C2E2 Variant Drama 24 24

[Sigur Ros]

On 8/10/2022 at 3:18 PM, Ares said:

Interesting to see what will happen when Marvel lawyers get on the case. 

Unless I am wrong they License and make all the variants so they get paid and Blackflag did not pay them.

 

Marvel didn't license these, so no money is due. 

The guy already paid Marvel for the variants, last year, then added his own acetate over them. There is no infringement. 

Marvel could stop him because of the assumption these are Marvel-approved, but other than a simple email I doubt they'll put any effort into doing so. 

Hell probably get the email, but nothing more. 

This is basically the same as someone drawing a Batman on a Spider-man blank variant.   Marvel can't do a thing about it. 

[Brock]

On 8/10/2022 at 3:26 PM, DavidTheDavid said:

Good point. Isn't this "variant" very easy for a forger to duplicate?

I think this would be a counterfeit of a counterfeit.

[Dr. Balls]

On 8/10/2022 at 1:23 PM, justafan said:

I can get where CGC might have just treated it as a double cover variant and graded both the acetate and original cover separately but assigned the acetate cover grade overall to achieve those 10.0 and 9.9 grades.  Normally, if that was the case, I'd be ok with it saying 10.0 Acetate Cover, 9.8 Black Flag Comics Edition cover on a Blue Label but I still can't get over the fact that they even allowed this bootleg with 4 staples in a Blue label.  It should be green or purple label any day of the week.

Aside from all the stuff we are talking about here, the massively critical fail is CGC's lack of foresight to see that their grading would either A) not be called out like it's being done here or B) have become so sloppy that they don't realize that they should have had a hand-crafted explanation ready 10 seconds after the first post. The failure to get out in front of it really shows that they have lost their way in understanding the role they play in this business. And I don't say that as hyperbole - I say that as it is simply shocking that so many people in a conference room thought this was a good idea. I mean, this is like, Washington D.C. levels of failure. Not just ethically, but in their ability to not see that customers would have a problem with it.

[WolverineX]

On 8/10/2022 at 3:25 PM, Brock said:

I'll bite... How do you feel about my latest venture?

Funny enough, the counterfeit Cerebus 1 goes for real money now as real copies have ballooned to 4 figures.. last one sold for $600 

[RonS2112]

On 8/10/2022 at 3:28 PM, Dr. Balls said:

Aside from all the stuff we are talking about here, the massively critical fail is CGC's lack of foresight to see that their grading would either A) not be called out like it's being done here or B) have become so sloppy that they don't realize that they should have had a hand-crafted explanation ready 10 seconds after the first post. The failure to get out in front of it really shows that they have lost their way in understanding the role they play in this business. And I don't say that as hyperbole - I say that as it is simply shocking that so many people in a conference room thought this was a good idea. I mean, this is like, Washington D.C. levels of failure. Not just ethically, but in their ability to not see that customers would have a problem with it.

Really?  Seems to me this entire hobby has become such a cash-grab over the last few years that CGC probably figured they'd just fit right in.

[Dr. Balls]

On 8/10/2022 at 1:28 PM, Sigur Ros said:

The guy already paid Marvel for the variants, last year, then added his own acetate over them. There is no infringement.

Ahhh. There's the rub. Thanks for clarifying that.

[awakeintheashes]

On 8/10/2022 at 3:23 PM, justafan said:

I can get where CGC might have just treated it as a double cover variant and graded both the acetate and original cover separately but assigned the acetate cover grade overall to achieve those 10.0 and 9.9 grades.

CGC grading a counterfeit aside, there is only one cover on these books. They are not double covers unless there are two acetate covers stapled onto the book.

If CGC treated them as double covers, that presents us with another episode of “Facepalm: WTF is CGC Doing?” Tune in Friday. 

Edited August 10, 2022 by awakeintheashes

[GeeksAreMyPeeps]

On 8/10/2022 at 1:36 PM, ygogolak said:

Why are people reporting sellers? They were all bought by individuals before it was known to be an issue. You're punishing the innocent instead of the perpetrators.

If re-sellers are having issues re-selling, what do you think is going to happen to sales of the next acetate frankenvariant?

[Dr. Balls]

On 8/10/2022 at 1:30 PM, RonS2112 said:

Really?  Seems to me this entire hobby has become such a cash-grab over the last few years that CGC probably figured they'd just fit right in.

