May Heritage Auction 3 3

[comix4fun]

33 minutes ago, cstojano said:

Keyword auction alerts from the big three aggregators have killed that.

I've noticed that. Also, several of the usual auction houses I'd search have drastically increased their minimum starting bids. In many cases pieces are starting at or above FMV.

[cstojano]

6 minutes ago, delekkerste said:

OMFG...the Sgt. Fury Annual 4 cover is up to $22K hammer ($26.3K with the juice).  Annuals #2, 3 and 4 are all very memorable back issues for me that I picked up out of the bargain back issue bin as a kid with barely any spending money.  I had been thinking about going after the #4 cover, but, this price is just shocking to me - nice cover, but it's Ayers/Severin, small art, and the main characters are tiny! 

I guess I'll just content myself with owning that tattered copy I pulled out of the bargain bin for 50 cents or whatever it was back then.  This market has just gone insane...the only way to win it seems is to be even more insane than the next guy.   I'm afraid I'm far too well-adjusted for this market.  

I can't imagine this is going to end well in the long-run, but, what do I know...I'm just a Bronze/Copper Age nostalgia collector.  

As I was reading your post this popped up in my feed, seems its an OMFG week in the art world.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/18/arts/jean-michel-basquiat-painting-is-sold-for-110-million-at-auction.html

Edited May 19, 2017 by cstojano

[SquareChaos]

11 minutes ago, delekkerste said:

OMFG...the Sgt. Fury Annual 4 cover is up to $22K hammer ($26.3K with the juice).  Annuals #2, 3 and 4 are all very memorable back issues for me that I picked up out of the bargain back issue bin as a kid with barely any spending money.  I had been thinking about going after the #4 cover, but, this price is just shocking to me - nice cover, but it's Ayers/Severin, small art, and the main characters are tiny! 

I guess I'll just content myself with owning that tattered copy I pulled out of the bargain bin for 50 cents or whatever it was back then.  This market has just gone insane...the only way to win it seems is to be even more insane than the next guy.   I'm afraid I'm far too well-adjusted for this market.  

I can't imagine this is going to end well in the long-run, but, what do I know...I'm just a Bronze/Copper Age nostalgia collector.  

As a still newish collector of OA... I've been saying this since I was a very new collector of OA  

 

Nothing makes sense, any price can be justified, everything is 'worth' what someone pays - remember these justifications, because we're gonna hear em.

[delekkerste]

19 minutes ago, cstojano said:

As I was reading your post this popped up in my feed, seems its an OMFG week in the art world.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/18/arts/jean-michel-basquiat-painting-is-sold-for-110-million-at-auction.html

I am a huuuuuuuuuge Basquiat fan (don't own any art, but do own books, DVDs, t-shirts and even 3 pairs of Basquiat-inspired shoes), but, man, that is a  price.  

I'll note that it may be an auction record for an American artist, but there have been private sales of other American artists (Pollock, Rothko, De Kooning if you count the latter as American) that were higher.  I guess in the context of comparing this sale to other crazy prices, it might not look that crazy.  But, really, it's all crazy...

Anyway, no bubbles here; $110.5 million for a Basquiat, $71.7K for NYX #3, Bitcoin nearing $2000, $660K for a 1952 Topps Mickey Mantle PSA 8 (was an $80-$90K card in 2011), Tesla stock at $313, Amazing Fantasy #15 CGC 6.5 north of $50K, nosebleed housing prices in SoCal/NoCal, Canada, Sweden, Australia, etc...all of these are perfectly justified by solid fundamental reasons I'm sure.  I'm sure it's not that we're living in the biggest, most all-encompassing asset bubble of all-time...naaaaaah, couldn't be!  

Edited May 19, 2017 by delekkerste

[Doc Joe]

14 minutes ago, delekkerste said:

I am a huuuuuuuuuge Basquiat fan (don't own any art, but do own books, DVDs, t-shirts and even 3 pairs of Basquiat-inspired shoes), but, man, that is a  price.  

