Rob Liefeld is out of his mind 4 4

[Kerdese]

I have a short list of books that I want signed. This will check one more off. I'm switching a #98 CBCS 9.4 to a CGC SS. I think there's a slight chance it might be a 9.6, which would be a huge plus, but we'll see. 

[Cman429]

On 4/8/2023 at 9:34 PM, Greengiant said:

I agree. The last that I saw was last years NYCC. He would charge different amounts depending on the book that he signed (NM90 vs. NM98).

Almost all comic guys do that. Azzarello has upcharged to sign Batman Damned since it came out. I was just at Megacon last weekend and Andy Kubert charged $30 for any comic except Batman 655 then he upcharged you to $60 to sign it. Creators knowing what’s valuable and what isn’t and charging premiums for premium books is common now. 

[Iceman399]

I'm glad his wallet convinced him to change his tune from a few years ago

[jdandns]

Pumped up chests mean pumped up prices. 

[jimbo_7071]

On 4/7/2023 at 11:09 AM, Ryan. said:

He will sell this signing out. He will raise his prices again for the next signing and sell that one out too.

Who is truly out of their minds here?

To me anyone paying for an autograph is out of his mind. Not only would I not pay $1 for an autograph, I wouldn't want one for free, and I wouldn't want a comic that had been defaced with an autograph unless there were a way to clean it and get the autograph off without getting a purple label.

[JollyComics]

On 4/7/2023 at 11:34 AM, thehumantorch said:

Don't pay ridiculous prices for a signature.  If enough people refuse to pay prices will come down.  The problem isn't the artist, it's us.

Frankly, I agreed with you.  I used to have Neal Adams signed my multiple copies like Superman #233, Batman, Detective Comics, Green Lantern, Superman's Pal Jimmy Olsen #134 and many 9.4, 9.6 & 9.8 graded copies (long before CGC decided to not use the labels and have to re-grade the books) from 2009 to 2012.  While I was selling them, I didn't expect them being sold 40-60% more than I paid. Those copies were attracted the buyers easily. I came to see Neal Adams' booth and was shocked to see his signature prices have gone to $50 per book. He used to charge me $15 per book for the signature but ever since 2013, he kept increasing his charge every year. Less and more less books I provided for him. I stopped in 2017.  I considered about having a commission for him to draw my X-Men #7 blank variant but he would charge me $1000. That was in 2018 in the same year, Stan Lee's passing.  I have no one signed my books ever since except my last attempt with George Perez recently but he was too sick and his signature series was cancelled.  The last signature was Russ Heath at SDCC before he was passing away in 2018. I sold them all but I keep one - Showcase #45 VF 8.0.  I wished to keep some Neal, Stan Lee and other signed books.

I didn't gorge the price but the buyers were aggressive upon my books in past. I had to pay my bills and you can blame me for leading them to gorge the prices. I am not only one but many sellers too.

[shadroch]

Capitalism is wonderful.

[jimbo_7071]

On 4/9/2023 at 9:41 AM, shadroch said:

Capitalism is wonderful.

It's entertaining, that's for sure. It's amusing to see how easily people can be manipulated into wanting and spending money on things that it would never have occurred to them on their own to want.

The market for collectible comic books developed organically, but the market for autographed comics didn't. It was basically created by CGC's marketing team. Thirty years ago most comic book collectors would have been disgusted at seeing a comic book autographed on the cover. If someone wanted an autograph, the person would have gotten it on a splash page, probably in the margin so that the artwork was unaffected. (The thought of a comic book cover being autographed by someone other than the actual cover artist or an actor appearing on a photo cover would have been considered absolutely absurd.)

Edited April 9, 2023 by jimbo_7071

[SlabSeeker]

On 4/9/2023 at 6:52 AM, jimbo_7071 said:

To me anyone paying for an autograph is out of his mind. Not only would I not pay $1 for an autograph, I wouldn't want one for free, and I wouldn't want a comic that had been defaced with an autograph unless there were a way to clean it and get the autograph off without getting a purple label.

