It's that time. New Overstreet 53rd Ed. out tomorrow. I still love the book. 3 3

[jimjum12]

On 7/21/2023 at 7:54 PM, Primetime said:

I’ve always used the CCA code as my silver age start era. Clean and simple. 

That's too much like "right", Brother. 

Why simplify something when it can be complicated ?  Why even consider that without the code we would be celebrating the 1000th issue of Tales From The Crypt ? GOD BLESS ... 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

[N e r V]

On 7/21/2023 at 4:54 PM, Primetime said:

I’ve always used the CCA code as my silver age start era. Clean and simple. 

 

On 7/21/2023 at 8:23 PM, jimjum12 said:

That's too much like "right", Brother. 

Why simplify something when it can be complicated ?  Why even consider that without the code we would be celebrating the 1000th issue of Tales From The Crypt ? GOD BLESS ... 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

You need to view the silver age as a slow burn. Action comics #1 blew up the industry instantly with DC and others churning out superheroes shortly thereafter and quickly sustained.

DC put out Showcase and the new version of the Flash and slowly added to him with other new version heroes over the next few years. Marvel finally jumps in 5 years later and progressively builds on it.

Action #1 was a nuclear explosion, Showcase #4  was the spearhead of forces set for a prolonged emerging battle or a time-bomb.

The Atlas superhero revival was a earlier failed incursion…

Edited July 22, 2023 by N e r V

[Primetime]

On 7/21/2023 at 8:23 PM, jimjum12 said:

That's too much like "right", Brother. 

Why simplify something when it can be complicated ?  Why even consider that without the code we would be celebrating the 1000th issue of Tales From The Crypt ? GOD BLESS ... 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

It’s already complicated in the Timely world. I don’t need it in silver 😂 plus it helps to organize the short boxes easier. Thirty plus years and I finally have the system that works 👍🏽

Edited July 22, 2023 by Primetime

[Robot Man]

On 7/21/2023 at 8:11 PM, tth2 said:

It's been a while since I took Logical Reasoning in college, but I'll give it a shot:

1.  The Silver Age began with Showcase 4

2.  Detective 225 came out before Showcase 4

3.  The Age that came before the Silver Age is the Golden Age

4.  Ergo, Detective 225 is a Golden Age book

See Prof Davis, I wasn't sleeping through your class! 

Logic is an invaluable tool in life grasshopper.

I has served me well in life…

[LearnedHand]

On 7/21/2023 at 10:42 AM, sfcityduck said:

Good for him! Eras are a particularly weak concept and the “Atomic Era” bears no relationship to their original purpose or use in the eyes of the first modern comic fans who invented the concepts - DC invention of superhero comics and DC modernized revivals and resulting trends.

Agree.
 

The two fundamental eras have also been referred to by fandom as the First Heroic Age and Second.  If GA and SA are still intended to be synonymous with the Heroic Age labels, metallurgical references (bronze, copper, etc.) are misplaced, given there was no general break in superhero themed books between the SA and these subsequent eras. 

Given I’m an Overstreet Advisor, this question may sound a little blasphemous, but do the annually published price estimates in the Guide necessarily impact anyone’s assessment on how much they will pay for any slabbed book that has available prior actual sales data?  
 

[Robot Man]

On 7/22/2023 at 8:15 AM, LearnedHand said:

Agree.
 

The two fundamental eras have also been referred to by fandom as the First Heroic Age and Second.  If GA and SA are still intended to be synonymous with the Heroic Age labels, metallurgical references (bronze, copper, etc.) are misplaced, given there was no general break in superhero themed books between the SA and these subsequent eras. 

Given I’m an Overstreet Advisor, this question may sound a little blasphemous, but do the annually published price estimates in the Guide necessarily impact anyone’s assessment on how much they will pay for any slabbed book that has available prior actual sales data?  
 

Only that I use it as a measuring tool for how much I am paying.

Overstreet only goes up to 9.2 and is mainly directed at raw books I believe.