I'll note that it may be an auction record for an American artist, but there have been private sales of other American artists (Pollock, Rothko, De Kooning if you count the latter as American) that were higher.  I guess in the context of comparing this sale to other crazy prices, it might not look that crazy.  But, really, it's all crazy...

Anyway, no bubbles here; $110.5 million for a Basquiat, $71.7K for NYX #3, Bitcoin nearing $2000, $660K for a 1952 Topps Mickey Mantle PSA 8 (was an $80-$90K card in 2011), Tesla stock at $313, Amazing Fantasy #15 CGC 6.5 north of $50K, nosebleed housing prices in SoCal/NoCal, Canada, Sweden, Australia, etc...all of these are perfectly justified by solid fundamental reasons I'm sure.  I'm sure it's not that we're living in the biggest, most all-encompassing asset bubble of all-time...naaaaaah, couldn't be!  

I heard someone talk about a rumor they heard from someone who overheard a person saying they thought they knew for sure maybe that there was going to be a movie based on the Sgt Fury Annuals - especially Annual 4

So it all makes sense...

[delekkerste]

11 minutes ago, Doctor Joe said:

I heard someone talk about a rumor they heard from someone who overheard a person saying they thought they knew for sure maybe that there was going to be a movie based on the Sgt Fury Annuals - especially Annual 4

So it all makes sense...

It will be a Sgt. Fury movie based on Annual 4, with a flash-forward scene that reveals that X-23 is Fury's grand-daughter and that she is marrying Tesla founder Elon Musk.  Tickets for the film will only be payable in Bitcoin.

NOW it all makes sense!

Edited May 19, 2017 by delekkerste

[comix4fun]

1 minute ago, delekkerste said:

It will be a Sgt. Fury movie based on Annual 4, with a flash-forward scene that reveals that X-23 is Fury's grand-daughter and that she is marrying Tesla founder Elon Musk.  Tickets for the film will only be payable in Bitcoin.

NOW it all makes sense!

[Squeezy McSphincter]

What are the odds that, in 10-20 years or so, the Fritz pieces are worth even close to what as paid for them yesterday?  I'm pretty ignorant of the market, but won't most Fritz fans be aged out by then?  I guess you only need two people with rabid interest and a pile of disposable cash, but that should be a tough ask by then despite the quality of the material.  The pool of interested buyers must already be fairly small.

 

[suspense39]

12 minutes ago, Bubb Rubb said:

What are the odds that, in 10-20 years or so, the Fritz pieces are worth even close to what as paid for them yesterday?  I'm pretty ignorant of the market, but won't most Fritz fans be aged out by then?  I guess you only need two people with rabid interest and a pile of disposable cash, but that should be a tough ask by then despite the quality of the material.  The pool of interested buyers must already be fairly small.

 

Crumb is a crossover artist, and reaches past nostalgia. He's represented by David Zwirner, so pretty strong backing there.

[delekkerste]

15 minutes ago, suspense39 said:

Crumb is a crossover artist, and reaches past nostalgia. He's represented by David Zwirner, so pretty strong backing there.

Yeah, it's definitely not just a nostalgia thing with Crumb any longer.  No guarantees that these prices will hold/increase in the coming decades, but I would think this material has a better chance of holding up than a lot of other comic art.  

That said, as I stated in another thread, there are very few things that I would trust to maintain their desirability over the very long term.  Maybe gold (with a 5000 year track record) and well situated property (though even that can change over time).  I certainly wouldn't count on recent trends in art or nostalgic totems of the past few generations holding their value, let alone increasing further from current levels in real (inflation-adjusted) terms, if you look a generation or two forward.  I just think that, as one Silicon Valley-based OA collector told me recently, we are in the biggest asset bubble in history - while the Tech Bubble 1.0 and the pre-2008 Great Asset Mania were both more egregious, neither was anywhere near as pervasive and widespread across all asset classes as the current one.  

