Heritage's Next Event Auction has started posting books ! 31 31

[Flex Mentallo]

On 9/17/2023 at 11:21 AM, jimbo_7071 said:

I don't think so. With these horror books, it's all about having the highest-graded copy to guys paying the insane prices. It may only be a small number of guys competing for the highest-graded copies. If that's the case, it might only take one or two guys dying for prices to collapse.

 

Alternatively, prices might collapse, and a small number of guys will have heart attacks.

[adamstrange]

On 9/10/2023 at 10:39 AM, tth2 said:

On 9/10/2023 at 7:22 AM, Professor K said:

   On 3/18/2023 at 4:21 PM, adamstrange said:

Mystery Men 2's cover feature is Rex Dexter of Mars.  Not a great name (neither is Blue Beetle or Green Mask, for that matter), but as a sci-fi feature with spaceships, ray guns, robots, jet packs etc. it's always going to have a wide appeal.  Mystery Men 3 had a darker color scheme and an earthbound, second banana hero who is posed more like a female fashion model.  While it's a great cover because "Lou Fine", I've never thought of it as a great Lou Fine cover, even though I've seen all the premier copies (Allentown, Church and Larson).

Which just goes to show that even greatly respected boardies like adamstrange can be utterly and spectacularly wrong sometimes!

I agree.

It hasn't happened yet to me, but it could.

[Professor K]

Speaking of Mystery Men 2 Rex Dexter. Heavy spine splits to cover, moderate tears to cover, Soiling to cover (which I don't really see much of). Nice 2.5

[twoseezy]

Hi All!

I've been doing a lot of research on the Action Comics #1 0.5 grade that just sold for 408K and some of the info I found was very interesting. Of the 44 unrestored copies of the census, there are (3) 0.5 grades. I wanted to see if any of those other copies were presentable with intact cover artwork. According to GPA, the other copy in 0.5 that has ever sold is the following:

1) CGC Cert # 0118834001 Grade: 0.5

COVERLESS/INCOMPLETE

Label Text: COVERLESS. CENTERFOLD MISSING, DOES NOT AFFECT STORY. INCOMPLETE. Grader Notes: Interior Centerfold Missing Staple Lite Rusted Whole Book Water Damage Through Book

Should CGC update the census on this or add some kind of asterisk here? Perhaps they can add a new line that says 0.5 Coverless? This seems to be the most responsible path for full disclosure to collectors. The lack of a cover is the defect that decreases the value of a book the most by far. Full disclosure of this defect is something that should be noted on the CGC census. Considering the inconsistency that some coverless books are receiving 0.5 grades with others receiving NG makes it even more important that coverless copies are notated on the census. Perhaps a new pinned topic could relate to coverless copies of 0.5 CGC books? This way the census can be updated accordingly going forward. 

There are (1) 1.0 and (2) 1.5 copies out there as well. In today's market, those copies would all likely fetch close to or over 1M, thus making the recent sale likely the most affordable/presentable copy of an entry-level grade in existence. Has anyone else seen pictures of another unrestored 0.5 Action Comics #1 before?

[Superman2006]

Yes. It took me bit of searching to find the old thread, but here's an old thread that has pictures of a 0.5 brittle Action #1. It looks like the notes on the label state "Spine of cover completely split & cover detached".  I can't seem to get the cert # to show up in the CGC Certification look up tool, so either I'm misreading the number (it's not that clear), or it was removed for some reason.

 

Edited September 18, 2023 by Superman2006
Forgot to include the link...

[Superman2006]

P.S. I think there is (or was) a website that had loads of pictures of Action #1 &/or a few other mega keys in various grades (not just from one source like Heritage, or ComicConnect, but pictures from all over).

[Telegan]

On 9/18/2023 at 5:15 PM, Superman2006 said:

Yes. It took me bit of searching to find the old thread, but here's an old thread that has pictures of a 0.5 brittle Action #1. It looks like the notes on the label state "Spine of cover completely split & cover detached".  I can't seem to get the cert # to show up in the CGC Certification look up tool, so either I'm misreading the number (it's not that clear), or it was removed for some reason.

 

Here you go; from https://www.cgccomics.com/certlookup/1308738001/ :

 

 

[Superman2006]

On 9/18/2023 at 6:41 PM, Telegan said:

Here you go; from https://www.cgccomics.com/certlookup/1308738001/ :

Thank you. I thought I tried that number, but I must have screwed it up!

