A question about what's hot and why 1 1

[Mokiguy]

Not that I want to exclude any answers from newer collectors, but I really hope that there are some comments from folks that have been collecting for 40 years or so, if there are any here.

I just started collecting comics the last couple of years, and collect almost exclusively Superhero DC Silver Age. That's what I grew up on and suppose I'm reliving my youth in a way. I am a low dollar collector so I buy nothing graded and nothing rare. I've noticed that the books I collect seem out of favor with most collectors today. Looking at what interests collectors today, it appears to have much to do with what's in the movies. Superman, Superboy, Lois lane, Jimmy Olsen, and along with that all the books like Action Comics and Adventure comics and World's Finest and others that mostly featured these same characters, really seem to have taken a back seat to all the Marvel Characters and the comics they are in. Except for maybe Wonder Woman and Batman .............. but they are still making some of those character movies.

So is the comic collecting world really that fickle, driven by Hollywood? And what happens when Spider-Man, Iron Man and Wolverine are no longer in vogue? Will they go the way of Superman?

So the question for the 40 year collectors, if there are any. When all the Superman Movies were hot, were the DC superhero comics also?

[MattTheDuck]

I think a fair analysis would be that DC books have never been as "popular" with collectors in general as Marvel books, at least in the Silver Age.  While some of the Golden Age DC books - AC#1, TEC#27, Supes#1, etc - are very popular/expensive, in the Silver Age most of the "big" books are Marvel - FF#1, AF#15, ASM#1, X-Men#1 and so on.  While there may have been some surge in DC values with the various movie releases, they've been much smaller and temporary in part due to the relative lack of popularity and quality of the movies themselves.

From a "why" standpoint, my view would be that the Silver Age Marvel stories are quite a bit better and a lot more appealing - fun to read even 50 years after I bought them.

[bc]

There is a portion of collectors who play the movies for short term speculation. Others just plod away collecting what they enjoy. Your comment about "reliving my youth" is a very popular sentiment that crosses not only into comics, but toys, cards and other collectibles. The "Rule of 25" is pretty spot on - once you get some disposable income as an adult, many people go back and collect things from their youth (usually a 25 year difference).

Even though we don't see much talk about Buck Rodgers, the comics that feature Frazetta artwork still goes for decent cash. Westerns and War themed comics still have a collector base even though those genres have fallen out of style for now. Spider-Man has been around for 60+ years and shows no sign of slowing down with the introduction of Miles and the Multiverse sagas.

The only excitement I can recall for DC was the "Death of Superman" issue that had people standing in lines at the LCS and hoarding copies in hopes of putting their kid thru college or retiring early.

Collect what you like, there are other financial investment vehicles if you are concerned about maintaining wealth over time.

-bc

[DougC]

I think you are confusing a comic collector and someone who fancies themselves a comic speculator/investor.

Hype, generally only extends to prominent books should a LoSH series or movie drop you can assume with a good certainty Adventure #247 would see a pop over current market but not run of the mill appearances that a collector or fan of the team would buy like the four issue series from 73 or there appearances in the superboy title starting in 74.

A fan will collect a title because they like it, a speculator buys and hypes a singular book because they think it will make them money.

[theCapraAegagrus]

On 6/7/2023 at 11:05 AM, Mokiguy said:

So is the comic collecting world really that fickle, driven by Hollywood? And what happens when Spider-Man, Iron Man and Wolverine are no longer in vogue? Will they go the way of Superman?

It's mostly due to speculators and flippers, not real collectors who value the medium. Which Superman comics do you think are undervalued?

[theCapraAegagrus]

On 6/7/2023 at 11:32 AM, MattTheDuck said:

...While there may have been some surge in DC values with the various movie releases, they've been much smaller and temporary in part due to the relative lack of popularity and quality of the movies themselves.

Or, DC tends to adapt Modern stories which don't have much room for value gain. Death of Superman, TDKR, New 52 Aquaman, New 52 Justice League, Flashpoint, etc.

[marvelmaniac]

I collected as a kid in the 60's (65-69) and began collecting again in 79 (Marvel, all books are Raw), there have been times in the past when books had there value artificially inflated for one reason or another, it could be due to a movie, TV show, a current storyline that peaks the interest of newer readers and makes them want to find earlier appearances of a character which of course increases the value of the older books, generally the older books hold their value, back in the day there was no social media to blow everything out of proportion, the only way you got your latest comic book news was from your LCS, Overstreet Price Guide, Wizard World or any other Comic Book Publications.

In the early 90's people started hoarding new books with variant covers, gimmick covers, this created an artificial shortage of these books (even though the print numbers were high) and because of the false shortage, interest peaked, the prices escalated and the publishers started printing 2nd, 3rd printings to keep up with demand. When the price of these new books climbed (Ghost Rider 15 Glow In The Dark Cover selling for $30.00 when it was 2 month's old, the 5 variant covers of X Men 1, etc.) everyone who hoarded started selling, this flooded the market with these books and soon interest peaked and faded away and the value took a big turn downward, or, back to normal. Comic book stores were stuck with numerous copies nobody wanted, the publishers were stuck with hundreds of thousands of books nobody wanted, it was almost the end of the comic book industry. For the most part, many of these books are now dollar bin books that only increased in value due to the MCU, once the film debuted and ran its course the value came back down.

