Marvel Developing Winter Soldier-Falcon Limited Series for Disney’s Streaming Service 3 3

[Bosco685]

7 minutes ago, @therealsilvermane said:

Okay, let's assume it's a small band of rogue Skrulls invading Earth and going against the wishes of Talos and Skrull ally Nick Fury. What's the point of that? Is it a band of teenage Skrulls just looking to cause mischief? The usual reason for an alien invasion according to the Handbook of Alien Invasions is to conquer Earth. It would be almost like Skrull suicide to cross Talos, Captain Marvel, and Fury who was aboard a Skrull spaceship in Spiderman FFH manned by an army of Skrulls. I just think it's an offbrand alien race who don't care about Captain Marvel (or never heard of her), Talos, or Fury.

There are so many aliens to choose from if Marvel wants to expand its universe. Why have Skrulls fighting each other? This is a chance to introduce Dire Wraiths (by another name, though, as the Wraiths name is owned by Hasbro), the Badoon, the Brood, the Cotati, or anybody else. Back in the days of Marvel's horror sci-fi Atlas comics, almost every issue featured a secret alien invasion from a new alien race like every month.

But to assume a group of Skrulls are good so therefore they all must be good is way over-simplified how living being think and act. Know what I mean?

Just like human beings can have a Steve Rogers to every Baron Zemo or Red Skull (no matter what motivation tipped them over the edge to villainy), Skrulls are going to have the same behavior.

[@therealsilvermane]

Also, if Skrulls end up being the bad guys in Secret Invasion and essentially are alien terrorists in the story, then that means that Yonn-Rogg, the villain of Captain Marvel, was right all along about Skrulls, as was Carol's Kree-brainwashed assumption of Skrulls as terrorists before her awakening. It would be going backwards storywise and justifying the actions and point of view of a previous MCU villain.

Edited April 24, 2021 by @therealsilvermane

[Bosco685]

Just now, @therealsilvermane said:

Also, if Skrulls end up being the bad guys in Secret Invasion and essentially are alien terrorists in the story, then that means that Yonn-Rogg, the villain of Captain Marvel, was right all along about Skrulls as was previous Carol's brainwashed assumption of Skrulls as terrorists before her awakening. It would be going backwards storywise and justifying the actions and point of view of a previous MCU villain.

That is just silly to take the stance ALL SKRULLS MUST BE GOOD BECAUSE IT HAPPENED IN CAPTAIN MARVEL.

Come on now. You have better understanding of thinking beings than that. Any of them can go bad with the right motivational influences.

[drotto]

24 minutes ago, @therealsilvermane said:

I've said this before and maybe I'll be wrong but I think the invading aliens in the Secret Invasion won't be Skrulls and be a different alien race altogether. This means it won't be a straight adaptation of the Bendis event storyline. It's a Disney+ show which makes me think it'll be a smaller scale story. In past posts, I've thrown out Dire Wraiths (or something similar) as a possible invading alien, but we'll see. Either way, I think it'd just be too confusing for general mainstream audiences to see Skrulls as both good guys and bad guys. Plus, Talos is going to team up with Fury in the show, again pointing to Skrulls being good guys.

Again this makes Zero sense.  They have already brought some Skrulls into the MCU and established that group them as good, does not mean all of them are good.  Bringing in a second shape shifting race, would be more confusing than saying some Skrulls are good and some are bad.  They will most likely make those that were already seen a peaceful faction or offshoot.  People are smart enough to realize races can be both good and bad. To say the audience can not see any degree of nuance is treating that audience as juvenile and stupid.  

[drotto]

11 minutes ago, Bosco685 said:

That is just silly to take the stance ALL SKRULLS MUST BE GOOD BECAUSE IT HAPPENED IN CAPTAIN MARVEL.

Come on now. You have better understanding of thinking beings than that. Any of them can go bad with the right motivational influences.

Another thought.  Making SC the Queen would be very logical.  They have not established Spider-Woman in the MCU, and they need a known character in a prominant position.  SC now more than fills that role.

