What happens to your collection after you die?

[Brian Peck]

I know this is a morbid question for some but I have been thinking about this over the last couple of days. Some of you may have seen the email on comicart-l from Ken Zenuk's son Michael, Ken had died last Saturday. Michael was looking thru his emails and discovered the list and sent an email asking for help with his father's collection.

I have known Ken for a number of years he used to live near me in the South Bay (near San Jose, CA) but had moved away some time back and we fell out of touch. Then just two months ago he emailed me and said he moved back to the area and wanted to get together. We planned on hooking up the weekend before I was going down to SDCC but I got busy and had to cancel. I planned on seeing him after SDCC but life got in the way and never did get to see him. Something I really regret.

I emailed Michael and offered to help and this got me thinking what will happen to my collection after I die, ya many of us joke it will be buried with us. Seriously, its a subject I haven't really given much thought until this week. Many of you have a wife or husband and many even kids. You can give it to them, some might appreciate like you dod but some might not care. Frank Thorne after keeping his art for many years starting selling it last year because he didn't think his kids would know the real value of the art. Then there are people like me, single but still have my parents. Neither one would know how to sell the artwork. My mom who is a big Submariner fan and is on CAF appreciates the artwork and would probably keep some of it and my father to a lesser extent would keep one of two pieces.

But what to do with the rest? I know some have a plan in place, another collector would be charged with selling the artwork. I have been collecting for 30 years and have amassed a large collection. That would be hard to sell. I know a few people/place I plan to bequeath artwork to, but don't have a concrete plan.

Does anyone have anything in place to covers distribution of your collection after you die?

[Mr. Machismo]

I would just reference Heritage or ComicLink in your will, and have them release across a set amount of time relative to the size and diversity of your collection.

[zhamlau]

My wife knows artists, books, and relative values. When I pass, she knows anything I have should go to auction and has contacts for the comics books, the movie props and autos, and all the sports cards. After a while when its time to close up shop, all of my items will go to auction and the proceeds will be given to her directly or she can break it up with the kids if need be.

[RabidFerret]

I think it depends on your goal for the art. If the goal is simply to convert it to cash it's a different story from if you'd like to see the collection maintained in some way.

 

While I'm not sure the future will have many comic art collections maintained like the Isabella Stuart Gardner Museum or The Hyde Collection, I like to think that I could donate a portion of my collection to a place like Ohio State's Billy Ireland Museum and maintain some sense of connectivity between the pieces while giving them a home where a lot of people can enjoy them.

 

My current plans for my collection are:

1) A handful of pieces go to specific people(~5%)

2) The most personal core collection I will donate to OSU(~25%)

3) Certain friends and family can pick through my collection for 1 piece each(~5%)

4) The rest my executor can sell off as they see fit(~65%)

 

 

[Michael Browning]

We are all just caretakers of this stuff for a little while. I hate to say this, but I really hope there comes a point where I decide to sell it all and enjoy the profits. I have said for years that I don't want to be the guy who dies and leaves behind a million dollar collection that makes the news, but that I'm the alive guy who makes the news for selling his million-dollar collection and enjoys the profits.

My wife doesn't care one bit about my art, except when I sell a piece and use that cash to take us on a vacation or to buy something we need.

So, I've already let her know that I want her to either get one of the dealers to buy/sell it all or to put it to auction.

I think we'd all be lying if we said we weren't looking at the eventual value of our collections. I think it's smart to have a post-exit plan for our art.

[comix4fun]

I made detailed list with names, addresses and phone numbers for my family of who they should contact, for what purpose (general advice, auction assistance , appraisal, etc ) and who they should cross reference whatever that person tells them against. There are two or three names that are marked "trust 100%" everyone else gets checked and balanced.

 

 

I have also made a list of predators who would undoubtedly reach out, trying to take advantage of my passing and my family's emotion and lack of hobby knowledge, I list them specifically and by name. For each anus that come-a-callin' I've set out some personally tailored invectives to be read aloud and word for word....preferably at a high volume.

 

Even beyond the grave they're not pulling one over on me.