The next time I get a Spider-Man #1, I think I'm going to list it on eBay as "RARE! Spider-Man #1 (1990) not signed by Todd McFarlane," then explain in the description how this is super rare because most versions come with Todd McFarlane's name written on the cover. 

I like comics. I like autographs. But I don't like a lot of autographed comics, and I personally tend to prefer collecting signatures on newer and/or lower-value things rather than older and/or higher-value things. That Spider-Man #1 I was joking about is kind of in the middle; it's common enough that I wouldn't mind having one signed as long as it was aesthetically pleasing, as most (but not all) McFarlane signatures tend to be. People who sign a dark background with a black Sharpie drive me bananas.

[Prince Namor]

On 4/9/2023 at 10:05 PM, jimbo_7071 said:

The market for collectible comic books developed organically...

It did???

Haven't we all heard enough stories about the history of this hobby to know there was plenty of market manipulation going on throughout the years, from dealers, from publishers, and even from Overstreet?

And signatures on comics (though like you say, much more so INSIDE of them) was a thing long before CGC, the same as there were people pressing (granted, using a stack of encyclopedias) long before it actually became an industry. These parts of the hobby grew out of the way people collected. 

Someone just found a way to monetize those ideas and make money off of it, the same way someone once realized they could make money off of selling back issues of comics. 

[jimbo_7071]

On 4/9/2023 at 3:07 PM, Prince Namor said:

It did???

Haven't we all heard enough stories about the history of this hobby to know there was plenty of market manipulation going on throughout the years, from dealers, from publishers, and even from Overstreet?

And signatures on comics (though like you say, much more so INSIDE of them) was a thing long before CGC, the same as there were people pressing (granted, using a stack of encyclopedias) long before it actually became an industry. These parts of the hobby grew out of the way people collected. 

Someone just found a way to monetize those ideas and make money off of it, the same way someone once realized they could make money off of selling back issues of comics. 

Prices were manipulated once a secondary market sprang up—and they continue to be manipulated—but the collecting of comic books began when some collectors started buying them off of the stands in the late 1930s, before a secondary market even existed, when most people were just throwing their comic books away. That's the difference.

In the case of Signature Series books, CGC basically invented that hobby by creating registry sets, giving more points to Signature Series books than to Universal books, and declaring that books with autographs on the cover were not to be penalized grade-wise whereas no one 30 years ago would have considered a comic book high grade if it had an autograph on the cover; it would have been considered defaced.

If you had told me back in 1993 that you had gotten the cover of a comic book autographed, my first thought would have been that you had some actor or actress autograph a dollar-bin comic with a photo cover. No one would have sought an autograph on the cover of a valuable book. (I'm sure someone here could post an example to prove me wrong, so let's just say that it would have been very uncommon, shall we?)

Edited April 9, 2023 by jimbo_7071

[jdandns]

I think the notion 30 years ago was it was basically OK to get autographs on key comics, as long as the book in question wasn't particularly high grade.

From the 90's through the mid 00's when I actually sought comic artists autographs, I usually asked them to sign either trading cards or pinup pages (from comics like Marvel Fanfare or DC pinup specials, not usually the covers of a full book a given artist did the art for. 

[newshane]

On 4/7/2023 at 1:29 AM, Hot Nickels said:

The pricing for his upcoming signing is insane. Chiseled Signature $210? GTFO. If people want to pay him that much to sign books good for him and good for them, my worry is that vastly more talented and more important artists will Jack up their prices after this. Liefeld is charging more for a sig than McFarlane, and his sketch is being offered for almost $200 more than Jim Lee, and Frankly I’d rather have a left handed Jim Lee sketch in crayon than anything Liefeld has ever created. I fear Lee’s sketch price is going to be a lot higher the next time he does a CGC event and I really want one  😢 

Easy solution. Spend your money on something else. 