[Professor K]

On 9/18/2023 at 5:18 PM, twoseezy said:

Hi All!

I've been doing a lot of research on the Action Comics #1 0.5 grade that just sold for 408K and some of the info I found was very interesting. Of the 44 unrestored copies of the census, there are (3) 0.5 grades. I wanted to see if any of those other copies were presentable with intact cover artwork. According to GPA, the other copy in 0.5 that has ever sold is the following:

1) CGC Cert # 0118834001 Grade: 0.5

COVERLESS/INCOMPLETE

Label Text: COVERLESS. CENTERFOLD MISSING, DOES NOT AFFECT STORY. INCOMPLETE. Grader Notes: Interior Centerfold Missing Staple Lite Rusted Whole Book Water Damage Through Book

Should CGC update the census on this or add some kind of asterisk here? Perhaps they can add a new line that says 0.5 Coverless? This seems to be the most responsible path for full disclosure to collectors. The lack of a cover is the defect that decreases the value of a book the most by far. Full disclosure of this defect is something that should be noted on the CGC census. Considering the inconsistency that some coverless books are receiving 0.5 grades with others receiving NG makes it even more important that coverless copies are notated on the census. Perhaps a new pinned topic could relate to coverless copies of 0.5 CGC books? This way the census can be updated accordingly going forward. 

There are (1) 1.0 and (2) 1.5 copies out there as well. In today's market, those copies would all likely fetch close to or over 1M, thus making the recent sale likely the most affordable/presentable copy of an entry-level grade in existence. Has anyone else seen pictures of another unrestored 0.5 Action Comics #1 before?

Good research. Yes it would be nice but I think there is enough out there to find out stuff like this already. A more detailed census would be nice. Perhaps a census that includes the CGC number of every book that they've graded, this way we could look up the notes. But it's a lot to ask I think. I would think at this point with over a million graded books it would be very difficult to update all that. 

[N e r V]

On 9/15/2023 at 9:29 AM, LadyDeath said:

It's not so much that. Just irks me Baker's name is (still) misattributed to something he didn't draw, using his name to jack up the worth even more.

Good discussion/breakdown revolving around it here

 

On 9/15/2023 at 2:01 PM, GreatCaesarsGhost said:

Everything I thought I knew is wrong??!!

Great Caesar’s Ghost! My old stomping grounds the MarvelMasterworks boards. I even had a post on that thread you linked. I’ve heard arguments for both sides and still no one has produced enough evidence to sway me one way or another. I think most of these arguments should be left at “I think” instead “It is or isn’t” as a fact without a smoking gun to prove your “opinion”. The fighting is tiring. We live in an age of comic covers as art and I don’t believe a lot of prices move up or down if it’s not the cover artist you think it is. A great cover is always going to be a great cover no matter who or who didn’t draw it.

[10centcomics]

On 9/18/2023 at 9:59 PM, N e r V said:

 

Great Caesar’s Ghost! My old stomping grounds the MarvelMasterworks boards. I even had a post on that thread you linked. I’ve heard arguments for both sides and still no one has produced enough evidence to sway me one way or another. I think most of these arguments should be left at “I think” instead “It is or isn’t” as a fact without a smoking gun to prove your “opinion”. The fighting is tiring. We live in an age of comic covers as art and I don’t believe a lot of prices move up or down if it’s not the cover artist you think it is. A great cover is always going to be a great cover no matter who or who didn’t draw it.

Generally if we are unsure of something, we should default to "uncredited" or "unknown." Older CGC labels of PL17 don't have the Matt Baker cover credit. I wonder when it changed and what evidence CGC saw that made them change their mind. I agree the value of PL17 isn't going to be swayed by the cover artist because it will always be a historic, infamous, and iconic book in the hobby. But attaching Matt Baker's name to a previously unknown book would certainly boost its value.

[N e r V]

On 9/19/2023 at 3:56 PM, 10centcomics said:

Generally if we are unsure of something, we should default to "uncredited" or "unknown." Older CGC labels of PL17 don't have the Matt Baker cover credit. I wonder when it changed and what evidence CGC saw that made them change their mind. I agree the value of PL17 isn't going to be swayed by the cover artist because it will always be a historic, infamous, and iconic book in the hobby. But attaching Matt Baker's name to a previously unknown book would certainly boost its value.