[Hekla]

Sad to hear about Ken. I rarely check the Comicart-l so didn't know he passed away until just now. I met him a few years ago after he moved to the Phoenix area - really nice guy. He had a nice collection of comic art and other cool non-comic pieces; his 'man-cave' was effectively a museum. He'll be missed.

[artdealer]

As morbid as this sounds, I'm named in several collectors wills to sell the art when they pass.

MI

[Hekla]

I created a 8 1/2 x 11 "catalog" to keep track of details about my pages, but the other benefit is my wife has a copy and can use it if she needs to look into liquidating my collection if something happened to me. Here's an example page (with a few details removed for privacy)

 

[Panelfan1]

Great topic. I recently picked up a piece at heritage. When it arrived I discovered it was dedicated on the back from the artist to its previous owner. As it turned out it was someone I knew from my youth and had not seen in decades. Brought to mind the same question posed by this thread.

[alxjhnsn]

Surprise! I have a standard answer. I keep it in a MS Word file with a list of my art and what I paid for it.

 

Kathy knows where it is, but I suspect Rebecca, my youngest, is the one that will remember.

 

 

 

SELLING MY COMIC STUFF

COMIC ART SELLING VENUES

Comic art selling venues available to you include:

• Direct Sales
  
  • comicart-l use my id (see Useful Info)
    
  • CGC OA Marketplace– use my id (see Useful Info)
    
  • CAF Premium Member Classified which does require a paid premium membership – use my id (see Useful Info)
    
  • Get a booth at Comicpalooza and/or Amazing Houston! Comic Con and sell there.

  [*]Auctions

  • CAF Auctions
    
  • eBay
    
  • ComicConnect
    
  • ComicLink
    
  • Heritage

  [*]Large comic art dealers include:

  • 
    
  • Anthony Snyder
    
  • Mike Burkey
    
  • Will Gabri-El
    
  • Mitch Itkowitz

 

All of them will consider consignments and outright buys. Consignments might yield more, but will generally take longer.

 

You can get a pretty comprehensive list of comic art dealers here: http://www.dragonberry.com under “Comic Art Sellers,” but really one of those above would be fine.

 

While working with a dealer might be simpler, geography tends to limit since you really need to take the art to the dealer. That said, some of the large auction houses (Heritage, ComicLink, ComicConnect) and larger dealers will/might travel to look at stuff. One approach would be to encourage them to come to Comicpalooza; Heritage is often here for it and the others might like the excuse.

 

PRICING COMIC BOOK ART

You might want to explore the following resources:

• The OA auction archive at Heritage Auctions - This archive presents the results from all of their OA auctions.. Once you sign-up and get an id, you can search for pieces by your artist and see what they have sold for.
  
• The CAF Market Data - More auction results (more than 1,000,000) are available if you join the Comic Art Fans site, pay for Market Data access, and access eBay and other auction sites as well as Heritage.
  
• The Comic Art Database. It contains transaction records entered by the owners of Comic OA.
• Dealer sites. Dealers, generally, post their art with fixed prices though there are exceptions. There is a list of dealers on CGC OA board and the Dragonberry site has a list as well. The CAF site will search the inventories of several dealers for you.
  
• Blouin Art Info which tracks sales at major art auctions. It can turn up some Comic OA as well. Look for the “Art Prices” item on the top right of the screen
  
• Jerry Weist's Comic Art Price Guide - Heritage published a third edition of it. In my opinion, it's a good history book and might be useful for comparison work, but it was out of date a year before it was printed.
  
• A topic on these CGC OA boards, A-level panel page valuations by artist/run - thoughts/additions/changes?, holds a discussion that relates to your question. It provides some "generally agreed upon" ranges for popular runs by popular artists on popular characters.
• The Biggest OA Prices thread tracked some of the largest sales in the OA space. While that particular thread has stopped; it's probably worth reading for the discussions. Meanwhile , the information is still being updated - just with a different mechanism.
  • The price information moved to The OA Elite blog. Click on the categories on the top of the page to see the updated list.
  • The discussion moved to Biggest OA Prices: The Blog

New buyers and sellers often find that OA is too hard to price. I agree. However, I think that there is a valid reason. Each piece is unique. Uniqueness make art sales generally and OA specifically non-linear.

