General discussion thread - keep the other threads clean 29 29

[Snake Eyes]

My two cents for what it is worth (as a frequent buyer). Many folks do use this site as an adjunct to their business, so many deals are not two friends working out a nice trade. Instead, two fellow collectors/colleagues doing business. Now some are friendly, so I admit there are both types...

 

When you list an item for sale, you are choosing to do so in the hopes of obtaining funds. I, in turn, am shopping as I browse through the sell threads. Let me tell you, if I was going back and forth from stores at the mall...I certainly would not shop at the one insists I pay their fees...that is the cost of them choosing to do business with the credit cards companies (or paypal in this case). If they insisted on check or money order only, that would be fine with me as they are not trying to pass on their cost of business.

 

Frankly, I almost always close the thread when I see this insisted upon (or am told a 3% surcharge will be added). This is a cost free platform for listing...just will not pay that fee for you. That being said, when someone cuts me a deal or I have dealt with someone awhile and consider them a friend I will add 3% to the total and pay via the purchase option (I know for sure I did this with my last three transactions). That is a choice that I want to have the ability to make however. Insisting upon my doing this does not build a trusting relationship in my opinion.

 

So the long and the short of it is you are losing a potential sale to me (and as I read some of the complaints on the board to others as well). If the 3% is a critical amount to receive build it into your initial price...then I do not feel insulted (albeit mildly don't want to be overdramatic here )and you are still asking for the price needed. Or better yet...sell it at the original price, build a relationship with someone, and then discuss personal payments. Again, just my two cents...

 

SE

 

 

[seanfingh]

My two cents for what it is worth . . .

 

 

That was worth more than 2 cents. Excellent post.

[chromium]

So what does everyone think of this recent growth of "Paypal PERSONAL Only" sales on here?

 

I'm not referring to the "it would be nice if you sent a Personal payment, but cool if not" comments, but strict requirements to disregard the PP TOS and your buyer protection, or not participate in the sales? These are NOT personal payments, but sales, you can have your account revoked or suspended for pulling this scam.

 

I think by allowing sellers to freely disregard Paypal policy and terms of service, CGC is on a slipperly slope here, and a few scams later, it could really harm their reputation and that of the Marketplace itself.

 

Thoughts?

 

I hate it with a vengeance. And will never buy anything from someone who demands it.

I don't care how nice the deal is or how much I want the book...

It screams "greed" to me. This place is already one the best venues to sell books due to the high volume of collectors and there is no charge at all to list items for sale. And still some people want more.

I have a tough time enough already with the people that come to the boards with the intent only to sell books with the lowest overhead possible and not to engage in any of the discussions, conversations or community building.

Is it a coincidence that a lot of these sellers are also the ones that want you to pay their paypal fees for them ?

[joeypost]

I feel Forum Transactions are personal also. Sometimes we trade books for books. and sometimes it's books for cash. Either way, I expect absolutely Zero protection from pay pal anyway. We self insure here by use of the Probation list.

 

I don't think there is any SCAM going on by using the personal option provided by pay pal.

 

I don't think it's a scam either, I think that Paypal has added that option to protect themselves from being regulated as a bank.

 

However, when I see someone insist on Personal Paypal, I really do close the thread. I have used the personal option many times, IF I happen to have money in my paypal account and if I know the person, but I prefer that to be an option, I feel uncomfortable being coerced. I feel the same way with people who want 3% if you use Paypal. I've bought that way from C-link, but it's my option, and they are a business, they have bills associated with the sales to pay.

 

In addition, my "protection" comes from my credit card company, and if I'm going to spend more than a few $$ on a book, I'd prefer that I have the OPTION of that protection.

 

Let me give you an example Sharon,

 

I submit books for individuals under my CGC account. If I submit $500 worth of books for someone and they pay me via paypal I now lose money. I am out the 3% or $15 per transaction. If I do this 20 times in a month I am now in the red $300. I always ask for a check. If they cannot pay with a check I ask for the additional 3% or if they decide to use the personal option it is fine. It has it's place, and I feel the main issue here is people abusing that place. If I sell a $500 comic I expect to eat the 3%. I personally am not taking any money out of my pocket, but when a service like submitting books is rendered I do expect the difference to be paid by the customer.

[Dick Pontoon]

So what does everyone think of this recent growth of "Paypal PERSONAL Only" sales on here?

 

I'm not referring to the "it would be nice if you sent a Personal payment, but cool if not" comments, but strict requirements to disregard the PP TOS and your buyer protection, or not participate in the sales? These are NOT personal payments, but sales, you can have your account revoked or suspended for pulling this scam.