I’ve given up trying to figure the daily stock market of comic prices. I basically pay what a book is worth to me. If I overpay, I figure time will eventually make it a good deal…

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

On 7/22/2023 at 10:15 AM, LearnedHand said:

Given I’m an Overstreet Advisor, this question may sound a little blasphemous, but do the annually published price estimates in the Guide necessarily impact anyone’s assessment on how much they will pay for any slabbed book that has available prior actual sales data?  

The answer should be no, but I think the true answer is “sometimes”. There are sellers that seem to have assigned a guide multiplier  number for their books, and when the guide value goes up, so does their price. If a book regularly goes for triple guide, and the guide base value goes up, so does the sellers price until it’s triple the new guide value. 

[lou_fine]

On 7/22/2023 at 9:50 AM, GreatCaesarsGhost said:

On 7/22/2023 at 8:15 AM, LearnedHand said:

Given I’m an Overstreet Advisor, this question may sound a little blasphemous, but do the annually published price estimates in the Guide necessarily impact anyone’s assessment on how much they will pay for any slabbed book that has available prior actual sales data?  

The answer should be no, but I think the true answer is “sometimes”. There are sellers that seem to have assigned a guide multiplier  number for their books, and when the guide value goes up, so does their price. If a book regularly goes for triple guide, and the guide base value goes up, so does the sellers price until it’s triple the new guide value. 

Great minds think alike as that's it exactly, as the guide valuation is used as the base to determine the multiplier to the condition guide value.  

I tend to joke that I like to buy at a discount to condition guide value and sell at a multiple to condition guide value.  I guess I am actually showing my age here because it actually was possible to buy books at discounts to guide back in the old days, but pretty much everything GA tends to sell at multiples to condition guide values nowadays.  Of course, this multiplier is different for indiviaul books, but if you go back into previous auction results, tend to have a pattern of consistency to it and gives you some basis to see if you are getting a good deal or overbidding on a particular book.  Plus you can also see the trajectory or trend of a book's multiple over time.  

Well, at least that's my take when it comes to the guide valuations, although I am sure that everybody here has their own use or non-use for it. 

[Dr. Balls]

On 7/22/2023 at 9:15 AM, LearnedHand said:

Given I’m an Overstreet Advisor, this question may sound a little blasphemous, but do the annually published price estimates in the Guide necessarily impact anyone’s assessment on how much they will pay for any slabbed book that has available prior actual sales data?  

 

It happened specifically to Chamber of Chills 19 last year. OSPG came out at the same time I was trying to find a slabbed issue of that, and it added to the elevated value of that book immediately because it was singled out as a important PCH book or something of that nature.

OSPG came out and overnight ones turned up everywhere. And by "turned up" I mean 2-3 copies at most, one of which was an Ebay scam. I got embroiled in a problem with buying one from an auction house on their exchange, and I didn't get the book - but another one turned up in a higher grade on Instagram, which I bought. While I was purchasing my 4.0, a 2.0 showed up on CLink, and it went for the same price I paid for my 4.0, which felt pretty good - considering I was trying to navigate my purchase right in the middle of the increased hype.

That book in particular is always hot, but OSPG definitely spiked it with the way they classified it in the 2022 issue. That spike went way up, and then came down to a moderate increase in value - but most of the time, unless you're tracking this book exclusively, it's hard to establish value because GPA can't get the private sales data. I usually keep an eye on this book out of curiosity since I'd bought mine.

 

[Courageous Cat]

I cannot buy these anymore as the print is so small I would need a magnifying glass 

[MusterMark]

On 7/23/2023 at 12:03 AM, Courageous Cat said:

I cannot buy these anymore as the print is so small I would need a magnifying glass 

The oversized edition (called the Big Big edition) comes out every year, and has much bigger print.

[Aman619]

yes.  the Big Big Overstreet is very easy to read, but a beast on the desktop, and flops closed a lot unless you're in the middle third of the book!

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

On 7/22/2023 at 5:16 PM, Aman619 said:

yes.  the Big Big Overstreet is very easy to read, but a beast on the desktop, and flops closed a lot unless you're in the middle third of the book!