CGC has given it as a Baker cover for some time. I’m posting 2 copies for you the first graded in 2003 and the next in 2006. So they’ve given Baker cover credit since 2006 at least. GCD and others also gives him credit for the cover and to be honest as far back as the 1980’s some people were calling it a Baker that I’m aware. As said I’m undecided. Nothing I’ve heard yet gives me 100% certainty either way but honestly we could say that about many many books in the hobby we aren’t 100% sure of. Given that it was pretty common at times to have more than one artist to work on books in comics I think it’s next to impossible to have anything but good educated guesses by people familiar with the work.

 

[Dark Knight]

I saw a PL 17 CGC 2.0 "unrestored" sell for $11k at a live IG sales stream. The reason why I placed unrestored in quotes is because it had a lot of color touch removal on the spine and mid front cover

[N e r V]

After one of the worst looking comics you could imagine seeing in that grotesque looking CGC 0.5 Action comics #1 took 408k absolutely nothing surprises me in GA sales these days….

[Dark Knight]

Yeah that poop stained copy was a major eye sore. I think I estimated it around $200k max 

[lou_fine]

On 9/18/2023 at 12:29 PM, Professor K said:

Speaking of Mystery Men 2 Rex Dexter. Heavy spine splits to cover, moderate tears to cover, Soiling to cover (which I don't really see much of). Nice 2.5

I actually thought this copy here would have had a shot at getting closer to the $5K price point considering how nicely it presents relative to its assigned grade, but on a price per point basis, seems to be pretty much in line with what copies in this condition range have been selling for since the summer of 2021.    

Then again, it just might have been negatively impacted by this CGC 3.0 graded copy that's coming up in the Fox Showcase Auction next week, even though I thought the above 2.5 copy presented nicer:  

https://comics.ha.com/itm/golden-age-1938-1955-/superhero/mystery-men-comics-2-fox-1939-cgc-gd-vg-30-off-white-to-white-pages/a/40239-82071.s

Hate that fugly oversized magazine holder, but it still looks like a neck and neck tussle for second place (i.e. behind Mystery Men 1) between Mystery Men 2 above with a current hammer bid of $1,150 and the long acknowledged collector favorite, namely Mystery Men 3, right behind with a current hammer bid of $1,100.  Will definitely be interesting to watch who wins Silver in this race, although my leaning is still towards MM 3 right now.    

Ten 

[Robot Man]

On 9/19/2023 at 5:40 PM, N e r V said:

CGC has given it as a Baker cover for some time. I’m posting 2 copies for you the first graded in 2003 and the next in 2006. So they’ve given Baker cover credit since 2006 at least. GCD and others also gives him credit for the cover and to be honest as far back as the 1980’s some people were calling it a Baker that I’m aware. As said I’m undecided. Nothing I’ve heard yet gives me 100% certainty either way but honestly we could say that about many many books in the hobby we aren’t 100% sure of. Given that it was pretty common at times to have more than one artist to work on books in comics I think it’s next to impossible to have anything but good educated guesses by people familiar with the work.

 

I don’t care who did the cover. I ran into it in the early ‘70’s long before I knew of SOTI or Matt Baker. It was mostly the look on her face and still is. Nobody wanted it at the time. I saw it at the Rose Bowl flea market. A guy was a regular comic seller and had it for $10. (A lot of money for one comic like this at the time). He had it for months. One day, I just went for it. Who would have ever known what the future would bring for it. One of my most favorite books. 

[Mr. Lady Luck]

Has anyone ever won a book in a Heritage auction, then a few days later, received an e-mail from Heritage that there would be a delay in sending the book because it had to be sent back to CGC? With no other explanation?

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

On 9/21/2023 at 7:51 AM, Mr. Lady Luck said:

Has anyone ever won a book in a Heritage auction, then a few days later, received an e-mail from Heritage that there would be a delay in sending the book because it had to be sent back to CGC? With no other explanation?

No. My guess would be a case got cracked while in their possession, but it’s a “who knows”. Have you tried calling customer service?

[Mr. Lady Luck]

On 9/21/2023 at 8:32 AM, GreatCaesarsGhost said:

No. My guess would be a case got cracked while in their possession, but it’s a “who knows”. Have you tried calling customer service?

I sent an e-mail reply but I have not heard back. I will try calling next. Thanks!