[@therealsilvermane]

18 minutes ago, Bosco685 said:

That is just silly to take the stance ALL SKRULLS MUST BE GOOD BECAUSE IT HAPPENED IN CAPTAIN MARVEL.

Come on now. You have better understanding of thinking beings than that. Any of them can go bad with the right motivational influences.

But it's not just Captain Marvel. We saw Fury taking R&R on a Skrull ship as Talos and Soren helped Peter Parker on Earth in FFH. We saw a Skrull give a goodwill message to Monica Rambeau at the end of WandaVision. All we've seen in the MCU is that Skrulls are good guys. The only reason to make them the bad guys in Secret Invasion is to faithfully follow Brian Michael Bendis' storyline.

Historically, the comic book Secret Invasion and Fantastic Four #2 are the only instances in the comics I remember when Skrulls tried to invade Earth. Dire Wraiths have a much longer history of it as they fought Rom and several superheroes over Earth.

Anyway, we'll find out soon enough. I know most fans and comics pundits are talking the Skrulls as the invaders in MCU's Secret Invasion(obviously as that's the comics Secret Invasion story) and I believe I'm a lone voice in the wilderness saying they aren't, and I think I'm right. We'll see.

Edited April 24, 2021 by @therealsilvermane

[@therealsilvermane]

11 minutes ago, drotto said:

Again this makes Zero sense.  They have already brought some Skrulls into the MCU and established that group them as good, does not mean all of them are good.  Bringing in a second shape shifting race, would be more confusing than saying some Skrulls are good and some are bad.  They will most likely make those that were already seen a peaceful faction or offshoot.  People are smart enough to realize races can be both good and bad. To say the audience can not see any degree of nuance is treating that audience as juvenile and stupid.  

Okay, then it will mean that Yonn-Rogg and the villainous Kree were right all along about the Skrulls as essentially terrorists in Captain Marvel. We'll see what Marvel does.

[Bosco685]

39 minutes ago, @therealsilvermane said:

But it's not just Captain Marvel. We saw Fury taking R&R on a Skrull ship as Talos and Soren helped Peter Parker on Earth in FFH. We saw a Skrull give a goodwill message to Monica Rambeau at the end of WandaVision. All we've seen in the MCU is that Skrulls are good guys. The only reason to make them the bad guys in Secret Invasion is to faithfully follow Brian Michael Bendis' storyline.

Historically, the comic book Secret Invasion and Fantastic Four #2 are the only instances in the comics I remember when Skrulls tried to invade Earth. Dire Wraiths have a much longer history of it as they fought Rom and several superheroes over Earth.

Anyway, we'll find out soon enough. I know most fans and comics pundits are talking the Skrulls as the invaders in MCU's Secret Invasion(obviously as that's the comics Secret Invasion story) and I believe I'm a lone voice in the wilderness saying they aren't, and I think I'm right. We'll see.

I thought what happens in the comic books influences the MCU stories.

2 hours ago, @therealsilvermane said:

If Sharon Carter never took the serum in the comics, I don't think they'd have her take it in the MCU. 

So now because of what took place in the Captain Marvel, that rule doesn't apply? Along with logical living being design where there can be good and bad portions of the population.

[D84]

My question is will secret invasion feature the boat?

[chezmtghut]

5 hours ago, the blob said:

Especially as there is one living flag smasher and 3 super soldiers (not including cap) to collect DNA from to build more. Of course, at the end of the day bullets kill them. Why weren't they wearing kevlar body armor?

That's a good question. Seems like the serum boosts their ego to some extent, but they ultimately wanted to be martyrs, so maybe dying to encourage others to rise up in their place was a motive.