Here’s another idea. Buy the online version. The text is expandable with just a pinch of your fingers, and an iPad is easier to handle than the Big Big Overstreet and much easier to read than the print in the normal sized guide

Edited July 22, 2023 by GreatCaesarsGhost

[N e r V]

On 7/22/2023 at 9:00 AM, Robot Man said:

Only that I use it as a measuring tool for how much I am paying.

Overstreet only goes up to 9.2 and is mainly directed at raw books I believe.

I’ve given up trying to figure the daily stock market of comic prices. I basically pay what a book is worth to me. If I overpay, I figure time will eventually make it a good deal…

That’s exactly how I work with buying. Less concerned about current market vs what the book is, how hard to find in grade or at all, so I ask the question what is it worth to me. Never worry about overpaying (within limits) for quality books because like all things you should eventually meet and exceed that price. Golden age for sure is always a stronger bet with the above advice.

[lou_fine]

On 7/22/2023 at 11:50 AM, Dr. Balls said:

It happened specifically to Chamber of Chills 19 last year. OSPG came out at the same time I was trying to find a slabbed issue of that, and it added to the elevated value of that book immediately because it was singled out as a important PCH book or something of that nature.

Although I get the demand side for this particular book, I don't really understand the prices being paid, considering the supply side of the equation. 

Especially since this book was apparently part of a warehouse find and there are already well over 100 graded and slabbed copies of this book, with copies seeming to pop up in almost every single major auction offering for the past two years. 

Considering the frequency with which they were showing up, I found it rather stunning that they managed to get 6-figures for a copy back in 2021 which were then followed by near-figures for slightly lower graded copies.  Even more stunning though was a lower grade CGC 2.5 beater copy which managed to sell for 5-figures last year which made me think back to how lucky the winner of this lot must have been:   

https://comics.ha.com/itm/golden-age-1938-1955-/horror/chamber-of-chills-19-multiple-file-copy-group-harvey-1953-condition-average-gd-vg-total-18-comic-books-/a/19062-12153.s?ic4=ListView-ShortDescription-071515

A multiple File Copy group of 18 water stained copies in G/VG raw condition selling for just over half of guide value for a whopping $418.25.  

Edited July 23, 2023 by lou_fine

[lou_fine]

On 7/22/2023 at 9:00 AM, Robot Man said:

Overstreet only goes up to 9.2 and is mainly directed at raw books I believe.

You don't seriously think that anybody in their right mind would sell any of the books listed in Overstreet's Top 100 in raw condition, do you?  

Although I've always heard this theory that Overstreet's valuation are based on raw condition books, my take is that the valuations are based upon the most common method that the underlying books themselves are sold in.  That is, graded prices for your high dollar value items which no rational person would ever sell in raw condition and raw prices for worthless drek in a condition that no rational person would ever think of sending in for slabbing before selling.  

[Dr. Balls]

On 7/22/2023 at 7:35 PM, lou_fine said:

Although I get the demand side for this particular book, I don't really understand the prices being paid, considering the supply side of the equation. 

Especially since this book was apparently part of a warehouse find and there are already well over 100 graded and slabbed copies of this book, with copies seeming to pop up in almost every single major auction offering for the past two years. 

Considering the frequency with which they were showing up, I found it rather stunning that they managed to get 6-figures for a copy back in 2021 which were then followed by near-figures for slightly lower graded copies.  Even more stunning though was a lower grade CGC 2.5 beater copy which managed to sell for 5-figures last year which made me think back to how lucky the winner of this lot must have been:   

https://comics.ha.com/itm/golden-age-1938-1955-/horror/chamber-of-chills-19-multiple-file-copy-group-harvey-1953-condition-average-gd-vg-total-18-comic-books-/a/19062-12153.s?ic4=ListView-ShortDescription-071515

A multiple File Copy group of 18 water stained copies in G/VG raw condition selling for just over half of guide value for a whopping $418.25.  

When I bought my copy, I believe the census only had 97 graded books, and now it's gone to 129 (like you had said) in a year. Black Cat 50 has 110 on census and CSS22 has 400+ and they also command big numbers. And they are the three most recognizable PCH covers to everyone in the hobby.