 

I think by allowing sellers to freely disregard Paypal policy and terms of service, CGC is on a slipperly slope here, and a few scams later, it could really harm their reputation and that of the Marketplace itself.

 

Thoughts?

 

I hate it with a vengeance. And will never buy anything from someone who demands it.

I don't care how nice the deal is or how much I want the book...

It screams "greed" to me. This place is already one the best venues to sell books due to the high volume of collectors and there is no charge at all to list items for sale. And still some people want more.

I have a tough time enough already with the people that come to the boards with the intent only to sell books with the least overhead possible and not to engage in any of the discussions, conversations or community building.

Is it a coincidence that a lot of these sellers are also the ones that want you to pay their paypal fees for them ?

 

Here’s a question for you guys who are turned off by folks who require it. I have some books listed currently, and I wrote “payment via PayPal personal will earn you my undying gratitude, but it is certainly not required.” In the past I've never mentioned the personal option.

 

Does that turn you guys off as well? I wouldn’t want to alienate anybody.

 

[chromium]

 

Here’s a question for you guys who are turned off by folks who require it. I have some books listed currently, and I wrote “payment via PayPal personal will earn you my undying gratitude, but it is certainly not required.” In the past I've never mentioned the personal option.

 

Does that turn you guys off as well? I wouldn’t want to alienate anybody.

 

No, it wouldn't turn me off, you just wouldn't get it

[skypinkblu]

I feel Forum Transactions are personal also. Sometimes we trade books for books. and sometimes it's books for cash. Either way, I expect absolutely Zero protection from pay pal anyway. We self insure here by use of the Probation list.

 

I don't think there is any SCAM going on by using the personal option provided by pay pal.

 

I don't think it's a scam either, I think that Paypal has added that option to protect themselves from being regulated as a bank.

 

However, when I see someone insist on Personal Paypal, I really do close the thread. I have used the personal option many times, IF I happen to have money in my paypal account and if I know the person, but I prefer that to be an option, I feel uncomfortable being coerced. I feel the same way with people who want 3% if you use Paypal. I've bought that way from C-link, but it's my option, and they are a business, they have bills associated with the sales to pay.

 

In addition, my "protection" comes from my credit card company, and if I'm going to spend more than a few $$ on a book, I'd prefer that I have the OPTION of that protection.

 

Let me give you an example Sharon,

 

I submit books for individuals under my CGC account. If I submit $500 worth of books for someone and they pay me via paypal I now lose money. I am out the 3% or $15 per transaction. If I do this 20 times in a month I am now in the red $300. I always ask for a check. If they cannot pay with a check I ask for the additional 3% or if they decide to use the personal option it is fine. It has it's place, and I feel the main issue here is people abusing that place. If I sell a $500 comic I expect to eat the 3%. I personally am not taking any money out of my pocket, but when a service like submitting books is rendered I do expect the difference to be paid by the customer.

 

Joey, aren't you doing that as a BUSINESS? I think that's a different story. If it's costing you more than you are getting, you need to up your fees, but what has that got to do with the marketplace? Are you listing your services for submitting books on the marketplace?

 

I think the difference is whether you are selling as a hobby/comic collecting funding/ OK, maybe I need a new pair of shoes kind of thing, or if you are in business.

 

At least that is how I view it. I'm selling part of my collection this year, I've just decided to concentrate on GA...I don't view it as a business, I don't sell to fund any personal expenses on a regular basis. Last year I sold a few books and put that money towards my daughter's wedding, but I don't sell for living expenses, if you do...then you have to make other adjustments.

 

I understand you not wanting to lose money, but I'm not sure what that has to do with demanding personal paypal, I certainly don't mind sellers upping their prices...it's the demand that bothers me.

 

BTW, I would certainly put YOU in the column of people I WOULD pay with personal paypal (if I have the funds) because I know you and trust you, but I'd like it to be my choice.

Edited February 25, 2010 by skypinkblu

[Snake Eyes]

Heres a question for you guys who are turned off by folks who require it. I have some books listed currently, and I wrote payment via PayPal personal will earn you my undying gratitude, but it is certainly not required. In the past I've never mentioned the personal option.

 

Does that turn you guys off as well? I wouldnt want to alienate anybody.

 

That does not bother me at all. (thumbs u You are offerring me a choice instead of attempting to force it upon me as a fee for buying from you. I think I look at it more as someone intruding upon my decisions to INSIST/DEMAND that form of payment. Here you make your preferences clear and allow the buyer to make their own decisions

[skypinkblu]

So what does everyone think of this recent growth of "Paypal PERSONAL Only" sales on here?

