire after them and as you soon as you come to an agreement they disappear. That is if you want to sell the piece. I was guilty of this a few times and don't do it anymore because I got annoyed with myself when I couldn't seal the deal. I've heard numerous collectors won't even put up pieces anymore because they are tired of people constantly asking after them, so keep that in mind if you are irritated by that possibility.

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I've heard numerous collectors won't even put up pieces anymore because they are tired of people constantly asking after them, ...

Me.

 

 

As soon as you put anything up, even if it's not in my wheelhouse, I'm going to "tire kick" the heck out of it. :grin:

 

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I've heard numerous collectors won't even put up pieces anymore because they are tired of people constantly asking after them, ...

Me.

 

 

As soon as you put anything up, even if it's not in my wheelhouse, I'm going to "tire kick" the heck out of it. :grin:

Feel free: http://www.comicartfans.com/mylowry.asp?gsub=43

But you'd need to offer at least 3x what I paid to tempt me ;)

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People are often lazy or less than diligent. :)

 

Hey! I resemble that remark ... at least when it comes to posting artwork ... but I like the latter and will now say that I am less than diligent when it comes to updating my CAF gallery!

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I've heard numerous collectors won't even put up pieces anymore because they are tired of people constantly asking after them, ...

Me.

 

 

As soon as you put anything up, even if it's not in my wheelhouse, I'm going to "tire kick" the heck out of it. :grin:

Feel free: http://www.comicartfans.com/mylowry.asp?gsub=43

But you'd need to offer at least 3x what I paid to tempt me ;)

 

That FF page is nice and depending on how far back you acquired the page, a 3X multiplier on your cost might be one heck of a deal!

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I've heard numerous collectors won't even put up pieces anymore because they are tired of people constantly asking after them, ...

Me.

 

 

As soon as you put anything up, even if it's not in my wheelhouse, I'm going to "tire kick" the heck out of it. :grin:

Feel free: http://www.comicartfans.com/mylowry.asp?gsub=43

But you'd need to offer at least 3x what I paid to tempt me ;)

 

I said "tire kick" so how is $10 for the the Amazing Spider-Man 03/25/1985 page.

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Feel free: http://www.comicartfans.com/mylowry.asp?gsub=43

But you'd need to offer at least 3x what I paid to tempt me ;)

 

That FF page is nice and depending on how far back you acquired the page, a 3X multiplier on your cost might be one heck of a deal!

Thanks. I love it too. But "Best of 2015" so...but seriously, that one is off the table for my lifespan. I'd turn away $50k, which would be ridiculous anyway and never be offered. (It's really just a number, just money, I have many other ways of raising that kind of money if I needed to). If you read my description, it explains why.

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I've heard numerous collectors won't even put up pieces anymore because they are tired of people constantly asking after them, ...

Me.

 

 

As soon as you put anything up, even if it's not in my wheelhouse, I'm going to "tire kick" the heck out of it. :grin:

Feel free: http://www.comicartfans.com/mylowry.asp?gsub=43

But you'd need to offer at least 3x what I paid to tempt me ;)

 

I said "tire kick" so how is $10 for the the Amazing Spider-Man 03/25/1985 page.

Deal! Shipping is $1k, Express, fully insured, worldwide ;) Lemme know when yo send PayPal over!
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I've heard numerous collectors won't even put up pieces anymore because they are tired of people constantly asking after them, ...

Me.

 

 

As soon as you put anything up, even if it's not in my wheelhouse, I'm going to "tire kick" the heck out of it. :grin:

Feel free: http://www.comicartfans.com/mylowry.asp?gsub=43

But you'd need to offer at least 3x what I paid to tempt me ;)

 

I said "tire kick" so how is $10 for the the Amazing Spider-Man 03/25/1985 page.

Deal! Shipping is $1k, Express, fully insured, worldwide ;) Lemme know when yo send PayPal over!

 

Haha. You got me... I'll get right on that. Usually I just offer free shipping when I sell because everyone asks me if I can do something. Free shipping seems to win the deal more times than not.

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