 

2 hours ago, @therealsilvermane said:

Okay, let's assume it's a small band of rogue Skrulls invading Earth and going against the wishes of Talos and Skrull ally Nick Fury. What's the point of that? Is it a band of teenage Skrulls just looking to cause mischief? The usual reason for an alien invasion according to the Handbook of Alien Invasions is to conquer Earth. It would be almost like Skrull suicide to cross Talos, Captain Marvel, and Fury who was aboard a Skrull spaceship in Spiderman FFH manned by an army of Skrulls. I just think it's an offbrand alien race who don't care about Captain Marvel (or never heard of her), Talos, or Fury.

There are so many aliens to choose from if Marvel wants to expand its universe. Why have Skrulls fighting each other? This is a chance to introduce Dire Wraiths (by another name, though, as the Wraiths name is owned by Hasbro), the Badoon, the Brood, the Cotati, or anybody else. Back in the days of Marvel's horror sci-fi Atlas comics, almost every issue featured a secret alien invasion from a new alien race like every month.

I think Secret Invasion will ultimately be about the Kree vs Skrull war that earth gets stuck in the middle of. Just like Thanos, Zemo or the Flag Smashers, everyone has their justifications for thinking what they do is right.

[Drummy]

If I remember right, Kevin Feige is on the record somewhere that not all skrulls -- just as with all humans -- are 'good'.  I think we'll be seeing plenty of evil skrulls in future storylines, not only to create some compelling conflicts but also to play up the 'anyone could be a skrull' questions for fans/audiences.  It will be the ultimate mind-fudge playground for the writers going forward.

Dan

[@therealsilvermane]

3 minutes ago, chezmtghut said:

That's a good question. Seems like the serum boosts their ego to some extent, but they ultimately wanted to be martyrs, so maybe dying to encourage others to rise up in their place was a motive.

 

I think Secret Invasion will ultimately be about the Kree vs Skrull war that earth gets stuck in the middle of. Just like Thanos, Zemo or the Flag Smashers, everyone has their justifications for thinking what they do is right.

I really don't. Kree vs Skrull with Earth in the middle was kinda the battle at the end of Captain Marvel. To do that yet again in a multi-episode TV show might be kinda...boring? I think that battle in CM is the extent of the classic Kree Skrull War that we're going to see. I really think the MCU Secret War will be Nick Fury, Talos, and maybe a few other Skrulls seeking out a new invading alien race on Earth or maybe even an entity. I could be wrong. We'll see.

I do think it's where we meet Dorrek aka Hulkling of the Young Avengers. Also, in the recent Empyre event series, the Skrull, Kree, and heroes of Earth all team up to fend off an attack on Earth by the Cotati, a plant-like alien race who resurrected the Swordsman in an Avengers storyline from the 70's, so maybe there's something there. We'll see.

[chezmtghut]

1 minute ago, @therealsilvermane said:

I really don't. Kree vs Skrull with Earth in the middle was kinda the battle at the end of Captain Marvel. To do that yet again in a multi-episode TV show might be kinda...boring? I think that battle in CM is the extent of the classic Kree Skrull War that we're going to see. I really think the MCU Secret War will be Nick Fury, Talos, and maybe a few other Skrulls seeking out a new invading alien race on Earth or maybe even an entity. I could be wrong. We'll see.

I do think it's where we meet Dorrek aka Hulkling of the Young Avengers. Also, in the recent Empyre event series, the Skrull, Kree, and heroes of Earth all team up to fend off an attack on Earth by the Cotati, a plant-like alien race who resurrected the Swordsman in an Avengers storyline from the 70's, so maybe there's something there. We'll see.

It would just be building on what happened in Captain Marvel & I don't think one small incursion was the end of that story. It also happened decades ago in the MCU timeline. It would be like arguing that WB is finished using Darkseid after Snyder's Justice League, because it's too repetitive. They're bringing characters back in streaming series for a reason.

[jcjames]

3 hours ago, @therealsilvermane said:

I've said this before and maybe I'll be wrong but I think the invading aliens in the Secret Invasion won't be Skrulls and be a different alien race altogether. This means it won't be a straight adaptation of the Bendis event storyline. It's a Disney+ show which makes me think it'll be a smaller scale story. In past posts, I've thrown out Dire Wraiths (or something similar) as a possible invading alien, but we'll see. Either way, I think it'd just be too confusing for general mainstream audiences to see Skrulls as both good guys and bad guys. Plus, Talos is going to team up with Fury in the show, again pointing to Skrulls being good guys.