 

I'm not referring to the "it would be nice if you sent a Personal payment, but cool if not" comments, but strict requirements to disregard the PP TOS and your buyer protection, or not participate in the sales? These are NOT personal payments, but sales, you can have your account revoked or suspended for pulling this scam.

 

I think by allowing sellers to freely disregard Paypal policy and terms of service, CGC is on a slipperly slope here, and a few scams later, it could really harm their reputation and that of the Marketplace itself.

 

Thoughts?

 

I hate it with a vengeance. And will never buy anything from someone who demands it.

I don't care how nice the deal is or how much I want the book...

It screams "greed" to me. This place is already one the best venues to sell books due to the high volume of collectors and there is no charge at all to list items for sale. And still some people want more.

I have a tough time enough already with the people that come to the boards with the intent only to sell books with the least overhead possible and not to engage in any of the discussions, conversations or community building.

Is it a coincidence that a lot of these sellers are also the ones that want you to pay their paypal fees for them ?

 

Here’s a question for you guys who are turned off by folks who require it. I have some books listed currently, and I wrote “payment via PayPal personal will earn you my undying gratitude, but it is certainly not required.” In the past I've never mentioned the personal option.

 

Does that turn you guys off as well? I wouldn’t want to alienate anybody.

 

No, not at all...but I find that most people who want to pay with personal paypal, just make the offer to ME in a PM. I just toss in something extra when they do (if I remember;)

[Snake Eyes]

My two cents for what it is worth . . .

 

 

That was worth more than 2 cents. Excellent post.

 

Thank you sir! Got going on the post and before I knew it there were a few paragraphs (when I initially intended a few sentences).

[Dick Pontoon]

So what does everyone think of this recent growth of "Paypal PERSONAL Only" sales on here?

 

I'm not referring to the "it would be nice if you sent a Personal payment, but cool if not" comments, but strict requirements to disregard the PP TOS and your buyer protection, or not participate in the sales? These are NOT personal payments, but sales, you can have your account revoked or suspended for pulling this scam.

 

I think by allowing sellers to freely disregard Paypal policy and terms of service, CGC is on a slipperly slope here, and a few scams later, it could really harm their reputation and that of the Marketplace itself.

 

Thoughts?

 

I hate it with a vengeance. And will never buy anything from someone who demands it.

I don't care how nice the deal is or how much I want the book...

It screams "greed" to me. This place is already one the best venues to sell books due to the high volume of collectors and there is no charge at all to list items for sale. And still some people want more.

I have a tough time enough already with the people that come to the boards with the intent only to sell books with the least overhead possible and not to engage in any of the discussions, conversations or community building.

Is it a coincidence that a lot of these sellers are also the ones that want you to pay their paypal fees for them ?

 

Here’s a question for you guys who are turned off by folks who require it. I have some books listed currently, and I wrote “payment via PayPal personal will earn you my undying gratitude, but it is certainly not required.” In the past I've never mentioned the personal option.

 

Does that turn you guys off as well? I wouldn’t want to alienate anybody.

 

No, not at all...but I find that most people who want to pay with personal paypal, just make the offer to ME in a PM. I just toss in something extra when they do (if I remember;)

 

maybe I should just strike it from the thread. Now I feel greedy!

 

I’ve actually done a 360 on this. A forumite paid me once with personal, and I thanked him, but said in the future we’d better do it “by the books” which seems really silly to me now.

 

 

[divad]

My two cents for what it is worth (as a frequent buyer). Many folks do use this site as an adjunct to their business, so many deals are not two friends working out a nice trade. Instead, two fellow collectors/colleagues doing business. Now some are friendly, so I admit there are both types...

 

When you list an item for sale, you are choosing to do so in the hopes of obtaining funds. I, in turn, am shopping as I browse through the sell threads. Let me tell you, if I was going back and forth from stores at the mall...I certainly would not shop at the one insists I pay their fees...that is the cost of them choosing to do business with the credit cards companies (or paypal in this case). If they insisted on check or money order only, that would be fine with me as they are not trying to pass on their cost of business.

 

Frankly, I almost always close the thread when I see this insisted upon (or am told a 3% surcharge will be added). This is a cost free platform for listing...just will not pay that fee for you. That being said, when someone cuts me a deal or I have dealt with someone awhile and consider them a friend I will add 3% to the total and pay via the purchase option (I know for sure I did this with my last three transactions). That is a choice that I want to have the ability to make however. Insisting upon my doing this does not build a trusting relationship in my opinion.