You're probably right - they took a very ignorant perspective to what they did with these. Instead of redoubling their efforts to shore up their core business model (grading books), they chose the cash-grab route (selling grades) - and to me, that is a colossal error that generally don't come home to roost for a few years. Hamstringing two decades worth of turning graded books into commodities because someone at CGC thinks they can outsmart collectors is pretty ballsy.

[october]

[Ares]

On 8/10/2022 at 3:28 PM, Sigur Ros said:

Marvel didn't license these, so no money is due. 

The guy already paid Marvel for the variants, last year, then added his own acetate over them. There is no infringement. 

Marvel could stop him because of the assumption these are Marvel-approved, but other than a simple email I doubt they'll put any effort into doing so. 

Hell probably get the email, but nothing more. 

This is basically the same as someone drawing a Batman on a Spider-man blank variant.   Marvel can't do a thing about it. 

They are marketing them as variants and since Marvel did not print them they cant be sold that way

[justafan]

On 8/10/2022 at 1:53 PM, wardevil0 said:

if you check the serial numbers you can see the "grade date" is in July

Yeah but were they graded on July 28th in Sarasota or were they graded on July 28th onsite at an earlier Con Black Flag was at?  Sorry If I'm responding to posts that have already been answered but I'm falling behind in this thread..

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 8/10/2022 at 3:37 PM, justafan said:

Yeah but were they graded on July 28th in Sarasota or were they graded on July 28th onsite at an earlier Con Black Flag was at?  Sorry If I'm responding to posts that have already been answered but I'm falling behind in this thread..

I’m confused as to why it matters if they were graded on-site or not.

[ExNihilo]

On 8/10/2022 at 12:37 PM, justafan said:

Yeah but were they graded on July 28th in Sarasota or were they graded on July 28th onsite at an earlier Con Black Flag was at?  Sorry If I'm responding to posts that have already been answered but I'm falling behind in this thread..

These were books that were originally published in September 2021.  Here's the KRS link with the copies they got.

ULTIMATE COMICS FALLOUT #4 FACSIMILE EDITION CLAYTON CRAIN EXCLUSIVE – KRS Comics LLC

And here's the link from 7ate9.

ULTIMATE FALLOUT #4 (Facsimile Edition) Clayton Crain Variant - COVER OPTIONS | 7 Ate 9 Comics

In all likelihood, they split the commission fee and each bought an allocation so one company wouldn't have to buy the full 3000 minimum order placement.  Black Flag had remaining stock which they decided to add an acetate cover to and rebrand it as a different variant.  These books were likely submitted months ago (hence the July grading date) and only hit the market now for C2E2.

Edited August 10, 2022 by ExNihilo

[TTony]

Well these prices have escalated quite a bit... can we now add shill bidding to the list of atrocities going on with this book?

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 8/10/2022 at 3:42 PM, ExNihilo said:

These were books that were originally published in September 2021.  Here's the KRS link with the copies they got.

ULTIMATE COMICS FALLOUT #4 FACSIMILE EDITION CLAYTON CRAIN EXCLUSIVE – KRS Comics LLC

And here's the link from 7ate9.

ULTIMATE FALLOUT #4 (Facsimile Edition) Clayton Crain Variant - COVER OPTIONS | 7 Ate 9 Comics

In all likelihood, they split the commission fee and each bought an allocation so one company wouldn't have to buy the full 3000 minimum order placement.  Black Flag had remaining stock which they decided to add an acetate cover to and rebrand it as a different variant.  These books were likely submitted months ago *hence the July grading date) and only hit the market now for C2E2.

I’m thinking BLACK FLAG jumped the TAT line....the same way influencers() jumped the line at the con. 

[Atomic Ponkie]

On 8/10/2022 at 1:14 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

You could just sell your books raw.

You can, but you won't get the best bang for your buck. 

[Brock]

On 8/10/2022 at 3:46 PM, TTony said:

Well these prices have escalated quite a bit... can we now add shill bidding to the list of atrocities going on with this book?

 

On 8/10/2022 at 3:30 PM, WolverineX said:

Funny enough, the counterfeit Cerebus 1 goes for real money now as real copies have ballooned to 4 figures.. last one sold for $600 

Amateurs...

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 8/10/2022 at 3:47 PM, Atomic Ponkie said:

You can, but you won't get the best bang for your buck. 

It’s ok to leave some meat on the bone....

[TTony]

My OCD just won't let this go...  it's called the "In God We Trust" Acetate edition... that's wrong.  The writing on the Acetate says "In God We Intrust".  Can CGC change the labels going forward?