HA February Auction 6 6

[stinkininkin]

On 12/17/2018 at 6:07 AM, Bird said:

@stinkininkin Any chance that you could please give some insight into who done did what on this page? (HA Sunday auction coming up.) It says that Art Adams, Whilce Portacio & you  did the art.

Easy.  Adams did full pencils, Portacio did all the primary inking, figures included, and I inked a percentage of the background (probably a small percentage since this is the first issue I helped on and was still trying to get my bearings), and I also filled in the blacks. That’s it!

[J.Sid]

[tth2]

10 hours ago, stinkininkin said:

I also filled in the blacks

Wow! This is the job I've been looking for my whole life!  How do I get such a gig?

[adamstrange]

15 hours ago, tth2 said:

Wow! This is the job I've been looking for my whole life!  How do I get such a gig?

You have to stay within the lines.

[tth2]

2 hours ago, adamstrange said:

You have to stay within the lines.

I was the champ at staying within the lines (and criticizing the kids who didn't).

[adamstrange]

28 minutes ago, tth2 said:

I was the champ at staying within the lines

I believe it!

[MrBedrock]

On 12/9/2018 at 4:19 AM, romitaman said:

i know what i offered privately before it was put in the auction, and my offer was passed on...so i'm pretty confident it will sell for way higher....(so sayeth Yoda...LOL)

I was told by a few different folks that it was offered around fairly recently for $400K and had no takers. If you think it will go upwards of $500K would simply being in an auction add that much value to the final selling price?

[tth2]

2 hours ago, MrBedrock said:

I was told by a few different folks that it was offered around fairly recently for $400K and had no takers. If you think it will go upwards of $500K would simply being in an auction add that much value to the final selling price?

If there are at least 2 people who would be willing to pay upwards of $500k and they were not part of the inner circle that the piece was offered to privately, then sure.

And that's why I like selling in auctions over private sales, because a private sale is limited by the seller's imagination and list of contacts, while an auction could reach buyers who the seller had no idea existed and who are much more imaginative about price. 

Plus, when you shop something around privately, potential buyers might not feel the same urgency to pull the trigger because they'll gamble that no one else will pull the trigger at that price either, and thus the price will remain available.  In contrast, if it's a no reserve auction, every interested buyer out there knows that if they don't win it, someone else will for sure.  

[MrBedrock]

1 hour ago, tth2 said:

If there are at least 2 people who would be willing to pay upwards of $500k and they were not part of the inner circle that the piece was offered to privately, then sure.

And that's why I like selling in auctions over private sales, because a private sale is limited by the seller's imagination and list of contacts, while an auction could reach buyers who the seller had no idea existed and who are much more imaginative about price. 

Plus, when you shop something around privately, potential buyers might not feel the same urgency to pull the trigger because they'll gamble that no one else will pull the trigger at that price either, and thus the price will remain available.  In contrast, if it's a no reserve auction, every interested buyer out there knows that if they don't win it, someone else will for sure.  

I suppose...or it could go for less than $400K. Guess we will see in February.

[tth2]

1 hour ago, MrBedrock said:

I suppose...or it could go for less than $400K. Guess we will see in February.

Also a possibility of course. 

There are some in this OA forum that claim the potential buyers for any major piece comes from a very small and well known pool of people, and that there are no others beyond them.  So if they were all contacted and all passed, then this is possible.

I still think the auction dynamic changes things, though.  I know that there have been comics that sat on a dealer's website for ages at what I considered an aggressive price and therefore I never pulled the trigger, thinking I'd buy it at a later time when funds weren't tied up for higher priority purchases or maybe the dealer would come to his senses and lower the price.  Either way, there was no sense of urgency on my part.  Once the books actually sold, then I would think I should've bought the book, even at that price, because now it was gone and might be buried in someone's collection for decades or longer.  If I'd known that there was really a risk that the book would be gone, then I would've been willing to pull the trigger right away. 

And that's what an auction is--win it or you definitely lose it.  Of course, the downside of an auction is it turns out that the market for the book is not that strong at all and the consignor ends up selling it for less than expected.  Even if there's one person who's willing to pay way up for it, it doesn't matter if there's no similarly aggressive underbidder, because the winner only has to pay an increment over the underbidder. 

Unless the consignor lines up some shills to protect the price, of course.       

[MrBedrock]

9 hours ago, tth2 said:

Also a possibility of course. 

There are some in this OA forum that claim the potential buyers for any major piece comes from a very small and well known pool of people, and that there are no others beyond them.  So if they were all contacted and all passed, then this is possible.

I still think the auction dynamic changes things, though.  I know that there have been comics that sat on a dealer's website for ages at what I considered an aggressive price and therefore I never pulled the trigger, thinking I'd buy it at a later time when funds weren't tied up for higher priority purchases or maybe the dealer would come to his senses and lower the price.  Either way, there was no sense of urgency on my part.  Once the books actually sold, then I would think I should've bought the book, even at that price, because now it was gone and might be buried in someone's collection for decades or longer.  If I'd known that there was really a risk that the book would be gone, then I would've been willing to pull the trigger right away. 

And that's what an auction is--win it or you definitely lose it.  Of course, the downside of an auction is it turns out that the market for the book is not that strong at all and the consignor ends up selling it for less than expected.  Even if there's one person who's willing to pay way up for it, it doesn't matter if there's no similarly aggressive underbidder, because the winner only has to pay an increment over the underbidder. 