 

So the long and the short of it is you are losing a potential sale to me (and as I read some of the complaints on the board to others as well). If the 3% is a critical amount to receive build it into your initial price...then I do not feel insulted (albeit mildly don't want to be overdramatic here )and you are still asking for the price needed. Or better yet...sell it at the original price, build a relationship with someone, and then discuss personal payments. Again, just my two cents...

 

SE

 

Well stated. (thumbs u

[divad]

I feel Forum Transactions are personal also. Sometimes we trade books for books. and sometimes it's books for cash. Either way, I expect absolutely Zero protection from pay pal anyway. We self insure here by use of the Probation list.

 

I don't think there is any SCAM going on by using the personal option provided by pay pal.

 

I don't think it's a scam either, I think that Paypal has added that option to protect themselves from being regulated as a bank.

 

However, when I see someone insist on Personal Paypal, I really do close the thread. I have used the personal option many times, IF I happen to have money in my paypal account and if I know the person, but I prefer that to be an option, I feel uncomfortable being coerced. I feel the same way with people who want 3% if you use Paypal. I've bought that way from C-link, but it's my option, and they are a business, they have bills associated with the sales to pay.

 

In addition, my "protection" comes from my credit card company, and if I'm going to spend more than a few $$ on a book, I'd prefer that I have the OPTION of that protection.

 

Let me give you an example Sharon,

 

I submit books for individuals under my CGC account. If I submit $500 worth of books for someone and they pay me via paypal I now lose money. I am out the 3% or $15 per transaction. If I do this 20 times in a month I am now in the red $300. I always ask for a check. If they cannot pay with a check I ask for the additional 3% or if they decide to use the personal option it is fine. It has it's place, and I feel the main issue here is people abusing that place. If I sell a $500 comic I expect to eat the 3%. I personally am not taking any money out of my pocket, but when a service like submitting books is rendered I do expect the difference to be paid by the customer.

 

No problem here Joe. It's your business - we don't expect you to lose money. Conduct it as you see fit. Consumers always have a choice wheteher to do business with someone or not.

 

One of the problems in this marketplace is that the seller generally has the leverage over the buyer. It is not regulated in any real fashion. Terms of sale should be by agreement of both parties, not just the seller. What would happen if I started posting 's all over the place and then refused the transaction on the basis of terms brought up after the fact in PM's? It wouldn't be long before I was put on the Probation List

[Jeffro.]

So what does everyone think of this recent growth of "Paypal PERSONAL Only" sales on here?

 

I don't care for it and have started ignoring sales threads that say Paypal PERSONAL Only

 

 

 

I'm not sure that all buyers realize that Paypal can revoke their account if they're caught, and that using this payment method for a sales transaction means ZERO Buyer Protection in case of fraud.

 

Bolded - emphasis mine

That's why I only use it with buyers and sellers I trust based on past dealings.

 

 

 

Edited February 25, 2010 by Jeffro

[kdoginohio]

So what does everyone think of this recent growth of "Paypal PERSONAL Only" sales on here?

 

I'm not referring to the "it would be nice if you sent a Personal payment, but cool if not" comments, but strict requirements to disregard the PP TOS and your buyer protection, or not participate in the sales? These are NOT personal payments, but sales, you can have your account revoked or suspended for pulling this scam.

 

I think by allowing sellers to freely disregard Paypal policy and terms of service, CGC is on a slipperly slope here, and a few scams later, it could really harm their reputation and that of the Marketplace itself.

 

Thoughts?

 

I hate it with a vengeance. And will never buy anything from someone who demands it.

I don't care how nice the deal is or how much I want the book...

It screams "greed" to me. This place is already one the best venues to sell books due to the high volume of collectors and there is no charge at all to list items for sale. And still some people want more.

I have a tough time enough already with the people that come to the boards with the intent only to sell books with the lowest overhead possible and not to engage in any of the discussions, conversations or community building.

Is it a coincidence that a lot of these sellers are also the ones that want you to pay their paypal fees for them ?

Define `Greed', I'm a little fuzzy on that.

[Boozad]

I feel Forum Transactions are personal also. Sometimes we trade books for books. and sometimes it's books for cash. Either way, I expect absolutely Zero protection from pay pal anyway. We self insure here by use of the Probation list.

 

I don't think there is any SCAM going on by using the personal option provided by pay pal.

 

I don't think it's a scam either, I think that Paypal has added that option to protect themselves from being regulated as a bank.

 

However, when I see someone insist on Personal Paypal, I really do close the thread. I have used the personal option many times, IF I happen to have money in my paypal account and if I know the person, but I prefer that to be an option, I feel uncomfortable being coerced. I feel the same way with people who want 3% if you use Paypal. I've bought that way from C-link, but it's my option, and they are a business, they have bills associated with the sales to pay.

