Has anyone had an Ebay buyer claim your book was a fake? 0

[JaySlim]

If so, how did you deal with it?

I am currently going through this process and would like some advice if anyone can spare it.  

I sold a CGC Signature series comic book back in Aug.  The buyer receives book, provides positive feedback then a few days later asks for a refund.  Since it is a CGC book with a verifiable number to check the validity of the book, my listing did not offer a refund on this item.  Buyer then opens a case with PayPal and loses.  He then proceeds to open one with his financial institution.  How have you dealt with this?  Is it to late once they have taken the money from my PayPal acct?  Or do I still have a chance that PayPal will win this dispute for me with this guy?  Anyone?

 

[FlyingDonut]

On 11/16/2018 at 3:50 PM, JaySlim said:

If so, how did you deal with it?

I am currently going through this process and would like some advice if anyone can spare it.  

I sold a CGC Signature series comic book back in Aug.  The buyer receives book, provides positive feedback then a few days later asks for a refund.  Since it is a CGC book with a verifiable number to check the validity of the book, my listing did not offer a refund on this item.  Buyer then opens a case with PayPal and loses.  He then proceeds to open one with his financial institution.  How have you dealt with this?  Is it to late once they have taken the money from my PayPal acct?  Or do I still have a chance that PayPal will win this dispute for me with this guy?  Anyone?

 

Please provide the buyer's name so I can block. Thanks.

[ExNihilo]

On 11/16/2018 at 12:50 PM, JaySlim said:

Buyer then opens a case with PayPal and loses.

This is surprising.  Based on what I've read here, it always sounds like the buyer has all the protection in these cases when they file a claim with eBay and PayPal.

For high value books, I'll bring the package to the post office and film in one continuous shot where the book never leaves the camera shot.  I'll lay out the book and packing materials, film a close up of the book/CGC number, set the camera to the side always keeping the book in the shot.  Then i'll place the book in the package, tape it up, apply the shipping label, turn the box around so all 6 sides are shown to the camera, then i'll take the camera to show the shipping label, before walking over and physically handing it over to the USPS employee.  Only after I physically hand off the package, do I stop filming.

[ADAMANTIUM]

9 minutes ago, ExNihilo said:

This is surprising.  Based on what I've read here, it always sounds like the buyer has all the protection in these cases when they file a claim with eBay and PayPal.

For high value books, I'll bring the package to the post office and film in one continuous shot where the book never leaves the camera shot.  I'll lay out the book and packing materials, film a close up of the book/CGC number, set the camera to the side always keeping the book in the shot.  Then i'll place the book in the package, tape it up, apply the shipping label, turn the box around so all 6 sides are shown to the camera, then i'll take the camera to show the shipping label, before walking over and physically handing it over to the USPS employee.  Only after I physically hand off the package, do I stop filming.

Unfortunately this is the world we may live in. I see infomercials on late night T.V. about a go-pro type camera that can be clipped on what your wearing to record all day. They even market as, "in case you witness a crime, road rage, ohh and also if your kid scores a soccer goal..." 

I didn't know what to think  

[ExNihilo]

2 minutes ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

Unfortunately this is the world we may live in. I see infomercials on late night T.V. about a go-pro type camera that can be clipped on what your wearing to record all day. They even market as, "in case you witness a crime, road rage, ohh and also if your kid scores a soccer goal..." 

I didn't know what to think  

I think I saw the same infomercial the other day.  Was it the one that you apparently hide at home and can use for break-ins, but also works as a dash cam, bike cam, etc?  :P

[ADAMANTIUM]

So the buyer was saying that the signature was a fake?

[ADAMANTIUM]

1 minute ago, ExNihilo said:

I think I saw the same infomercial the other day.  Was it the one that you apparently hide at home and can use for break-ins, but also works as a dash cam, bike cam, etc?  :P

Ya and it has a cop decked out in a bullet proof vest and like 10 police cars behind him all lined up for duty, don't leave home without it!

[ADAMANTIUM]

I guess by the title you meant "book", but that is odd... I think that you'll win any of the cases, if he bases his reason on "fake", unfortunately I think there is always the "i don't want it" and I don't know how the buyer's "financial institution" will react....

 

[theCapraAegagrus]

If he paid via checking account, I think it's very unlikely that he wins any such cases from his financial institution. It's the customer's money. Now, if he paid via credit card, then the tune could change. In those cases, it's the bank's money, and they want you accruing interest and paying annual fees (and earning them network transaction fees). It goes from about 0.1% to 25% chance they side with the cardholder if it's a credit transaction.