Unless the consignor lines up some shills to protect the price, of course.       

The flip side of the coin is that many prices realized are achieved by the actions of only two bidders and if, due to auction timing, one of those potential bidders cannot participate then the realized price can be dramatically lower. There were a couple of cool items in recent auctions that, in hindsight, I wish I had been able to participate on. On one of those items it could have made a 100% difference in the final price. Sometimes a seller will offer much more reasonable terms than an auction, without all of the pressure of timing, and can then realize a stronger price.

[tth2]

So in summary, the Frazetta could sell for more in an auction than a private sale, or it could sell for less in an auction than a private sale.

I suddenly had to double check to make sure I wasn't in the "$500 Gold" thread in the Water Cooler! 

[Bronty]

HOW DARE THEY COLOR OUTSIDE THE LINES!!!! 

[delekkerste]

10 hours ago, tth2 said:

I still think the auction dynamic changes things, though. 

SOMETIMES it changes things.  Sometimes it doesn't.  I hear from people all the time that something sold for beneath what a consignor was offered privately.  I've also paid - and have been paid - above FMV in private transactions, sometimes far above FMV.  Prices which very likely would not have gotten realized at auctions.  Don't forget that many times people are willing to pay up to secure something in a 1:1 negotiation to avoid the uncertainty of going to auction (even if the Bayesian expected value is less than what is offered), especially if it's going to be fresh to market.  The experience of something that has been getting stale in dealer inventory or been shopped to death finding a couple of determined bidders willing to pay over the odds given the certainty of a piece selling at auction, is probably not a common occurrence. 

46 minutes ago, tth2 said:

I suddenly had to double check to make sure I wasn't in the "$500 Gold" thread in the Water Cooler! 

For those who don't read/participate in the above-referenced investment thread, Tim has the annoying habit of, on the first day the market goes against anyone's prediction, jumping up and down, pointing fingers and yelling "How Does He Do It?!?!?!?", despite knowing full well that markets don't go from point A to point B in a straight line.  It is literally the only reason why anyone bothers to offer any kind of hedge at all to their views/forecasts/predictions.  And yet, despite that, every single participant in that thread still knows exactly where everyone else stands.  Except Tim, apparently. 

[Bronty]

1 hour ago, delekkerste said:

SOMETIMES it changes things.  Sometimes it doesn't.  I hear from people all the time that something sold for beneath what a consignor was offered privately.  I've also paid - and have been paid - above FMV in private transactions, sometimes far above FMV.  Prices which very likely would not have gotten realized at auctions.  Don't forget that many times people are willing to pay up to secure something in a 1:1 negotiation to avoid the uncertainty of going to auction (even if the Bayesian expected value is less than what is offered), especially if it's going to be fresh to market.  The experience of something that has been getting stale in dealer inventory or been shopped to death finding a couple of determined bidders willing to pay over the odds given the certainty of a piece selling at auction, is probably not a common occurrence. 

For those who don't read/participate in the above-referenced investment thread, Tim has the annoying habit of, on the first day the market goes against anyone's prediction, jumping up and down, pointing fingers and yelling "How Does He Do It?!?!?!?", despite knowing full well that markets don't go from point A to point B in a straight line.  It is literally the only reason why anyone bothers to offer any kind of hedge at all to their views/forecasts/predictions.  And yet, despite that, every single participant in that thread still knows exactly where everyone else stands.  Except Tim, apparently. 

[MrBedrock]

3 hours ago, tth2 said:

So in summary, the Frazetta could sell for more in an auction than a private sale, or it could sell for less in an auction than a private sale.

 

Or...

[First Upgrade]

...Red Herring lurks until the Reserve Price is posted, and then 'shills' the final moments of live bidding, and then drops the lot on the unsuspecting winning bidder...(gravel strike, pre-record applause then briefly fills the auction floor)

[delekkerste]

According to this critique, the #209 cover in this auction is the only one of the Frazetta Famous Funnies covers that doesn't have any glaring anatomical or compositional flaws. 

The more I look at this one, the more I appreciate it. 

[tth2]

12 hours ago, delekkerste said:

12 hours ago, tth2 said:

I suddenly had to double check to make sure I wasn't in the "$500 Gold" thread in the Water Cooler! 

For those who don't read/participate in the above-referenced investment thread, Tim has the annoying habit of, on the first day the market goes against anyone's prediction, jumping up and down, pointing fingers and yelling "How Does He Do It?!?!?!?", despite knowing full well that markets don't go from point A to point B in a straight line.  It is literally the only reason why anyone bothers to offer any kind of hedge at all to their views/forecasts/predictions.  And yet, despite that, every single participant in that thread still knows exactly where everyone else stands.  Except Tim, apparently. 

[tth2]

1 hour ago, delekkerste said:

According to this critique, the #209 cover in this auction is the only one of the Frazetta Famous Funnies covers that doesn't have any glaring anatomical or compositional flaws. 

The more I look at this one, the more I appreciate it. 

I generally like when people obsess about anatomical/compositional flaws and lose interest in pieces because of them, because I could care less. 

What's impressed me is how good the OA looks!  When I first heard it was in the auction, I wasn't too excited because it's not one of my favorite covers from the series.  But when I actually saw the OA, and how good it looks in B&W, I was really blown away.