I think this book gets purchased and maybe doesn't flip as often as other PCH books. I mean, I'm hanging onto mine because I don't want to try and track it down again - and I paid at the very beginning of the run-up. I imagine the guys who are into this book for $200-$300 from 15+ years ago will never part with it because replacing it at 50X what they bought it for isn't an option. And I dunno about the "warehouse find". That's been the go-to boogeyman phrase in comics most of my adult life (and probably before) that is used to squash pricing. Until I see a stack of 50 Chamber of Chills 19 wrapped in twine, I remain skeptical.

It's just a classic cover. From an graphic illustration aspect, it's one of the best covers of the era, between line quality, the black cover popping the color and mixing beauty with the macabre - it hits a lot of desirable and interesting traits. And there's a whole generation of Gen-Xers that grew up looking at the Misfits album cover (like me). I think only CS22 is homage'd more on modern books than CoC19. And for younger generations who are dabbling into the PCH stuff because they want to venture into something older than Silver Age - this is like a cornerstone piece. All those things drive up the hype. I'll be the first to admit that when I got back into comics, specifically PCH - I wanted one of these for sure.

The water-damaged ones from that old HA auction are crazy - you could leak one or two of those out for a few years and buy yourself a nice, big boat.

[MusterMark]

On 7/23/2023 at 1:56 AM, GreatCaesarsGhost said:

Here’s another idea. Buy the online version. The text is expandable with just a pinch of your fingers, and an iPad is easier to handle than the Big Big Overstreet and much easier to read than the print in the normal sized guide

Hi,

Please let me know where you found the digital version for this year.

I used the buy the digital versions on the Heritage website.  But last year and this, I have been unable to find them for sale anywhere, including the Heritage website.

Thanks.

 

[lou_fine]

On 7/22/2023 at 7:33 PM, Dr. Balls said:

When I bought my copy, I believe the census only had 97 graded books, and now it's gone to 129 (like you had said) in a year.

Glad to see that you was on top of your game here and hopefully able to pick up your copy at a steal of a deal before the big runup in prices.  

Always a smart move to pick up a book before it gets broken out in the guide because once that happens, the book usually tends to rocket up pretty fast.  

 

On 7/22/2023 at 7:33 PM, Dr. Balls said:

The water-damaged ones from that old HA auction are crazy - you could leak one or two of those out for a few years and buy yourself a nice, big boat.

Well, instead of paying a mere $418.25 for 18 copies, I guess you could have dig just a tiny bit deeper into your pocket for this single copy here:  

https://comics.ha.com/itm/golden-age-1938-1955-/horror/chamber-of-chills-19-file-copy-harvey-1953-cgc-nm-94-cream-to-off-white-pages-cover-by-lee-elias-interior-art-by-bob/a/15121-17097.s?ic4=ListView-ShortDescription-071515#

Still the second highest graded copy after being auctioned off for $477.25 back in 2005, or if you was willing to dig deeper into your pocket:  

https://comics.ha.com/itm/golden-age-1938-1955-/horror/chamber-of-chills-19-harvey-1953-cgc-nm-96-cream-to-off-white-pages-the-lady-on-the-cover-is-flirting-with-death-and/a/813-1100.s?lotPosition=27&ic16=ViewItem-BrowseTabs-Inventory-BuyNowFromOwner-ArchiveSearchResults-012417

You could have picked up this still highest copy for a mere $776.25 back in 2004, and if so, hope you would have been smarter than the flipper who made an unsuccessful attempt to CPR the book and then flipped it for what was a most likely money losing $1,063.75 less than a year later. 

Now, that winner there (i.e. the owner of the Black Cat Collection) was the smart one as they held the book until it was sold for $102K in 2021.  

Edited July 23, 2023 by lou_fine

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

On 7/22/2023 at 9:55 PM, MusterMark said:

Hi,

Please let me know where you found the digital version for this year.

I used the buy the digital versions on the Heritage website.  But last year and this, I have been unable to find them for sale anywhere, including the Heritage website.

Thanks.

 

Now that you mention it, I can no longer find sources for downloadable copies anywhere(I stopped downloading them 2 years ago with the 51st Edition). Accordingly, I have just now sent an inquiry to Heritage