Celebrate Dell'Otto! 15 15

[darkstar]

However, in this case the books were not on the sales floor. Despite having a price tag they are effectively not priced yet. You can't fault an owner/dealer for having un-priced books which are then priced at current market prices. The fact that he let you browse his otherwise unavailable backstock is benefit enough.

No, if the dealer had said, "these need price updates first", that would mean the books weren't priced.

 

But the dealer set the maximum price for the customer when he said, "Don't worry about the price stickers". At that moment, the price sticker ($39.95) was the worst case scenario for the customer.

 

How do you go from "Don't worry about $39.95" to "Now, it's $225" without it being a bait-and-switch?

 

The owner didn't set a maximum price. He said "PROBABLY less than that." This being an unsold incentive variant he made that statement because he believed the book was no longer a 40 dollar book, as incentive variants typically go down in price, especially if they don't sell out and see a demand upon their initial release. A month ago the owner would have looked up the price of that book and seen it selling for 15-20, so he would've discounted the book. You can't have it both ways.

 

You should never assume books that are backstock or otherwise not on the sales floor/wall have been priced. This is why owners are typically quick to point out that their backstock/overstock cannot be dug through; same as collections that have just come in, they haven't been priced. Getting access to these books, and a discount on top of that, are the benefits.

We're beating a dead horse here, but the owner said "Don't worry about the $39.95".

You can't raise the price after you've told a customer not to worry about the old price.

You didn't promise a discount, but you promised "no worries" at $39.95.

 

If he had said, "Ignore the sticker" or "I need to price these", he gets to price them at any number.

He said "don't worry" about $39.95 being too high, then ended up at a higher price. That's the opposite of "don't worry".

 

You cut off the second half of the statement where he says "...its probably less than that." That indicates the book is not currently priced. As I said, if the book was currently selling for 10 dollars the owner likely would've discounted it down from 40 to 10.

[Kaboom]

I went to an LCS yesterday and requested to see his Original Sin books from the back. He brings them out and I look through them. He has all the Dell'Otto's with Gamora and Punisher being in the best shape. Gamora has a $39.95 tag and Punisher has a $19.95 tag. He then says, don't worry about the prices, they are probably less than that.

At this point in the story, you've seen a printed price and you've had an indication that the price will "probably" be discounted (but the discount isn't guaranteed).

 

The rest of the story doesn't matter. Any price asked above the amount on the sticker is the literal definition of "bait-and-switch".

He only "advertised" the price to an audience of one person... you... but you saw the price and he indicated it would be THAT price, or lower.

 

Except for the fact that Valiantman21Pittsburgh58 asked for books that were in the back room and not for sale at the moment. They could have still listed at cover price. It wouldn't matter. The owner, who is negligent in staying current with his stock and prices, did have a right to check (he said they would probably be cheaper) to see what the current value/price was.

 

He did offer a discount, but he did not say thank you to Valiantman21Pittsburgh58, and that is where he is wrong and what VM seems mad about. I wouldn't call this a bait and switch as it was not on the wall at that price, nor would I call it shady business practice. Now if it was on display in a case or on the wall at that price and he didn't honor it, that would be bait and switch and shady.

It wasn't me. No, I'm saying that it was all fine (going to the back room, pulling old stickered books) UNTIL the seller indicated that the $39.95 and $19.95 prices were TOO HIGH, and they would probably be lower. Once he said "$39.95, possibly less than that", he can't raise the price.

He has advertised the $39.95 price, without a guarantee of a discount to this buyer (21Pittsburgh58).

 

Then, he changed the prices to much, much higher. That's an instant bait-and-switch.

 

Oops, sorry I thought you were the poster the way the thread broke down in the message box.

 

He did say don't worry about the prices they are "PROBABLY" lower than that. But were not. I still think using the term "probably" shows that it was not a guarantee.

 

 

It's all good. No harm, no foul. I agree with you. But...

 

Would it be a different story if I bought them at the sticker prices and then came on here to say "I just got these at an absolute steal from my LCS"? Absolutely. Would it be justified to "look down" on me as a buyer? Sure. Why not the other way around?

 

I've already stated twice that I asked for the books to be brought up from the back and because they were not on the floor, that it was up to the LCS to do what they did.