Using this logic, Nick Fury is going to team up with Talos, pointing to human's being good guys. 

[@therealsilvermane]

26 minutes ago, Drummy said:

If I remember right, Kevin Feige is on the record somewhere that not all skrulls -- just as with all humans -- are 'good'.  I think we'll be seeing plenty of evil skrulls in future storylines, not only to create some compelling conflicts but also to play up the 'anyone could be a skrull' questions for fans/audiences.  It will be the ultimate mind-fudge playground for the writers going forward.

Dan

Sure, I just don't think we're going to see an armada of Skrulls invading Earth, though, in Secret War. I think Skrulls, as a general whole, are indebted to Carol Danvers and Nick Fury of Earth because they helped them find a new home on the other side of the galaxy away from the Kree bullies.

[@therealsilvermane]

58 minutes ago, jcjames said:

Using this logic, Nick Fury is going to team up with Talos, pointing to human's being good guys. 

You could apply that logic if the show was taking place on the Skrull's planet on the other side of the galaxy which is probably populated with Skrulls with all different kinds of personalities, maybe even a few rotten ones. But I think we can assume Secret Invasion takes place on Earth. That means the Skrulls on this side of the galaxy will be involved, which obviously includes Talos as well as the very very large Skrull crew we saw on the Skrull mothership upon which Fury was taking R&R at the end of Spiderman Far From Home. Then there's the Skrull messenger at the end of WandaVision. That's a lot of Skrulls which appear to be allies of Nick Fury, and thus the good guys in Secret Invasion.

 

[jcjames]

I'm saying you can't judge whether an entire advanced intelligent species is "good" or "bad" based on a few examples from that species, regardless of where that example is found in the galaxy. 

 

Edited April 25, 2021 by jcjames

[GeeksAreMyPeeps]

On 4/22/2021 at 2:40 PM, TupennyConan said:

Yes, it's a hateful insult. The internet is correct, yet again.

It's critical. That isn't necessarily hateful.

[fastballspecial]

6 hours ago, @therealsilvermane said:

But it's not just Captain Marvel. We saw Fury taking R&R on a Skrull ship as Talos and Soren helped Peter Parker on Earth in FFH. We saw a Skrull give a goodwill message to Monica Rambeau at the end of WandaVision. All we've seen in the MCU is that Skrulls are good guys. The only reason to make them the bad guys in Secret Invasion is to faithfully follow Brian Michael Bendis' storyline.

Historically, the comic book Secret Invasion and Fantastic Four #2 are the only instances in the comics I remember when Skrulls tried to invade Earth. Dire Wraiths have a much longer history of it as they fought Rom and several superheroes over Earth.

Anyway, we'll find out soon enough. I know most fans and comics pundits are talking the Skrulls as the invaders in MCU's Secret Invasion(obviously as that's the comics Secret Invasion story) and I believe I'm a lone voice in the wilderness saying they aren't, and I think I'm right. We'll see.

There are many ways they can write the story. They can use the FF story of Galactus destroying their homeworld. They can use they cant shape shift anymore. They are running from the  Kree and so on. I agree with the Dire Wraith comparison as they were much more sinister then the Skrulls, but essentially from memory the Skrulls always had several factions vying for power in the empire. 

This just might be one of those factions. I would much prefer the Dire Wraiths though.

 

Edited April 25, 2021 by fastballspecial

[Mephisto]

On 4/23/2021 at 8:40 PM, drotto said:

I did not think about your Sharon theory, I like it.

 

This show was ok, I am glad I watched it, I do not feel the need to watch it again. My biggest criticism of the show is I found it very predictable.

The Falcon/Karli/Carter scene near the end was nothing sort of cliche done over and over again in films.

The whole thing was predictable garbage.