Then, there's also the case of AmEx v Discover v Visa v Mastercard. If he paid with a credit card and it's AmEx/Discover, the likelihood increases (Visa Signature and World Elite Mastercard have considerably close standards to these 2 networks). A normal Visa or Mastercard holder is at the entire whim of his/her individual bank, and they're probably half as likely to side with the customer as the previous 4 mentioned.

No matter how you cut it, this customer is a DB.

[MadGenius]

I'd love to hear more about this. What makes the buyer think his Signature Series book is a fake? 

Also, you should out this person so we can all block them.

[deadleg]

34 minutes ago, MadGenius said:

I'd love to hear more about this. What makes the buyer think his Signature Series book is a fake? 

Also, you should out this person so we can all block them.

+1

[Buzzetta]

And what might this fine upstanding citizen's name be?  I like to say, "Hi." 

[The Brain]

1 minute ago, Buzzetta said:

And what might this fine upstanding citizen's name be?  I like to say, "Hi." 

 

This is a rather ambiguous response, as it could be taken two ways.

One, and I think this one is most unlikely, is that you are "this fine upstanding citizen."

Or, Two, you would like to "greet" this person.

Any clarification on this would be most helpful, thanks.

 

[Buzzetta]

1 hour ago, The Brain said:

 

This is a rather ambiguous response, as it could be taken two ways.

One, and I think this one is most unlikely, is that you are "this fine upstanding citizen."

Or, Two, you would like to "greet" this person.

Any clarification on this would be most helpful, thanks.

 

The following statements are true:

I am not the person in question that did a transaction with the original poster. 

I am by no means a fine upstanding citizen. 

I would like to greet the person who did business with the original poster. 

[PopKulture]

12 hours ago, ExNihilo said:

For high value books, I'll bring the package to the post office and film in one continuous shot where the book never leaves the camera shot.  I'll lay out the book and packing materials, film a close up of the book/CGC number, set the camera to the side always keeping the book in the shot.  Then i'll place the book in the package, tape it up, apply the shipping label, turn the box around so all 6 sides are shown to the camera, then i'll take the camera to show the shipping label, before walking over and physically handing it over to the USPS employee.  Only after I physically hand off the package, do I stop filming.

Ughh. That sounds like an ungodly amount of work. I'm glad I don't sell high value books online. I'm sure, however, you only take precautions like this because you've leaned the hard way.  

I have to admit I'm a tad bit curious at what price point all that becomes necessary...  

Edited November 30, 2018 by PopKulture

[ExNihilo]

1 hour ago, PopKulture said:

Ughh. That sounds like an ungodly amount of work. I'm glad I don't sell high value books online. I'm sure, however, you only take precautions like this because you've leaned the hard way.  

I have to admit I' a tad bit curious at what price point all that becomes necessary...  

Fortunately for me, I've never had an issue (knock on wood).  I just do it this way because of the horror stories I've read on these boards.  I don't make very many eBay sales, fewer still that are high value.  To date, I've done three sales above $300 where I felt like doing this just to cover myself.  There was one transaction for $175 to a buyer in Singapore that seemed sketch (<10 feedback, international sale where I specified domestic sales only), but that one worked out because the buyer just turned out to be a new eBayer.

[JaySlim]

Thanks for the replies all.  I was just about done with PayPal and Ebay when this happened to me but I'd like to give those interested and update.

So, I sold the comic book, a CGC Signature Series Killing Joke signed by Brian Bolland, to an Ebay customer.  I purchased the book from Lone Star Comics and I had no doubt to its authenticity coming from them.  So I shipped the book and then a couple weeks later buyer asks for a refund claiming a friend of his says its a fake.  I politely refuse since I had posted the cert # and listed the book as non returnable.  He opens a case with PayPal with this evidence, see pic 1.  The holographic sticker that CGC used previously to authenticate books was the older one.  Out of curiousity,  I checked what the buyer was selling and lo and behold I find him selling a book with, you guessed it, the very same holograph. pic 2.  So in other words he knew what he was claiming was a bunch of BS.  The item was quickly deleted though and buyer went ahead and he made a claim with his financial institution.   Soon after, the money gets withdrawn from my PayPal account until they get a chance to review the case.   This is beyond frustrating.  