He can charge what he wants. You can pay or refuse to pay. If people refuse to pay, he will adjust his price, but most people will pay what he's asking. Simple economics. 

Edited April 9, 2023 by newshane

[ExNihilo]

On 4/9/2023 at 10:13 AM, SlabSeeker said:

I personally tend to prefer collecting signatures on newer and/or lower-value things rather than older and/or higher-value things.

Agreed.  When I first joined the boards I thought it'd be cool to have expensive key books signed.  Then I quickly realized I didn't like that and now, while rare, if I do get a creator sig, it's on a cheap, easily replaceable book.  I just didn't like knowing that having a megakey signed meant that the number of available unsigned copies was smaller than it used to be.

[ADAMANTIUM]

On 4/9/2023 at 4:47 PM, ExNihilo said:

Agreed.  When I first joined the boards I thought it'd be cool to have expensive key books signed.  Then I quickly realized I didn't like that and now, while rare, if I do get a creator sig, it's on a cheap, easily replaceable book.  I just didn't like knowing that having a megakey signed meant that the number of available unsigned copies was smaller than it used to be.

While I technically agree with your sentiment, it's worth noting that even hulk 181 is only a tenth signed and documented with cgc copies at least.

Idk doesn't seem all that bad, I even remember @valiantman looking after Stan died, and that hulk was in the hundreds, so I can onky imaging whom is signing them now, maybe Roy thomas? Still 12000 blue labels is nothing to sneeze at

 

Edited April 9, 2023 by ADAMANTIUM

[grendel013]

Yeah. I don't like autographs. At all. If I meet someone famous that I like/admire, I wouldn't mind them putting an X or some sort of mark on my ticket stub to "commemorate" the meeting but I have never been a fan of obtaining signatures. Not to say I never got any. When I was a kid, my dad would take me to get autographs from baseball players and I'd buy a photo to have them sign. But honestly, keep your filthy pen/sharpie away from my trading cards and comic books. I don't really care what they charge these days because I don't want one. Both sides can argue how "this is unfair" but honestly, I don't care. If someone was willing to pay $200 for my signature, I'd probably be signing like a whore, but they are not so again, I don't care. Leifeld is a dork not because of his signature prices but because he draws kidney bean feet. If I buy a sketch and autograph from him I will request it be a closeup of Deadpoo's feet. I have spoken. Kidneybean foot has spoken. This is the way. Now go eat your Easter candy but don't forget to brush your teeth before bedtime.

[ADAMANTIUM]

I just have trouble believing that non moderns were ever in a threat to have more signed than unsigned. Not that it couldn't happen, I'm just not aware. And that is the issue everyone is standing behind? Unless you mean "key moderns"

Which I've seen more signed than unsigned. 

Basically there is no argument, it's personal preference as stated here, and while some of that "sounds like an argument", it is not. It's again just personal preference for whatever reason stated 😂

[ADAMANTIUM]

I'm not paying for liefeld, although I do have already a sig from him.

Jim Lee I didn't think was all that bad, I got one with a cgc signing, it was expensive like $500.for just the remarque.  but they were pretty nice looking. Idk, I don't see a lot of sketches by artists ell all the time anyway

I consider them more keepsakes than sigs, but same vein and I get why people don't like sigs. I've just seen it all as harder to sell, so I think this secondary market of flipping seems a bit fictitious but don't really know

 

Neal adams did one, his was $220 for a remarque. Sketch was $500. I went with remarque. But I'm glad I did. Pick and choose I guess.

 

[SpineTic]

Enjoy!

Rob Liefeld Sketch is $1,085 per item = SOLD OUT.

 

 

[ADAMANTIUM]

On 4/9/2023 at 5:55 PM, ak47po said:

Enjoy!

Rob Liefeld Sketch is $1,085 per item = SOLD OUT.

 

 

In the middle of a show, but soon as commercial hits