 

For example,

• Consecutive pages could and do sell for radically different amounts.
  
• Take page layout - In general, you might say:
  Covers > 1st Page Splash > Other Splash > 1/2 splash > panel pages
  However, that's not always true either. The right panel page can be much more compelling than a bland splash.
  
• Take pencillers- There are "A-list" artists, but not all of their books/characters have the same value. Kirby FF pages generally go for more than JIM/Thor pages which go for more than Cap pages (2nd run) which go for more than ...
  
• Take combinations of pencilers/inkers - Kirby/Sinnott FF pages rank above Kirby and anyone else on FF, but a Kirby/X FF page might be more or less than a Kirby/Stone Thor page. Hard to tell.

 

Finally, you should join the comic book OA community. The three main points of Internet contact are:

• Yahoo's comicart-l mailing list
  
• The Comic Art Fans website
  
• The CGC OA Board

 

The main points of physical contact are probably:

• San Diego Comic Con
  
• New York City Comic Con
  
• Comic Art Con
  
• Heroes Comic Con

 

One last comment, if you are looking to buy or sell, spend the time to learn the market. That might take 6 months, but it's worth the time.

 

COMIC BOOK VENUES

The outlets for comic books are similar – direct sales, auction, and dealers.

 

For direct sales though you are really limited to setting up at comic convention.

 

The auction houses to consider are as above though CAF auctions would be the wrong venue.

 

The dealers are different though. Large comic book dealers include:

• Bedrock City Comic Company (Houston – Richard Evans or Mike Steenbergen)
  
• Mike High Comics (Denver – Chuck Rozanski)
  
• MyComicShop.com – (Dallas)

 

Bedrock could move both comics and comic art.

 

 

 

COMIC BOOK PRICING

Prices vary with age and condition. In general books printed before 1980 are more liquid and interesting than those printed after 1980. Comic book collecting got pretty popular about that time and it’s the rare comic that is rare. ☺

 

Price guides are available on-line plus dealers like MileHighComics and MyComicShop offer pretty complete selections of graded comics and their prices. Of course, there are paper guides as well, e.g., Overstreet Price Guide. As a compromise, Heritage offers the OPG as a PDF file.

 

Grading is very subjective and you really need professional help. You could hire someone from Bedrock.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I suspect that at the end of the day, they will turn to Bedrock City Comic Company here in town and that's okay by me.

[Brian Peck]

I would just reference Heritage or ComicLink in your will, and have them release across a set amount of time relative to the size and diversity of your collection.

 

Going thru an auction house like HA or clink is a bit simplistic. Some people who have never used an auction house could be a be afraid of using them with the agreements and other issues. I think you should at least have a fellow collector setup to help your family in selling with an auction house. Someone who has sold thru them before. Especially with higher end items, they can give them advice if they need to have some art setup with a reserve.

[malvin]

I made detailed list with names, addresses and phone numbers for my family of who they should contact, for what purpose (general advice, auction assistance , appraisal, etc ) and who they should cross reference whatever that person tells them against. There are two or three names that are marked "trust 100%" everyone else gets checked and balanced.

 

 

I have also made a list of predators who would undoubtedly reach out, trying to take advantage of my passing and my family's emotion and lack of hobby knowledge, I list them specifically and by name. For each anus that come-a-callin' I've set out some personally tailored invectives to be read aloud and word for word....preferably at a high volume.

 

Even beyond the grave they're not pulling one over on me.

 

My lawyer is late (very late, almost a year now) in making my will, but I was going to do something similar to Chris' first paragraph.

 

The second one I never thought of (presumably the first paragraph would take care of the disposition) but a great idea. Can I just copy your list

 

Malvin

[Twanj]

unfortunately I've lost too many friends already & I'm still in my 30s.

 

besides wills/living wills, I have an In Case of Death file for myself & family members that lists who to contact, accounts, along with a list of properties, vehicles, smaller assets, safe deposits, etc.