Yes, the MCU created a large interest with younger/newer readers who until the movies were released knew nothing about comic book characters, this led to a demand for early appearances of these characters which increased the value dramatically between 2020 and 2022, now that the movies have flooded the market and folks have lost interest, the price of these books is coming down, basically, back to a normal, a non-artificially inflated price.

Every 6 month's (June/December) I check the FMV (eBay sold auctions for books in the same grade) of my top books, basically for curiosity and for my heirs, my top 50 books lost $6000.00 in value from June 2022 to December 2022, as I am in the process of doing this right now for 2023, it appears the value is going to drop even more, going by this trend, this is probably a good time to be a buyer.

The point of all of this is, that unless you are a speculator/investor/flipper, buy and read what you enjoy, not for it's monetary value, if the value goes up, Great, if it does not, who cares, you are collector and enjoy reading/having the books. If there are older issues/stories you are interested in but cannot afford you can always buy reprints of those issues for a lot less.

[rumrunner71]

On 6/7/2023 at 12:13 PM, marvelmaniac said:

I collected as a kid in the 60's (65-69) and began collecting again in 79 (Marvel, all books are Raw), there have been times in the past when books had there value artificially inflated for one reason or another, it could be due to a movie, TV show, a current storyline that peaks the interest of newer readers and makes them want to find earlier appearances of a character which of course increases the value of the older books, generally the older books hold their value, back in the day there was no social media to blow everything out of proportion, the only way you got your latest comic book news was from your LCS, Overstreet Price Guide, Wizard World or any other Comic Book Publications.

In the early 90's people started hoarding new books with variant covers, gimmick covers, this created an artificial shortage of these books (even though the print numbers were high) and because of the false shortage, interest peaked, the prices escalated and the publishers started printing 2nd, 3rd printings to keep up with demand. When the price of these new books climbed (Ghost Rider 15 Glow In The Dark Cover selling for $30.00 when it was 2 month's old, the 5 variant covers of X Men 1, etc.) everyone who hoarded started selling, this flooded the market with these books and soon interest peaked and faded away and the value took a big turn downward, or, back to normal. Comic book stores were stuck with numerous copies nobody wanted, the publishers were stuck with hundreds of thousands of books nobody wanted, it was almost the end of the comic book industry. For the most part, many of these books are now dollar bin books that only increased in value due to the MCU, once the film debuted and ran its course the value came back down.

Yes, the MCU created a large interest with younger/newer readers who until the movies were released knew nothing about comic book characters, this led to a demand for early appearances of these characters which increased the value dramatically between 2020 and 2022, now that the movies have flooded the market and folks have lost interest, the price of these books is coming down, basically, back to a normal, a non-artificially inflated price.

Every 6 month's (June/December) I check the FMV (eBay sold auctions for books in the same grade) of my top books, basically for curiosity and for my heirs, my top 50 books lost $6000.00 in value from June 2022 to December 2022, as I am in the process of doing this right now for 2023, it appears the value is going to drop even more, going by this trend, this is probably a good time to be a buyer.

The point of all of this is, that unless you are a speculator/investor/flipper, buy and read what you enjoy, not for it's monetary value, if the value goes up, Great, if it does not, who cares, you are collector and enjoy reading/having the books. If there are older issues/stories you are interested in but cannot afford you can always buy reprints of those issues for a lot less.

I agree with all this, except the movies causing the wild prices in 2020 to 2022. There were other factors at play then in all of the collectibles markets.

Edited June 7, 2023 by rumrunner71

[Dr. Balls]

Aside from movie stuff, books can start picking up due to art teams on them as well. 70’s DC horror has started to pick up - it’s always been collected by many (like the Woman In White covers) but it’s starting to see a spike in popularity in the high grades. At least, that’s what I have been seeing in the past few months.

The movie business did wonders for first appearances (and potential first appearances in new media) but the art on/in books seems to be gaining momentum as the movie book trend seems to be winding down from what it was.

[marvelmaniac]

On 6/7/2023 at 12:30 PM, rumrunner71 said:

I agree with all this, except the movies causing the wild prices in 2020 to 2022. There were other factors at play then in all of the collectibles markets.

You are absolutely correct.

[Zonker]

On 6/7/2023 at 11:05 AM, Mokiguy said:

So is the comic collecting world really that fickle, driven by Hollywood? And what happens when Spider-Man, Iron Man and Wolverine are no longer in vogue? Will they go the way of Superman?

So the question for the 40 year collectors, if there are any. When all the Superman Movies were hot, were the DC superhero comics also?

As mentioned, comics values for certain key issues have been inflated by movie-appearance-driven speculation, and this definitely happened as long ago as the original Tim Burton Batman film from 1989.  I don't recall the Christopher Reeve movies having much effect on back issues at that time, though it may have boosted newsstand circulation of then-current Superman comics.