However I am happy to report that the buyers financial institution also decided in my favor. After 4-6 long weeks.  What it boiled down to was, in my opinion, buyers remorse and it is disheartening to see or think that people get away with this kind of theft by gaming the system.   I know this guy had done his homework and knew what to say in order to get the decision sided in his favor but he lost, woot!   

Buyers name was :  dwightfactor         just fyi be cautious if this guy wants buy a book off you.

[theCapraAegagrus]

8 minutes ago, JaySlim said:

Thanks for the replies all.  I was just about done with PayPal and Ebay when this happened to me but I'd like to give those interested and update.

So, I sold the comic book, a CGC Signature Series Killing Joke signed by Brian Bolland, to an Ebay customer.  I purchased the book from Lone Star Comics and I had no doubt to its authenticity coming from them.  So I shipped the book and then a couple weeks later buyer asks for a refund claiming a friend of his says its a fake.  I politely refuse since I had posted the cert # and listed the book as non returnable.  He opens a case with PayPal with this evidence, see pic 1.  The holographic sticker that CGC used previously to authenticate books was the older one.  Out of curiousity,  I checked what the buyer was selling and lo and behold I find him selling a book with, you guessed it, the very same holograph. pic 2.  So in other words he knew what he was claiming was a bunch of BS.  The item was quickly deleted though and buyer went ahead and he made a claim with his financial institution.   Soon after, the money gets withdrawn from my PayPal account until they get a chance to review the case.   This is beyond frustrating.  

However I am happy to report that the buyers financial institution also decided in my favor. After 4-6 long weeks.  What it boiled down to was, in my opinion, buyers remorse and it is disheartening to see or think that people get away with this kind of theft by gaming the system.   I know this guy had done his homework and knew what to say in order to get the decision sided in his favor but he lost, woot!   

Buyers name was :  dwightfactor         just fyi be cautious if this guy wants buy a book off you.

Le sigh. Glad things were all sorted out correctly, but this is really bothersome.

[RockMyAmadeus]

This is a general reply; these may not all apply to this situation.

1. Take returns. Always take returns. The hassle of taking returns is far, FAR outweighed by the time wasted dealing with things like this. "Sorry you're not happy, if you send it back, I will refund your purchase price. Thanks!" Forcing buyers to keep something they don't want...BARRING FRAUD (see #2)...always, always costs you more in the long run. Remember: the world has its fair share of lunatics, and there are people out there who are dangerous. You could potentially create enemies (rightly or wrongly) who could do you serious, long term damage. In the name of expediency, take the return.

1a. The only exception is in the case of someone trying to defraud you (not just "buyer's remorse.") Fight that, tooth and nail, with everything you've got...but make 100% sure it's fraud, and not just stupidity.

2. Be very diligent in all things. KEEP RECORDS. 

3. Never...under any circumstances, for any reason, get snotty with a buyer, regardless of how insane they are. The second you show one peep of annoyance, you have lost the high ground, and will end up looking "just as bad" before whomever else sees it.

4. Block them and sell to the next person, who will likely be very happy.

5. Report them...and all details...wherever you can. 

6. GET INSURANCE. CGC even sent out a promo ad this morning, promoting CIS.

 

Specific question to Jayslim:

49 minutes ago, JaySlim said:

I checked what the buyer was selling and lo and behold I find him selling a book with, you guessed it, the very same holograph. pic 2.  So in other words he knew what he was claiming was a bunch of BS.  The item was quickly deleted though

Was this on eBay? Sellers can't "delete" items on eBay. Did you mean the listing was ended? Did you use this evidence to dispute the claim?

[Cat]

On 11/30/2018 at 5:52 AM, TwoPiece said:

If he paid via checking account, I think it's very unlikely that he wins any such cases from his financial institution. It's the customer's money. Now, if he paid via credit card, then the tune could change. In those cases, it's the bank's money, and they want you accruing interest and paying annual fees (and earning them network transaction fees). It goes from about 0.1% to 25% chance they side with the cardholder if it's a credit transaction.

Then, there's also the case of AmEx v Discover v Visa v Mastercard. If he paid with a credit card and it's AmEx/Discover, the likelihood increases (Visa Signature and World Elite Mastercard have considerably close standards to these 2 networks). A normal Visa or Mastercard holder is at the entire whim of his/her individual bank, and they're probably half as likely to side with the customer as the previous 4 mentioned.

No matter how you cut it, this customer is a DB.

This info is all kinds of wrong.