 

Re-stating what happened: He had sticker prices at $39.95 and $19.95, looked them up on eBay and jacked the price to $225 and $150. Offered me a 20% discount off of eBay prices which would have cost me:

 

1) $180 for the Gamora ($39.95 sticker to $225 eBay to $180 final sale w/ 20%discount)

 

2) $120 for the Punisher ($19.95 sticker to $150 eBay to $120 final sale w/ 20% discount).

 

Those 2 books would have cost me $300 + tax (at 20% off) instead of $60 + tax = 5x what was actually on the book. Now they are looking to make (if they sell) $375 + tax.

 

Is that how you would have done business? I never, ever said that they SHOULD have sold them to me at the sticker price, I stated that a simple 'thank you' would have sufficed.

 

Bottom line is this: I don't have the books. The LCS has the books but, at this time, haven't sold the books. Guaranteed sale vs. potential sale. I wish them the best because I really like going there!

 

But to think that the LCS wasn't even a TINY bit ridiculous in the handling of this, is, in my opinion, ridiculous.

 

Hey 21Pittsburgh58 I never said that it was not ridiculous in fact I said, . I have a store that checks ebay on everything I buy. He has no pulse on what is going on and his stock is not priced accordingly. He does however honor the prices of his stock on the floor that is priced.

 

I did say, "Granted, pricing it in front of him was wrong and showed lack of social skills (business and otherwise.)". I am not disagreeing that what he did lacked common sense or etiquette, but was saying that it is not a bait and switch to check the prices of a book being pulled from the back room. A bait and switch is when it is advertised at one price to lure people in and then try to switch the item with a higher priced item.

 

How would I have handled it? I wouldn't have given you a priced book or would not have told you the price before checking it out. The back room is often over stock and not up to date priced.

 

Either way I do not fault you and would 100% feel slighted along with you. No, you would not have been looked down upon if you got them at that price, people would have applauded your savvy purchase.

[21Pittsburgh58]

However, in this case the books were not on the sales floor. Despite having a price tag they are effectively not priced yet. You can't fault an owner/dealer for having un-priced books which are then priced at current market prices. The fact that he let you browse his otherwise unavailable backstock is benefit enough.

No, if the dealer had said, "these need price updates first", that would mean the books weren't priced.

 

But the dealer set the maximum price for the customer when he said, "Don't worry about the price stickers". At that moment, the price sticker ($39.95) was the worst case scenario for the customer.

 

How do you go from "Don't worry about $39.95" to "Now, it's $225" without it being a bait-and-switch?

 

The owner didn't set a maximum price. He said "PROBABLY less than that." This being an unsold incentive variant he made that statement because he believed the book was no longer a 40 dollar book, as incentive variants typically go down in price, especially if they don't sell out and see a demand upon their initial release. A month ago the owner would have looked up the price of that book and seen it selling for 15-20, so he would've discounted the book. You can't have it both ways.

 

You should never assume books that are backstock or otherwise not on the sales floor/wall have been priced. This is why owners are typically quick to point out that their backstock/overstock cannot be dug through; same as collections that have just come in, they haven't been priced. Getting access to these books, and a discount on top of that, are the benefits.

 

 

 

 

I agree with most of what you said, except for the bolded part.

 

Who actually benefitted from what he did? He did (if the books sell). I didn't. I brought them to his attention and he gets to make more than he would have off of books that were gathering dust in the back room. I've already stated (3 times now, this is the 4th), that I understand that they were not fair game because they were not on the floor yet. But what exactly was the benefit for me? A potentially lower price than the one listed? Yep. Did that happen? Nope. The 20% discount off of top eBay prices? Was the benefit merely to hold those books and can always say forever and ever that I did?

 

The only thing I was frustrated with, was that he never said thank you for bringing them to his attention. That's it. Period. What is so hard to understand about that?

 

[21Pittsburgh58]

I went to an LCS yesterday and requested to see his Original Sin books from the back. He brings them out and I look through them. He has all the Dell'Otto's with Gamora and Punisher being in the best shape. Gamora has a $39.95 tag and Punisher has a $19.95 tag. He then says, don't worry about the prices, they are probably less than that.