I think Marvel collectability and valuation over DC has been a fact of life since the mid-1960s.  Partly it was the chance for fans to build a complete Marvel (1961-onwards) collection, when that was never a realistic possibility for DC collectors.  And of course Stan Lee was very savvy in marketing each new Marvel Comic as a sure-fire collectors' item.  Marvel also pitched itself to a slightly older demographic, and the worst thing possible when you were a teenaged boy was to be caught doing something perceived as too "kiddish," like reading a Superman comic of the 1960s.  Marvel also did a decent job of having material that its fan base could grow into, so you might start out with Spider-Man, and if that got old after a while, there came along Conan the Barbarian, then the Starlin cosmic books, Uncanny X-Men, etc.  With DC you had Batman as a more mature option starting in 1970, and frequent flashes of brilliance elsewhere as DC attempted to compete with Marvel's emerging sales dominance, but nothing really stuck from them until the early 1980s.  By then, there was kind of a brand allegiance by the so-called Marvel Zombies, and a perception that Marvel was the Apple Macintosh to DC's DOS-based PC.  

[rumrunner71]

On 6/7/2023 at 11:37 AM, bc said:

 

The only excitement I can recall for DC was the "Death of Superman" issue that had people standing in lines at the LCS and hoarding copies in hopes of putting their kid thru college or retiring early.

 

I remember the gas station clerk by my house growing up, showing us a stack of 25 Death of Superman books and telling us how he was going to retire on them. I bet that's why I don't see him at the gas station anymore 

[shadroch]

Just prepare for the day Disney buys DC and tosses  out a minor JLA villain as an after credits teaser.

[comicginger1789]

Personally I’ve always viewed DC comics from the 50s through into the 70s as inferior to what marvel put out. And I think that sentiment holds true for many collectors. If anything be happy you collect stuff you love and that it is very affordable to do so. For me to collect what I love I have to drop hundreds of dollars in many cases for a single book. I wish I like stuff that was cheaper but I just don’t. 
 

Now could movies change this? Maybe but I really only think that if DC starts hitting it out of the park with films, it will still only mean a handful of books will see some of the increases they deserve. Many titles like Jimmy Olsen, Superboy and Adventures Comics from that era will probably always be relatively affordable, especially in lower grade 

[golfplyr]

I wonder what will happen with the prices of comics now that it seems that people are getting burnt out on the Marvel movies, confused about the multiverse or burnt out with the amount of TV series breaking continuity with movies.

[LowGradeBronze]

On 6/11/2023 at 2:19 PM, golfplyr said:

I wonder what will happen with the prices of comics now that it seems that people are getting burnt out on the Marvel movies, confused about the multiverse or burnt out with the amount of TV series breaking continuity with movies.

Still enough new young fans to get sucked in and bled dry for the tail of the comet to continue for a while yet. Slow decline is my best guess.

[Dick Pontoon]

On 6/11/2023 at 9:19 AM, golfplyr said:

I wonder what will happen with the prices of comics now that it seems that people are getting burnt out on the Marvel movies, confused about the multiverse or burnt out with the amount of TV series breaking continuity with movies.

That's me on all counts, except I don't have Disney+ and haven't seen any of the shows. However, I'm still plugging away on my runs and have been buying more books in the past few months as prices have normalized from the crazy pandemic run-up.

[CitrusZ28]

On 6/7/2023 at 7:34 PM, comicginger1789 said:

Personally I’ve always viewed DC comics from the 50s through into the 70s as inferior to what marvel put out.

Back in the Day, a friend of mine's brother used to refer to DC as Dumb Cluck comics. He was obviously a Marvel fan. When I was a kid growing up in the 60's I really liked the DC titles, later as I grew older I gravitated to the Marvel titles.

[Mokiguy]

On 6/7/2023 at 11:31 AM, Zonker said:

Marvel also pitched itself to a slightly older demographic, and the worst thing possible when you were a teen-aged boy was to be caught doing something perceived as too "kiddish," like reading a Superman comic of the 1960s. 

Superman and friends, that's all I ever read, guess I was pretty lucky nobody ever caught me!

[seanfingh]

On 6/7/2023 at 11:37 AM, bc said:

The only excitement I can recall for DC was the "Death of Superman" issue that had people standing in lines at the LCS and hoarding copies in hopes of putting their kid thru college or retiring early.

Collect what you like, there are other financial investment vehicles if you are concerned about maintaining wealth over time.

-bc

In the summer of '89, when the Michael Keaton Batman movie was released. Batman (in the aggregate) was as hot as any of modern Marvel movie books.  Any Joker cover books were smoking hot - and i mean smoking hot.  Getting $15-20 in trade per Joker cover and buying Marvel Bronze in F-NM out of the quarter boxes - Eternals, mid run SubMariner, ROM, 25 cent Caps etc.  I was in comics from about 1984 through 2016, and the only thing that was ever close to '89 Batman was the Walking Dead in about 2012.