 

for art, comic art, & other collectibles I keep a detailed log. here's an example for comic art:

 

Issue, page. Artists, writers, published date. bought from X on X/X/XXXX for X, paid via X, shipped via X, received X/X/XXX. Auction text. (along with scans of the art).

 

there's also http://www.gyst.com/

 

I am not a lawyer but at least where I am, I don't think you want to be naming specific people or things unless you are bequeathing them in the will.

 

i.e., you wouldn't write "have Jim sell comic art" or "sell comic art through Heritage". You'd bequeath the art to your heirs. People & businesses change & you don't want to re-write your will if something happens to a dealer or Heritage or somewhere goes out of business. In another document, you'd specify the best venue, tactics, & people to sell your art.

[AnkurJ]

While simplistic, I have told my family to contact Heritage if they wish to sell my collection and instruct everything be auctioned with a 0% sellers fee. And if the money isn't needed, to donate it to our local museum.

[AKA Rick]

I would recommend you assign trusted friends to help your widow, family or heirs on the process of distributing your collection. You should outline if any specific pieces goes to any specific person as a gift.

 

Anything for sale, simply have your assigned helpers bring to ComicLink to evaluate.

 

In general, most of the material should qualify for either the Focused Auction or the Featured Auction.

 

And anything they deem unworthy of auctioning off, is probably eBay fodder for auctions.

 

This way you know you're getting the top potential dollar in the open marketplace.

 

Another resource is to use an art dealer not selling it to them but consigning it at a % of sales payment, then you know the dealer isn't trying to find a bargain and rip you off, but in fact is going to try to get you the top dollar since their compensation is based upon a % of the sales price, so it's in their best interests to have your best interests at heart.

 

You, as a collector should have an inventory list of what you have, incluidng what your cost basis is, in the event there's any issue with taxation on proceeds, as well as simply for context of what you paid vs what it may sell for or what it's worth. It's not always accurate, in that you may have paid $400 for a Byne X-Men page in the 80's that's worth $10k now, but in general if you've acquired material within the last few years there's at least a gauge to the price and therefore a potential view of the scope of the value of your collecting given what you've invested overall.

 

Put post-it notes on your artwork identifying the artists and if published, the publication issue and page, it makes it easier for the uneducated to determine what is what.

 

Be at peace with the fact that you've enjoyed the art as long as you had your vision and breath in your lungs, and once it's over, the artwork will find it's way to a new home to appreciate it rather than having family just hold onto it for sentimentality or not knowing what to do with it. Then, they can use the proceeds towards their own passions and necessities.

 

This topic is why I don't believe in holding onto any one piece or calling anything my grail, and feel, there will be a time when I sell all of the art off, as I'd rather liquidate it myself than to leave it to my heirs, as I sort of feel, I can do it better and maximize the profits.

 

Luckily, I don't have that many pieces nor anything so expensive or huge that it's going to be an issue one way or another.

[BCarter27]

I'm sure this has been said before, but what museums would even want this stuff? The Lucas Museum is catching a lot of grief as being a vanity project and that is undoubtedly a jaw-dropping collection.

 

And furthermore, most comic art will probably just languish in a museum or library's archives. I can't see them displaying it prominently or at all. Then, what? After a time, it gets deaccessioned anyway?

 

Just let it go back into the market for other collectors to enjoy. Start the cycle over again.

 

My wife and I pick out most purchases together (except those we might get as a gift for one another.) So she's well versed in the various outlets for selling.

 

I imagine we will do a big sell off when we get older. Selling is a fun part of the hobby too.

[Brian Peck]

There is the Library of Congress, Ohio State Univerity and Michigan State University are some. Also the Cartoon Art Museum in San Francisco.

[BCarter27]

Oh, and don't forget to list your best shill bidders for your loved ones to contact when the time comes. Very important.

[BCarter27]

There is the Library of Congress, Ohio State Univerity and Michigan State University are some. Also the Cartoon Art Museum in San Francisco.

 

What kind of material are they interested in? What have they accepted in the past?