At this point in the story, you've seen a printed price and you've had an indication that the price will "probably" be discounted (but the discount isn't guaranteed).

 

The rest of the story doesn't matter. Any price asked above the amount on the sticker is the literal definition of "bait-and-switch".

He only "advertised" the price to an audience of one person... you... but you saw the price and he indicated it would be THAT price, or lower.

 

Except for the fact that Valiantman21Pittsburgh58 asked for books that were in the back room and not for sale at the moment. They could have still listed at cover price. It wouldn't matter. The owner, who is negligent in staying current with his stock and prices, did have a right to check (he said they would probably be cheaper) to see what the current value/price was.

 

He did offer a discount, but he did not say thank you to Valiantman21Pittsburgh58, and that is where he is wrong and what VM seems mad about. I wouldn't call this a bait and switch as it was not on the wall at that price, nor would I call it shady business practice. Now if it was on display in a case or on the wall at that price and he didn't honor it, that would be bait and switch and shady.

It wasn't me. No, I'm saying that it was all fine (going to the back room, pulling old stickered books) UNTIL the seller indicated that the $39.95 and $19.95 prices were TOO HIGH, and they would probably be lower. Once he said "$39.95, possibly less than that", he can't raise the price.

He has advertised the $39.95 price, without a guarantee of a discount to this buyer (21Pittsburgh58).

 

Then, he changed the prices to much, much higher. That's an instant bait-and-switch.

 

Oops, sorry I thought you were the poster the way the thread broke down in the message box.

 

He did say don't worry about the prices they are "PROBABLY" lower than that. But were not. I still think using the term "probably" shows that it was not a guarantee.

 

 

It's all good. No harm, no foul. I agree with you. But...

 

Would it be a different story if I bought them at the sticker prices and then came on here to say "I just got these at an absolute steal from my LCS"? Absolutely. Would it be justified to "look down" on me as a buyer? Sure. Why not the other way around?

 

I've already stated twice that I asked for the books to be brought up from the back and because they were not on the floor, that it was up to the LCS to do what they did.

 

Re-stating what happened: He had sticker prices at $39.95 and $19.95, looked them up on eBay and jacked the price to $225 and $150. Offered me a 20% discount off of eBay prices which would have cost me:

 

1) $180 for the Gamora ($39.95 sticker to $225 eBay to $180 final sale w/ 20%discount)

 

2) $120 for the Punisher ($19.95 sticker to $150 eBay to $120 final sale w/ 20% discount).

 

Those 2 books would have cost me $300 + tax (at 20% off) instead of $60 + tax = 5x what was actually on the book. Now they are looking to make (if they sell) $375 + tax.

 

Is that how you would have done business? I never, ever said that they SHOULD have sold them to me at the sticker price, I stated that a simple 'thank you' would have sufficed.

 

Bottom line is this: I don't have the books. The LCS has the books but, at this time, haven't sold the books. Guaranteed sale vs. potential sale. I wish them the best because I really like going there!

 

But to think that the LCS wasn't even a TINY bit ridiculous in the handling of this, is, in my opinion, ridiculous.

 

Hey 21Pittsburgh58 I never said that it was not ridiculous in fact I said, . I have a store that checks ebay on everything I buy. He has no pulse on what is going on and his stock is not priced accordingly. He does however honor the prices of his stock on the floor that is priced.

 

I did say, "Granted, pricing it in front of him was wrong and showed lack of social skills (business and otherwise.)". I am not disagreeing that what he did lacked common sense or etiquette, but was saying that it is not a bait and switch to check the prices of a book being pulled from the back room. A bait and switch is when it is advertised at one price to lure people in and then try to switch the item with a higher priced item.

 

How would I have handled it? I wouldn't have given you a priced book or would not have told you the price before checking it out. The back room is often over stock and not up to date priced.

 

Either way I do not fault you and would 100% feel slighted along with you. No, you would not have been looked down upon if you got them at that price, people would have applauded your savvy purchase.

 

I'm with you! I also never mentioned bait and switch, someone else did. All I wanted was a 'thank you' for bringing them to his attention. The books became secondary to courtesy once I declined the purchase.