 

In addition, my "protection" comes from my credit card company, and if I'm going to spend more than a few $$ on a book, I'd prefer that I have the OPTION of that protection.

 

Let me give you an example Sharon,

 

I submit books for individuals under my CGC account. If I submit $500 worth of books for someone and they pay me via paypal I now lose money. I am out the 3% or $15 per transaction. If I do this 20 times in a month I am now in the red $300. I always ask for a check. If they cannot pay with a check I ask for the additional 3% or if they decide to use the personal option it is fine. It has it's place, and I feel the main issue here is people abusing that place. If I sell a $500 comic I expect to eat the 3%. I personally am not taking any money out of my pocket, but when a service like submitting books is rendered I do expect the difference to be paid by the customer.

 

Totally different situation. To be honest, I think this sort of scenario is exactly what the personal option was made for.

[mschmidt]

I feel Forum Transactions are personal also. Sometimes we trade books for books. and sometimes it's books for cash. Either way, I expect absolutely Zero protection from pay pal anyway. We self insure here by use of the Probation list.

 

I don't think there is any SCAM going on by using the personal option provided by pay pal.

 

I don't think it's a scam either, I think that Paypal has added that option to protect themselves from being regulated as a bank.

 

However, when I see someone insist on Personal Paypal, I really do close the thread. I have used the personal option many times, IF I happen to have money in my paypal account and if I know the person, but I prefer that to be an option, I feel uncomfortable being coerced. I feel the same way with people who want 3% if you use Paypal. I've bought that way from C-link, but it's my option, and they are a business, they have bills associated with the sales to pay.

 

In addition, my "protection" comes from my credit card company, and if I'm going to spend more than a few $$ on a book, I'd prefer that I have the OPTION of that protection.

 

Let me give you an example Sharon,

 

I submit books for individuals under my CGC account. If I submit $500 worth of books for someone and they pay me via paypal I now lose money. I am out the 3% or $15 per transaction. If I do this 20 times in a month I am now in the red $300. I always ask for a check. If they cannot pay with a check I ask for the additional 3% or if they decide to use the personal option it is fine. It has it's place, and I feel the main issue here is people abusing that place. If I sell a $500 comic I expect to eat the 3%. I personally am not taking any money out of my pocket, but when a service like submitting books is rendered I do expect the difference to be paid by the customer.

 

Totally different situation. To be honest, I think this sort of scenario is exactly what the personal option was made for.

 

I agree - joey's basically just the middle-man here, the guy who collects the money from his customers & give it to CGC. There's zero reason why he should be out of pocket for providing this service.

 

To return to the topic at hand, I too think it's crappy to require personal PP payments in FS threads - when I invoice people, I include the following snippet:

 

I always appreciate a personal paypal payment (so I avoid having to pay the PP fees), but it's never a problem if that's not convenient for you. (thumbs u

 

I think that's a pretty decent way of doing it ...

[drbanner]

If a seller states that payment is required in Wooden Nickles, I move on. Free choice is a beautiful thing.

 

However, I don't believe "the forum" has any right or obligation to prohibit the seller from only accepting payment in Wooden Nickles. Each seller sets their own terms and conditions, and each buyer can choose to accept them, or not.

 

 

Whoa, I just noticed the disclaimer stating "We do not monitor buys and sells. Please check out your buyer or seller before you commit to a transaction. Disputes and issues are not the responsibility of the board hosts, you are transacting at your own risk."

 

Guess there's a bunch of "de-regulators" 'round here, eh?

[JerryZ]

I always appreciate a personal paypal payment (so I avoid having to pay the PP fees), but it's never a problem if that's not convenient for you. (thumbs u

 

I think that's a pretty decent way of doing it ...

 

I agree.. I NEVER will list in my threads "personal ONLY" and if I see a thread with that in it I will not read any further..

 

I will let the buyer decide how they want to pay me.be it regular or personal it makes no diff to me Im selling my item so I really dont care.Repeat customers usually will pay via the personal tab and I do appreciate that but Im not forcing anyone to do it .

 

Listing books for sale then saying personal only is a bit tacky IMO..Ill rank it up there with people who list books for sale they dont have in hand.."grades today" so what..... Lets see the book first before you decide to put it in a sales thread..

 

Isnt that what the announcment thread is for?

Edited February 25, 2010 by JerryZ

[drbanner]

Listing books for sale then saying personal only is a bit tacky IMO..Ill rank it up there with people who list books for sale they dont have in hand.."grades today" so what..... Lets see the book first before you decide to put it in a sales thread..

 

Isnt that what the announcment thread is for?