Next, look at the demographic trends (negative), especially in light of current asset prices and debt levels.  If you believe, as I do, that demography is destiny, looking out over the very long term (20-30 years plus), you can expect the future to be deflationary, not inflationary.  Finally, look at the pace of content creation and technological and cultural change.  The amount of new stuff being created in a year these days is more than what used to take a decade or more to create.  With population growth not increasing at nearly the same rate, there's just no way that the aggregate number of people, entertainment hours and dollars spent on any given thing can keep up.  More and more things will fall by the wayside with each passing year and decade - it is inevitable.  There is a thread in The Water Cooler section now about how Elvis collectibles are falling off a cliff now.  Even The King is not immune!  Spidey & Co. may be in good hands at the Mouse House, but, I wouldn't count on NYX #3 being worth more in inflation-adjusted terms 20 years from now than it is today.  

Edited May 19, 2017 by delekkerste

[vodou]

Gene...we can boil it down, I think, to this:

Every collector should ask themselves how their spending habits (both life and art) would change if...all their lines of credit rates doubled? Extrapolate that outward and you get your answer for current mature collectors. If you're really pessimistic, ask yourself again how much would change is those doubled rates doubled again...and you could get an easy 5-8% yield on CDs or money markets like you used to, as recently as 2000ish. The next group/s coming up, demographically, that's already pretty black and white. They don't have any money to begin with and (seemingly) owe something to everybody they ever shook hands with too.

[NinjaSealed]

3 hours ago, delekkerste said:

Anyway, no bubbles here; $110.5 million for a Basquiat, $71.7K for NYX #3, Bitcoin nearing $2000, $660K for a 1952 Topps Mickey Mantle PSA 8 (was an $80-$90K card in 2011), Tesla stock at $313, Amazing Fantasy #15 CGC 6.5 north of $50K, nosebleed housing prices in SoCal/NoCal, Canada, Sweden, Australia, etc...all of these are perfectly justified by solid fundamental reasons I'm sure.  I'm sure it's not that we're living in the biggest, most all-encompassing asset bubble of all-time...naaaaaah, couldn't be!  

Tulip mania, except, of course AF #15 which will grow at a 10% APR 4 EVER!!!

[Bronty]

11 minutes ago, NinjaSealed said:

Tulip mania, except, of course AF #15 which will grow at a 10% APR 4 EVER!!!

the AF 15 on platinum night (not sure if that's the one Gene was referencing as the grade is different) got 50k for a 6.0... nutty!

[NelsonAI]

The Crumb Fritz the Cat piece will look cheap in a decade.  Crumb is revered in Europe and Fritz the Cat is arguably, his most recognizable creation.

Cheers!

N.

 

[delekkerste]

3 minutes ago, Bronty said:

the AF 15 on platinum night (not sure if that's the one Gene was referencing as the grade is different) got 50k for a 6.0... nutty!

Was referencing a recent 6.5 sale...didn't even see last night's result.  $50.2K for a 6.0...madness, dude, madness.  

[Bronty]

9 minutes ago, delekkerste said:

Was referencing a recent 6.5 sale...didn't even see last night's result.  $50.2K for a 6.0...madness, dude, madness.  

I haven't looked it up, but it seems people in the Gold heritage thread are talking about the sale of a 4.0 today at 35k?   That seems even crazier, if that's possible.

[Bronty]

I had to look it up.    4.0, OW, $35,850.

I remember a friend selling his 4.0 for 5k or something like 5 years ago?   And us both thinking 5k was too much for an AF15.   And now its 7x that?  

 

https://comics.ha.com/itm/silver-age-1956-1969-/amazing-fantasy-15-marvel-1962-cgc-vg-40-off-white-pages/a/7163-92164.s?ic4=GalleryView-Thumbnail-071515

Edited May 19, 2017 by Bronty

[Doc Joe]

What I hear from Gene is a cunning attempt to stop us bidding on the art he wants...

You Sir are transparent in your schemes, your evil evil schemes

[NinjaSealed]

I think in mid grade AF 15 has pretty much doubled since the beginning of the year. Just crazy.

 

Auction starts in a few, so good luck all. 

I have one bid out so we will see how that goes.

[drdroom]

These are some lovely Foster examples.