[BarryAllen]

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9217952&gonew=1#UNREAD

[Lethal_Collector]

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9217952&gonew=1#UNREAD

 

Do it! What good is money without spending it?

 

 

Jerome

[BarryAllen]

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9217952&gonew=1#UNREAD

 

Do it! What good is money without spending it?

 

 

Jerome

 

No offense, but I think this thread has gone to your head if you think that book is worth that much money...

[ebtorres]

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9217952&gonew=1#UNREAD

 

Do it! What good is money without spending it?

 

 

Jerome

 

No offense, but I think this thread has gone to your head if you think that book is worth that much money...

 

Good work baiting someone to give you the response you were looking for to be able to retort with the above statement. That was cunning and we'll played, sir.

 

That was why you linked that sales thread here, right?

[Lethal_Collector]

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9217952&gonew=1#UNREAD

 

Do it! What good is money without spending it?

 

 

Jerome

 

No offense, but I think this thread has gone to your head if you think that book is worth that much money...

 

None taken at all buddy I just thought if you love Cap and Otto, maybe you'd really enjoy the book. Sure it's spendy, but how much to people pay for OA pages and whatnot? It can be a lot too.

 

 

Jerome

Edited March 15, 2016 by Lethal_Collector

[jsilverjanet]

 

 

Sorry but the PIF is gone and I don't have anything else to watch

[Lonzilla]

I did a lot of driving to a few shops in the boonies today, I guess they don't have the internet out in them parts. Original Sin #1 & #2 $5 ea, Daken #1 $10. Avengers #25 $10

Stuff is still out there for the pickin

[darkstar]

However, in this case the books were not on the sales floor. Despite having a price tag they are effectively not priced yet. You can't fault an owner/dealer for having un-priced books which are then priced at current market prices. The fact that he let you browse his otherwise unavailable backstock is benefit enough.

No, if the dealer had said, "these need price updates first", that would mean the books weren't priced.

 

But the dealer set the maximum price for the customer when he said, "Don't worry about the price stickers". At that moment, the price sticker ($39.95) was the worst case scenario for the customer.

 

How do you go from "Don't worry about $39.95" to "Now, it's $225" without it being a bait-and-switch?

 

The owner didn't set a maximum price. He said "PROBABLY less than that." This being an unsold incentive variant he made that statement because he believed the book was no longer a 40 dollar book, as incentive variants typically go down in price, especially if they don't sell out and see a demand upon their initial release. A month ago the owner would have looked up the price of that book and seen it selling for 15-20, so he would've discounted the book. You can't have it both ways.

 

You should never assume books that are backstock or otherwise not on the sales floor/wall have been priced. This is why owners are typically quick to point out that their backstock/overstock cannot be dug through; same as collections that have just come in, they haven't been priced. Getting access to these books, and a discount on top of that, are the benefits.

 

 

 

 

I agree with most of what you said, except for the bolded part.

 

Who actually benefitted from what he did? He did (if the books sell). I didn't. I brought them to his attention and he gets to make more than he would have off of books that were gathering dust in the back room. I've already stated (3 times now, this is the 4th), that I understand that they were not fair game because they were not on the floor yet. But what exactly was the benefit for me? A potentially lower price than the one listed? Yep. Did that happen? Nope. The 20% discount off of top eBay prices? Was the benefit merely to hold those books and can always say forever and ever that I did?

 

The only thing I was frustrated with, was that he never said thank you for bringing them to his attention. That's it. Period. What is so hard to understand about that?

 

My original point was that what the owner did in this case is not the same thing as when a store re-prices a book available for purchase at the register. The distinction that these books were not on the sales floor available to anyone and everyone is important. Updating the prices at that point is fair game in my opinion and, at least to me, is all but understood.

 

Did the owner handle this appropriately? Not exactly. He could have double or tripled the 40 dollar price, making a decent amount of money off you while still leaving you the opportunity to make money off the book (or at least obtain it at a fairly cheap price compared to current eBay sales). But that wasn't the argument I was making here.

 

Access to otherwise unavailable books and a 20% discount off the market price is something a lot of collectors would jump at and one of the benefits of getting to know your lcs owners.

[darkstar]

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9217952&gonew=1#UNREAD

 

Do it! What good is money without spending it?

 

 

Jerome

 

No offense, but I think this thread has gone to your head if you think that book is worth that much money...

 

Until you sit back and wonder which is more ridiculous. 2 or 3 grand for a 1 of 1 sketch cover (with colors!) or 1 to 2 grand for a graded incentive variant of which there are numerous copies.

 

If everyone is all over Dell'Otto because his art is just that amazing then surely his one offs are worth that much, no?

[thecollector881]

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9217952&gonew=1#UNREAD

 

Do it! What good is money without spending it?

 

 

Jerome

 

No offense, but I think this thread has gone to your head if you think that book is worth that much money...

 

Until you sit back and wonder which is more ridiculous. 2 or 3 grand for a 1 of 1 sketch cover (with colors!) or 1 to 2 grand for a graded incentive variant of which there are numerous copies.

 

If everyone is all over Dell'Otto because his art is just that amazing then surely his one offs are worth that much, no?

[Lethal_Collector]

 

 

 

Jerome

[Ultramanking]

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9217952&gonew=1#UNREAD

 

Do it! What good is money without spending it?

 

 

Jerome

 

No offense, but I think this thread has gone to your head if you think that book is worth that much money...

 

Until you sit back and wonder which is more ridiculous. 2 or 3 grand for a 1 of 1 sketch cover (with colors!) or 1 to 2 grand for a graded incentive variant of which there are numerous copies.

 

If everyone is all over Dell'Otto because his art is just that amazing then surely his one offs are worth that much, no?

 

Man Gab art is not cheap

[Lonzilla]

Curious as to what the criteria is for a desirable Dell 'Otto cover. Not being a smart a** here, just wondering why the Original Sin Nick Fury and Ant-Man covers aren't seeing the same bump as the others in the series. Ultimate Origins #2 sketch is another, is it because it's not in color and collectors prefer his color art? Secret War #1 has a great Spider-Man cover, yet they can be had for under $10, same with his ASM 1:15s.

He's approaching JSC territory where almost every Marvel cover is pricey you'd think... Thoughts?

[BarryAllen]

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9217952&gonew=1#UNREAD

 

Do it! What good is money without spending it?

 

 

Jerome

 

No offense, but I think this thread has gone to your head if you think that book is worth that much money...

 

Until you sit back and wonder which is more ridiculous. 2 or 3 grand for a 1 of 1 sketch cover (with colors!) or 1 to 2 grand for a graded incentive variant of which there are numerous copies.

 

If everyone is all over Dell'Otto because his art is just that amazing then surely his one offs are worth that much, no?

 

No.

 

 

[BarryAllen]

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9217952&gonew=1#UNREAD

 

Do it! What good is money without spending it?

 

 

Jerome

 

No offense, but I think this thread has gone to your head if you think that book is worth that much money...

 

None taken at all buddy I just thought if you love Cap and Otto, maybe you'd really enjoy the book. Sure it's spendy, but how much to people pay for OA pages and whatnot? It can be a lot too.

 

 

Jerome

 

Big fan of cap and Otto, but I found this quite a bit excessive. It is a painted sketch-cover, not an original page or larger piece. Even then, for something that likely cost in the realm of $300 to obtain in 2013, over $3,000 is beyond silly.

 

My original (albeit unstated and poorly implied) point was that this thread is likely driving the huge price.

[Ultramanking]

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9217952&gonew=1#UNREAD

 

Do it! What good is money without spending it?

 

 

Jerome

 

No offense, but I think this thread has gone to your head if you think that book is worth that much money...

 

None taken at all buddy I just thought if you love Cap and Otto, maybe you'd really enjoy the book. Sure it's spendy, but how much to people pay for OA pages and whatnot? It can be a lot too.

 

 

Jerome

 

Big fan of cap and Otto, but I found this quite a bit excessive. It is a painted sketch-cover, not an original page or larger piece. Even then, for something that likely cost in the realm of $300 to obtain in 2013, over $3,000 is beyond silly.

 

My original (albeit unstated and poorly implied) point was that this thread is likely driving the huge price.

Ha ha usd300 to get Gab painted cover in 2013, no way mate.

 

However, It did cost me over usd5k to get Gab big painting in 2013.